Originally posted by chuckg
[B]I grew up with Superman and came to love the guy as well...but seriously have you guys even watched DBZ?
1)Goku CAN move instantly with IT, and there are Ki sources all over the damn Universe, meaning Goku can move around the Universe instantly...as he demonstrated many times in the series...Superman cannot.
Yes, Goku can move instantly with IT, but he has to lock onto a ki source before he does that. When he came back to earth, he searched for Master Roshi's ki, then teleported. He did the same thing when Vegeta came back to earth in order to fuse with him when up against Super Buu. He did not do it instantly. Super Buu almost nailed.
2)All of Goku's abilities are innate...Superman relies largely upon the sun...Goku can destroy suns and survive in space
For heaven sakes guys...the weak villians in the beginning of the series were capaable of destroying planets and later on, Cell even said he could destroy the solar systyem...and Goku grows even greater still, now what do you think Goku is capable of
Superman couldnt destroy a solar system if he tried....sure he can juggle planets, but what the hell is that going to do for him in a fight?
Vegeta was the first person capable of destroying a planet. Goku was never in the vacuum of space and never displayed the ability to destroy a sun. Most of their attacks barely damage the planet. Planet juggling strength is strong enough to punch Goku from the earth to the sun in mere seconds.
3)Goku devotes his life towards martial arts and perfecting his combat abilities...Superman has nowhere near his discipline.
Superman may not train as much as Goku, but he has more experience (1000 year war)
4)Goku is a tactical genius...Superman would look like an incompetent infant before him.
Oh, and Superman cannot move faster than light...(he CAN move at 99% the speed of light...now how often do you see him fight at that speed? ya thats what I thought) When he raced Flash and nearly beat him...Flash was NOT going 8 times the speed of light, that was later on added to Flash, AFTER the race.
Superman is faster than light. He's flown from earth to Jupiter in under four minutes and has flown from the sun to earth in under a minute countless times. Look in the Superman Respect Thread.
6)Goku's 10X kamehameha in SSJ4 is many times more powerful than any explosion Superman has withstood.
You have proof of this? Everybody was given a massive powerdown in GT. Akira Toriyama did not work on it and said he liked GT as a side story. GT is not cannon.
The example with Snake Way is false...Goku was deterred several times and he even fell off....2 days is not a correct calculation of his speed (once again he can move instantly with IT as he demonstrated many times)
That example is right. After his training with King Kai, he gets wished back, then travels two days to meet Kami so he can go to earth and fight Vegeta and Nappa.
Oh and the After Image Technique DOES mean they can move at light speed (Why the hell else does it leave images of the person in their last known spot)
And in many instances is the series...you see Goku and his opponents phase in and out of existence when they are rushing their enemies....seemingly because they are so fast.
The After Image technique does not mean they move at light speed. It just leaves an image. Theoretically, you should move at light speed if you do that. However, that's just a physics error on Toriyama's part. No one, not even in the Buu saga is light speed.
The Funimation dub of DBZ stated that Snake Way is 10,000 miles. How long did it take Goku to travel that distance? 3/4 of a year. He already knew the After Image Technique (light speed) yet it took him that long to travel 10,000 miles! He obviouslyy wasn't light speed. The reason why I brought this up is because Funimation's dub is inaccurate. It provides too many inconsistencies. Now I will state what the manga said.
The manga stated that Snake Way is 600,000 miles long. When Goku finished his training, he traveled Snake Way again in 2 days (Mach 18). That's still not light speed. You can't fight and move at light speed and move slower than a speeding bullet.
Oh, and every character you mentioned would get their asses handed to them by Goku...simply because they don't have the speed to even keep up with his movements.
Simply not true, especially since Michael, Lucifer, and the Spectre are creations from the Presence (God) and can blow up a universe and are beyond physical damage. Wonder Woman can also access the God Wave (gains the power of every god in the DCU that ever existed). Do you seriously think Goku can beat all these people effortlessly.
In conclusion, Goku would school Superman, beat his ass silly, and then bang Lois Lane afterwards.
Supes should stay in his own league and fight Batman instead (and lose even there).
In conclusion, Goku is does not fight or move at light speed until proven. The after image technique does not mean he moves at light speed. And he needs to lock onto a KI source before teleporting. Superman may not fight at light speed either, but he is capable of going faster than light, which means he's faster than Goku without IT.
Superman is more durable. Surviving the pull of a double black hole that can easily destroy the sun is far greater than training in 400x gravity and getting killed by Cell's planet destroying explosion or the dragon's elemental attacks.
Superman is stronger. He can split the moon in two and lift 1 million tons effortlessly while Goku is struggling with 40 tons and SSJ2 Goku struggles to push a mountain apart. Non-cannon SSJ4 Goku had trouble with a city block. Aquaman can do that under water.
Superman is no stranger to fighting. He has training from the best in DCU and has 1000 years of experience. Martial artists even say that an experienced fighter is a force to be reckonned with. Goku is skilled, but I haven't seen him defeat more powerful opponents without a plot device. If he's so skilled, he would have used his skills to defeat his more powerful opponents without getting more powerful. Cell and Majin Buu are the only exceptions, because they can regenerate any part of their body. He wouldn't have defeated King Piccolo without drinking the sacred water. He would never have defeated Radditz without Piccolo's help, and he wouldn't have beat Frieza without turning Super Saiyan. Android 17 and 18 were humans that were kidnapped and turned into androids. They had no training, yet they beat up Piccolo, Trunks, Tien, and Vegeta, all of whom are more skilled and experienced than the androids.
Superman is more experienced, knows martial arts, is stronger, faster, more durable, has heat vision that will turn Goku into plasma, and has more stamina. Of course Superman won't kill Goku, since he already outclasses him anyway. Superman wins.