Originally posted by Lightsnake
And who says he had to have made Vaapad to get on the council?2. Who says he taught it to Depa right then and there? Mace was over fifty at the time of the CW...plenty of time to teach Depa.
She was sitting on the Council in TPM if you didn't know that. So Depa was already a Jedi Master when Mace was 40 years old. Since Mace was the youngest Council member ever up to that point and joined the Council being 28 Depa must at least have been 29.
Since Younglings are chosen to be Padawans and train under another Jedi in the age of 13, Depa must have been with Mace at least 16 years before TPM (and this would mean she became a Council member directly after she was made a Jedi Knight) and Mace was 24 years old at that time. And he was using Vaapad back then...so he couldn't have invented it in his 30s...
Originally posted by Lightsnake
1. When he beat Simus, it's probably not a single Sith dared to challenge him.
What makes you think this? There were several whole new generations of Sith to challenge him who never knew Simus' power, btw.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
2. Hm, point them.
It's not as impressive as anyone makes it out to be. I know, because I was one of the people who carried Luke up to his pedastol a long time ago. I helped with the Revan vs. Luke threads a long time ago and, since I was one of, if not the most knowledgable guy on NJO at the time(I had read it a lot more recently), I told about the black hole thing.
Anyway, a ship can't produce more power shields then the total amount of power it has. Putting a third of something's energy into defense is above average, but it's a nice and easy percentage to work with.
If the ship is the YV version of an AT-AT, it's shields are weaker then an actual black holes amount of power. Many Ancient feats are above this, since they are above the guy who instakills people.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
3. Sadow's illusions were very undetailed andmainly worked because they came from his imagination and the Meditation sphere projected them. It augmented his strength severely. Aleema's illusions were done a lot differently as she had a talent for manipulating minds...and her illusions tended to be beaten easily by the Jedi. Most of the illusions were pretty...undetailed, though granted that could be the fault of the artist
Because they were on such a huge scale. 10,000 pounds of sand(Sadows illusion) is heavier then a 1,000 pound brick(Luke's illusion).
Yeah, I remember Depa was a council memebr at that point...and no, Mace saved Depa when he was really, really young...I forget his exact age, but when he fought the slavers, he was a Padawan. It's occasional that the gifted students can become padawans prior to the age of 13...we also don't know that she didn't learn Vaapad in the interim of time ON the council....Depa's an unfortunate mystery in most cases
Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
What makes you think this? There were several whole new generations of Sith to challenge him who never knew Simus' power, btw.It's not as impressive as anyone makes it out to be. I know, because I was one of the people who carried Luke up to his pedastol a long time ago. I helped with the Revan vs. Luke threads a long time ago and, since I was one of, if not the most knowledgable guy on NJO at the time(I had read it a lot more recently), I told about the black hole thing.
Anyway, a ship can't produce more power shields then the total amount of power it has. Putting a third of something's energy into defense is above average, but it's a nice and easy percentage to work with.
If the ship is the YV version of an AT-AT, it's shields are weaker then an actual black holes amount of power. Many Ancient feats are above this, since they are above the guy who instakills people.
Because they were on such a huge scale. 10,000 pounds of sand(Sadows illusion) is heavier then a 1,000 pound brick(Luke's illusion).
1. I'd think all they had to do was look at the head in a jar...most of them never dared challenge him while he was dying,...I doubt they'd have dared challenge him, considering Sith can live a few centuries.
2. Ok, even without the blackhole one, Luke still has plenty to his name though. He manipulates solar flares-he shows Brakiss how to do this-he shields planets from view, creates powerful illusions with no enhancements, bests DE Sidious-before he and LEia join together...The most any Ancient has ever done was to use a ship's superweapon to blow up a star-and it IS a weapon...open the Sith war and open to the page where Dace, Qrrrrl and Shoaneb die...it specifically states there it was a superweapon on Sadow's ship/
3. Sadow wasn't creating such massive illusions though. Let me find the quote...It shows the sphere flashing illusions as Sadow concentrates and he says it makes his illusions real. OTherwise, damaging the meditation sphere wouldn't have been so costly
Since I've missed it:
Originally posted by Lightsnake
2. Except Edge of Victory book I stated a Dark Sider's FL doesn't work on them. Lomi and Welk used darkside techniques on Voxyn and their own weaponry. And forc elightning won't stop armies...it needs focus on several Vong
How are "some Dark Siders" compareable to Ancient Sith Lords ?
