the 360 controller rules over all. some of us went over a friends house and played on his ps3 last night, i did good but that ps3 analog seems too high which ef's up my quick reaction movements. and it's too high up on the controller. (i don't ever play with the d-pad, unless i'm side stepping) the 360's analog is shorter and closer to my thumbs base which allows for faster movements for me. ps3's analog's more like a lever.
i fought with my friends sfv joystick and prefered the controller over it. i kept pressing the reverse commands on the joystick for some reason.
on another note, by the end of the week i will have mastered Bruce's secret "Sample Combo #3". It's an 8 hit juggler.
Originally posted by FistOfThe NorthI actually prefer the 360's d-pad as well. IMO, it sticks out more, you can really "feel" it.
the 360 controller rules over all. some of us went over a friends house and played on his ps3 last night, i did good but that ps3 analog seems too high which ef's up my quick reaction movements. and it's too high up on the controller. (i don't ever play with the d-pad, unless i'm side stepping) the 360's analog is shorter and closer to my thumbs base which allows for faster movements for me. ps3's analog's more like a lever.i fought with my friends sfv joystick and prefered the controller over it. i kept pressing the reverse commands on the joystick for some reason.
on another note, by the end of the week i will have mastered Bruce's secret "Sample Combo #3". It's an 8 hit juggler.
Originally posted by FistOfThe North
the 360 controller rules over all. some of us went over a friends house and played on his ps3 last night, i did good but that ps3 analog seems too high which ef's up my quick reaction movements. and it's too high up on the controller. (i don't ever play with the d-pad, unless i'm side stepping) the 360's analog is shorter and closer to my thumbs base which allows for faster movements for me. ps3's analog's more like a lever.i fought with my friends sfv joystick and prefered the controller over it. i kept pressing the reverse commands on the joystick for some reason.
on another note, by the end of the week i will have mastered Bruce's secret "Sample Combo #3". It's an 8 hit juggler.
With the d-pad it is a whole lot faster, especially when pressing 2 consecutive directions. They are only better when it comes to doing rotations...
Call me a goddamn tard...but when did Tekken in all of its life look better on their arcades than on their console versions?! jawdrop
And what sense is there in this? Why would Namco make a game that is graphically superior on a frucking machine you have to lug around with you and forces you do use huge buttons scattered over a surface (like a freaking fighting stick which I can't imagine someone using and winning in high level fights but you know...it's a weird world I guess)?
It makes so much more sense making Tekken/SF/whatever better looking on the home console that was released LATER IN TIME IN THE YEAR on a disc you can take out of your console to put in another game to play. Arcades, whether they are Tekken or Virtua Fighter are silly pieces of equipment that probably should have been obsolete since the start of the millenium. They are too clunky to even think of making IMO. Instead of making arcades, they could just release freaking demos of the game and have them tested that way. Demos that are similar to the arcades, of course. Arcades aren't going to have things like scenario campaign for example...but if the BR arcade does, then never mind.
I still find it effin blasphemous that apparently when it comes to graphics:
Tekken 6 Arcade/Tekken 6 BR Arcade > Tekken 6 (PS3) > Tekken 6 (360)
I mean God Damn...why can't they make the same just look the damn same? They already know they were making it for the PS3 so why'd they make the specs higher on the fat brick? Arcades are silly and stained by cheetos fingers, and smell like butt as well.
This is hilarious:YouTube video
Originally posted by FWahMaN
It's all about the d-pad. I don't understand how people can use analogs or joysticks unless they have very fast thumbs/wrists and magically can execute the right directions each time using an analog/joystick.With the d-pad it is a whole lot faster, especially when pressing 2 consecutive directions. They are only better when it comes to doing rotations...
that's the same way i feel about the dpad.
imo, it's too flat and too 2 dimensional for me especially when it's dealing with a (fast) 3d fighter like Tekken 6 which is why the analog stick is perfect cause it allows for more (thumb and game) roaming freedom with ease..
Originally posted by FistOfThe North...
that's the same way i feel about the dpad.imo, it's too flat and too 2 dimensional for me especially when it's dealing with a (fast) 3d fighter like Tekken 6 which is why the analog stick is perfect cause it allows for more (thumb and game) roaming freedom with ease..
What you just said was the total opposite of what I did dude, rofl.
