Exar Kun and DN Luke Vs Rots Sidious and ROts Yoda

Hyperbole? Uhhh, no it's a direct statement in REGARDS TO COMBAT. And Yoda's still called the most powerful force of light that's ever lived up to that point

Prove no other Jedi has greater skills? He was the foremost fighter and master of the golden age of fighting and is declared the strongest and fiercest enemy the darkness had EVER known. Proven.

Yeah, don't use 'blew up a star', because Kun did no such thing. And that freezing thing? Exceeded. That's all Kun has going for him.

In other words: "I can use totally unsupported numbers just because I want to!"

And *Yawn* Raynar stronger than Sidious, who was channeling the entire Dark Side. try again.

And I'll fail? You're trying tos ay "The strongest foe the darkness had ever known.' is nothing but exaggeration when put in several official sources.

Hey, it's my 7000 post!

Hyperbole? Uhhh, no it's a direct statement in REGARDS TO COMBAT. And Yoda's still called the most powerful force of light that's ever lived up to that point

Are you referring to the statement from the NEGtC? If so, then know that I have read and that I know full well that it is not specifically referring to combat.

Prove no other Jedi has greater skills? He was the foremost fighter and master of the golden age of fighting and is declared the strongest and fiercest enemy the darkness had EVER known. Proven.

Notice that "had ever known". It is not referring to those who came after him. If it was, it would say "ever knew". There is a MASSIVE difference between the two.

The foremost fighter of an age of fighting? The Jedi are AGAINST fighting, hence a Golden Age for the Jedi would be a time that had as little fighting as possible.

Yeah, don't use 'blew up a star', because Kun did no such thing. And that freezing thing? Exceeded. That's all Kun has going for him.

No it isn't. I found the post and I'll put it lower in my post.

In other words: "I can use totally unsupported numbers just because I want to!"

They are supported. If you're to blind to see that it's your problem, not mine.

And *Yawn* Raynar stronger than Sidious, who was channeling the entire Dark Side. try again.

Do you have a source for this ****?

And I'll fail? You're trying tos ay "The strongest foe the darkness had ever known.' is nothing but exaggeration when put in several official sources.

Which were?

we look at the difference between ROTJ Sidious and DE Sidious we can see pretty well what the difference is, meaning what the additional power gained from the planet did to him. Sort of at least.

The most powerful feat that we see Sidious do it in ROTS when he lifts three of the Senate Pods into the air high above his head. There is only one way to do this that I can think of. You guessed it, math and science.

BTW, rather then just labeling this pseudoscience like I know you will try to do, prove it wrong if you can.

Lets say that each Senate Pod weighs 150 metric tons. Obviously this is an extremely generous estimate, as thats far more then even a main battle tank. Lets also say that Sidious raised the pods 300 meters into the air. Again, this is extremely generous in YOU"RE favor. And then lets say that he raised the pods to the entire distance in a single second.

So, ROTS Sidious was able to move 150 metric tons with an acceleration of 300 meters per second.

Let's just plug these numbers into the formula: F = m*a

150,000 * 300 = 45,000,000 newtons of force behind that lift. That is a lot.
^The reason that it is 150,000 rather then 150 is because the kilogram is the base unit, not the metric ton.

This equates to 45,000,000 watts as well, as it was done over the course of a single second. Very impressive.

However, DE Sidious has one feat which is FAR more impressive.

Any of the following in bold is a direct quote from stardestroyer.net, which is a very reliable source. But don't take my word for it, check it out yourself.

If ISDs carry 200 Turbolasers (as suggested by blueprints), then they must average around 2.5 million terawatts of sustained firepower per cannon. Of course, there are different sized cannons, some releasing less power than this, and some more.

The common belief is that ISDs carry 60 turbolasers. This is very conservative, since 64 cannons are mounted immediately lateral to the command superstructure alone, with scores covering the rest of the hull. However, if we assume there are only 60 cannons, then they must average around 8 million terawatts of firepower each.

^ quoted from the turbolasers commentary section, under the firepower page. If you want to see all of the proof behind it, it's there.

