thor vs darkseid(strongest version)

Originally posted by abhilegend
OK? ODG's position is that Mokkari broke space time by releasing ALE on internet but ALE was already released in the world by Boss Dark Side on several kids without any such things happening.
ALE didn't do anything to accelerate the breaking of the time and space. That was solely due to the fall of Darkseid's true form.

ODG point blank refuses to accept that there's a true form of Darkseid to begin with. It's the most bizarre thing to read lol.

I think the important point in this entire argument is are there any *explicit* proofs that ALE amped Darkseid in dragging the Multiverse
We only have the comics explicitly say Darkseid dragging down the whole Multiverse, his personal singularity/black hole was dragging down the Multiverse
"Darkseid's falling, dragging this whole universe down as he goes...the whole Multiverse"
https://ibb.co/cXDTGqbQ

"The Eartth is at ground zero of a Doomsday singularity. *The impact of Darkseid's fall* is causing cracks to spread through all space setors."
"Darkseid's dragging all our freinds into hell with him!"
https://ibb.co/R4S5y17c

"Darkseid is sitting at the center of a *personal* singularity"
https://ibb.co/JFsVfXNK

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
I think the important point in this entire argument is are there any *explicit* proofs that ALE amped Darkseid in dragging the Multiverse
We only have the comics explicitly say Darkseid dragging down the whole Multiverse, his personal singularity/black hole was dragging down the Multiverse
"Darkseid's falling, dragging this whole universe down as he goes...the whole Multiverse"
https://ibb.co/cXDTGqbQ

"The Eartth is at ground zero of a Doomsday singularity. *The impact of Darkseid's fall* is causing cracks to spread through all space setors."
"Darkseid's dragging all our freinds into hell with him!"
https://ibb.co/R4S5y17c

"Darkseid is sitting at the center of a *personal* singularity"
https://ibb.co/JFsVfXNK

This has been pointed out to him several times previously.

Originally posted by Juntai
That's why I wrote 'may have', because it would require an affirmative of sorts as well.

From what I can gather, the comics only say Darkseid dragging the whole Multiverse, the impact of his fall/his personal singularity caused the spacetime problems

It's like....we can argue about ALE *may* cause the spacetime going down, but we can also argue it's just the presence of Darkseid causes it because in the very same issue it also says gods' presence deforms time
https://ibb.co/JWwfdM3W

Originally posted by abhilegend
Circular arguments are so funny.

... even though previous depictions of the ALE were merely "facets of the unimaginable whole that is the complete Anti-Life Equation"?

Originally posted by abhilegend
You still have to show us the supposed "amp" he got from ALE.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Nobody cares.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Yawn, the same garbage every time. Typical.

Originally posted by Juntai
The Antilife equation being released and expanding Darkseid's influence may have accelerated things, but it was all already happening.

Spoiler:
Darkseid finally obtained the Anti-Life Equation.

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
I think the important point in this entire argument is are there any *explicit* proofs that ALE amped Darkseid in dragging the Multiverse

That's not how this works. The burden of proof is actually on you schnooks to prove a dying Darkseid w/o ALE would have done so during Final Crisis. It's the same burden of proof for all of those Thanos w/ IG shills who insisted that his fight against the Marvel Earth heroes could somehow be divorced from the IG gems due to a bastardized interpretation of Thanos alluding to "sensory input".

You don't get to reverse this burden of proof. Particularly since within the pages of Final Crisis, the Astroforce-wielding New God Orion descended into the lower dimension while dying and caused no DC multiversal upheaval. Neither did any of the deaths of any other New Gods like Big Barda, Steppenwolf, Desaad, Mad Harriet result in similar DC multiversal upheaval. And what exactly is the obviously on-panel fact that differentiates those dying New Gods from Darkseid?

Spoiler:
Darkseid finally obtained the Anti-Life Equation.

Originally posted by Juntai
This has been pointed out to him several times previously.

