Hulk Vs. Storm [Deathmatch with a catch]

Originally posted by wannabe
Your knowledge about human physiology is quite impressive X, but how does a shut down brain affect the heart???

The heart's function is not regulated or otherwise stimulated by the brain, but has it's own independent quasi-neural system that keeps it going...the sinus- and AV-nodi, the Purkinje-fibres etc.(hope i wrote them right in english, 'cause i know only the correct german names).

So, if Hulk's heart was "out of order", it was directly due to the lightning.

If indeed the lightning damaged the SA node directly then I don't doubt Hulk could have healed from that without Storm's defibrillation.

Yea but regardless...one of the unique characteristics of cardiac muscle is that its muscle twitch is activated on its own. Even without signals from the brain or SA node...if u put a piece of healthy cardiac muscle in a petri dish, as long as it has the nutrients and oxygen it needs, it will undergoe the twitch...the other factors just regulate the rate I think. I havent had physiology in a couple years myself...but I explicitely remember the petri dish thing.

No point in arguing about it though...Im pretty sure its been longer since the writer of that comic took physiology 😉

Oh, I was just answering wannabe's question about how affecting the brain could affect the heart. Still I don't see why a model that the neuronal shut-down was temporary based on physiology is any less valid than a model that the mind-body connection was deteriorating and that Storm restarting the heart re-established this connection based on nothing.

Originally posted by Cosmic Cube

You keep saying that Hulk couldn't restore brainwave functioning. He has done it before. In this case, your opinion doesn't hold much sway.

Where has 616 Hulks brain been shut down before and he restored it?

Originally posted by wannabe

A brain can be perfectly healthy and nonetheless not functioning. Certain kinds of coma and brain-death work this way.

Precisely.

As the lightning attack effected his brainwaves which in turn shut off his bodily functions, hulk could very well heal his tissue damage but not the harm done to his psyche which would be beyond the capacity of a healing factor.

Without that healed and with that as the cause of the cease of functions whilst his healing factor might be able to go on for a little while restoring tissue damage it would eventually cease to function without sufficient nutrients delivered to it by the bodily functions. Which themselves cant heal without the source of the problem (the disrupted brainwaves) being dealt with.

Why do you keep referring to brainwaves as if they aren't physical? They are. They're a result of bioelectrical and biochemical activity. Their combined attack managed to damage the brain causing a cessation in activity - a physical process.

There isn't anything there to take that his mind is slipping away - only that Banner's mind was trapped under Onslaught's influence. When Cable enters Hulk's mind, he resumes from where he last was when he entered Hulk's mind. He frees the trapped Banner. That is all. There is no indication of having to seek out the psyche, or fortifying any connections, or repairing any severed connections.

Processes such as healing and immunity are autonomic processes they aren't controlled in any great deal by the brain or the "psyche". The only "bodily function" that had ceased was proper cardiac function. His heart was either in asystole or arrhythmia - due to physical malfunction either of the heart or the brain.

You can presume that his body wouldn't heal from these physical traumas, but healing from physical injury isn't something that Hulk has great problems with. All that can be taken from those scans is that if Cable had not intervened Banner's mind would have remained trapped and that if Storm - who may or may not have defibrillated Hulk depending upon the conditions of his cardiac arrest - had not intervened the restoration of cardiac function might have taken longer.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Why do you keep referring to brainwaves as if they aren't physical? They are. They're a result of bioelectrical and biochemical activity. Their combined attack managed to damage the brain causing a cessation in activity - a physical process.

Hulk can heal the brain matter but how could he heal brainwave activity after a disruption and cessation of said activity? As Wannabe said you can have a perfectly healthy brain but still be brain dead.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
There isn't anything there to take that his mind is slipping away - only that Banner's mind was trapped under Onslaught's influence. When Cable enters Hulk's mind, he resumes from where he last was when he entered Hulk's mind. He frees the trapped Banner. That is all. There is no indication of having to seek out the psyche, or fortifying any connections, or repairing any severed connections.

Well as aforementioned its inferred by Cables paniced state and talk of there being only a small window of oppurtunity. However i will dig up the issue and have a read of it myself and post scans if possible. Its hard to make an argument from a few isolated scans.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Processes such as healing and immunity are autonomic processes they aren't controlled in any great deal by the brain or the "psyche". The only "bodily function" that had ceased was proper cardiac function. His heart was either in asystole or arrhythmia - due to physical malfunction either of the heart or the brain.

Yes but if the heart stopped pumping nutrients from the body then his healing would eventually give out would it not?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
You can presume that his body wouldn't heal from these physical traumas, but healing from physical injury isn't something that Hulk has great problems with. All that can be taken from those scans is that if Cable had not intervened Banner's mind would have remained trapped and that if Storm - who may or may not have defibrillated Hulk depending upon the conditions of his cardiac arrest - had not intervened the restoration of cardiac function might have taken longer.

Im not presuming that Hulk couldnt heal from physical trauma. Im saying he couldnt heal from damage done to brainwave activity. He could restore the brain tissue to a state where brain activity could resume, however its not certain whether or not his psyche would be negatively affected as a result of the trauma or whether brain wave activity would resume in the first place.