Since 200 turbolasers appears to be the actual number for the number of turbolasers, we'll go with each turbolaser having an output of 2.5 million terrawats.

In the opening scene of AHN we see approximately 25 turbolaser blasts fired from an ISD in 5 seconds. That equates to 5 shots per second.

We see in ROTJ that the Mon Calamari cruisers were able to go 30 minutes before their shields started to fail.

Lets add the above up.

2.5 terrawatts * 5 shots per second = 12.5 terrawatts of fire taken by the shields EVERY SINGLE SECOND.

The cruisers were able to survive for 1,800 seconds before their shields started to fail. From this we can discover how much energy the shields were capable of absorbing.

12,500,000,000,000 watts * 1,800(seconds) = 2.25e+16 watts

2.25e+16 watts means 22,500,000,000,000,000 watts of energy. That is a LOT.

Now, to find out how much more powerful DE Sidious is then ROTS Sidious, we look at how much enery Sidious would have generate in the same amount of time, ASSUMING THAT SIDIOUS WOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO KEEP UP THE MAXIMUM BURTS OF ENERGY FOR AN ENTIRE HALF ON WITHOUT REST!! This is extremely in YOUR favor, as the chance of Sidious being able to keep up the maximum burts of energy that we seen from him for an entire half hour is practically zero.

45,000,000watts(the amount of power Sidious produced, as calculated above) * 1,800(seconds) = 81,000,000,000 watts

Since DE Sidious destroyed a fleet with his force storms, we can calculate that how much stronger DE SIdious was then ROTS Sidious.

22,500,000,000,000,000 watts - 81,000,000,000 watts = 2.2499919e+16 watts

2.2499919e+16 = (rounded) 22,499,920,000,000,000 watts.

That is a huge difference in energy.

But wait, there's more.

22,499,920,000,000,000 watts * 375 planets = 8.43747e+18 watts

8.43747e+18 watts = 8,437,470,000,000,000 watts

Notice that the above calculations are based on the idea that DE Sidious only destroyed a single Mon Calamari Cruiser with his force storms. The actual number would be several times higher, as he took on an entire fleet of them.

Notice that I have been extremely generous in your favor throughout proving the power of 375 planets. If you can, prove me wrong. The proof is there, stardestroyer.net.

But what does the above number mean? A lot really. We just have to put it into perspective with Exar.

If we look at Exar's instakill, which you parade around as being able to blast through walls, we will so learn who was more powerful, Raynar or Exar.

Since I don't know through how much of the Temple Exar's blast went through, I am going to assume that he blasted through a rectangular prism that is 10 meters tall, 10 meters wide, and a hundred meters deep and made of iron with such force that he vaporised the entire cube.

He(Wong) states that, to cause flashes that large, the weapons must have vaporised at least one cubic meter of armor. If so, and we assume that the Death Star is made of iron; the four X-Wing cannons output approximately 60 GJ of energy.

So, we can see from this that a block of iron that is one meter long will take 60 GJ of energy to vaporize. If it is done in one second, it will equal 60 GW. If it is done in a tenth of a second it will take 600 GW.

The rectangle that I mentioned Exar blasting through with enough force to vaporise has a mass that is 10,000 times greater then a one meter long cube. 10 * 10 = 100. 100 * 100 = 10,000.

So, we take 600 GW and multiply it by 10,000 and we get 6e+15watts. If he did it very quickly, that number could easily become 6e+18 watts.

6e+18 = 6,000,000,000,000,000,000 watts

To find out which blast is more powerful the the other and by how much, we'll take Raynar's power figure and divide it by Kun's.

8,437,470,000,000,000,000 watts / 6,000,000,000,000,000,000 watts = 1.406245

This shows that Raynar had roughly 40% more power then Exar did. Don't forget that Luke overpowered Raynar.

Prove me wrong if you can.

The novelization, Power of the JEdi, Clone Wars sourcebook.

And since it was the golden age of skills for the Jedi? And 'had ever known'...meaning, ever up until that point, case closed.

Meaning they're your opinion only. Try actually canon facts.

Dark Empire and SW Insider as my source. Sidious channeled the entire Dark Side, try again!