So here's an obvious question for you: during the last 15+ years since Final Crisis, have you ever paused to reflect on how Darkseid hasn't displayed such abject personal power like you pretend he did during Final Crisis?

Any self-introspection at all? Have you no self-awareness?

And Darkseid has since died even. But his death-throes did not collapse the DC multiverse. What exactly is the obviously on-panel fact that differentiates such death throes from that during Final Crisis?

Spoiler:
Darkseid finally obtained the Anti-Life Equation.

Re-emerging years later across random scattered threads hoping KMC has forgotten isn't a winning strategy. It's the nature of cockroaches.

Neither is pretending that an additional 15+ years of publications since Final Crisis doesn't abjectly erode such a laughable outdated myth. That's the nature of trolls.

Originally posted by ODG
Agreed. Insisting that Final Crisis showed the true scope of Fourth World concepts/characters that had been only hinted at prior like for Darkseid but absolutely not for the ALE...

... even though previous depictions of the ALE were merely "facets of the unimaginable whole that is the complete Anti-Life Equation"?

You should read Final Crisis #1-6. kinda Definitely not those who are trembling and petrified over repeating thoroughly deconstructed arguments of the past. Well... yes. Exactly this. shocklaugh

This is garbage, even by your standards.

Originally posted by ODG

You don't get to reverse this burden of proof. Particularly since within the pages of Final Crisis, the Astroforce-wielding New God Orion descended into the lower dimension while dying and caused no DC multiversal upheaval. Neither did any of the deaths of any other New Gods like Big Barda, Steppenwolf, Desaad, Mad Harriet result in similar DC multiversal upheaval. And what exactly is the obviously on-panel fact that differentiates those dying New Gods from Darkseid?

Spoiler:
Darkseid finally obtained the Anti-Life Equation.

Final Crisis outright states that all the new gods except Darkseid already died before Darkseid's fall in the material world in the War in Heaven and what we see is their emnations, not the actual new gods. I mean, how many times do you have to be corrected lol.

Originally posted by ODG
I'll be clear. None of these "arguments" are new. They've all been routinely deconstructed into obscurity years upon years ago across multiple threads. Mainly because I kept needling your self-serving hypocrisies underlying your biases and ya'll eventually flee. These innumerable discussions with Allankles, TricksterPriest, kevdude, WhiteWitchKing, The Great Galen, comicfan11, Philosophia and you, Juntai, all happened in the immediate wake of Final Crisis.

So here's an obvious question for you: during the last 15+ years since Final Crisis, have you ever paused to reflect on how Darkseid hasn't displayed such abject personal power like you pretend he did during Final Crisis?

Any self-introspection at all? Have you no self-awareness?

And Darkseid has since died even. But his death-throes did not collapse the DC multiverse. What exactly is the obviously on-panel fact that differentiates such death throes from that during Final Crisis?

Spoiler:
Darkseid finally obtained the Anti-Life Equation.

Re-emerging years later across random scattered threads hoping KMC has forgotten isn't a winning strategy. It's the nature of cockroaches.

Neither is pretending that an additional 15+ years of publications since Final Crisis doesn't abjectly erode such a laughable outdated myth. That's the nature of trolls.

This is where you pretend this was never shown to you and Darkseid was somehow made big by ALE here.

Originally posted by ODG
I'll be blunt. What sort of flaccid limp-d1cked burden of proof fallacy is this? You are impotently begging the question by demanding that I disprove a dying Darkseid w/o ALE could've dragged down the DC Multiverse during Final Crisis.

That's not how this works. The burden of proof is actually on you schnooks to prove a dying Darkseid w/o ALE would have done so during Final Crisis. It's the same burden of proof for all of those Thanos w/ IG shills who insisted that his fight against the Marvel Earth heroes could somehow be divorced from the IG gems due to a bastardized interpretation of Thanos alluding to "sensory input".

