Originally posted by Lightsnake
Seriously, READ the comic. Sadow's SHIP was the ting that blew up the star. The FRIGGIN SHIP. And in case YOU missed it, Palpatine knows every technique of the Jedi, and Ancient Sith and what he's invented, including the ability to kill someone instantly with his anger. Wanna go with text, dear? and by the by, ability to kill someone instantly, a technique you invented along with the ability to blast holes in people with your bare hands, and the ability to create holes ranging from small ship to big enough to devour fleets...YEAH that's gonna be helping the good emperor, who's also capable of sucking worlds dry and razing all life from them with the force
Okay, then Palpatine is the greatest Dark Lord of all time, lived in a time when the Dark Side wasn't spread thin and concentrated fully, a god in the Dark Side, a titan, a divinity of darkness, darkness beyond darkness, an event horizon in the force, THE Dark Side...Oh, by the way: the New Sith Empire surpassed the Ancient EmpireOh, and Ragnos's creator thinks Sidious is the stronger. Thanks!
LOL Palpatine knows every technique? Let me guess, because one of the sourcebooks or whatever says it right? Ok then Marka Ragnos is the most powerful of the most powerful.. You're not making any sense and all of your arguments are solely based on, like I said, arbitrary and ambiguous text. And by all, I mean every single argument.. And as I recall, Nai, Janus, IKC, and someone else destroyed your "Ragnos' creator thinks Sidious is stronger" theory months ago. But it's funny that you should reuse it knowing they are all gone.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Nope, that's what we call 'power'...see, the force storm is described as possibly the most 'powerful' and what Sidious did was the most powerful usage of the dark side.What do you think anger and strong will are? The Dark Side
And where did this power derive? Oh wait, the ancient sith! And the Force Crush was also called 'possibly the greatest force maneuver in either dark side or light".
Yeah, exactly.
Oh, and according to the authors at LFL...that 'Most powerful' comment refers to, survey says....5000 years ago and KEVIN J. ANDERSON HIMSELF makes it clear that Exar Kun was stronger than Ragnos! Y'know, the man who CREATED Ragnos? Think you know better than Kevin, honey?
And yeah, you know something? That's EXACTLY what those sourcebooks AND the author of Dark Empire said, and a guide're two. And you know something else? According to the Lucasfilm canon policy, those are JUST AS CANON as any book or comic. You want to play? Try me. Do yoruself a favor and read up on what you're trying to join. Nai even admitted I've proven what Sidious knew
And before you make an idiot out of yourself, I've been arguing with Janus and IKC before they left...and Nai and I are still debating.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Yeah, exactly.Oh, and according to the authors at LFL...that 'Most powerful' comment refers to, survey says....5000 years ago and KEVIN J. ANDERSON HIMSELF makes it clear that Exar Kun was stronger than Ragnos! Y'know, the man who CREATED Ragnos? Think you know better than Kevin, honey?
And yeah, you know something? That's EXACTLY what those sourcebooks AND the author of Dark Empire said, and a guide're two. And you know something else? According to the Lucasfilm canon policy, those are JUST AS CANON as any book or comic. You want to play? Try me. Do yoruself a favor and read up on what you're trying to join. Nai even admitted I've proven what Sidious knew
And before you make an idiot out of yourself, I've been arguing with Janus and IKC before they left...and Nai and I are still debating.
Lightsnake, I love how you take irrelevant OPINIONS as canon sources just to boost your character. No really.. I don't know why you throw around the same arguments for months at a time, wait til people leave, and throw it back again. Exar Kun was NOT stronger than Ragnos, that is proposterous. With your logic, Kun>Sadow and Kun>Kressh and all of the ancient sith. And you still cannot quantify Palpatine's "Power", nor understand that by your logic, Palpatine was the most powerful of his time, as Ragnos was of his, as you say.
And in spite of all of this, you really DO fail to fully grasp the concept of a versus forum. Explain how Palpatine's force storm is going to win him a battle with Kun, or Nadd, or anyone more powerful than him. Then again, you can't even quantify the power.. And before I "Embarass" myself, maybe you should take a look at all of your Sidious arguments from the past year, and see who's the embarassment. Try to provide facts, not opinions nor arbitrary text.. Thanks "Honey".
Lightsnake, I love how you take irrelevant OPINIONS as canon sources just to boost your character. No really.. I don't know why you throw around the same arguments for months at a time, wait til people leave, and throw it back again. Exar Kun was NOT stronger than Ragnos, that is proposterous. With your logic, Kun>Sadow and Kun>Kressh and all of the ancient sith. And you still cannot quantify Palpatine's "Power", nor understand that by your logic, Palpatine was the most powerful of his time, as Ragnos was of his, as you say.
We need to cool it down a bit!
Now, Kevin J Anderson created Marka Ragnos. He owns the character. His opinion does matter in this case. He has legal rights over both of his character. If he says that Exar Kun and Palpatine are both more powerful than his character, then it's canon fact...
Logical deduction indicates that Marka and Naga are more powerful than Exar Kun, however if someone with legal authority says otherwise, then I guess the Ancient Sith weren't all they were cracked up to be.
#1. Show me where Anderson says this
#2. Fact is different from "I think".
#3. Logical deduction is the point of these forums.. If we used Lightsnakes "Well he said this this and that" logic, there would be no versus forums..
Logical deducton states that the ancient sith were the most powerful, hence their golden age.
