Originally posted by Darth Avis
Lucas also said that Boba died in episode 6. We cant exactly take what lucassays and i know he is the creator of star wars. also nai you are so full of cra......................coolness that you turn it into intellect.
Actually, Lucas made a more recent statement that Boba did in fact survive and that he was going to put that into ep6 but it didn't flow with the rest of the movie.
And what Nai just said about GL saying is true and it logically makes sense(except for Mace being more powerful than Dooku or Mace in the force). The reason that I say that is because Mace did it with the help of a lightsaber rather than his hands.
Mace overpowered Sidious, I agree. But in that particular situation. It was mentioned, I think, on another thread that had Sidious fought as he did against Yoda, and actively used his Force powers instead of his sub par lightsaber ability, the fight may have turned out differently. But I will placate the masses.
Mace vs Sidious - Mace wins.
Yoda vs Dooku - Yoda wins.
Mace vs Dooku - Can go either way. Frankly I see no evidence that institutes Dooku as victorious over Mace (though I personally believe so), nor have I seen anything else. So this is a long hard battle.
Yoda vs Sidious - Yoda. Unless Sidious can disarm Yoda using lightning as he did in ROTS (not likely). However, Sidious has an affinity to use the environment to his advantage. If he distances himself from Yoda and uses the environment, he'll still most likely lose.
Yoda walks out of this alive. He's more powerful than Sidious (ROTS), Mace, or Dooku, and is superior to them in every aspect.
Personally, Glentract, I don't see Mace as that talented of a Force user. This is, simply, because I have yet to see him do it. It is obvious that he relies more on his lightsaber abilities, just as Sidious relies more on his Force powers. And we've seen that preference can have an impact on how one performs. But do I consider him on Dooku's level, let ALONE Sidious or Yoda in the Force? Nope.
Originally posted by Escape81
Mace overpowered Sidious, I agree. But in that particular situation. It was mentioned, I think, on another thread that had Sidious fought as he did against Yoda, and actively used his Force powers instead of his sub par lightsaber ability, the fight may have turned out differently. But I will placate the masses.Mace vs Sidious - Mace wins.
Yoda vs Dooku - Yoda wins.
Mace vs Dooku - Can go either way. Frankly I see no evidence that institutes Dooku as victorious over Mace (though I personally believe so), nor have I seen anything else. So this is a long hard battle.
Yoda vs Sidious - Yoda. Unless Sidious can disarm Yoda using lightning as he did in ROTS (not likely). However, Sidious has an affinity to use the environment to his advantage. If he distances himself from Yoda and uses the environment, he'll still most likely lose.
Yoda walks out of this alive. He's more powerful than Sidious (ROTS), Mace, or Dooku, and is superior to them in every aspect.
Mace VS Dooku - Although this doesn't provide much, or hold much water, Dooku did defeat Mace Windu once. They both grew with more experience through time and Dooku was introduced to new found Darkened power. Dooku is a very dangerous force wielder and Lightsaber wielder. I know Mace Windu is also basically one of the best Jedi Swordsman besides Yoda, and Mace's force powers.... Well... Can't tell all that well. I still hand it to Dooku, though.
Yoda VS Sidious - Hard to say, although after Dooku defeats Mace, he could help Sidious take down Yoda, but Sidious and Yoda alone? So hard to say, but I am leaning towards our little green friend.
Mace and Dooku will be a long battle. Dooku is an exceptional duelist, but so is Mace. If Dooku wins, he will be 'LIMPING' away, possibly one armed.
As for Yoda and Sidious. Look, they're both my characters. And Yoda frankly doesn't outclass anyone (Mace, Dooku, or Sidious) to a horrible degree. Yoda DID and WILL have a hard time with Sidious. Yoda wasn't screwing around in that battle. He knew Sidious was damn near his equal and he fought smart, too. Also, I can argue Sidious would stand a better chance against Yoda than Dooku did, because unlike Dooku:
- He disarmed Yoda (though after Yoda disarmed him).
- He nailed Yoda with Force lightning.
Dooku's never done either. But that has nothing to do with this duel.
Yoda WILL win in the end, against Sidious. But especially if Sidious uses his environment, it will be a long duel.
Dooku and Yoda will be the victors of either duel. But again. If Mace dies quicker, Dooku and Sidious will team up, and then Yoda will bite the big one. If Yoda defeats Sidious, Dooku's gonna die.
Mace and Dooku will be a long battle. Dooku is an exceptional duelist, but so is Mace. If Dooku wins, he will be 'LIMPING' away, possibly one armed.
No, Dooku would not win wounded. It's all or nothing with them two.
As for Yoda and Sidious. Look, they're both my characters. And Yoda frankly doesn't outclass anyone (Mace, Dooku, or Sidious) to a horrible degree. Yoda DID and WILL have a hard time with Sidious. Yoda wasn't screwing around in that battle. He knew Sidious was damn near his equal and he fought smart, too.
I agree. To an extent.
- He disarmed Yoda (though after Yoda disarmed him).
- He nailed Yoda with Force lightning.
Dooku stayed and fought. He didn't try to run. Sidious got his ass thrown into a chair, which Dooku didn't, and then tried to run. I saw Dooku and Yoda on par with force, being why Dooku made a comment about settling it with Lightsabers. Sidious and Yoda kept on passing each other with the force.
Yoda WILL win in the end, against Sidious. But especially if Sidious uses his environment, it will be a long duel.
That can't be said. Yoda still ran from the fight and was fairly on par with Sidious. It's quite hard to say, in my eyes.
Dooku and Yoda will be the victors of either duel. But again. If Mace dies quicker, Dooku and Sidious will team up, and then Yoda will bite the big one. If Yoda defeats Sidious, Dooku's gonna die.