3. Ragnos'd have it comissioned when he was still Dark Lord. Sadow was dark lord for a matter of....a day or two. Three at the max. And when he was gone, Ludo Kressh took his spot....I don't see Ludo letting a monument to Naga stand.
Well...I don't think that they would break the tradition to bury their Dark Lord in a tomb seeing that Korriban is covered with them.
4. What entire army of Vong? Luke and the twins were fighting in a massive army battle with numerous others, Luke doing most of the work. The galaxy saw the Sith Empire once. Just once. Then they annihilated them in the matter of a day when the Sith lost their war and got genocided by the Tetans...keep in the mind the Sith didn't have enough force to take Coruscant and Naga has a horrific track record tactically.
You're again talking about a single generation of Sith when I'm talking about - at least 2000 years - of the Sith Empire including people like Ragnos who would curbstomp people like Sadow or Kressh. So if you multiply the Sith force by 80 I'm pretty sure they would have been able to take anything they'd like to take especially when you give them the Star Forge.
5. Jocasta Nu trained Jerec...he was a Jedi of the old Order who was recruited to the Dark Side after the Purge.
And then somebody did train him to use the Dark Side and that would have been Vader and Sidious.
And in the Dark Forces novellas-Kyle's Canon-he never wastes an imperial base by himself.
He did that between Jedi Knight and JK II. And yes he did it on his own...Boba Fett repeated that feat later.
6. What logic? KOTOR has other errors,
Same goes for the Essential Guides...
DE never mentions when the Empire originated...
DE mentions lightsaber that are more than 10,000 years old and are weapons which the Sith didn't know about. The Essential Guide (at least the last one I've seen) put the invention of lightsabers as they exist to 9,990 BBY and even states that they have experimented with similar technology before that. So how is it possible that the Sith didn't know about weapons that were invented 2000 years before they left the Republic ?
TOTJ never mentions when the Order originatedThe Lettow were destroyed and according to TOTJ the survivors of the 100 years Darkness were the ones who found the primitive, peaceful Sith
Oh...TOTJ doesn't mention were the order originated but at the same time it says that it's origin were survivors of the 100 year Darkness... 🙄
I don't read that stuff. I haven't read any of the novels. I don't know anything about that world. That's a different world than my world. But I do try to keep it consistent. The way I do it now is they have a Star Wars Encyclopedia. So if I come up with a name or something else, I look it up and see if it has already been used. When I said [other people] could make their own Star Wars stories, we decided that, like Star Trek, we would have two universes: My universe and then this other one. They try to make their universe as consistent with mine as possible, but obviously they get enthusiastic and want to go off in other directions. - George Lucas, from an interview in Starlog #337
Oh yeah... Lucas REALLY cares about how powerful Luke is. I'm sure he's reading each and every book and okaying all the words, too.
Originally posted by Borbarad
Since I've missed it:How are "some Dark Siders" compareable to Ancient Sith Lords ?
Well...I don't think that they would break the tradition to bury their Dark Lord in a tomb seeing that Korriban is covered with them.
You're again talking about a single generation of Sith when I'm talking about - at least 2000 years - of the Sith Empire including people like Ragnos who would curbstomp people like Sadow or Kressh. So if you multiply the Sith force by 80 I'm pretty sure they would have been able to take anything they'd like to take especially when you give them the Star Forge.
And then somebody did train him to use the Dark Side and that would have been Vader and Sidious.
He did that between Jedi Knight and JK II. And yes he did it on his own...Boba Fett repeated that feat later.
Same goes for the Essential Guides...
DE mentions lightsaber that are more than 10,000 years old and are weapons which the Sith didn't know about. The Essential Guide (at least the last one I've seen) put the invention of lightsabers as they exist to 9,990 BBY and even states that they have experimented with similar technology before that. So how is it possible that the Sith didn't know about weapons that were invented 2000 years before they left the Republic ?
Oh...TOTJ doesn't mention were the order originated but at the same time it says that it's origin were survivors of the 100 year Darkness... 🙄
1. Somehow the Sith would be able to sense the Vong through the Force?
2. Alright: Sadow was never buried on Korriban...he was believed dead and sent to Yavin 4 AFTER Ludo Kressh took over-within a day or two. And the Tetans proceeded to genocide the Sith...
3. Ok, I'm talking about the end of the Sith Empire to the end of the Vong Empire...Ragnos was also the Sith pinnacle....before and after him, quality can only decrease.