We're getting too scientific here and theres no need because as VVD said i bet the writers didnt give the biology of the hulk this much thought when they wrote the issue. I bet the writers didnt know the conditions required for Storms lightning to actually be effective and ineffective (asystole). All what was presented was that the combined assault from Storm and Cable apparrently killed the hulk. Cable couldnt sense an psyche from the Hulk s Storm said they should leave. Cable rejected her advice tried again talking of there still being a small window of oppurtunity. He took it and at the same time ordered storm to start his heart up again. The heroes know very well of Hulks healing abilities Cable would especially. If Hulk could heal by himself without intervention then i doubt there would have been such panic from Cable and regret from Storm.

Either way none of this is really relevant to the battle in this thread.

I can't be bothered doing the multiquote so just assume numbers refer to paragraphs.

1. I don't know which comatose patients wannabe's referring to but if the brain is perfectly healthy - then no, they wouldn't be in a coma.

3. Whether or not the healing factor requires circulatory function is unknown. If the heart stopped pumping for a prolonged period of time then he would likely die.

4. If the structure of the brain, down to subcellular levels to full functionality is restored then brain activity would resume.

5. Yes, but it was an interesting aside.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I can't be bothered doing the multiquote so just assume numbers refer to paragraphs.

1. I don't know which comatose patients wannabe's referring to but if the brain is perfectly healthy - then no, they wouldn't be in a coma.

Well i'll let you two duke it out on that front.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
3. Whether or not the healing factor requires circulatory function is unknown. If the heart stopped pumping for a prolonged period of time then he would likely die.

Cool.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
4. If the structure of the brain, down to subcellular levels to full functionality is restored then brain activity would resume.

5. Yes, but it was an interesting aside.

Well i'll await Wannabes reply before i get stuck in but all of this aside she can win by knocking him out.

Whats to stop her suffocating him in a hurricane. Suspended in mid air with no projectiles at his disposable and nothing to apply his strength to he's helpless. On Kick her power will be increased dramatically and she doesnt tire in this thread. So yeah hulk can hold his breath but thats irrelevant under those circumstances.

Storm wins imo

Is it sure that Hulk needs air?

He works well in underwater.

Or does he just have so big lungs he can breathe so long?

She can't win by knocking him out... because this is a fight to the death.

Her powers would increase 5 times on kick if I recall correctly (although I don't actually know if illadelph intended this or if he simply wanted to make it so that Storm wouldn't tire).

If she's close enough to create a controlled vacuum in an open environment then she's likely close enough to get thunderclapped.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Is it sure that Hulk needs air?

He works well in underwater.

Or does he just have so big lungs he can breathe so long?

He can breath trace molecules of oxygen because of his powerful lungs. But he does need to breath, otherwise he falls unconscious. And that isn't a good thing. Unconscious Hulk = Bruce Banner.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
If Hulk could heal by himself without intervention then i doubt there would have been such panic from Cable and regret from Storm.

Shows how much they really knew. 😛

Let me clarify then:

Storm's on the Kick so she won't tire and can go all out full bore with her powers for the full duration of combat just as Hulk can. I only included the stipulation so Storm's stamina would be on par with Hulk's (stamina, not durability, still a 1 punch pwn3d), as Hulk's staying power wins a lot of fights.

Oh, and death equates to being put down and bodily functions ceasing. Hulk can be "dead", and come back and reform himself from being dissasembled at an atomic level, just like Doomsday (his clone).

Whoever puts the other down first, regardless of the ability to 'resurrect', wins.

Whichever opponent can render their opposition clinically dead first wins.

Originally posted by illadelph12
Let me clarify then:

Storm's on the Kick so she won't tire and can go all out [B]full bore with her powers for the full duration of combat just as Hulk can. I only included the stipulation so Storm's stamina would be on par with Hulk's (stamina, not durability, still a 1 punch pwn3d), as Hulk's staying power wins a lot of fights.

Oh, and death equates to being put down and bodily functions ceasing. Hulk can be "dead", and come back and reform himself from being dissasembled at an atomic level, just like Doomsday (his clone).

Whoever puts the other down first, regardless of the ability to 'resurrect', wins.

Whichever opponent can render their opposition clinically dead first wins. [/B]

Good explanation, illadelph.

That will put an end to a lot of the bickering going on.

I thought Hulk breathed underwater by filling his lungs with fluid from some magic Hulktacular gland.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
I thought Hulk breathed underwater by filling his lungs with fluid from some magic Hulktacular gland.

It's a gland that lets him breath trace air molecules dissolved in water. It works the same way in space. But, if there's NO air present whatsoever, he's going to pass out.

storm could literally rip hulk into shreds if she can go all oput and not have to worry about tiring. just turn up the pressure up so much that his body can't take it. even with a bit of pressure your insides already start to go up, and with enough pressure they would literally rip out of your body.

Originally posted by stormfront13
storm could literally rip hulk into shreds if she can go all oput and not have to worry about tiring. just turn up the pressure up so much that his body can't take it. even with a bit of pressure your insides already start to go up, and with enough pressure they would literally rip out of your body.

Hulk can take the pressure of being in deep space, unprotected. I don't think it gets much greater than that.