Is Bush The Worst U.S. President Ever?

Originally posted by lord xyz
There shouldn't have been a treaty at all. Cheney himself in 94 said if they went into Iraq it will be a horrible situation, there would be no one on their side, it would take a long time to revover etc. Also, Clinton knew it was unpopular and the very same people that are for the war now, said it would be bad back then, I recall Clinton said this in one of his interviews with the press...

You are correct. The Bush administration made the mistake of assuming that the people would cheer us in the streets. They were thinking in a WWII mentality.

Originally posted by BigRed
Well, I know at least Iraq wouldn't have turned into a terrorist haven because Saddam did not tolerate terrorism and hated bin Laden.

Our being there just displaced a shitload of Iraqis and killed a shitload more. Plus, the sanctions and bombing of Iraq prior to the actual invasion didn't boad too well for the Iraqis.

Not to mention the fact that the United States gave Saddam the gas he ended up using on his own people...

Okay lets talk about this eventual improvement. When will that be? Furthurmore, I believe anyone else (McCain or Gore or Bradley) could've handled it better.

Well, by looking at graphs, everything dropped faster when Bush took over in 01, he must've been doing something wrong.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
You are correct. The Bush administration made the mistake of assuming that the people would cheer us in the streets. They were thinking in a WWII mentality.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
Pencils, mistakes, etc.

It might take 10 years. Maybe 20 or 30 or 40 or 50. I don't know.

I counter with "Clinton left him a failing economy that plummeted in 2001 because of external factors."

I saw a speculation that under a different administration, the economy would've fallen, but recovered again. I, unfortunately have lost the graph I was going to show, but it showed in about 2002 the budget would've gone back up. Also, as I said, it dropped faster when Bush took over.

Originally posted by lord xyz
Thanks, I mean, who would want a war with a country most of us haven't heard of?

😕 You need to study geography.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
Iraqis dying--that's too bad. But would less have died if Saddam and his vile kin were allowed to continue ruling?

irrelevant to u.s. interests, yet your use of the word "vile" sways me

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What is all bullshit?

The Gulf war is bullshit?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_War

I'm not protecting Clinton. I didn't even bring him up.

Originally posted by chithappens
I'm not protecting Clinton. I didn't even bring him up.

Then I don't understand your reply to my post. I was trying to show that the Bush administration inherited a bad situation from the Clinton administration. The war in Iraq my have been a bad idea (but only time will tell if that is true), but the idea that the war was illegitimate is completely wrong.

I would not say that GW Bush is the worst ever, I would just say that he is one of the worst

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Then I don't understand your reply to my post. =

Because u quoted me

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Then I don't understand your reply to my post. I was trying to show that the Bush administration inherited a bad situation from the Clinton administration. The war in Iraq my have been a bad idea (but only time will tell if that is true), but the idea that the war was illegitimate is completely wrong.

And Clinton inherited from other Presidents. I can't put full blame on Bush. But Bush still ****ed up a lot.

It is illegitimate among other things...

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
😕 You need to study geography.

Originally posted by lord xyz
It's true though, most of us didn't know of Iraq til the war.

That or the education system really is going down the drain.

And for the record, a good portion of Americans still couldn't tell you where Iraq is on a map.

Buchanan is still worse. Bush hasn't started a catastrophic split of the USA, so he doesn't really compare.

Originally posted by BigRed
I could care less if Iraq becomes a vibrant democracy in the Middle East. The ends do not justify the means period.

And Clinton inherited from other Presidents. I can't put full blame on Bush. But Bush still ****ed up a lot.

It is illegitimate among other things...

Yes, the Bush administration did screw up on the implementation, but unless you are using a different meaning of the word illegitimate, it is just your opinion and not the world courts.

Originally posted by BigRed
I can't put full blame on Bush.

Explain this one.

The Iraq is a preemptive strike based on falsified evidence that the administration knew was incorrect.

As Truman said:

Bush is THE worst U.S President.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Yes, the Bush administration did screw up on the implementation, but unless you are using a different meaning of the word illegitimate, it is just your opinion and not the world courts.

Originally posted by chithappens
Explain this one.

The Iraq is a preemptive strike based on falsified evidence that the administration knew was incorrect.

Now the act of invading Iraq is all on Bush and his cronies.

Originally posted by BigRed
Well, illegitimate can mean "unlawful", so by definition, fact and the rule of law, the Iraq War is illegitimate.
...

No, it may have been wrong or even immoral, but it was not unlawful. If the war had been unlawful there would have been charges brought up in international court and a finding that states the war was unlawful. There is not such statement.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
No, it may have been wrong or even immoral, but it was not unlawful. If the war had been unlawful there would have been charges brought up in international court and a finding that states the war was unlawful. There is not such statement.

Knowingly lying about different facts (and in some cases all out made up stuff) to justify a war to the international community IS UNLAWFUL.

Originally posted by BigRed
If it is against the Constitution, it is unlawful.

That 2