And once more: Bullshit statistics. Try again. That's really all I need to prove you wrong, considering you just change how impressive a feat is considering which character you favor.

Exar's insta kill? Mmmhmm, he so had one. He only killed an ancient, near death guy. And Sidious destroyed a fleet, nice job actually, y'know, READING. If you want to use math and science, how are there explosions in space? Is Ludo KRessh so weak he can't move a damaged ship? Why is there noise in space? Why does SW break numerous laws of motion and physics on a regular basis?

And when exar was using his OWN power and not a Sith gauntlet, get back to me

Once more: Yoda is declared the strongest until that point, period

And Yoda's stated to have mastered all the powers of the lightside. Is that hyperbole too?

Originally posted by Lightsnake
The novelization, Power of the JEdi, Clone Wars sourcebook.

And since it was the golden age of skills for the Jedi? And 'had ever known'...meaning, ever up until that point, case closed.

The strongest Jedi up until that point, sure. Jedi aren't Sith.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Meaning they're your opinion only. Try actually canon facts.

Nah, they're supported.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Dark Empire and SW Insider as my source. Sidious channeled the entire Dark Side, try again!

I'm not taking you BS word for it. Where in Dark Empire does it say that? What comic, what page?

Originally posted by Lightsnake
And once more: Bullshit statistics. Try again. That's really all I need to prove you wrong, considering you just change how impressive a feat is considering which character you favor.

For your information, I was arguing AGAINST Exar in that thread. You can't prove my statistics wrong, or at least have failed to do so, meaning I am right.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Exar's insta kill? Mmmhmm, he so had one. He only killed an ancient, near death guy. And Sidious destroyed a fleet, nice job actually, y'know, READING. If you want to use math and science, how are there explosions in space? Is Ludo KRessh so weak he can't move a damaged ship? Why is there noise in space? Why does SW break numerous laws of motion and physics on a regular basis?

Check power levels. BTW, why do you keep making references to DE Sidious. This thread is about ROTS Sidious.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
And when exar was using his OWN power and not a Sith gauntlet, get back to me

Once more: Yoda is declared the strongest until that point, period

Who cares if Exar was using a Sith gauntlet. He's not going to be fighting in the nude, so he will have it.

Strongest Jedi, not strongest period. Stop lying about quotes.

Your point being? Strongest foe of the darkness up til that point...doesn't just include Jedi and puts him bounds ahead of Exar.

You can't use math that way, pal. Try again when you realize that these statistics don't exist anywhere but in your opinion.

DE appendix, in the originally published volumes, when they go on about the book of anger and the like. SW Insider and Hyperspace when they practically narrarate the big duel.

I need to prove that crap wrong? You do a fair job of it yourself.
Ok: Do these statisstics show up in anything official? No? Then they don't mean a DAMN.

And the NEC called Sidious the strongest Sith ever by ROTS with intimate knowledge of Exar. End all be all? Nope...a step in my direction if you can use those little statistics? Yep.

And Good Guys?Bad guys, Yoda knows every technique of the Jedi, has faced the dark side, is the strongest Jedi master up til that point and the strongest enemy of the Darkness as well as the strongest force of light. All this is enough to put him well above Exar.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Hey, it's my 7000 post!

[b]Hyperbole? Uhhh, no it's a direct statement in REGARDS TO COMBAT. And Yoda's still called the most powerful force of light that's ever lived up to that point

Are you referring to the statement from the NEGtC? If so, then know that I have read and that I know full well that it is not specifically referring to combat.

Prove no other Jedi has greater skills? He was the foremost fighter and master of the golden age of fighting and is declared the strongest and fiercest enemy the darkness had EVER known. Proven.

Notice that "had ever known". It is not referring to those who came after him. If it was, it would say "ever knew". There is a MASSIVE difference between the two.

The foremost fighter of an age of fighting? The Jedi are AGAINST fighting, hence a Golden Age for the Jedi would be a time that had as little fighting as possible.

Yeah, don't use 'blew up a star', because Kun did no such thing. And that freezing thing? Exceeded. That's all Kun has going for him.

No it isn't. I found the post and I'll put it lower in my post.

In other words: "I can use totally unsupported numbers just because I want to!"

