Originally posted by forumcrewThe elbow was actually to his chest, which is why he wasn't suspended.
Pushing down (a foul) on a rebound does not in anyway deserve an ELBOW towards your face/throat that is the dumbest logic I have ever heard. If people can get suspended for stepping on the court from the bench, and Howard can for whiffing on an elbow I dont see how this isnt a suspension also. There cant be subjectivity in these you either need to stick to the rule of an elbow is 1 game or not.
Originally posted by MindsetSeriously........I was so dissapointed when I found ouit Artest lied. Kobe hit him in the chest. Fisher I can understand being suspended. That was out of character but I like the toughness in that play. Maybe losing him won't be so bad. Sure he played good last night but maybe this will help Farmar emerge.
Kobe obviously collapsed Artest's trachea with his elbow, you could see the pain he was in when he was complaining to the refs and got in Kobe's face...he's lucky to be alive and I salute his strength and composure.
Also why doesn't Phil give Mbenga minutes when Drew picks up quick fouls? He IS a 7-footer you know. Now I was crapping in my pants in the second quarter when Phil put the bench in and they evaporated the lead........AGAIN! But they really came through for us late causing all of those turnovers. They scrramble and our a feisty bunch.
Question: What's our starting lineup now that D-Fish is gone? Should we go big and defensive?
Kobe Bryant
Trevor Ariza
Lamar Odom
Pau Gasol
Andrew Bynum
Personally I like Bynum coming off the bench. He doesn't play well with Gasol. They both command the ball. Brown never fails to give us good solid play. I'd like to see Kobe try and drive for free throws. Those shots were redicolously dificult in game 2 and I'm not sure he can sustain that %. Farmar has to run, run, run for him to be effective.
I'm not sure if we can win both Game 3 & 4 but I know we can get a split to regain HCA. I would like for us to win 3 straight.
I thought we covered Brooks well. Fisher heard the badmouthing everyone was giving him. We can't continue to leave shooters open like Brooks, Artest, and Shane. Barry is a threat if he comes off the bench. Sasha has gotten into Wafer's head. And how Landry is shredding our defense and their bench players are outrebounding us I don't know. I wish Gasol would finish plays with dunks instead of layups. And Odom has got to hit his free throws. We did okay on Yao. Bynum's got to show up. Great to see Walton back. Ariza's shot hasn't been clicking. And Odom can't guard Scola on the block.
Originally posted by forumcrew
Pushing down (a foul) on a rebound does not in anyway deserve an ELBOW towards your face/throat that is the dumbest logic I have ever heard. If people can get suspended for stepping on the court from the bench, and Howard can for whiffing on an elbow I dont see how this isnt a suspension also. There cant be subjectivity in these you either need to stick to the rule of an elbow is 1 game or not.
Video: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4149491
Pics: http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=86451
Howard elbowed Dalembert over frustration and it was pre-meditated. Kobe was simply trying to establish position and box out which called for an elbow seeing as how Artest was leaning on him and if you look at the pics you'll see Artest elbowed Kobe first.
Originally posted by guy222You'd start Farmar or you think Phil will. If you'd give it to him explain why.
Jordan should get the startAndrew has to play like he can. Reports are the knee is bothering him. The Lakers should run some early plays for him
Haven't seen Lamar at his best yet. Was strong on the glass
I think it's more of the brace than his knee.
Originally posted by Darth Martin
Video: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4149491Pics: http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=86451
Howard elbowed Dalembert over frustration and it was pre-meditated. Kobe was simply trying to establish position and box out which called for an elbow seeing as how Artest was leaning on him and if you look at the pics you'll see Artest elbowed Kobe first.
Yeah Howard's was nowhere near the play and the ball wasn't even in play at the time, he was just frustrated and purposely threw an elbow at Dalembert(which connected by the way, he didn't whiff, almost did though)
Drew doesnt even need to look for his offense, if he is active then he will get 10 plus points on dump off passes and putbacks. Thats all we need from him on that end, he really needs to step it up on the glass and contesting shots though. He played Yao well in the 4th by using his length to front him, if we continue to play Yao that way (which we should) then Bynum could be very effective. Again we dont need a dominant Bynum, just an average, active center so Pau doesnt have to log heavy minutes. If Bynum cant get it going then i agree put in Mbenga, he played Yao very tough last time we played them in the regular season and he works hard.
Originally posted by Mindset
The elbow was actually to his chest, which is why he wasn't suspended.
