Originally posted by A.J
Not much of a fight but may aswell post it !!!Afterwards Spidey realises its for the best and swings off.
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Cheers for the scans 😄
I like how in that issue Cap has superspeed to the same level as Spidey 😆
Alright, so the three fights featuring Cap and Spidey mean nothing.
Even Spider-man himself saying that he could never match Cap in hand to hand combat means little.
"He's holding back!" you cry.
What of the Spidey-bot that Kang created? It had each and every one of Spider-man's powers. It matched Spiderman blow for blow. It then engaged Captain America in hand to hand and said "He's too Battle-wise, too Courageous, too dangerous! I'd be a fool to fight him on his terms!"
No?
What about Cap facing down the Scorpion and Hyde at the same time? Scorpion again?
How about when Cap faced down Doc Ock? The Tarantula?
Come on now. Two fights where Cap was dominating Spider-man, one where he was at least keeping up with him, another fight with a Spider-bot that matched Spiderman, but couldn't take Captain America hand to hand, Cap outfighting the Scorpion (twice), beating the Tarantula (and an ally of his simultaneously), and Steve taking it to Doc Ock?
"But Steve can't keep up with Spider-man's speed and agility!"
Well, besies him doing just that at least four times, and dealing with people who COULD a few more, he also has kept up with Beast, who is widely regarded as just below Spider-man. Beast himself tells steve that he is "nearly as nimble as I am!"
What it truly comes down to is marvel. The writers. The creators. They have the final say; if they, tomorrow, want to release a book with Cap as a class 100 character with Flash-like speed, they will. Thus far, they have represented Captain America and Spider-man in the same class. Not once or twice, but repeatedly. Hell, I just pointed out about ten instances in Comics that put Cap and Spider-man in the same league. Straight from the horses mouth, so to speak. Marvel didn't throw it in to continue the story line once. They wrote it explicitly. At least a dozen times.
This post is truly what my argument comes down to. Whether you want to believe that a comic character can be so skilled that he can compensate for super strength and speed (as cap has shown to be, over and over) or not...it seems to be the implication that Marvel has pushed over and over.
Cap has been written as in Spider-man's league. He has been written as capable of matching Spider-man. Steve can pull more than one win out of ten. Considering their showings, three seems more than reasonable. But, as I mentioned before, it is rare that in a debate, the debators are swayed. I'm not expecting to change anyone's opinions; just hopefully try to expose the fact that Steve isn't completely incapable against Pete.
AJ
Quote Soljer
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"He's holding back!" you cry.
What of the Spidey-bot that Kang created? It had each and every one of Spider-man's powers. It matched Spiderman blow for blow. It then engaged Captain America in hand to hand and said "He's too Battle-wise, too Courageous, too dangerous! I'd be a fool to fight him on his terms!">
AJ please read the thread.
Originally posted by A.J
He has been written in his league, but spidey always holds back, if he was written to potentiol I say cap gets curb stomped
And a Spider-robot holds back as well? Mr Hyde hold back? Scorpion holds back? Doc Ock holds back?
Hell! Cap holds back all the time too, but "He was holding back!" can't be a catch-all in comics.
Hey guys, Im out for the moment, I'll be back later.
Originally posted by AlfheimThe hell am i reading all that, basicly this battle would be interesting but if spiderman was written to full potentiol and i dont mean not holding back, written to what he should and could do he would batter cap.
AJQuote Soljer
<
"He's holding back!" you cry.
What of the Spidey-bot that Kang created? It had each and every one of Spider-man's powers. It matched Spiderman blow for blow. It then engaged Captain America in hand to hand and said "He's too Battle-wise, too Courageous, too dangerous! I'd be a fool to fight him on his terms!">AJ please read the thread.
I would try to debate properly but i feel sick 😘
Originally posted by Soljer
He's holding back!" you cry.
What of the Spidey-bot that Kang created? It had each and every one of Spider-man's powers. It matched Spiderman blow for blow. It then engaged Captain America in hand to hand and said "He's too Battle-wise, too Courageous, too dangerous! I'd be a fool to fight him on his terms!"
What about Cap facing down the Scorpion and Hyde at the same time? Scorpion again?
How about when Cap faced down Doc Ock? The Tarantula?
Come on now. Two fights where Cap was dominating Spider-man, one where he was at least keeping up with him, another fight with a Spider-bot that matched Spiderman, but couldn't take Captain America hand to hand, Cap outfighting the Scorpion (twice), beating the Tarantula (and an ally of his simultaneously), and Steve taking it to Doc Ock?
It's a cold hard fact that Spider-Man is a lot faster, more durable, way stronger and way more agile than Captain America ever will be. You can not argue about this.
Of course CA will hold his own for a while, I have no problem with that. But really, when Spider-Man gets angry and decides not to hold back anymore... do you honestly believe CA can survive an unpulled punch from Spider-Man ?
Before you answer : Spider-Man can easily punch trough a concrete wall, he can punch away a steel vault door and such.
No way CA can take such a punch. Not in a fight without PIS and CIS.
