Stupid assumption, since when did DE Sidious display "superior" power, this is universally agreed that Kun > DE Sidious adding on top of that Freedon Nadd learnt of the Ancient Sith are singlehandley conquered a planet, and that puts him below Luke?
I agree with what Illustrious once stated...Freedon Nadd is underrated here.
To a bloody, unresolved battle that leaves Luke dead.
In all candor, what the hell is so impressive about Luke Skywalker? "zOMG HE CONTROLLED TEH BLACK HOLE!" Okay, telekinesis. And? Are the Vong uber for making it in the first place? Is Kyp uber for replicating Luke's feat? "zOMG, EMERALD LIGHTNING" Oh, you mean the "attack" we know next to nothing about that managed to drop a creature somehow and which left no physical marks?
"zOMG, HE KILLED X SLAYERS - SLAYERS RAPE JEDI" Well, no, Slayers raped Luke's Jedi, and I still find their combat skills questionable at best. "zOMG, HE'S BEEN TRAINING LONGER THAN KUN'S BEEN ALIVE" Yeah, so did Vodo, and Vodo had an exponentially larger knowledge base to work with. We saw how that turned out, didn't we?
Freedon beats Sidious while Kun takes Luke.
Wow IKC your hatred for Luke is apparent.. What's so special about Kun? Oh yea, his amulet blast that he's never used on a living force user, that's really going to take down Luke. But of course in your mind he's more powerful than any instance of Luke, and everyone except the Ancient Sith which you'll make an argument for(bias). Thanks for your opinion IKC, but this forum isn't "What IKC thinks". Oh and Freedon Nadd takes down DE Sidious why? Because he threw down Vodo is a spirit, or because we don't know jack sht about him except that he's TOTJ and that automatically in your mind puts him about Post ROTJ? Thanks for stating your biased opinions/unfounded assumptions.
I'm not going to throw in my opinion because this thread is going to go to shit as a result of Kun and DN Luke being in there. But I like the fact that arguments are being made for someone we know very little about.
Originally posted by tdtd
Wow IKC your hatred for Luke is apparent.. What's so special about Kun? Oh yea, his amulet blast that he's never used on a living force user, that's really going to take down Luke. But of course in your mind he's more powerful than any instance of Luke, and everyone except the Ancient Sith which you'll make an argument for(bias). Thanks for your opinion IKC, but this forum isn't "What IKC thinks". Oh and Freedon Nadd takes down DE Sidious why? Because he threw down Vodo is a spirit, or because we don't know jack sht about him except that he's TOTJ and that automatically in your mind puts him about Post ROTJ? Thanks for stating your biased opinions/unfounded assumptions.I'm not going to throw in my opinion because this thread is going to go to shit as a result of Kun and DN Luke being in there. But I like the fact that arguments are being made for someone we know very little about.
Don't be ridiculous, tdtd. The turbolasers on the Executor haven't been shown to be used on force users... zOMG! tehy wont work!!!11 They blow through Sith alchemy created monstrosities and temple walls with ease. Unless Luke's face > those things? You have conclusive PROOF for that, I imagine?
And have you READ the Freedan Nadd uprising?
I just got it Saturday. Oh yes Janus, the amulet blasts were shown to be used on living force users.. Oh wait, they weren't? Show me they were used on a living force user, and then I'll finally believe this minority opinion of Exar Kun>Any Luke which I find ridiculous. Putting Freedon Nadd in a thread is a waste of time, and then putting him above a powerful force user, although I agree that Freedon Nadd is up there with the Ancient Sith, we have no conclusive evidence. And you're going to tell me that turbolasers can't kill Sith Alchemic beasts? Come on..
Oh but when I bring up emerald lightning, you'll respond with "It was never shown to work on a force user so it doesn't!"
And the massassi empowered by the dark side doesn't make them force users. By force user I mean an actual force user, who has a grasp of the force, and of the light/dark side.
Absence of proof isn't what my argument is based on but saying that Kun's amulet was never shown to work on a living force user is in the same category of Luke's emerald lightning was never shown to be used on a force user. You can't accept 1 instance and not the other.
Originally posted by tdtd
Oh but when I bring up emerald lightning, you'll respond with "It was never shown to work on a force user so it doesn't!"And the massassi empowered by the dark side doesn't make them force users. By force user I mean an actual force user, who has a grasp of the force, and of the light/dark side.
Absence of proof isn't what my argument is based on but saying that Kun's amulet was never shown to work on a living force user is in the same category of Luke's emerald lightning was never shown to be used on a force user. You can't accept 1 instance and not the other.