OK Howards elbow hit air. I just dont like the subjectivity to it all. Either the rule is you throw an elbow you are out or it isnt. So a hot towards the head but not really making contact puts you out but a clean shot to the chest that lands flush does not? There needs to be consistency and so far its just a crap shoot.
Originally posted by forumcrewThe rule is if it is above the shoulders(Howard's was) then that's an automatic one game suspension. Kobehit Ron in the chest.
OK Howards elbow hit air. I just dont like the subjectivity to it all. Either the rule is you throw an elbow you are out or it isnt. So a hot towards the head but not really making contact puts you out but a clean shot to the chest that lands flush does not? There needs to be consistency and so far its just a crap shoot.
And again D-12 elbow diudnb't hit air he made contact.
Originally posted by koolruningz
I've seen cleaner elbows land in the WNBA or even Netball, it was two guys fighting for a rebounding position. Jesus its a good thing Charles Oakley or Rick Mahorn dont play anymore, this is what playoff hoops is supposed to be about.
I dont disagree with you in terms of just letting them play. The problem is some people they let play some they dont. There is no consistency to it which is the worst thing there can be.
Originally posted by Darth Martin
You'd start Farmar or you think Phil will. If you'd give it to him explain why.I think it's more of the brace than his knee.
In the minutes played, he's managed to stay with Brooks. Good energy in the last game from Farmar
I hope Andrew is healthy enough. The Lakers can use his defense and rebounding
His off the court actions get more publicity than his time on the court
Originally posted by koolruningz
Drew doesnt even need to look for his offense, if he is active then he will get 10 plus points on dump off passes and putbacks. Thats all we need from him on that end, he really needs to step it up on the glass and contesting shots though. He played Yao well in the 4th by using his length to front him, if we continue to play Yao that way (which we should) then Bynum could be very effective. Again we dont need a dominant Bynum, just an average, active center so Pau doesnt have to log heavy minutes. If Bynum cant get it going then i agree put in Mbenga, he played Yao very tough last time we played them in the regular season and he works hard.
The Lakers should involve Andrew in the offense. True enough, he should be active
His length can cause Yao problems
Love to see DJ play
Originally posted by forumcrew
I dont disagree with you in terms of just letting them play. The problem is some people they let play some they dont. There is no consistency to it which is the worst thing there can be.
Anytime you give referees as much power as they have in the NBA this is what happens. Every ref seems to have a different interpretation of the rules which leads to inconsistency. The less whistles you have the more its on the players to decide the game, which i am all for.
Guy, i'd like to see Drew involved in the offense but the fact of the matter is that Gasol is a far more reliable option in the post right now. While Drew is waiting for his timing to come back on offense lets see him use his energy on the defensive end, its not like he can be tired - he's only played half a season.
Originally posted by forumcrewOne was during a play with ambiguous intent, the other was not. You'd be better off trying to compare Howard's situation with Rondo than with Kobe. Because elbows are thrown all the time during plays and if it isn't above the head, well, not much to be done, at worst a flagrant 1.
OK Howards elbow hit air. I just dont like the subjectivity to it all. Either the rule is you throw an elbow you are out or it isnt. So a hot towards the head but not really making contact puts you out but a clean shot to the chest that lands flush does not? There needs to be consistency and so far its just a crap shoot.
Originally posted by koolruningz
Anytime you give referees as much power as they have in the NBA this is what happens. Every ref seems to have a different interpretation of the rules which leads to inconsistency. The less whistles you have the more its on the players to decide the game, which i am all for.Guy, i'd like to see Drew involved in the offense but the fact of the matter is that Gasol is a far more reliable option in the post right now. While Drew is waiting for his timing to come back on offense lets see him use his energy on the defensive end, its not like he can be tired - he's only played half a season.
Love for the players to decide the game. Inconsistency is bad
Pau is the #1 big man for the Lakes, but good friend...when Drew was in the Lakers didn't make an effort to get em involved at all. A putback was his only shot in the 1st half. We agree the Lakes have to involve him and Drew has to post up and demand the ball
The big guy isn't tired when he makes MSN Entertainment News Story #1 😄
Guy, Drew is an offense first type player if you look back at his young career he has always taken a while to get his timing. Once his offense comes round his defense follows, i wish it was the other way around but i know how lucky we are to have a player like Bynum who has a long promising future ahead of him.
We have a tendency to become a perimeter team though which is crazy when you have such skilled big men, i can understand if we were the Bulls or Wizards but both Pau and Drew (especially if he is running with the bench) need to see the ball in the post. If nothing else it makes Kobe's life easier because he doesnt have to use the dribble to penetrate the defense, just throw it into the post and work off the ball.