yeah exactly^^
"The Hero has died a modern man; but as eternal man - perfected, unspecific, universal man(because of Elizabeth) - he has been reborn. His second solemn task and deed therefore . . . is to return to us, transfigured, and teach the lesson he has learned of life renewed. . . . The effect of the successful adventure of the Hero is the unlocking and releasing again the flow of life into the body of the world."
OK GOT IT!!
so its like a ressurection of the new jack
the old jack died. the cowardness, the material objects, the lying all the darkness died. all his old ways.
he is born again a new man. sees everything now in a different way. he sees a light through the tunnel. He finally understand the meaning of life and has a reson to live for it (liz).
jack is still jack, but different. he just sees everything in a different ligh. and learns something new in life. again jack is still jack..but stronger in character.
Originally posted by Chiki Mina
so its more like an internal conflict.accepting to be a hero accepting responsibiliy to take care of ur loved one(s)
YESH! thats his biggest fear in movie 2..is the obligation of Elizabeth..and the hero at first is afraid persue the elixir...he denies the call to adventure it is what he fears..but when she is in danger he becomes the hero for her..
"No i never read that but I was made to study these steps in college lol
is it a good book?
movie 2/3 are actually one story..i can imagine them doing the 12 steps again with Jack though because they kinda need to..in each lord of the rings despite the fact frodo was following these 12 over the entire trilogy..in each movie he started from scratch again lmao.
Also because movie 1 was one story Will was the reluctant hero who got the girl...Jack was the mentor...he was there thoughout
Tia is obviously the mentor in movie 2/3..because although we dont see her..she is the one behind many of the events IMO.."helping Jack along"
Will's new elixir is obviously his father and Tia is actually helping him too
1. Ordinary World
2. Call to Adventure
3. Refusal of the Call
4. Meeting With the Mentor
5. Crossing the First Threshold
6. Tests, Allies, Enemies
7. Approach
8. Supreme Ordeal
9. Reward
10. The Road Back
11. Resurrection
12. Return With the Elixir"
It is a good book. It relates a lot of this stuff to Beowulf, Luke Skywalker, and Odysseus to name a few. Jack definitely applies here. For clarification, can you explain these steps?
Would you consider Tia Dalma, or even Barbosa, to be Jack's mentor? It doesn't seem like he really has one, especially since he plays mentor to Will. I think Will and Liz both fit these steps, too. They're all heroes!
Also, what is approach?
They are all pretty silent at the moment..because i said this:
and as soon as Will meets the mentor for the first time Tia actually HELPS him gain his true elixir..His father..she gives him the location to the flying dutchman where his father is located..and after this he takes the first threshold..he begins to persue the means to gain his elixir...he's probably going to go through something similar to what we saw and are going to see Jack do when it comes to gaining his elixir
Same with Jack..by sending Will there she can help Jack can now gain his elixir..and he begins to right after the supernatural help..he's the one who got the furthest before the story ended but he still has to face the other steps before he can return home with her.
same with Liz..when its her turn to meet the supernatural helper ..she helps her to perssue her true elixir. Jack Sparrow. and she accepts the first threshold..which is going after him to singapore..
and this is the closure to the love triangle that Terry and Ted are on about...they have all chosen their top priority in life thier true elixir by the end of movie 2...so move 3 need not be there as they say..but they are gonna make it anyway lol
and this:
well the help usually given is the means for them to find their true elixir
Will = location to the dutchman and his father..and can learn how to save him
Jack = gives Will the distraction so that Jack can now learn to gain his elixir (Liz)
Liz = Gives her the means to go and gain her true elixir (Jack) and she accepts the next thershold before the movie ends.
Look at the supernatural helper in the Matrix 1..Trinity was the elixir for Neo..and she tries to make him understand and by the inner most cave moment where he faces his fear he actually does.."there is no spoon"
OMG!! you know what? I think will is actually at the meeting with the goddess/temptress stage..and Its not Liz..Its Tia lmao
Willofthewisp..Tia is the mentor/supernatural aid to all 3 characters in movie 2 and 3 I 'm guessing
Jack sort of hands over his reigns to her when he meets her..He was actually the mentor in movie 1 for both characters..thats why he didn't end up with anyone lol..
all the other characters in the story will probably revolve aroind the minor parts..like the "shadow"(Dragon Lady?) the "trickster" etc..Jack's a trickster but he is a main character/hero so he's not the one..Norrington was actually the trickster I think
4th post in a row!
Here's where dear ole Lizzie is by the end of movie 2
World Of Modern day - I actually think this is movie 1 because straight away they all get called into adventure by movie 2
(1.Ordinary World)
Call to adventure
(2. Call to adventure)( bekett was telling her it was Jack she wants to save, the compass was telling her to go with Jack...Norrington was telling her it was Jack she wants as a man..BUT!..her denial was constantly there because she;'s stuck on this stage through out the middle of movie 2..she still has Will on her mind she's determiend to believe he is one thing she wants most but Jack as a person needs her in his life a WHOLE lot more, she is his elixir..Jack coming back was basically him saying."I need YOU in my life Elizabeth"😉
Refusal of the call
(3. refusal of the call)(refuses Jack, determined to think that it's Will who she needs although will did save him self before hand without her..I actually think that they made it so she "saves him" at th e end so she wont be a totally hated character for refusing Jack/call to adventure like that. Jack coming back for her is what told her that he needs her in his life to feel strong..and she refused the call..this must be why she feels so guilty afterward..the man needs her in his life or he will crumble as a person..and she refused him..left him to die.)
Supernatural Aid
(4. Meeting with the mentor)(Tia's hut is where she realizes where her true priorities lie/true elixir..Tia helps her in gaining him)
Crossing The First Threshold
(5. Crossing the first threshold, belly of the whale) (accepts Jack as an obligation is going to set out after her true elixir )
he may well be..but I doubt Davy Will be a GOOD mentor if you know what I mean..he's going to teach Will to hate Jack...davy is a horrible man
I can imagine this being a point where he does something bad to liz becuse she is no longer his goal /elixir in the story..so what ever he does he will have time to redeem. (resurrection) before the end..
Jack was rejecting his elixir until he met up with Tia...who basically tells us that he is rejecting herlol "loath to claim it as your own"..so she gives him a shove in the right direction..she gives him the jar of dirt so that he loses what he thinks is his true elixir..and it also makes him learn to stop putting faith into material objects..thet are in no way as important as Liz..his saftey is not imporatnt..hers is..then he goes back and gets her
she also helps him by getting rid of will so he can face the first threshold..he takes Liz on board..(quite literally)
Originally posted by shannstar79
Hey Guys,
I have been reading the boards for a long time I hardly eer post, I do love reading your stories and Theories. You are all so talented. I do have to say Lovleyone : this is a great theory and My Favorite!!!
Its not really my theory ..its volgers and campbells..they picked up on it like 50 years ago..you can place it over almost any story revolving around a hero and it usually fits perfectly..even ones from hundreds of years ago..even since ancient times..😄
but thatnks..but I dont deserve the credit lol
I just realized..they probably wont do the 12 steps again from scratch in movie 3..LotR never did that lol I was wrong...movie 1 is pretty seperate from movie 2/3..movie 1 appears to actually be the world of modern day in terms of steps in movie 2