You FAIL to see the difference, tdtd... Kun's amulet has tangible effects on all sorts of things. Luke's Emerald Lightning only phased a Vong; it didn't phase the ground, the walls, or anything else. For all we know, it targets the Vong's nervous system and shuts it down.
When you bring up emerald lightning I question the nature of the attack. The problem with bringing up emerald lightning is that it did no observable physical damage and we have no idea how it killed the Vong it was used on. The amulet beams did have observable physical effects, however. We know how they killed their targets: they vaporized them.
And the Massassi are suddenly not Force users? Argue with the omniscient, non-character narrator some more, tdtd:
Do they have actual knowledge of the force, or able to use force attacks? No, they're just empowered with the dark side correct? And I agree that the author does a very poor job of describing emerald lightning but it was indeed a force attack. At the same time and as off as it seems Luke did block an AT-AT laser, but one of you mentioned that Kun's blasts were too thick for a saber to blast. Semantics or not, Luke did show to stop a blast of immense power. Unless of course you rate Kun's blasts as more powerful than an AT-AT blast. There's a lot of absences of proof here, even if you keep telling me his blasts destroyed everything in it's path, the fact remains that we've never seen it work on a living force user. Doesn't mean it can't of course.
Do they have actual knowledge of the force, or able to use force attacks?
Read what the narrator states, dude. It reads that they're able to use the Dark Side to guide their weapons (as it shows one doing just that). One cannot do so without using the Dark Side. The Dark Side is a half of the Force, thus they are using the Force, thus they are Force-users.
Where the hell are you getting this "empowered by the Dark Side" crap from anyway? What does that even mean?
And I agree that the author does a very poor job of describing emerald lightning but it was indeed a force attack.
I didn't say it wasn't a Force attack, but we have no idea as to its nature or even what it specifically does.
At the same time and as off as it seems Luke did block an AT-AT laser, but one of you mentioned that Kun's blasts were too thick for a saber to blast.
There's also the point that it's a big unsupported assumption that the nature of the amulet beams are the same as turbolasers, even though they appear to have similar effects.
Semantics or not, Luke did show to stop a blast of immense power.
These aren't semantics, dude. Just because he stopped a blast fired with technology doesn't mean he can stop a beam fired with the Force.
Unless of course you rate Kun's blasts as more powerful than an AT-AT blast.
They may well be, but the fact remains that the nature of these two attacks are not the same and thus we cannot throw out a blanket statement to the effect of, "Oh, he can resist it like he did attack X."
even if you keep telling me his blasts destroyed everything in it's path, the fact remains that we've never seen it work on a living force user. Doesn't mean it can't of course.
Then there's no point in repeatedly stating "it's never shown on a living Force user," because for one, Massassi are living Force users, and secondly, it has been shown to work on materials that are harder to destroy than what would make up a living Force user. I highly doubt Luke's skin is harder to destroy than massive rocks.
Right and again Turbo lasers can destroy anything the amulet can. So what is the difference in saying that
1. Because Luke can stop a powerful blast that could or could not be on the same level as the amulet blast, he MAY be able to stop the amulet blast.. AND
2. The Ancient Sith can stop the amulet blast because it was their technology and if they created it, they must have a defense for it.
Originally posted by tdtd
Right and again Turbo lasers can destroy anything the amulet can. So what is the difference in saying that
1. Because Luke can stop a powerful blast that could or could not be on the same level as the amulet blast, he MAY be able to stop the amulet blast.. AND
2. The Ancient Sith can stop the amulet blast because it was their technology and if they created it, they must have a defense for it.
Your logic isn't sound, here.
A large (or potent) enough bomb can destroy anything the Death Star superlaser can. Does this suddenly mean both weapons have the same nature?
Of course not. Ergo:
1. It's an unsupported assumption at best to just state that Luke can stop the amulet beam because he could stop an AT-AT blast. Why? Because even though both have the same (or similar) destructive potential, this doesn't mean they operate under the same principles.
2. It's an assumption (a fairly sound one) that the Ancient Sith have a defense for the amulet beams, but why is this even being brought up? Luke isn't an Ancient Sith and doesn't have access to their stuff.
Couldn't Luke block AT-AT fire by DE? Being quite a bit more powerful by DN, shouldn't he be able to use the same technique against Kun's blasts? They aren't the same, but he's blocking the blasts with the Force. The Force is ultimately the source for Kun's bracer's blasts as well.
Not sure if he would be able to block 'em though.