Cap has been written as in Spider-man's league. He has been written as capable of matching Spider-man.
Originally posted by Arahan
I still want to know which issue that scans are from.
ASM 534 if no one else has answered. Just came out the other day.
And notice how hesitant Peter was during the fight, and also that Cap's 3 hits did basically nothing to him. He wasn't hurt at all.
Turn down the jobber aura and it's a Spidey win every time....and probably even with the aura, just a longer fight but the same outcome.
Originally posted by DigiMark007
ASM 534 if no one else has answered. Just came out the other day.And notice how hesitant Peter was during the fight, and also that Cap's 3 hits did basically nothing to him. He wasn't hurt at all.
Turn down the jobber aura and it's a Spidey win every time....and probably even with the aura, just a longer fight but the same outcome.
Thx, I will check that issue.
It is sad that Spidey has low showings against guys like CA or DD.
The way they hit and attack him let me really think that Spidey hasnt Super Speed or superior reactions. Especially after the The Other Arc he had a big Speed upgrade, it just makes no sense that he still gets hit so much by slower characters. He never gets the respect he deserves.
And the writers already have forgotten his new powers like Night vision.
In one issue when he pursues Stegron he makes fire to see in the dark.
Poor Spidey ❌
Originally posted by DigiMark007he wasn't hurt at all?
ASM 534 if no one else has answered. Just came out the other day.And notice how hesitant Peter was during the fight, and also that Cap's 3 hits did basically nothing to him. He wasn't hurt at all.
Turn down the jobber aura and it's a Spidey win every time....and probably even with the aura, just a longer fight but the same outcome.
okay technically you may be right but he WAS "numb" from the punches.
Originally posted by Arahandude which issues is he fighting stegron in? I miss my dinosaur!
Thx, I will check that issue.It is sad that Spidey has low showings against guys like CA or DD.
The way they hit and attack him let me really think that Spidey hasnt Super Speed or superior reactions. Especially after the The Other Arc he had a big Speed upgrade, it just makes no sense that he still gets hit so much by slower characters. He never gets the respect he deserves.And the writers already have forgotten his new powers like Night vision.
In one issue when he pursues Stegron he makes fire to see in the dark.Poor Spidey ❌
Originally posted by Metalmanxit makes perfect sense... his spider sense is an instinctive reflex... he reacts INSTINCTIVELY to his spider sense. A laser or bullet or whatever is going to have a linear pattern, once it begin's it's movement it will continue in that linear direction and keep going that way. Once spiderman dodges it he won't have to worry about it again... A human fighter who can "change it up" cap potentially outsmart his spider sense.. his body will react to one attack and depending on the reaction he'll be too helpless to stop another... akin to when daredevil was using his spider sense against him when he KOed spidey... hell even stegron has used spider sense against spiderman with his tail... other than that I feel soljer's reply to this subject was quite sufficient...
See, this right here makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.Precog. He knows an attack is coming before it comes. He knows what it will be and where it will POTENTIALLY land so he can avoid it in time.
Other, far slower opponents using his precog against him? What the hell? Does Spidey only predict one move every Thirty seconds now? 🤨
His Spider-Sense would allow him to know each and every attack thrown his way before it occurs, thus knowing the set-up attack and then the real attack. Whatever Cap ties to set up, Spidey will already know what it is.
Cap may have planned 2 steps ahead of Spidey, but Spidey has read said plans ahead of time.
Originally posted by MetalmanxHow can you not agree with it? the evidence is posted plainly in front of you in print... if you think spiderman's superhuman durability is >>>> than an ultron construct then i have to say you're out of your damned mind.
That, I cannot agree with.Yea, it's gone through some durable things before. But against a person is completely different. Especially a person with superhuman durability.
Originally posted by Metalmanxconsider for the moment that cap isn't a killer.... thus this question is irrelivant.
Out of all the times that Cap has thrown his shield all out, when has it gone through his (non-robot) opponent? 😕
Originally posted by MetalmanxCIS included cap would never throw the shield to go through him... sans CIS if the shield hits spidey and cap has the intention of severing limbs body parts etc etc... they're coming off.. the only way you can ignore this is if you discard comic book feats... not that spidey fans have a problem with that but...
It would hit Spidey really hard, yes. I never doubt that. But it would just carry him a bit with its momentum, not go through him. 🙄
Originally posted by jinzin
How can you not agree with it? the evidence is posted plainly in front of you in print... if you think spiderman's superhuman durability is >>>> than an ultron construct then i have to say you're out of your damned mind.consider for the moment that cap isn't a killer.... thus this question is irrelivant.
CIS included cap would never throw the shield to go through him... sans CIS if the shield hits spidey and cap has the intention of severing limbs body parts etc etc... they're coming off.. the only way you can ignore this is if you discard comic book feats... not that spidey fans have a problem with that but...
But it wouldn't hit Spidey, so all these points are moot.
Originally posted by Skeets
But a quadruple post is ok.😆
It was actually a quintuplet. I think. ermm