I argued with someone the other night and they agreed with me, and we both met on Soul Calibur 4 and currently play Tekken 6. You will not agree with the following but this is why I think analogs suck when it comes to fighters, and are good pretty much only with 3rd person shooters/action adventure games, like Halo/Kingdom Hearts/Devil May Cry/Ninja Gaiden. For fighters, hell no (for me) because:
1. With the d-pad there is more confidence with pressing directions, meaning you're not shaking in your pants about pressing a direction you don't mean to press, because it's possible the console will read your analog right as right/up, or right/down. However with a d-pad, you basically FEEL what the right side of the d-pad feels like, and you know for a fact pressing right will make your character go forwards, and left will make your character go backwards, etc.
2. You also know HOW MUCH you have to press the d-pad unless for some reason it is so pressure sensitive. Usually with a d-pad you hear a click, to an extent, indicating you have DEFINITELY pressed the direction you're trying to press so there is more confidence due to this as well. This would not apply if your d-pad sucks (like the 360's, too bad the original Xbox had a better one which was perfect) or is malfunctioning.
3. You know how much (and this just means how hard, like in my second point) you have to press the d-pad, and another thing is you don't have to press it that hard/much. The result is fast movement in-game. I don't know about analog users, but pressing up+up, left+left, down+down, and then right+right is done considerably faster by me with a d-pad than an analog. In fact with an analog, if I tried to pull this off in the same amount of time I can (easily) do with a d-pad, at one point the console will very likely read a direction I didn't try to press (like instead of right+right, right+up/right 😆) since basically there's no way to tell how much up, up/right, down, down/right etc. takes up or spans, so you don't know where the line is that separates down from down/right. You're left guessing and it's all in your head where boundaries are separating directions...
4. I have less control. Seriously. The d-pad is fixed down where it is. You just press the friggin direction. Easy. With an analog/joystick, you are waving that thing around but I guess since you're used to it, you work that thing pretty well. I am dying to see someone's hands (in the case of an arcade stick) and someone's thumb (in the case of an analog on the PS3/360 controller) while they're playing in a high level Soul Calibur/DOA/Tekken match. I would probably gape at how they're using it.
Personally whenever I'm using an analog/joystick, I feel like I'm just going to wave that thing around like crazy, because I feel I have virtually no control with it whatsoever, and I don't know what the hell direction I'm pressing. K I'm done...
Oftentimes I read on forums that people usually get fighters on the PS3 instead JUST because of M$'s lack of quality as usual, this time being with their d-pad.
The only thing I use the analog for in fighters is left-right sequences. In other words for example, Jin has a 3 hit punch combo and the first punch is done by back+foreward then left punch (so on the 360 controller, it's back+forward, Y) and since the 360 d-pad is made of fail as usual, I use the analog instead for that because it's more guaranteed, but that's the only time I EVER use the analog in Tekken at least.
I understand if you're talking about something like the SNES d-pad which is pretty much crap, but the PS dualshock+PSP (virtually the same) d-pads are one of the best ever made, and the Xbox S Controller d-pad was nice. The 360 controller's would be the same as the Xbox S's, if only the well the d-pad resides in was wider. Ain't sanding down anything because of M$'s fault out of their numerous ones, either.
Seriously...when you truly play both of them inside out...
J-Stick>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Controller by like...100,000 miles, it's not even close.
J-Stick only feels like you can move all over the place is because your not used to it's controls and flexibility. Not only that, but the layout of the buttons on a J-Stick in contrast to a controller suites and is more comfortable with your hands and fingers naturally.
With things like shoulder buttons, a diamond shape button layout, try doing double taps or triple taps with those. In fact, you say you play Tekken 6 right...if you know what a Wavedash is, try doing that with a D-Pad...it's absolutely terrible and to make it even more, you can't even do the super quick WD's with the D-Pad, due to the fact that for J-Sticks you can lightly tap it with full control, while in contrast for the D-Pad, you cannot.
Obviously it's preference on what you like, however J-Stick gives you far greater flexibility then the D-Pad because of it's lay-out.
Lol, that can't be serious...
Wave dash as in the Mishima-like crouch dash? If so...