They are supported. If you're to blind to see that it's your problem, not mine.

And *Yawn* Raynar stronger than Sidious, who was channeling the entire Dark Side. try again.

Do you have a source for this ****?

And I'll fail? You're trying tos ay "The strongest foe the darkness had ever known.' is nothing but exaggeration when put in several official sources.

Which were?

we look at the difference between ROTJ Sidious and DE Sidious we can see pretty well what the difference is, meaning what the additional power gained from the planet did to him. Sort of at least.

The most powerful feat that we see Sidious do it in ROTS when he lifts three of the Senate Pods into the air high above his head. There is only one way to do this that I can think of. You guessed it, math and science.

BTW, rather then just labeling this pseudoscience like I know you will try to do, prove it wrong if you can.

Lets say that each Senate Pod weighs 150 metric tons. Obviously this is an extremely generous estimate, as thats far more then even a main battle tank. Lets also say that Sidious raised the pods 300 meters into the air. Again, this is extremely generous in YOU"RE favor. And then lets say that he raised the pods to the entire distance in a single second.

So, ROTS Sidious was able to move 150 metric tons with an acceleration of 300 meters per second.

Let's just plug these numbers into the formula: F = m*a

150,000 * 300 = 45,000,000 newtons of force behind that lift. That is a lot.
^The reason that it is 150,000 rather then 150 is because the kilogram is the base unit, not the metric ton.

This equates to 45,000,000 watts as well, as it was done over the course of a single second. Very impressive.

However, DE Sidious has one feat which is FAR more impressive.

Any of the following in bold is a direct quote from stardestroyer.net, which is a very reliable source. But don't take my word for it, check it out yourself.

If ISDs carry 200 Turbolasers (as suggested by blueprints), then they must average around 2.5 million terawatts of sustained firepower per cannon. Of course, there are different sized cannons, some releasing less power than this, and some more.

The common belief is that ISDs carry 60 turbolasers. This is very conservative, since 64 cannons are mounted immediately lateral to the command superstructure alone, with scores covering the rest of the hull. However, if we assume there are only 60 cannons, then they must average around 8 million terawatts of firepower each.

^ quoted from the turbolasers commentary section, under the firepower page. If you want to see all of the proof behind it, it's there.

Since 200 turbolasers appears to be the actual number for the number of turbolasers, we'll go with each turbolaser having an output of 2.5 million terrawats.

In the opening scene of AHN we see approximately 25 turbolaser blasts fired from an ISD in 5 seconds. That equates to 5 shots per second.

We see in ROTJ that the Mon Calamari cruisers were able to go 30 minutes before their shields started to fail.

Lets add the above up.

2.5 terrawatts * 5 shots per second = 12.5 terrawatts of fire taken by the shields EVERY SINGLE SECOND.

The cruisers were able to survive for 1,800 seconds before their shields started to fail. From this we can discover how much energy the shields were capable of absorbing.

12,500,000,000,000 watts * 1,800(seconds) = 2.25e+16 watts

2.25e+16 watts means 22,500,000,000,000,000 watts of energy. That is a LOT.

Now, to find out how much more powerful DE Sidious is then ROTS Sidious, we look at how much enery Sidious would have generate in the same amount of time, ASSUMING THAT SIDIOUS WOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO KEEP UP THE MAXIMUM BURTS OF ENERGY FOR AN ENTIRE HALF ON WITHOUT REST!! This is extremely in YOUR favor, as the chance of Sidious being able to keep up the maximum burts of energy that we seen from him for an entire half hour is practically zero.

45,000,000watts(the amount of power Sidious produced, as calculated above) * 1,800(seconds) = 81,000,000,000 watts

Since DE Sidious destroyed a fleet with his force storms, we can calculate that how much stronger DE SIdious was then ROTS Sidious.

22,500,000,000,000,000 watts - 81,000,000,000 watts = 2.2499919e+16 watts

2.2499919e+16 = (rounded) 22,499,920,000,000,000 watts.

That is a huge difference in energy.

But wait, there's more.

