Originally posted by Blue nocturneit has nothing to do with god. God is ruled off from the equation and therefore does not need questions about god to (dis)prove it. So why talk about god when talking about evolution when it's irrelivant?
I never said they all did, But the theory as it's known does not support nor deny a diety it is indifferent, also not all evolutionist belive in abiogenesis but that doesn't stop others from proclaiming it does.
then again, I'm talking to someone who thinks Stand ups are stupid for some reason 😕
Originally posted by lord xyzthen again, I'm talking to someone who thinks Stand ups are stupid for some reason 😕
And I'm talking to a guy who doesn't even understand a theory yet defends it, makes stuff up, and is vindictive as hell.
Originally posted by lord xyzStand ups are stupid for
Stand up's saying funny, stupid things like you. 😆
Lets not confuse things.... creationism is something that can be proven wrong, and ID... I thought that ID was about stating creationism scientifically, but if ID is just the point of view that there is an intelligent agent behind the origin of life, it cannot be proven wrong scientifically. It can be true, in fact. Now if it is a scientific theory or not is another problem.
I think there are many things in nature that can lead one to think that an intelligent agent is needed, it is not so senseless to think like this. It is a possibility that must be considered if we are sincelery analyzing all the possibilities. But as I said before, if it is a scientific theory or not is another problem.
Anyway it is obvious that ID is linked with this religious behavior of people trying to make everyone accept the bible. Even if ID is in principle a possibility(as long it does not make any reference to creationism and the bible), its is orginally meant an another way to force the bible to be accepted. This is obvious to me.
ok...if ID refutes macro evolution then why is it that there are species which can be dated to have existed in utterly different times on the earth
no homonid ever existed in the same time frame as any dinosaur species yet the hominids must have come from somewhere
so if evolution only takes place within species then where did the later species come from?
not to mention that ID completely ignores the factors of physics on molecules and states that the earliest cells evolved purely by chance
proto-cells occurred simply because phospholipids are hydrophobic and thus automatically repel water...this makes them form into spheres simply by their nature...a phospholipid layer is the absolute basics of a cell membrane
the other factor of ID that i dont quite understand is that somehow they claim that because evolution is mathematically unlikely then ID must be true...how do they jump from 1 to the other without any hypothesis testing?
they back this up with spurious and irrelevant analogies to strings and clocks and suddenly ID is the truth?
BUT WHERE IS THE PROOF OF A DESIGNER
thats when they pull out their Bibles, Jaden
Originally posted by lord xyz
19? Seems to me that you're probably high at the mooment. Just so you know, you do understand what evolution means don't you.
I hope you realize you are making a huge ass out of yourself. Not only is he older than you(which you probably didnt expect being that you asked in the first place) but your lack of knowledge is really noticable and your incessant triple posting is really, really annoying.
Stop bashing people. Pick up a few Biology and Physical Anthropology textbooks(although they're college level) and actually know something before you try to come and debate.
And this is coming from a guy who agrees with your point of view. You must really be f*cking up.
Originally posted by Arachnoidfreakokay, yes I know I'm not very knowing, but how can someone take ideas like creationism and ID seriously, then try and say they're scientific and factual. There can't be evidence for evo and ID because they're against eachother. There are facts for evo so ID can't be true sinse it's against these facts.
thats when they pull out their Bibles, JadenI hope you realize you are making a huge ass out of yourself. Not only is he older than you(which you probably didnt expect being that you asked in the first place) but your lack of knowledge is really noticable and your incessant triple posting is really, really annoying.
Stop bashing people. Pick up a few Biology and Physical Anthropology textbooks(although they're college level) and actually know something before you try to come and debate.
And this is coming from a guy who agrees with your point of view. You must really be f*cking up.
The idea of intelligent design is not irrational. The truth is......we simply do not know. The fallacy lies in the reasoning of those who are using the term "intelligent design" to justify a diety.....a belief, something that exists soly in a person's mind...not in our real/physical world.