#1. Show me where Anderson says this
Lightsnake will have to do that. 🙁
#2. Fact is different from "I think".
I'm glad that you know the difference.
#3. Logical deduction is the point of these forums.. If we used Lightsnakes "Well he said this this and that" logic, there would be no versus forums..
Wrong. These "well he said this in that" logic is what ultimately determines the argument when both sides are unable to disprove the other.
Because, unfortunately for humanity in general, logical deduction can - at times - be illogica and incorrect.
Logical deducton states that the ancient sith were the most powerful, hence their golden age.
Read. Above.
#1. Show me where Anderson says this
It's pointed out in others threads, DE Sidious vs Marka and maybe even this one. If you read through it, I'm sure you'll find the answer. Lightsnake posted it... you can always ask him again.
#2. Fact is different from "I think".
Problem is: We don't have any facts regarding the Ancient Sith since we know so little of them. It's hard to quantify their power since we haven't seen a single one take out a Jedi or whatever. Most of their feats can be downplayed too, based on the statements given by KJA and Veich.
#3. Logical deduction is the point of these forums.. If we used Lightsnakes "Well he said this this and that" logic, there would be no versus forums..
I agree, but we can't deny the man of his legal right over his own creations.
Logical deducton states that the ancient sith were the most powerful, hence their golden age.
I was personally in agreement with this until those statements by KJA. We can't deny his authority over his own characters.
ok then so when you can quantify Palpatine's "Most powerful" to Ragnos' more obvious "Most powerful of the most powerful, hit me up".. And I'll wait for Lightsnake to show me Anderson's opinion.
Let me make this absolutely clear.
There has been absolutely no comic, no book, no piece of LFL-approved material that details the power of Marka Ragnos.
The only indicators of his power are that he bested Simus (who is another unknown in this case), that Sadow (who is only truly exceptionally powerful with his ship) feared him (which could - not saying that it is - be the result of politics or propoganda or even Ragnos's mere reputation) feared him, and the big hype that his spirit brought up (which was exiled by one of Luke's mere trainees).
He is the intellectual and - more importantly - legal property of Kevin J. Anderson. If (Lightsnake has the source) he said that Ragnos is inferior to Kun and Palpatine, than that is a fact - until LFL or George Lucas comes and retcons or rebukes that statement, and one that you may not like - nor may you even accept it - but it is one that you cannot disprove.
Further, Lucas himself states that the PT was "the golden age of the Jedi". Are we then to assume that these Ancient Sith could wipe their asses with the best of the best (in the PT)?
Also, more sources label Emperor Palpatine as "the most powerful", than any other Sith Lord - including Marka Ragnos. So, let's say that we assume for a moment that Ragnos is the most powerful of the most powerful.
That only counts for his time, whereas the New Essential Chronology stated that Sidious is "the most powerful in history."
No, it's my opinion considering the fact that I created Sauron as the most powerful.
After you say he isn't, then he isn't anymore. You have the right to determine your character's strength...
And even in LotR, there isn't much to definatly put Sauron over Gandalf. You can easily deduce as much, but nothing's really set in stone. The only measure of their power is Gandalf's own statement, which is perfectly fallible (Unlike yours).
Bah, talking Rings again.
Originally posted by Escape81
Let me make this absolutely clear.There has been absolutely no comic, no book, no piece of LFL-approved material that details the power of Marka Ragnos.
The only indicators of his power are that he bested Simus (who is another unknown in this case), that Sadow (who is only truly exceptionally powerful with his ship) feared him (which could - not saying that it is - be the result of politics or propoganda or even Ragnos's mere reputation) feared him, and the big hype that his spirit brought up (which was exiled by one of Luke's mere trainees).
He is the intellectual and - more importantly - legal property of Kevin J. Anderson. If (Lightsnake has the source) he said that Ragnos is inferior to Kun and Palpatine, than that is a fact - until LFL or George Lucas comes and retcons or rebukes that statement, and one that you may not like - nor may you even accept it - but it is one that you cannot disprove.
Further, Lucas himself states that the PT was "the golden age of the Jedi". Are we then to assume that these Ancient Sith could wipe their asses with the best of the best (in the PT)?
Also, more sources label Emperor Palpatine as "the most powerful", than any other Sith Lord - including Marka Ragnos. So, let's say that we assume for a moment that Ragnos is the most powerful of the most powerful.
That only counts for his time, whereas the New Essential Chronology stated that Sidious is "the most powerful in history."
Bro, most powerful of the most powerful means he was the most powerful. Sidious was the greatest sith lord, there is no doubt there, but with the statement that was made about him, you can clearly interpret it a few ways. Ragnos' statement was absolute and clear. Until you can quantify what "most powerful" means in terms of Sidious, or show me the clear and definitive statement of Anderson, it is still a LOT more logical to assume the Ancient Sith were the greatest. And yes, the ancient sith of the golden age would destroy the golden age of the Jedi, because those two things are complete opposites, if you thought about it. The Golden age of the Jedi is peace, the Golden age of the Sith is power, and magic.
Originally posted by Generic Hero
After you say he isn't, then he isn't anymore. You have the right to determine your character's strength...And even in LotR, there isn't much to definatly put Sauron over Gandalf. You can easily deduce as much, but nothing's really set in stone. The only measure of their power is Gandalf's own statement, which is perfectly fallible (Unlike yours).
Bah, talking Rings again.
It becomes canon when you make a definitive statement dude. There is a difference between "I think" and a definitive statement, which we have yet to see.