22,499,920,000,000,000 watts * 375 planets = 8.43747e+18 watts

8.43747e+18 watts = 8,437,470,000,000,000 watts

Notice that the above calculations are based on the idea that DE Sidious only destroyed a single Mon Calamari Cruiser with his force storms. The actual number would be several times higher, as he took on an entire fleet of them.

Notice that I have been extremely generous in your favor throughout proving the power of 375 planets. If you can, prove me wrong. The proof is there, stardestroyer.net.

But what does the above number mean? A lot really. We just have to put it into perspective with Exar.

If we look at Exar's instakill, which you parade around as being able to blast through walls, we will so learn who was more powerful, Raynar or Exar.

Since I don't know through how much of the Temple Exar's blast went through, I am going to assume that he blasted through a rectangular prism that is 10 meters tall, 10 meters wide, and a hundred meters deep and made of iron with such force that he vaporised the entire cube.

He(Wong) states that, to cause flashes that large, the weapons must have vaporised at least one cubic meter of armor. If so, and we assume that the Death Star is made of iron; the four X-Wing cannons output approximately 60 GJ of energy.

So, we can see from this that a block of iron that is one meter long will take 60 GJ of energy to vaporize. If it is done in one second, it will equal 60 GW. If it is done in a tenth of a second it will take 600 GW.

The rectangle that I mentioned Exar blasting through with enough force to vaporise has a mass that is 10,000 times greater then a one meter long cube. 10 * 10 = 100. 100 * 100 = 10,000.

So, we take 600 GW and multiply it by 10,000 and we get 6e+15watts. If he did it very quickly, that number could easily become 6e+18 watts.

6e+18 = 6,000,000,000,000,000,000 watts

To find out which blast is more powerful the the other and by how much, we'll take Raynar's power figure and divide it by Kun's.

8,437,470,000,000,000,000 watts / 6,000,000,000,000,000,000 watts = 1.406245

This shows that Raynar had roughly 40% more power then Exar did. Don't forget that Luke overpowered Raynar.

Prove me wrong if you can. [/B]

Glentract not that I'm trying to be a dick but how do you think the term 'Glentract math' originated.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
And the NEC called Sidious the strongest Sith ever by ROTS

Erm, did you miss the email that Dan sent in response to a EoD member, here?. It effectively makes that line nothing but a point of view.

And Good Guys?Bad guys, Yoda knows every technique of the Jedi,

Erm, more hyperbole?

has faced the dark side,

WTF? This line barely makes sense. Are you just making more things up, Lightsnake?

is the strongest Jedi master up til that point

More unsubstantiated hyperbole

and the strongest enemy of the Darkness

More nonsensical, unsubstantiatable hyperbole.

as well as the strongest force of light.

Erm, more hyperbole.

All this is enough to put him well above Exar.

No, we've got nothing more than your idle conjecture and nonsensical hyperbolic statements that border on delusional.

-

Seriously, WTF Lightsnake? This is just a complete crock of shit. It's crap, quite frankly; even by your standards.

Hey Traya why don't you present an argument for Exar?

I'm surprised she didn't notice Glentract's mathematical nightmare...

Erm, don't be so presumptuous about who I support. I'm merely pointing out the nonsense that LS spouted.

Originally posted by Jonathan Mark
I'm surprised she didn't notice Glentract's mathematical nightmare...

I noticed it.

Not even going to touch this one.

Though, I will say that I'm not even going to pretend that I have the mathmatical comprehension or capabilities to even begin translating that jargon, Glentract, you've been throwing that stuff out in your debates since as long as I've been here. I suppose because I lack the skill to even begin understanding, I've never really appreciated it, nor have I considered it proof at all.

But, you and Lightsnake both have a problem. Of dismissing things as "hyperbole". Exaggeration really isn't something that a 'source book' or a 'guide' would use, now would it, since it is there to provide 'fact'.

Because certain articles of information and sources state things that neither of you like, you dismiss it as hyperbole. Stop it. It's incredibly immature, and shows that you really have no form of countering each other's argument except to attempt to 'dismiss' the statements of other sources.

It's come to this, has it?

Sadly, it has. Although Glen had a good post, and made his point.

Originally posted by Admiral Akbar
Sadly, it has. Although Glen had a good post, and made his point.