ID and evolution are not "against each other" at all. If the religious nuts could somehow miraculously show their diety was the intelligent designer, it in no way eliminates evolution as it's method to achieve present results.
The problem with these religous folk is that they do not approach this scientific subject from any stance that could be loosely concieved as scientific. Their agenda is not to answer a question.......but to impose the beliefs residing in their minds onto other people, which is basically what religion is about in the first place. They take illogical steps to do so.
There is no way to know how the universe came into existence. No way to ever know. What existed before the first particle? What existed before the first bit of energy? No way to answer these questions at all. Their lack of logic comes into focus by their assertions....
Okay....somehow our universe came to be and we don't know how because everything had to begin at some point, right? That's how they open the door for their god answer. Next they claim that god had to create the universe. Okay, who created god then? They will say god always existed. When you point out that they just said 4 lines up that everything in existence had to have a beginning (including a god), they will just pretend they have gone deaf all of a sudden.
That's one far-fetched fantastical step that is unnecissary. If we are to say something could have always existed, as they proclaim god, isn't it more logical to simply state the universe always existed? That's cutting out one highly illogical middle man.......who happens to be invisible...living in the sky.
As for intelligence....we humans have barely begun to scrape the surface on the subject. Out of the vast, un-imaginable size of our universe......we have only yet encountered one kind of complex intelligence, ourselves......and none greater. The highest pinnicle of intelligence we human can understand at this point is our own......and some humans never figured out how to program their VCRs. We humans could be at the bottom of the heap relative to intelligence in our universe. Our intelligence compared to that of other forms could be the equivelant of a flea's intelligence compared to our own. We ourselves may not be intelligent enough to understand the intelligence at work in our natural world.
This is where REAL intelligent design comes in........not some fake stuff about invisible people who watch and judge you. Human beings have been around what, a few hundred thousand years in various forms? In this relatively short period of time....we have gained intelligence to some as of yet unknown degree. We are not even sure how our intelligence came to be......we believe it to be attributed to some interactions between electro-chemical impulses and matter (tissue) in our brains. It has only taken a few hundred thousand years to attain this. Our universe is 14 billion years old........and most certainly contain electrical impulses, chemicals and matter in abundance. As we know, all interact with each other.......just as in our brain. Why not believe the universe itself has evolved a form of intelligence over the 14 billion year time scale given........galaxies or even clusters of galaxies could be to the universe what one receptor cell is to our brains. It's not religous hokus pokus......but is intelligent design none the less......a universal intelligence guiding the physiology of the universe, functions and interactions........even if through millions or billions of years of trial and error/natural selection.
Originally posted by Evil Deadyes we can't be certain, but I'd rather use a 'more factual' theory, than a 'made-up' one.
The idea of intelligent design is not irrational. The truth is......we simply do not know. The fallacy lies in the reasoning of those who are using the term "intelligent design" to justify a diety.....a belief, something that exists soly in a person's mind...not in our real/physical world.
Originally posted by Evil Deadagreed. Evolution just simply means develop. A creator doesn't prove a plan, and a design doesn't disprove evolution. Either it was all designed at once, meaning there's no change, or it all came out through millions of years using scientific processors, and the dominant, is what is here today. Which also says, it's not over yet. The 'creation' is still getting better.
ID and evolution are not "against each other" at all. If the religious nuts could somehow miraculously show their diety was the intelligent designer, it in no way eliminates evolution as it's method to achieve present results.
Originally posted by Evil Dead✅ they don't do things properly, because if they do, they'll know they're wrong.
The problem with these religous folk is that they do not approach this scientific subject from any stance that could be loosely concieved as scientific. Their agenda is not to answer a question.......but to impose the beliefs residing in their minds onto other people, which is basically what religion is about in the first place. They take illogical steps to do so.