Lol indeed...just recently I tried doing that with an analog (works the same way as a joytick iirc) some days ago and it was/is still horrendous. End up jumping/doing some random unintended move instead. With a d-pad (a good one, like the dualshock's, PSP's, etc.) they are pulled off 90% of the time. With an analog/joystick, 10%. You have to move a stick to the right, then bring it back to center, then push it down, then down+forward just to do the damn crouch dash. With a d-pad, click forward, then down, then mush slightly to the forward position holding down+forward, and wala. Easier than the d-pad my ass. I know the effort difference is there since I try this all the time. I don't know what joystick/analog you're using that magically works wonders or is accurate and light as hell to push, and what craptastic d-pads you've experienced (my guess would be the 360 d-pad although that is preferable to its analog anyway), to be honest. Sure, this would have a lot to do with experience with both. The fact I perform twice as good as I do with an analog/joystick, and the fact countless people on forums ask "is there a good third part 360 controller with a good d-pad for fighting games?" could very well imply there's something regarding the d-pad joysticks are missing, or people just find joysticks difficult to use. If you can use one well, huge props. You deserve it having mastered using such a difficult method of maneuvering in fighters (for those who find it hard of course).
@ Satosa: Why is it for VF sticks are ok but for other fighters it is not (for you of course)?
the other fighters seem to use a semi traditional means of executing commands.. VF on the other hand requires some precise / fast inputs to bust the moves out... akiras classic soloplex thrust > elbow to the back > double palm knockdown combo comes to mind.. I just couldnt find myself trying it on the d-pad.. I think i got it to work 2 times on the saturn pad and then never again XD
as for wave dashing.. i'm pretty sure thats the technique that you see in tourney vids where it looks like the characters are spazzing out.. it allows for easier access to a dash at any given time
Originally posted by FWahMaN
Lol, that can't be serious...Wave dash as in the Mishima-like crouch dash? [b]If
so...Lol indeed...just recently I tried doing that with an analog (works the same way as a joytick iirc) some days ago and it was/is still horrendous. End up jumping/doing some random unintended move instead. With a d-pad (a good one, like the dualshock's, PSP's, etc.) they are pulled off 90% of the time. With an analog/joystick, 10%. You have to move a stick to the right, then bring it back to center, then push it down, then down+forward just to do the damn crouch dash. With a d-pad, click forward, then down, then mush slightly to the forward position holding down+forward, and wala. Easier than the d-pad my ass. I know the effort difference is there since I try this all the time. I don't know what joystick/analog you're using that magically works wonders or is accurate and light as hell to push, and what craptastic d-pads you've experienced (my guess would be the 360 d-pad although that is preferable to its analog anyway), to be honest. Sure, this would have a lot to do with experience with both. The fact I perform twice as good as I do with an analog/joystick, and the fact countless people on forums ask "is there a good third part 360 controller with a good d-pad for fighting games?" could very well imply there's something regarding the d-pad joysticks are missing, or people just find joysticks difficult to use. If you can use one well, huge props. You deserve it having mastered using such a difficult method of maneuvering in fighters (for those who find it hard of course). [/B]
I'm going to go down on paper right now and say this...
J-Stick>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Analog, I don't know why you would even bother comparing an Analog to a J-Stick. Because an analog, you are basically using only your thumb, while a j-stick, you are utilizing your entire palm and fingers to control it.
Also, Wavedashes can be done in multiple forms, not just one. Have you ever tried doing "Light" WD's w/ a D-Pad? It's an absolute nightmare and it is nearly impossible to do consistently, while upon the J-Stick, it is much easier due to the fact that you have much greater control. When controlling someone like Tag Jin back in the days when WDing was more difficult to do, you had to utilize long WD's and Light WD mixups. If you tried executing the same formula upon a D-Pad, you would be fighting to do this strategical advantage. The neutral point of the J-Stick is better, and not only that, but you can cut the crouch much more quickly with the J-Stick because stopping at the mid-way point is much easier, where as on a D-Pad...pressing and stopping at the mid-point is extremely difficult due to the fact that the d-pad is a stiff cross control.
So I disagree with you on this notion, of the D-Pad giving better control, the J-Stick still has far greater freedom and control over the D-Pad.
Also You performing better on a D-Pad is contradictory when you yourself say that you really don't know how to use a J-Stick at all, and thus consider it not as good as a D-Pad, so if you ask me, how does that logic even really work?