3. Actually, Jerec was trained there by Inquisitor Tremayne.
4. canonically we don't know. Wait'll the next Kyle Katarn stuff is written. And Boba wiped out a garrison once, yes
5. Essential guides pretty much decide the Chronology of the thing and everything else....in this case, it made a massive retcon and we'll have to see what happened.
6. The Legions of the Lettow were NOT in the 100 year darkness...they never were. I meant 'WHEN' they originated
And Ianus, considering they have to run more than a few things by him....not the least of which was a decision to kill Luke, later replaced with Chewbacca...and he was a big fan of Dark Empire.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
1. I'd think all they had to do was look at the head in a jar...most of them never dared challenge him while he was dying,...I doubt they'd have dared challenge him, considering Sith can live a few centuries.
Ragnos must have gone through other challenges in order to get the title of a Sith Lord and be allowed to challenge Simus. It's not like he simply came out of nowhere and thought "Oh...I never found somebody...I'll try to fight the strongest immediatly...".
2. Ok, even without the blackhole one, Luke still has plenty to his name though. He manipulates solar flares-he shows Brakiss how to do this-he shields planets from view, creates powerful illusions with no enhancements, bests DE Sidious-before he and LEia join together...The most any Ancient has ever done was to use a ship's superweapon to blow up a star-and it IS a weapon...open the Sith war and open to the page where Dace, Qrrrrl and Shoaneb die...it specifically states there it was a superweapon on Sadow's ship/
Ah...the illusions feat is not that much of a measure for power neither is the "hiding a planet" thing. In the Black Fleet books you can see that other people are reproducing that feats quite effortless. And you still missing the fact that somebody had to create all the nice toys people were using later from amulets over Exar Kun's "Sith Gauntlets" to Sadow's ship. And an army of people equipped with stuff like that will be freaking dangerous...
3. Sadow wasn't creating such massive illusions though. Let me find the quote...It shows the sphere flashing illusions as Sadow concentrates and he says it makes his illusions real. OTherwise, damaging the meditation sphere wouldn't have been so costly
As said before: Aleema did do it without a meditation sphere and in the Black Fleet books other people do it too. You just need to know how it works...
Where's the proof of that, Lightsnake? I have provided you with a quote verbatim. You have provided me with... your word. You rely so much on these vaunted quotes but you do not provide others with a means of checking your homework.
GL said that Ragnos was the strongest Sith of all time.
Disprove that, please.
1. Why couldn't he just challenge Simus? Why would there be a big 'challenger' system?
2. Where in the Black Fleet trilogy? I try to forget it a lot. However, remember: When the Vong are at the Sith core worlds, the Sith re very limited: They can't begin blowing up their own stars, that'll kill 'em faster than the Vong...as for the amulets, it's unknown if that could work on a race unsensed via the Force. And what he did in TUF and Dark Empire are certainly measures of great power, as well as moving star destroyers with the force.
3. Aleema just had Sadow's ship and the force...that's all she really needed...hell, even CRADO was working the thing's weapons...Aleema had nothing on Sadow either, her illusions were done with the help of other Krath and much smaller scale. Plus, she got some nice trinkets from Nadd that belonged to Sadow
Originally posted by Lightsnake
1. Somehow the Sith would be able to sense the Vong through the Force?
I think you still didn't get the point here. Force Lightning is just massive amount of energy channeled and thrown against a target. Why would anybody need to sense the target in order to hit it ?
And somehow I believe that the creators of that force ability who did use it for centuries would quite better using it than some mere Dark Jedi...
3. Ok, I'm talking about the end of the Sith Empire to the end of the Vong Empire...Ragnos was also the Sith pinnacle....before and after him, quality can only decrease.
Ok...so you have only that what is present at the highest point of the Sith Empire vs all Vong that invaded the Republic. What would stop thousands of minor Sith (force users), millions of Massasi Warriors, and 21 Sith Lords from obliterating the Vong HQ ? What would stop the Sith from using Sadow's ship to obliterate some Vong fleets ?
And please remember that Sadow didn't use the forces of the entire Sith Empire.
3. Actually, Jerec was trained there by Inquisitor Tremayne.
Actually it's told that Palpatine trained Jerec personally and gave him access to some Sith sources but then stopped it because he never thrusted Jerec.