Originally posted by Evil DeadI have some assumptions about the big bang, but I'd rather not debate on ANYTHING to do with my big bang theories.
There is no way to know how the universe came into existence. No way to ever know. What existed before the first particle? What existed before the first bit of energy? No way to answer these questions at all. Their lack of logic comes into focus by their assertions.....
Originally posted by Evil Dead✅ they don't even listen to themselves sometimes.
Okay....somehow our universe came to be and we don't know how because everything had to begin at some point, right? That's how they open the door for their god answer. Next they claim that god had to create the universe. Okay, who created god then? They will say god always existed. When you point out that they just said 4 lines up that everything in existence had to have a beginning (including a god), they will just pretend they have gone deaf all of a sudden.
Originally posted by Evil Deadyou could say the universe always existed, but that I'm not sure about. I used to think that, but now I've got lots of crazy theories which I still don't want to mention.
That's one far-fetched fantastical step that is unnecissary. If we are to say something could have always existed, as they proclaim god, isn't it more logical to simply state the universe always existed? That's cutting out one highly illogical middle man.......who happens to be invisible...living in the sky.
Originally posted by Evil Deadyes, we are very uncertain. 🙂
As for intelligence....we humans have barely begun to scrape the surface on the subject. Out of the vast, un-imaginable size of our universe......we have only yet encountered one kind of complex intelligence, ourselves......and none greater. The highest pinnicle of intelligence we human can understand at this point is our own......and some humans never figured out how to program their VCRs. We humans could be at the bottom of the heap relative to intelligence in our universe. Our intelligence compared to that of other forms could be the equivelant of a flea's intelligence compared to our own. We ourselves may not be intelligent enough to understand the intelligence at work in our natural world.
Originally posted by Evil Deadyes, you could say it was designed at once in one big plan, or you could say lots of little plans from new traits, and development, and other factors. These factors then over millions of years get greater and greater and more complex, this says the present is a result of a magnificent process, AND, the cause of even greater stuff in the future.
This is where REAL intelligent design comes in........not some fake stuff about invisible people who watch and judge you. Human beings have been around what, a few hundred thousand years in various forms? In this relatively short period of time....we have gained intelligence to some as of yet unknown degree. We are not even sure how our intelligence came to be......we believe it to be attributed to some interactions between electro-chemical impulses and matter (tissue) in our brains. It has only taken a few hundred thousand years to attain this. Our universe is 14 billion years old........and most certainly contain electrical impulses, chemicals and matter in abundance. As we know, all interact with each other.......just as in our brain. Why not believe the universe itself has evolved a form of intelligence over the 14 billion year time scale given........galaxies or even clusters of galaxies could be to the universe what one receptor cell is to our brains. It's not religous hokus pokus......but is intelligent design none the less......a universal intelligence guiding the physiology of the universe, functions and interactions........even if through millions or billions of years of trial and error/natural selection.
ID is no more than a dumb thought that is basically against something, that that thing isn't anyway.
Originally posted by Arachnoidfreak
thats when they pull out their Bibles, JadenI hope you realize you are making a huge ass out of yourself. Not only is he older than you(which you probably didnt expect being that you asked in the first place) but your lack of knowledge is really noticable and your incessant triple posting is really, really annoying.
Stop bashing people. Pick up a few Biology and Physical Anthropology textbooks(although they're college level) and actually know something before you try to come and debate.
And this is coming from a guy who agrees with your point of view. You must really be f*cking up.
Don't be so hard on him,He hasn't even finished highschool.
Originally posted by jaden101
ok...if ID refutes macro evolution then why is it that there are species which can be dated to have existed in utterly different times on the earthno homonid ever existed in the same time frame as any dinosaur species yet the hominids must have come from somewhere
so if evolution only takes place within species then where did the later species come from?
This is something either I haven't found yet or ID ignores either way, it'salways good to do research.
Originally posted by The Omega
(Repeats herself)
I already posted it, you just choose to ignore it.