anyway you just said that magus with the IG could negate the ultimate nullifier didnt you mr masters why couldnt lucifer do the same? he's half the spark of creation like PF is in the MU, he can make his own universe and rewrite reality and make up such concepts as time and space and servived the demigoric blast i dont think that the IG would do anything to him and since you say the IG can negate the ultimate nullifier lucifer would do the same its been stated has it not that he could come back even after being annihilation just from sheer will, i dont think galactic storm is that much of a fanboy why would he be, he brings proof when he comes online doesnt he? he did bring us proof the PF held the universe in its hand. When people talk about darkseid today they say he's a jobber and then others look at his old feats and say he's super powerful, but even then people still say he's not that powerful anymore well i then state that LT is not as powerful as he once was, and thus is below the PF and is very weak since losing to reed richards why do i say this RECENT FEATS he's a jobber.
Originally posted by Mider
anyway you just said that magus with the IG could negate the ultimate nullifier didnt you mr masters why couldnt lucifer do the same? he's half the spark of creation like PF is in the MU, he can make his own universe and rewrite reality and make up such concepts as time and space and servived the demigoric blast i dont think that the IG would do anything to him and since you say the IG can negate the ultimate nullifier lucifer would do the same its been stated has it not that he could come back even after being annihilation just from sheer will, i dont think galactic storm is that much of a fanboy why would he be, he brings proof when he comes online doesnt he? he did bring us proof the PF held the universe in its hand. When people talk about darkseid today they say he's a jobber and then others look at his old feats and say he's super powerful, but even then people still say he's not that powerful anymore well i then state that LT is not as powerful as he once was, and thus is below the PF and is very weak since losing to reed richards why do i say this RECENT FEATS he's a jobber.
Interesting,
good observation,
but the Infinity Gauntlet can control those concepts on a greater than universal scale, Magus used the Gauntlet to turn back the Ultimate nullifier energies back on it's wielder, and it was an INCOMPLETE Gauntlet let me point out, it was missing the Reality Gem.
And the energies that the Gauntlet resisted from the Ultimate Nullifier would have destroyed the Multiverse and remade it aswell.
Question is, can Lucifer withstand a Multiverse destroying blast?
And yet the Ultimate Nullifier is nothing to the Infinity Gauntlet.
Thanos took out the nearly the entire hierarchy with the IG.
And Phoenix did mold the 616 universe in her hands, but so can many others.
One more point on the Living Tribunal.
He can turn beings into Universes, how you like them apples, I have the scans if you wish.
And as far as that person you mentioned is concerned, when you make claims that are proven wrong and you still argue even with the evidence in your face, that's a fanboy.
he did in the lucifer comics supposidly when he killed his brother micheal he is the vessel of the energy that made the multiverse, lucifer shapes that energy, he stood at ground zero of that and was not even harmed, weather that was multiversal or universal is to be speculated, i dont believe the IG is multiversal though its been negated even for a second by dr strange, and has been even userped by adam strange, lucifer can just rewrite the universe saying both the ultimat nullifier and the IG are candy Warlock did what he did i think cause he would step out of the loop of chaos and order or something like that well all i can say is that lucifer could step out of reality he did when making his own creation.
Originally posted by Mider
he did in the lucifer comics supposidly when he killed his brother micheal he is the vessel of the energy that made the multiverse, lucifer shapes that energy, he stood at ground zero of that and was not even harmed, weather that was multiversal or universal is to be speculated, i dont believe the IG is multiversal though its been negated even for a second by dr strange, and has been even userped by adam strange, lucifer can just rewrite the universe saying both the ultimat nullifier and the IG are candy Warlock did what he did i think cause he would step out of the loop of chaos and order or something like that well all i can say is that lucifer could step out of reality he did when making his own creation.
If Lucifer can take a blast from Michael and come out unfazed, Lucifer is one tuff cookie.
Yet I understandd it niether Michael nor Lucifer can create a Multiverse on their own, Lucifer made a Universe.
But if Michael is the one with the power that Lucifer uses to shape, then by definition in terms of raw power, Michael should be more powerful than his brother.
I don't really understand what your saying about the Gauntlet not being Multiversal, Magus warped 616 universe from outside 616 universe, this autoatically makes it Multiversal, now whether it's influence or range of control can transcend the ENTIRE Multiverse, I don't know, but what I do know is that it overpowered a weapon that can definitely destroy & remake the Multiverse to whatever one wishes. As you now know.
So if you put one and one together, you see what you get.
And I don't think Lucifer can say to the Gauntlet and UN be candy, and that will happen, the objects themselves not only hold power they are power.
What did strange do and in what title and issue?
And Warlock usurped the Gauntlet? Elaborate.
Originally posted by MiderLucifer has always been an iffy comic for me. Dont get me wrong, I enjoy the books on there fictional takes but many times people add their own little changes to things. In Lucifer, it states he created a universe yet everyone states its a multiverse when it clearly says a universe.
he did in the lucifer comics supposidly when he killed his brother micheal he is the vessel of the energy that made the multiverse, lucifer shapes that energy, he stood at ground zero of that and was not even harmed, weather that was multiversal or universal is to be speculated, i dont believe the IG is multiversal though its been negated even for a second by dr strange, and has been even userped by adam strange, lucifer can just rewrite the universe saying both the ultimat nullifier and the IG are candy Warlock did what he did i think cause he would step out of the loop of chaos and order or something like that well all i can say is that lucifer could step out of reality he did when making his own creation.
i submit that perhaps lucifer started out with one creation only to test out how it is to be its god, he didnt make a multiverse because that would mean he'd be testing many universes, why do i say this because he and his brother made the multiverse already once, and thus they do indeed have the power to make half a multiverse each thats why i state this.