4. canonically we don't know. Wait'll the next Kyle Katarn stuff is written. And Boba wiped out a garrison once, yes
Boba wiped out a garnison because Kyle did defeat him and he had to rebuilt his reputation.
5. Essential guides pretty much decide the Chronology of the thing and everything else....in this case, it made a massive retcon and we'll have to see what happened.
That's funny. I've told Glentract before and I'll tell you again: The Essential Guides just gather information and put them into some form and they make mistakes. Also they don't have any authority over the actual sources and since they use game and RPG information they are even below those in terms of "canon". So actually you can ignore them if they contradict actual sources.
6. The Legions of the Lettow were NOT in the 100 year darkness...they never were. I meant 'WHEN' they originated
I wonder where that can be found in the TOTJ comics...
And Ianus, considering they have to run more than a few things by him....not the least of which was a decision to kill Luke, later replaced with Chewbacca...and he was a big fan of Dark Empire.
And he was a big fan of the CW cartoons and still they are exegarreting and contradict the movies.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
1. Why couldn't he just challenge Simus? Why would there be a big 'challenger' system?
Imagine you never fought anybody and you're living in a surrounding in which everybody is fighting for power (what a contradiction) - would you go and challenge the most powerful person around ? And if you do that how great is the possibility that you'll manage to defeat him without any training and experience. Logic says that Ragnos fought other people before...
2. Where in the Black Fleet trilogy? I try to forget it a lot. However, remember: When the Vong are at the Sith core worlds, the Sith re very limited: They can't begin blowing up their own stars, that'll kill 'em faster than the Vong...as for the amulets, it's unknown if that could work on a race unsensed via the Force. And what he did in TUF and Dark Empire are certainly measures of great power, as well as moving star destroyers with the force.
In the last book.
Erm...when the entire Vong fleet invades the Sith systems and the Sith create a supernova (which they can do) that would destroy all Vong at the Sith can evacuate their worlds before. Still the Vong lose. If the Republic would have used superweapons those Vong would have been crushed before taking down that huge amount of worlds.
3. Aleema just had Sadow's ship and the force...that's all she really needed...hell, even CRADO was working the thing's weapons...Aleema had nothing on Sadow either, her illusions were done with the help of other Krath and much smaller scale. Plus, she got some nice trinkets from Nadd that belonged to Sadow
My point was that the illusions can be created without an meditation sphere...
Originally posted by Borbarad
I think you still didn't get the point here. Force Lightning is just massive amount of energy channeled and thrown against a target. Why would anybody need to sense the target in order to hit it ?
And somehow I believe that the creators of that force ability who did use it for centuries would quite better using it than some mere Dark Jedi...Ok...so you have only that what is present at the highest point of the Sith Empire vs all Vong that invaded the Republic. What would stop thousands of minor Sith (force users), millions of Massasi Warriors, and 21 Sith Lords from obliterating the Vong HQ ? What would stop the Sith from using Sadow's ship to obliterate some Vong fleets ?
And please remember that Sadow didn't use the forces of the entire Sith Empire.Actually it's told that Palpatine trained Jerec personally and gave him access to some Sith sources but then stopped it because he never thrusted Jerec.
Boba wiped out a garnison because Kyle did defeat him and he had to rebuilt his reputation.
That's funny. I've told Glentract before and I'll tell you again: The Essential Guides just gather information and put them into some form and they make mistakes. Also they don't have any authority over the actual sources and since they use game and RPG information they are even below those in terms of "canon". So actually you can ignore them if they contradict actual sources.
I wonder where that can be found in the TOTJ comics...
And he was a big fan of the CW cartoons and still they are exegarreting and contradict the movies.
1. Force lightning is still an extension of force energy. It doesn't matter if Ragnos himself was attempting to lightning or Force choke a Vong...if it doesn't work, it doesn't work.
2. Sadow used nearly the entire Empire, only Kressh resisted with a small force. And the Sith wouldn't sense the Vong until they were on their doorstep...by then, if they took up the ship, they';d have to be blowing up their own stars while the Vong are slamming moons into them...the superweapon causes a chain reaction in the stars and if they destroy their own stars, in any where close to them, they'd end up wiping themselves out while the Vong had far more people than the Sith. That the Sith can't use most of their pwoers against the Vong, who live for a very long time, training as warriors and always in constant battle...The Vong tend to move faster than the eye can see....a FLUNKY of Shedao Shai killed a Noghri before his deflected knife even touched the ground and their resistance is insane, coupled with the fact they'd never have any compunction about killing themselves for the greater good, far unlike Sith...and their weaponry would certainly cause some confusion amongst the Sith....if they tried to grab an amphistaff onto have it bite them? And Massassi weren't impressive warriors...we saw the Jedi and Republic really taking them out and Jori daragon killed quite a few of them. As for the sith Lords...they could finish off generic Vong, but against the commanders and Supreme Commanders in a straight up duel? I doubt they're that superior. And I'd put a warmaster against any Sith warrior. And Like I said: Vong have a lot of surprises for the Sith.