I consider Glentract and Lightsnake to be exceptional debators. As I said, I lack the mathmatical skills to comprehend Glentract's 'facts'. But that doesn't mean that they aren't true. So what? Glentract's a fine debator.

People dislike Lightsnake because he blasphemes the anti-Sidious environment. So screw the people who just dislike his opinion.

My problem is that this has become completely immature.

As I said before, he did not set out to kill Kun.

Then tell me how he wasn't trying as hard as Kun. Because Kun initially wanted to recruit Vodo - hell, he was talking to him about it for the entire match up until he unleashed his double-bladed lightsaber. You call me bias? LOL. Shut up, noob and back up the claim.

One can't battle to the best of their abilities when holding back from killing them. I thought this was obvious.

Kun was trying to recruit Vodo, you dolt. I thought as much was obvious:

The "join me" on the page before, and trying to turn Vodo to Kun's cause is the exact same thing Vodo was doing - so to say Kun was giving it his all is nonsensical bullshit - which seems to be all of what you spew anyways.

Now, I've backed up my claims of why Kun wasn't even giving it his all, and was doing the same as Vodo. Didn't you notice Kun easily cleaved Vodo in-half once he "turned on the juice"? Similiar to Vader and Luke's duel during ESB. As I've said you are nothing but ridiculous, and can't offer anything valid to an argument besides unsupported, and quite frankly absurd, assumptions. I provide scans, logical arguments, and the like - can't say the same for you though.

These assumptions are all nice but the fact remains that the comic does not even hint or imply that Kun was 'tooling' him.

Kun was toying with him - and the comic shows as much. Vodo and Kun exchange words, once Kun realizes he can't turn Vodo, he ignites the other side of the saber, and cleaves Vodo in HALF with ONE SIDE. You are so crazy, seriously. You downplay to the end, even when I show scans, and logical arguments - to call me a "fangirl" is laughable. I could say the same for you, but more or less you're just ignorant.

Oh, and also - Kun was STILL telling him to join him AFTER he ignites the other end of the saber, THAT much tells me he was toying with him:

Your rebuttal? I expect nothing more from you than:

"Etc, etc, etc, etc - B1AS!!//1ELEVENz0mg!!!! LUK3 pwn5 A1L/ glauifgudsav."

Seems all you do is just that, no logical arguments - just ridiculous claims, and when I refute them properly - as said - you say "z0mg bias!!//!".

That is just your interpretation of it and a very biased one if you ask me.

Sorry, no one asked you, troll. And tell me - how is it bias? Because I go based off the comic, logic and you go based off...well, nothing.

My interpretation was that Kun was giving his all and could simply not break through Vodo's defence by outdueling him.

Then what the f*ck is destroying his stick? That is outdueling him, he broke through his defense - his defense was the stick.

Instead he had to destroy his stick. Also can you please explain how all the dark side knowledge and sith magic that Kun has learnt would improve his dueling ability.

Considering the Dark side makes you stronger as we all know from watching the movies, reading the books, hearing from Lucas. Oh, and considering when he dueled Vodo the first time:

That happened when he wasn't a master of the Darkside, hadn't gain vast amounts of knowledge - and yes, knowledge turns into power in Star Wars, and his first duel with Vodo as a padawan, he wasn't even a master lightsaber duelist - now he is:

Anymore laughable assertions, child?

However that quote was obviously wrong and innaccurate as we have seen a saber destroy the stick twice in DLOTS and TSW. Vodo was simply wrong.

Really, so the omniscient narrator is wrong? You said it had a "weakness", I didn't see any mention of this crap. Furthermore, the second time they met he broke the stick in-half with one side, showing the mere strength of Exar Kun.

As did Arca Jeth. At least Coleman got killed by the best bounty hunter in the galaxy at the time. Arca Jeth got killed by simple Krath droids.

Irrelevant.

Did I say I was going to refute it? It all makes perfect sence to me. However you canot ignore the fact that Kun did set out to kill Aleema.

If you aren't going to refute it, there is no room to keep making the claim. That's obvious in even a Star Wars debate.