If your simply talking about the "analog" stick like that on a PS3 then yes, I can "agree" with you somewhat, however again, when mastered on the analogy, it can potentially benefit your controls even more so then the D-Pad when playing characters like Mishima's because, stopping at the mid points is much easier when you've fully mastered the control of it.
Check Out Jang Iksu's Hand's when Wavedashing with a J-Stick...you can't do it this fast or consistently with a D-Pad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZ4fAqSInnc&feature=related
Originally posted by SaTsuJiNIf that's so, then it's probably not what I mentioned.
as for wave dashing.. i'm pretty sure thats the technique that you see in tourney vids where it looks like the characters are spazzing out.. it allows for easier access to a dash at any given time
By the way I was referring to a d-pad similar to the dualshock's and/or Xbox S Controller's (which is the same as the 360 only with a wider well giving the d-pad more space) because very early d-pads that look like Christian crosses are horrible with diagonals, IIRC.
In fact, a d-pad like the Xbox's/360's is similar to a joystick in that you can tilt it to the right, left, north and so on, but this is kind of like any other d-pad as well. What matters most is how precise a device is and how well you can use it. There's not really a clear winner. There's just the argument "there are more people who can use the d-pad/joystick with great ease than there are people who can use the other tool, with great ease".
Originally posted by FWahMaN
By the way I was referring to a d-pad similar to the dualshock's and/or Xbox S Controller's (which is the same as the 360 only with a wider well giving the d-pad more space) because very early d-pads that look like Christian crosses are horrible with diagonals, IIRC.In fact, a d-pad like the Xbox's/360's is similar to a joystick in that you can tilt it to the right, left, north and so on, but this is kind of like any other d-pad as well. What matters most is how precise a device is and how well you can use it. There's not really a clear winner. There's just the argument "there are more people who can use the d-pad/joystick with great ease than there are people who can use the other tool, with great ease".
That doesn't remove the fact that when you've mastered the two, J-Stick gives better control and overall flexibility due to the fact it gives you full control without having to be "exact". Your telling me shoulder buttons and all is better then having all of your buttons laid out in front of your finger tips?
Try doing a 3-button hit with a D-Pad is alot more of a pain then doing it on a J-Stick. Also the 360 Pad you speak is no different then the Sega Genesis pad, the fact remains simple...you look to Tekken, and doing Light dashing on a J-stick is 100x easier, then trying to ever attempt it on a D-Pad...that's a fact.
The Dual Shock Controller's "diagnols" I'm sorry to say are absolutely horrible to try and do the Light Dash with. Again, the simple reason is that...a D-Pad is one whole solid "block" therefore it's harder to achieve the "lighter" taps within it. Why do you think more "d-pad" players struggle to achieve Light Dashing in Tekken, or short jumps in CvS2 on a D-Pad, "if" the capabilities are the same?
I'll also go on record right now as well, people whom in my time when I used to do tournaments. The ones who mainly used pad were not proficient enough in J-Stick in the first place, and more importantly did not practice enough with a J-Stick and therefore preferred a pad over it. That is the scenario for all pad users, because that was the one they started out with, however practice with both to the elite level equally, and I guarantee 100% you'll drop the pad if it came down to a real competition for the J-Stick.
wow, is anyone playin' tekken at all?
why isn't anyone posting anything about the best fighter on the planet.
i have dozens of games but tekken 6 is the one i play the most. it's the funnest, most engaging and the most challenging game i have. honestly i can't get enough of tekken but the last post on this game happened last winter.
wow.
so does anyone still play. Bruce irvin's my main. i'm a juggle monster with him, i'm now trying to master wall splat combos. my secondary is lili.
I just picked up jin about 4 days ago and i've halfway mastered him.
my teams now called the 4 horsemen. team triple 3 b's and jin as their leader. bruce, bob, and beak. and now i'm off to my cousins house to challenge his team: delta squad II since i annihilated delta squad 1 in front of 7 witnesses, all tekken fiends, with just team triple B just last month. i say bring it. he added 2 more members than before totaling to 7.
his team's all dressed in black and he purchased the strategy guide since then. he may've gotten better but so have i, with jin that its, (kinda) and it's time to put jin to the test now. my ultimate tekken goal: my friend, and his team: the assassinators, he's the current tekken champ amoung us, as well. but that's later in the week.
but for now, peace. and i'll let you know what happened afterwards in all honesty.
now. on to battle..