3. Huh? Palp trained Jerec? I know he gave him some secrets, but Tremayne took care of Jerec mostly...Jerec hardly needed much training anyways.
4. I know Boba wiped out a garrison, I confirmed he did.
5. Proof that Essential guides don't matter? What sources do they contradict? Dan Wallace was talking about this stuff on TFN, about the Lucasfilm position on KOTOR....a lot of stuff he's given has to be verified and confirmed. Leland Chee also has a bit to do with the stuff-you can find a LOT of Leland questions on the link earlier in the topic. For all intents and purposes now: Xendor and Arden Lyn were in 25000 BBY, the Hundred year Darkness 7100 BBY
6. It's found in other sources, the LEgions of Lettow never appear in TOTJ...hell, the HUndred Year Darkness is mentioned in a footnote
Originally posted by Borbarad
Imagine you never fought anybody and you're living in a surrounding in which everybody is fighting for power (what a contradiction) - would you go and challenge the most powerful person around ? And if you do that how great is the possibility that you'll manage to defeat him without any training and experience. Logic says that Ragnos fought other people before...In the last book.
Erm...when the entire Vong fleet invades the Sith systems and the Sith create a supernova (which they can do) that would destroy all Vong at the Sith can evacuate their worlds before. Still the Vong lose. If the Republic would have used superweapons those Vong would have been crushed before taking down that huge amount of worlds.My point was that the illusions can be created without an meditation sphere...
1. What if your reputation outgoes you for decades and noone dares challenging you for that long?
2. The Sith would NEVER willingly sacrifice their worlds...when would they have the time when surrounded by the entire Vong Fleet? there'd be no place to slip out. and I think Han summed up what'd happen in superweapons were used best...and the Sith don't have access to this kind of technology. The supernova'd never claim all the Vong and it'd exterminate most of the Sith....like I said, if the Vong have all their forces there, the Sith COULD NOT get out...we're talking the entire area and long thereafter barricaded and slamming a moon into Ziost before the Sith know what's even going on...and you think they'd jsut decide to cause a supernova off the bat?
3. Of course they can. However they don't work as well
Originally posted by Lightsnake
1. Force lightning is still an extension of force energy. It doesn't matter if Ragnos himself was attempting to lightning or Force choke a Vong...if it doesn't work, it doesn't work.
They still can throw them around or throw stuff at them. And I'm still not conviced that the ancient Sith Lords won't be able to use force lightning on the Vong. And I'm still not conviced that a normal Vong, one of their warriors or even a slayer would be a match for some people who can break Sith swords harder than blast doors with their sheer physical power.
2. Sadow used nearly the entire Empire, only Kressh resisted with a small force.
Obviously more than half of the Sith Lords (and their personal forces) remained at the Sith Empire when Sadow went to fight some war against the Republic...so that "small force" was some considerable part of the entire Sith Empire's forces.
And the Sith wouldn't sense the Vong until they were on their doorstep...
So your estimating the Vong just "pop out" in the middle of the Sith Empire not knowing the hyperspace routes needed to get there and you assume that all Sith will be on one single planet (despite the fact that the Sith Empire contained hundrets of them) and they won't sense if one of their planets will be attacked (thousands or millions dying) ?
by then, if they took up the ship, they';d have to be blowing up their own stars while the Vong are slamming moons into them...the superweapon causes a chain reaction in the stars and if they destroy their own stars, in any where close to them, they'd end up wiping themselves out while the Vong had far more people than the Sith.
Just think about how this would most likely go: The Vong reach the Sith Empire from Republic space and that means they reach some less important planet containing only minor servants. Now they attack it and destroy it's population. In the same second the Sith Lords will sense that unless you want to tell me they're all weaker force users than Obi-Wan.
While the Vong are now continuing to destroy whatever system they reach first the Sith can do two things at once:
a) if confronted with some enemy which can pretty much whipe out planets they will get themselves into space
b) they can send Sadow's ship to the system which gets attacked.