If he had some uber technique with his amulets, don't you think he would have used it?

Why didn't Sidious use one of his instakills on Luke? Why didn't Dooku use Force lightning at every turn? Why didn't so and so use this power on him or her? Why didn't Nomi strip everybody of the Force? Why didn't Kreia use her instakill at every chance? Thought so, I'll treat your points as defeated until you come up with something, or at least refute my damn argument.

Add on the fact that that is the only time we have ever seen it being used against a force user. It was both simple and innefective. The fact that you are even trying to argue that it was a different attack is desperate fanboyism.

Simply no. I've argued a complete post, you argue one thing - and in which Ulic did the same without any prior knowledge like Kun. If you read my post, refute it, and it's all correct - I'd stop suggesting it, however, since you:

1.) Refuse to do such.
2.) Keep calling me a "fanboy" (what pisses me off the most because I'm a female for one, and two you argue bullsh*t).
3.) Can't come up with logical arguments.
4.) Can't refute logical arguments.
5.) Are ridiculous.

I'll take it as you cannot come up with an argument against it, since the only thing you say is "Aleem4 bl4st = fin4l product", which I've already address. And, that list I made - that isn't fanboyism on your part, it's plain ignorance and stupidity.

I wasn't 'banned for a reason'. I was wrongly banned.

Wrongly banned? You didn't accept your ban, come back with mutliple usernames a la Numan, and continue to post constant bullsh*t. And once it's rebutted, you say "bias!!!//!eleven z0mg fanboy!!!1/!".

You're annoying, stay banned or if you continue to come back with multiple usernames...

REFUTE ARGUMENTS LOGICALLY AND WITH PROOF, TROLL.

That is all.

I was under the impression that "The Darkness" in this case was describing Bane's New Order, the only Sith Order that could best the Jedi. Yoda being the greatest enemy of this darkness could mean he was the greatest Jedi in 1000 years.

Anyways, it IS debatable that Yoda is the greatest Jedi of all time. Hoth, Vodo, Revan are great too, but this quote, depending on the context, seals the deal. It's written in EU.

The foremost fighter of an age of fighting? The Jedi are AGAINST fighting, hence a Golden Age for the Jedi

This quote was in regards to combat ability.

Originally posted by Great Vengeance
Oh yeah, great argument Nai.

Thought so...

1. You assume Vodo is as powerful as Yoda.

I was talking about melee combat skills. The point is to counter this argument you have to assume that Yoda is as powerful or more powerful than Vodo in terms of melee combat.

2. You pull out the bs argument that Sidious lost the fight. It was at *best* a stalemate concerning Yoda.

Lmao. Lucas said it was a stalemate but considering the fact that Yoda always had the weaker position and still managed to overcome Sidious (in both lightsaber and force fights) it's pretty clear that he is superior to Sidious on equal ground.

3. You assume that Kun is better at lightsaber dueling than Sidious. Any proof Nai? Thought so. And I dont believe Kun ever took out 3 jedi masters in 5 seconds though I could be wrong?

Let me think. Kun was a lightsaber prodigy and this is clearly not true for Sidious. He had his ass handed to Mace in a lightsaber duel, Yoda possibly disarmed him and Luke who didn't have that much saber combat training / experience by DE was able to outduel him.

So you really want to tell me that somebody who got his ass handed to a Luke by DE who nearly hadn't any training with that weapon at this point (except his combat action) would be able to outduel the guy who did destroy one of the best - if not the best - Jedi combatant of his era ?

4. Any proof that Luke is capable of defeating *both* Sidious and Yoda at the same time? I realize he would probably win against one of them, but I doubt he can take both.

Oh DN Luke is just powerful enough to withstand a force attack powered by the combined force potential of the entire Killik hive which contained 375 worlds at this point. And remember that we are talking about ROTS Sidious here - not about DE Sidious. What exactly would ROTS Sidious do against DN Luke ? Try to force lightning him ? Try to throw pods at him ? He has no chance and his equal Yoda doesn't have either.

Originally posted by Motoko Sama
Then tell me how he wasn't trying as hard as Kun. Because Kun initially wanted to recruit Vodo - hell, he was talking to him about it for the entire match up until he unleashed his double-bladed lightsaber. You call me bias? LOL. Shut up, noob and back up the claim.