You don't get to reverse this burden of proof. Particularly since within the pages of Final Crisis, the Astroforce-wielding New God Orion descended into the lower dimension while dying and caused no DC multiversal upheaval. Neither did any of the deaths of any other New Gods like Big Barda, Steppenwolf, Desaad, Mad Harriet result in similar DC multiversal upheaval. And what exactly is the obviously on-panel fact that differentiates those dying New Gods from Darkseid?

Spoiler:
Darkseid finally obtained the Anti-Life Equation.

As for how Darkseid differentiates from other New Gods, didn't recent DC All-In actually make it clear Darkseid is an essential force(and Snyder's intentions are also meant to say Darkseid is far more than just a New God)

Also, I don't know if anyone mentioned this before
Morrison's intentions seem to be just Darkseid's fall that broke the Multiverse

NRAMA: To translate Uberfraulein's comments, she mentions the "bleeding heavens" - basically, we're taking that this is the Supergirl from earth-10 as shown in the final pages of 52? And that means that something is ripping up the multiverse?

GM: The Multiversal structure of parallel worlds is collapsing. Darkseid’s fall has broken the Multiverse basically and he’s pulling everything that exists down with him into Hell, the swine!

And the DC official website synopses on issue 5 and Secret files also seems to agree with it

As Darkseid's presence causes reality itself to sicken and the lights to go out across the universe

Finally, the secrets of this year's most talked about event can be revealed! Witness how Darkseid's death shattered the Multiverse, creating continuity ripples throughout the DC Universe!

Originally posted by abhilegend

This is where you pretend this was never shown to you and Darkseid was somehow made big by ALE here.

NRAMA: To translate Uberfraulein's comments, she mentions the "bleeding heavens" - basically, we're taking that this is the Supergirl from earth-10 as shown in the final pages of 52? And that means that something is ripping up the multiverse?

GM: The Multiversal structure of parallel worlds is collapsing. Darkseid’s fall has broken the Multiverse basically and he’s pulling everything that exists down with him into Hell, the swine!

In the synopsis of issue 5, we have

As Darkseid's presence causes reality itself to sicken and the lights to go out across the universe

And in the Secret Files, we have:

Finally, the secrets of this year's most talked about event can be revealed! Witness how Darkseid's death shattered the Multiverse, creating continuity ripples throughout the DC Universe!

Links already posted above

Originally posted by abhilegend
Grant Morrison clearly showed that all Darkseid appearances after Final Crisis were his emanations, just like the other new gods.

This is where you pretend this was never shown to you and Darkseid was somehow made big by ALE here.

Originally posted by Juntai
Yep, Darkseid was dead for the last years of post-crisis universe all the way through New52 lol. The Darkseid they kept encountering throughout the multiverse was a new emanation.

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
I also think Morrison's interview and DC official website synopses on issue 5 and Secret Files also seem to agree with it's mere just Darkseid's fall caused the Multiverse to be broken

In the synopsis of issue 5, we have

And the comic also states
"The Eartth is at ground zero of a Doomsday singularity. *The impact of Darkseid's fall* is causing cracks to spread through all space setors."
"Darkseid's dragging all our freinds into hell with him!"
https://ibb.co/R4S5y17c

And in the Secret Files, we have:

Links already posted above

Originally posted by Juntai
obviously the panel of The Ray saying that’s when space and time broke is somehow more important than the other dozen or so mentions that it was the war in heaven and Darkseid’s fall/singularity causing it, the writer himself, DCs position, and most knowledgeable posters position on it.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Grant Morrison clearly showed that all Darkseid appearances after Final Crisis were his emanations, just like the other new gods.

And even in the actual comic, Barbara Gordon confirms ALE is a mathematical proof, nothing more. From Final Crisis 4.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
this isn't even a new concept either. the new gods were working through emanations way before morrison ever mentioned it. remember back when darkseid and highfather were both trapped on the source wall, and darkseid was still able to act on the physical plane exactly because he DOES use avatars? pretty sure he or desaad (or both) directly said as much like decades ago.

He's stuck with his nonsensical notions for over 15 years now, gotta respect the idiocy.