Maybe not. I understand that Yoda is powerful, but I saw on AOTC that they were on par with the Force. And wthem not fighting all day and in an entirely different enviroment, who knows.
A) Perhaps so. Then he'd probably fall over from a heart-attack and the lack of oxygen in his lungs. He'd definately be exhausted.
B) Yoda and Sidious are equals in the Force category. But I do think that Yoda is better in saber skills.
C) Simply means that Dooku had the desire to fight while Sidious did not. Consider. That in itself also puts Sidious in a good light. If Sidious was trying to 'escape' and he 'still' got in blows that Dooku never did, it makes him look even stronger. And I agree. But again, of a sorts, it was a stalemate. Palpatine's initial blow was stronger than Yoda's counter.
D) Yoda ran because he was out of options. He realized that it would only end in a vicious stalemate, or Sidious would've killed him at that point, having the advantage of offensive Force abilities.
E) You like to bring scripts in, I think (or maybe it's Nai). The AOTC script was used more than the original ROTS one, and it still said that Yoda bested him. And I was told that the script even supercedes the website. So who knows, indeed? And now also consider. The website or the script either say 'it was a stalemate' or they say that Dooku was overmatched and was forced to flee. You never see the opposite. Dooku is weaker than Yoda. It's obvious. As is Sidious.
Originally posted by Sorgo No, Dooku would not win wounded. It's all or nothing with them two. [/B]
I disagree here. The victor would be very wounded no matter who it was.
Originally posted by Sorgo Dooku stayed and fought. He didn't try to run. Sidious got his ass thrown into a chair, which Dooku didn't, and then tried to run. I saw Dooku and Yoda on par with force, being why Dooku made a comment about settling it with Lightsabers. Sidious and Yoda kept on passing each other with the force. [/B]
It could also be arrogance on Dooku's part. Dooku was actually quite arrogant in many situations, so it's not out of the question. And Sidious knocked Yoda back in many situations, twice in one fight as a matter of fact.
Originally posted by Sorgo That can't be said. Yoda still ran from the fight and was fairly on par with Sidious. It's quite hard to say, in my eyes. [/B]
There were thousands of Clone Troopers on the way. Yoda needed to get out of there. He was running from the Clones, not Sidious.
Originally posted by Sorgo Maybe not. I understand that Yoda is powerful, but I saw on AOTC that they were on par with the Force. And wthem not fighting all day and in an entirely different enviroment, who knows. [/B]
I wouldn't exactly call Dooku and Yoda on par. Yoda never made a full attack against Dooku. He more wanted to protect Obi-wan and Anakin and figure out what Dooku was trying to do.
Actually, there's no evidence of stormtroopers being "on the way" in the Yoda-Sidious fight.
Also, I like how Sidious is being said to be better than Dooku based on the fact that he scored a hit on Yoda in a fight that lasted something close to eight minutes, whereas Dooku fought Yoda for less than a minute. And Anakin got more hits in on Dooku and Obi-Wan beat his ass. Where's the logic in that?
I wouldn't exactly call Dooku and Yoda on par. Yoda never made a full attack against Dooku. He more wanted to protect Obi-wan and Anakin and figure out what Dooku was trying to do.
No proof of that. Yoda won the fight, but that doesn't mean he is better. My theory goes like this. For example, the Maul and Kenobi fight. Apparently, according to several people, Maul won the fight. But guess what? He is at the bottom of a Generator shaft rotting in two pieces dead while Kenobi went on with his Jedi Career, so who really won the fight? In order to technically "Defeat" someone or "win" a fight, you must KILL them or disarm several limbs. If you don't even touch them with your lightsaber.
Yoda ran because of Clone troopers? That holds just as much water as Dooku running because of the Death Star plans. You think Sidious and Yoda tied their fight, but Yoda ran, correct? Maybe Dooku and Yoda tied, because Dooku ran and no one was hurt.
Yoda and Dooku's duel was ON PAR. They clashed with the force and proved to be on par. With Lightsabers, on par again. I don't care if Yoda is better, that damned duel they had was on par, besides the fact that Dooku ran. Same with Yoda running away. They were on par for the fight, but Yoda busted-a-move.
Lets see:
Yoda vs. Dooku = Yoda
Mace vs. Sidious = Sidious and don't try starting another did or did not Mace truely win arguement please.
Sidious vs. Yoda = Could go eitehr way but I'll say Sidious since he won fair and square the only time they did fight.
or
Mace vs. Dooku = As of now I say unknown
Yoda vs. Sidious = See above
Mace vs. Sidious and Dooku = Mace gets owned
So I'll say the Sith
Originally posted by darthsith19
Lets see:
Yoda vs. Dooku = Yoda
Mace vs. Sidious = Sidious and don't try starting another did or did not Mace truely win arguement please.
Sidious vs. Yoda = Could go eitehr way but I'll say Sidious since he won fair and square the only time they did fight.or
Mace vs. Dooku = As of now I say unknown
Yoda vs. Sidious = See above
Mace vs. Sidious and Dooku = Mace gets ownedSo I'll say the Sith
Wow.... I am getting Dejavu.
Originally posted by Borbarad
ROTS commentary...Lucas himself:
- Mace [b]overpowered Sidious
- Sidious wanted to kill Mace with lightning but Mace deflected it back (that was the reason for Sidious face "melting"😉(The next person that tries to tell me Sidious threw the fight will get force pimp slapped)
Conclusion.
Force powers:
Yoda > Mace > Sidious > or = DookuLightsaber skill:
Yoda > Mace > or = Dooku > SidiousThe Jedi win this on equal ground. [/B]