Kun was trying to recruit Vodo, you dolt. I thought as much was obvious:

The "join me" on the page before, and trying to turn Vodo to Kun's cause is the exact same thing Vodo was doing - so to say Kun was giving it his all is nonsensical bullshit - which seems to be all of what you spew anyways.

Now, I've backed up my claims of why Kun wasn't even giving it his all, and was doing the same as Vodo. Didn't you notice Kun easily cleaved Vodo in-half once he "turned on the juice"? Similiar to Vader and Luke's duel during ESB. As I've said you are nothing but ridiculous, and can't offer anything valid to an argument besides unsupported, and quite frankly absurd, assumptions. I provide scans, logical arguments, and the like - can't say the same for you though.

Kun was toying with him - and the comic shows as much. Vodo and Kun exchange words, once Kun realizes he can't turn Vodo, he ignites the other side of the saber, and cleaves Vodo in HALF with ONE SIDE. You are so crazy, seriously. You downplay to the end, even when I show scans, and logical arguments - to call me a "fangirl" is laughable. I could say the same for you, but more or less you're just ignorant.

Oh, and also - Kun was [b]STILL telling him to join him AFTER he ignites the other end of the saber, THAT much tells me he was toying with him:

Your rebuttal? I expect nothing more from you than:

"Etc, etc, etc, etc - B1AS!!//1ELEVENz0mg!!!! LUK3 pwn5 A1L/ glauifgudsav."

Seems all you do is just that, no logical arguments - just ridiculous claims, and when I refute them properly - as said - you say "z0mg bias!!//!".

Sorry, no one asked you, troll. And tell me - how is it bias? Because I go based off the comic, logic and you go based off...well, nothing.

Then what the f*ck is destroying his stick? That is outdueling him, he broke through his defense - his defense was the stick.

Considering the Dark side makes you stronger as we all know from watching the movies, reading the books, hearing from Lucas. Oh, and considering when he dueled Vodo the first time:

That happened when he wasn't a master of the Darkside, hadn't gain vast amounts of knowledge - and yes, knowledge turns into power in Star Wars, and his first duel with Vodo as a padawan, he wasn't even a master lightsaber duelist - now he is:

Anymore laughable assertions, child?

Really, so the omniscient narrator is wrong? You said it had a "weakness", I didn't see any mention of this crap. Furthermore, the second time they met he broke the stick in-half with one side, showing the mere strength of Exar Kun.

Irrelevant.

If you aren't going to refute it, there is no room to keep making the claim. That's obvious in even a Star Wars debate.

Why didn't Sidious use one of his instakills on Luke? Why didn't Dooku use Force lightning at every turn? Why didn't so and so use this power on him or her? Why didn't Nomi strip everybody of the Force? Why didn't Kreia use her instakill at every chance? Thought so, I'll treat your points as defeated until you come up with something, or at least refute my damn argument.

Simply no. I've argued a complete post, you argue one thing - and in which Ulic did the same without any prior knowledge like Kun. If you read my post, refute it, and it's all correct - I'd stop suggesting it, however, since you:

1.) Refuse to do such.
2.) Keep calling me a "fanboy" (what pisses me off the most because I'm a female for one, and two you argue bullsh*t).
3.) Can't come up with logical arguments.
4.) Can't refute logical arguments.
5.) Are ridiculous.

I'll take it as you cannot come up with an argument against it, since the only thing you say is "Aleem4 bl4st = fin4l product", which I've already address. And, that list I made - that isn't fanboyism on your part, it's plain ignorance and stupidity.

Wrongly banned? You didn't accept your ban, come back with mutliple usernames a la Numan, and continue to post constant bullsh*t. And once it's rebutted, you say "bias!!!//!eleven z0mg fanboy!!!1/!".

You're annoying, stay banned or if you continue to come back with multiple usernames...

REFUTE ARGUMENTS LOGICALLY AND WITH PROOF, TROLL.

That is all. [/B]

The fact that you resort to such petty insults shows how much of a troll you are and how weak your argument is.