(If it's the entire Ancient Sith Empire they could also start producing stuff with the Star Forge at this point).
Now Sadow's ship reaches the system, sees that it will be destroyed no matter what and after a little manipulation of the sun / suns of the system the entire system turns into a nice supernova while Sadow's ship escapes. How many Vong do you think a supernova would kill ?
That the Sith can't use most of their pwoers against the Vong, who live for a very long time, training as warriors and always in constant battle...
This is only an assumption of yourself and not a proven fact. And the Sith are people who live for a very long time, training as warriors and always be in constant battle theirselves...with the little difference that killing a Sith Lord could be a bigger problem than killing a Vong seeing that they could take being crushed, burned and even beheaded without facing death...
The Vong tend to move faster than the eye can see....a FLUNKY of Shedao Shai killed a Noghri before his deflected knife even touched the ground and their resistance is insane, coupled with the fact they'd never have any compunction about killing themselves for the greater good, far unlike Sith...and their weaponry would certainly cause some confusion amongst the Sith....if they tried to grab an amphistaff onto have it bite them?
Ever heard about force speed ? If Padawan Kenobi can use it in TPM I think some Sith Lord would not have any problem with it. And why would some Sith Lord even think of grabbing an amphistaff seeing that they wield some huge Sith swords able to resist blaster hits and lightsaber strikes ?
And Massassi weren't impressive warriors...we saw the Jedi and Republic really taking them out and Jori daragon killed quite a few of them. As for the sith Lords...they could finish off generic Vong, but against the commanders and Supreme Commanders in a straight up duel? I doubt they're that superior. And I'd put a warmaster against any Sith warrior. And Like I said: Vong have a lot of surprises for the Sith.
You can't compare the situations here. Did you see Republic soldiers and Jori deal with Massasi Warriors in melee weapon combat 1vs1 ? Jedi could do that but as we have seen Jedi are also able to deal with Vong in melee combat.
5. Proof that Essential guides don't matter? What sources do they contradict?
The Star Wars Databank. Read the Expanded Universe part of the "Sith" entry there:
"In the early days of the Jedi, a great schism tore the order apart. Jedi who had tapped the forbidden power of the Force's dark side rebelled against their light-sided brothers. After a terrible war, the Dark Jedi were exiled from the Republic. Past the Republic's growing borders, these castaways discovered Korriban and the Sith people."
As you see the Sith Empire was founded in "the early days of the Jedi" after the first great schism under Xendor. And while you beloved TFN isn't endorsed by Lucasfilm - Lucasfilm owns starwars.com.
So the highest authority on history of Star Wars apart from Lucas himself gives the Sith Empire 20,000 years of existance. And since Lucasfilm does have the final word here...
1. What if your reputation outgoes you for decades and noone dares challenging you for that long?
What reputation would you have if you never fought anybody ? Not that it would even matter if Ragnos fought people or not. He simply beheaded the most powerful person (and in terms of the Sith Empire this means the most powerful fighter / force user).
2. The Sith would NEVER willingly sacrifice their worlds...
They won't sacrifice their own lives. Since when do Sith give a damn about other especially their servants ?
when would they have the time when surrounded by the entire Vong Fleet?
I wonder how the entire Vong fleet would be able to "surround" hundrets of planets and how they would even get to the important ones (Ziost, Korriban)...
there'd be no place to slip out.
Ah well...I guess the "invisible" sister planet of Korriban called Koros Minor doesn't even count. Can the Vong hit things they can't see ?
and I think Han summed up what'd happen in superweapons were used best...and the Sith don't have access to this kind of technology. The supernova'd never claim all the Vong and it'd exterminate most of the Sith....like I said, if the Vong have all their forces there, the Sith COULD NOT get out...we're talking the entire area and long thereafter barricaded and slamming a moon into Ziost before the Sith know what's even going on...and you think they'd jsut decide to cause a supernova off the bat?
See above. Ziost is deep in the core of the Sith Empire and the Vong will impact on the outer rim of the Empire first. And why would a Sith Lord not sacrifice some star systems filled with some minions ?
3. Of course they can. However they don't work as well
Why won't they work. Illusions are created and that's it. They won't scare the Vong away but they'll need time to figure out what's an illusions and what's real. And since the Vong threat even minor force users like gods what do you think will happen if they have to face an army of powerful force users ?