Mider,
Not to mention that in Silver Surfer issues to took place during the IG saga, there were completely different events going on. For example, NECRONOS that world did not exist in the original Infinity Gaunlet Saga, yet in Silver Surfer issues that's what Thanos created.
Is that not an alternate reality?
And if so, if this WAS an alternate reality, then that means that classic IG is multiversal in power.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Mider,Not to mention that in Silver Surfer issues to took place during the IG saga, there were completely different events going on. For example, NECRONOS that world did not exist in the original Infinity Gaunlet Saga, yet in Silver Surfer issues that's what Thanos created.
Is that not an alternate reality?
And if so, if this WAS an alternate reality, then that means that classic IG [b]is
multiversal in power. [/B]
Magus from UniverseS away warped 616 Universe while being nearly all powerful in the reality he was in, this IS Multiversal power, because he was affecting more than one Universe simultaneously.
Here's a scan that tells us he's MANY realities away, from here he warped 616 verse.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Magus from UniverseS away warped 616 Universe while being nearly all powerful in the reality he was in, this IS Multiversal power, because he was affecting more than one Universe simultaneously.Here's a scan that tells us he's MANY realities away, from here he warped 616 verse.
After he warped 616 from MANY realities away.
Originally posted by Mider
i dont understand what you mean what did he create?
Mider, Necronos is a world that Thanos created with the IG where people are born to die. There are lines of death camps where people are born, die, and reborn just to die all over again. Silver Surfer was witness to this, after Thanos killed Adam Warlock. This happened in Surfer seires.
This never happened in IG saga, yet this exact issue took place in IG saga.....therefore, these are alternate realities.
Therefore, since there is only ONE IG in the Marvel existance, its power MUST be multiversal.
Mr. Master, we seriously need to inform people that classic IG is multiversal in influence and power, and not just universal, because people like GalacticStorm and others have already convince everyone that classic IG is strictly universal.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
A pocket universe where another IG exists?
Not to mention Franklyn Richard's pocket universe only composed of the beings he allowed to exist there after Onslaught's reign.
In Thanos' alternate reality or pocket universe, he had the SAME IG, remember, there is only one, and everyone else who existed in IG saga was present. How would that be a pocket universe, when it was pretty much the same exact scenario and setting as the main IG saga universe, just different events???
its kinda disgusting that a being who killed himself would be better then lucifer who is half the spark of creation, its also sad that LT who barely shows up when there is trouble and jobs most of the time is supposidly greater then the spark that made the MU such as the phoenix, does that mean i love the phoenix hardly, i still think spectre should kick her butt but unsure if he could but then again a full powered one would, and sadly i dont think lucifer could beat her but she wouldnt be able to kill him........sorry just my opinion.
Originally posted by Mider
its kinda disgusting that a being who killed himself would be better then lucifer who is half the spark of creation, its also sad that LT who barely shows up when there is trouble and jobs most of the time is supposidly greater then the spark that made the MU such as the phoenix, does that mean i love the phoenix hardly, i still think spectre should kick her butt but unsure if he could but then again a full powered one would, and sadly i dont think lucifer could beat her but she wouldnt be able to kill him........sorry just my opinion.
Fair Enough Mider, but your opinions should be based on fact, as much fact as possible.
For example you have been using the whole "Living Tribunal was scared of Korvac" example for months, and then you are finally prove wrong, and you go"well sorry i made a mistake"....yeah a huge one, a mistake that convinced tons of people of how incapable LT is, it's total misinformation.
Do you ACTUALLY read the issues that involve LT? Please Mider, know what you are talkin about before you bash on him....this isnt just about opinion Mider, there are debators who dont know anything about Living Tribunal, and then you just go saying certain things about him and convince everyone that your depiction of the LT is correct, when its sooo wayy off !
1) Like i said before, Living Tribunal is not like Spectre. Spectre takes his job personally, Spectre gets involved in miniscule matters that take place on Earth. LT doesn't get involved in anything, unless an entire Universe is in danger. LT is not good or evil, like Spectre, LT is neutral....he only cares about the multiversal balance, not about child molestors and world conquerers like Spectre focuses on....please understand this.
2) You say Spectre jobs most of the time....please name when. Can you site specific issues and give references? Details of the event, and quotes?
Sorry bro, but i have yet to see you do this.
3) Are you saying that Spectre can beat White Pheonix of the Crown? 🤨
Originally posted by batdude123
It's pretty damn feasible, though I doubt that eather one could kill the other.
But White Pheonix of the Crown is not a "being" like Lucifer. Lucifer has a mind, feelings, an ego.....White Pheonix of the Crown is more of an undefinable entity, the spark of creation itself.
Yahweh used Lucifer and Micheal to create the multiverse, but they are not the spark of creation per say. They are more like the tools of creation.
Lucifer himself can only create a universe on his own, not a multiverse without Micheal's help.
White Pheonix of the Crown is the embodyment of creation itself. She is at LEAST the equal of Micheal and Lucifer combined.