So you could make the argument that Montana was the best relative to his time, but if you could choose to draft either in their youth today, it would be silly to take him over Brady or Manning. The latter two are simply playing in a better era, just like how modern Force users tend to be better than ancient ones. 🙂
Originally posted by MS Warehouse
He wasn't dominating the NBA at 19. He wasn't the best player until he was what, 23-24? Lived up to expectations? Uh that depends on what those are. Comparable stats? Barely. Did more with less? You're kidding right? He's not doing more with less, he's doing less with less. As far as overachieved in the finals, when? The 73-9 Warriors had no resemblance to their regular season selfs by ever stat imaginable. So he didn't overachieve. And lets say he did for argument's sake. That gets canceled out by his 2011 NBA finals where he stunk up the joint. He can make a case for top 5, even top 2 but not really for #1.
27-7-7 is by all means dominating. And at age 20-21 he was averaging 31-7-7, actually outplaying Kobe in his vaunted 35-5-5 season.
Most People and pundits literally expected Lebron to win multiple championships and dominate the league and be superior to Jordan. It's hard to comprehend how ludicrous that level of pressure is. And look how many failed: from AI to Grant Hill to TMac to Vince Carter.
Lebron is very slightly inferior in all advanced statistics except BPM, where he supersedes Jordan.
Taking the 2007 team to the Finals is more impressive than anything Jordan ever did in terms of doing more with less.
Overachieved relative to the amount of times he was favored. Jordan was favored 6 times, won 6. Lebron was favored once, won 3.
I agree. I never said Lebron was actually better than Jordan-he's not. I'm just saying that a case can be made, which, even if it's not much of a case, can't be argued with.
And at age 20-21 he was averaging 31-7-7, actually outplaying Kobe in his vaunted 35-5-5 season.
Most People and pundits literally expected Lebron to win multiple championships and dominate the league and be superior to Jordan. It's hard to comprehend how ludicrous that level of pressure is. And look how many failed: from AI to Grant Hill to TMac to Vince Carter.
Taking the 2007 team to the Finals is more impressive than anything Jordan ever did in terms of doing more with less.
Overachieved relative to the amount of times he was favored. Jordan was favored 6 times, won 6. Lebron was favored once, won 3.
Originally posted by MS Warehouse
Exactly what year is this?Most people do NOT expect Lebron to be better than MJ. I don't know where you got this.
That's not more with less. More with less would be winning more titles than Jordan or having historically greater teams than Jordan. None of this has actually happened so the correct concept would be "less with less".
Lebron was favored in 2011, don't remember 2012, was favored in 2013 or 2014. So in the 3 titles that he won, he was favored in 2 of those. Jordan was favored each time because he was Jordan and his teams were great because of that fact.
1. 2005-2006. Lebron had better advanced stats across the board, and I'm pretty sure his team got farther in the playoffs, though don't quote me on that.
2. My mistake, I meant people expected him to sort of be the next MJ.
3. Basically, I'm trying to say when they had comparably shitty teams, Lebron did much better in the regular season and playoffs than Jordan did. And Jordan's supporting cast, mainly during the 2nd 3-peat, is better than Lebron had/has.
4. You're right: favored in 2011, not in 2007, not 2012, favored in 2013, not 2014, not 2015, not 2016. In the 3 titles he won, he was favored in 1. Jordan was favored each time because his team was better, and of course because of his individual greatness. When the Heat really came together in 2013, they were the heavy favorites to defeat an absolutely excellent Spurs team. Lebron's supporting cast for the most part is inferior to what Jordan had. In the 2014 Finals, DWade and Bosh were literally nowhere to be found, and the Spurs played their best basketball ever. In 2015, injuries. Not exactly favorable circumstances.
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZlook at the teams in the east in both eras, that's your answer. Also i believe jordan had less help than lebron until pippen came.
doesnt really explain how Jordan's 30-win teams were still making the playoffs, while Lebron's above .500 Cavs weren't in his first season or two. mmm
Originally posted by JmanghanHe can't throw the ball as accurately as Aaron Rodgers. We saw Cam exposed when he went up against that Broncos defense. He came apart on the biggest stage. There was no more dabbing and he pouted in the post game.
Thats why he's been beating him out the entire year? Hmm.
Originally posted by MS WarehouseEli didn't rattle Brady it was that defense. That being said Eli was clutch as **** but it doesn't mean Eli's better than Brady just that he had his teams number twice on the biggest stage on the planet.
If Brady is the greatest of all time and Eli is 2-0 against Brady, does that make Eli goddamn Manning the greatest of all time? HmmAlso Tim Duncan has to be the classiest athlete of all time.
Originally posted by quanchi112Eli was at his absolute best against Brady both times. That 3-4 defense the first time around was all time great though
Eli didn't rattle Brady it was that defense. That being said Eli was clutch as **** but it doesn't mean Eli's better than Brady just that he had his teams number twice on the biggest stage on the planet.