Why Do Other Christians Condemn Catholics?

Originally posted by Alliance
i.e. the well endowed.

Yes, God didn't want people to be well endowed.

*["...A Christian is a universal term, and umbrella term for a person who believes Jesus was the Messiah/savior and follows the Bible. It is that simple..."]

***And, of course, you do err...not knowing the Scriptures.

The Lord Jesus Christ was the Great Physician [for He alone knew the illness that afflicts the hearts of ALL mankind and was the ONLY one who had the CURE for it]...and this is what He said: "And Jesus answering said unto them, 'They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick. I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance'" [Luke 5:31-32]. It is not enough for a person to know that the Lord Jesus Christ is the Great Physician. To be "cured" of the malady that afflicts them...they must "go" to Him for the "cure." Many people [i.e., most of so-called Christendom] know that He is the Messiah/Saviour [God Incarnate]...but mere "mental assent" cannot nor will not make them a "Christian." Until one goes to Him as their Great Physician...and accepts Him as the "cure" for their malady...they will remain "sick" [remain in their sins] and PERISH [i.e., "die the death" in Hell]...for He is the ONLY cure (Saviour) [John 14:6].

To become a "Christian" [i.e., be REDEEMED]...you must see yourself for what you really are...a sinner. You may not like to hear that but it does not change the fact that you are...for it is written: "For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God" [Romans 3:23]..."As it is written, there is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God" [Romans 3:10-11]..."For the wages of sin is death, but the GIFT of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." [Romans 6:23]

(Continued)

Originally posted by Marchello
*["...A Christian is a universal term, and umbrella term for a person who believes Jesus was the Messiah/savior and follows the Bible. It is that simple..."]

***And, of course, you do err...not knowing the Scriptures.

A witty come back there. Trust me, I know the scriptures. I know them enough even to tell you that your point is irrelevant.

You asked the question, I answered it. What I told you was the way Christians are defined in theological terms, in linguistic terms, in terms of categorisation.

Jesus + Bible = Christian.

And doesn't matter one iota how they interpret the Bible, it doesn't stop them being Christian. It doesn't matter one iota if they have other things in addition to the Bible, it doesn't stop them being Christian. It only affects them in terms of denomination. It is that interpretation, that doctrine, that makes them Catholic or Protestant or whatever.

Jesus + Bible = Christian. It doesn't get any simpler then that.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
...Jesus + Bible = Christian. It doesn't get any simpler then that.

Actually, the term "Christian" was used contemptuously to refer to followers of the Way (i.e. Jesus Christ). Those who hated, persecuted, and harrassed Jesus' followers gave them this name out of disdain, to mark and label them. It was not intended to designate any religious denomination as such.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Actually, the term "Christian" was used contemptuously to refer to followers of the Way (i.e. Jesus Christ). Those who hated, persecuted, and harrassed Jesus' followers gave them this name out of disdain, to mark and label them.

And later they became Catholic.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Actually, the term "Christian" was used to contemptuously to followers of the Way (i.e. Jesus Christ). Those who hated, persecuted, and harrassed Jesus' followers gave them this name out of disdain, to mark and label them.

Historicity. Originally perhaps, however in the modern world its meaning has changed.

And now it is the category one goes in if you belong to a Christian sect/denomination. And to qualify as such one has to believe Jesus is the Christ, which usually goes hand in hand with the Bible.

So sorry, but that doesn't change:

Jesus + Bible = Christian.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Actually, the term "Christian" was used contemptuously to refer to followers of the Way (i.e. Jesus Christ). Those who hated, persecuted, and harrassed Jesus' followers gave them this name out of disdain, to mark and label them. It was not intended to designate any religious denomination as such.

It is still the highest honor to be called a Christian.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
It is still the highest honor to be called a Christian.

No, not according to Osama Bin Lodan. 😆

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
It is still the highest honor to be called a Christian.

So? What does that have to do with the topic at hand? The non-rational attempt to claim that Catholics are not in fact Christian when in in terms of definition they are?

Page 2:

You must repent (turn away from your sins). Repentance is not making a resolution to do better and it is not conviction of sin, for a person can be convinced that he is wrong and still not repent. Repentance is a change of mind, a change of heart, and it results in a change of action: "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; and He shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you" [Acts 3:19-20].

You must trust in the "completed work" that Jesus Christ accomplished for you on the cross...you must believe that Jesus Christ "took your place" on the cross, died for your sins (although He never sinned) and was resurrected bodily from the dead [Romans 10:8-11]: "By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ ONCE FOR ALL [i.e., He does not have to die again...over and over again on any altar]. And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can NEVER take away sins: But this man, after He had offered ONE SACRIFICE for sins forever, sat down on the right hand of God: From henceforth expecting till His enemies be made His footstool" [Hebrews 10:10-13].

Salvation is a GIFT of God...and we cannot earn it by our good works [Ephesians 2:8-9]. God gives it to us "free" when we place our FAITH [i.e., trust] in the "completed work" of the Lord Jesus Christ [on our behalf] as the satisfaction [or payment] for our sins [Romans 6:23]. He died as our "substitute" and took the punishment for our sins upon Himself (even though He never sinned) and became our "sacrifice" to satisfy the righteousness required by God [1 John 2:2]. Now because salvation is a GIFT that God offers us "freely"...we must "receive" it [Revelations 3:20;John 1:12-13] to be "saved"...that is, we must "reach out" in faith and receive the GIFT of God [Jesus Christ...John 1:12-13]: "For the wages of sin is death; but the GIFT of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord" [Romans 6:23]. (Continued)

Originally posted by Marchello
Page 2:

You must repent (turn away from your sins). Repentance is not making a resolution to do better and it is not conviction of sin, for a person can be convinced that he is wrong and still not repent. Repentance is a change of mind, a change of heart, and it results in a change of action: "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; and He shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you" [Acts 3:19-20].

You must trust in the "completed work" that Jesus Christ accomplished for you on the cross...you must believe that Jesus Christ "took your place" on the cross, died for your sins (although He never sinned) and was resurrected bodily from the dead [Romans 10:8-11]: "By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ ONCE FOR ALL [i.e., He does not have to die again...over and over again on any altar]. And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can NEVER take away sins: But this man, after He had offered ONE SACRIFICE for sins forever, sat down on the right hand of God: From henceforth expecting till His enemies be made His footstool" [Hebrews 10:10-13].

Salvation is a GIFT of God...and we cannot earn it by our good works [Ephesians 2:8-9]. God gives it to us "free" when we place our FAITH [i.e., trust] in the "completed work" of the Lord Jesus Christ [on our behalf] as the satisfaction [or payment] for our sins [Romans 6:23]. He died as our "substitute" and took the punishment for our sins upon Himself (even though He never sinned) and became our "sacrifice" to satisfy the righteousness required by God [1 John 2:2]. Now because salvation is a GIFT that God offers us "freely"...we must "receive" it [Revelations 3:20;John 1:12-13] to be "saved"...that is, we must "reach out" in faith and receive the GIFT of God [Jesus Christ...John 1:12-13]: "For the wages of sin is death; but the GIFT of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord" [Romans 6:23]. (Continued)

And? The relevance? You must believe in Jesus and the things the Bible said he did?

It doesn't change the definition. There are Christians who think the Bible is metaphorical and figurative, there are ones who believe it is exactly as it says it is. Doctrine.

Originally posted by Marchello
Page 2:

You must repent (turn away from your sins). Repentance is not making a resolution to do better and it is not conviction of sin, for a person can be convinced that he is wrong and still not repent. Repentance is a change of mind, a change of heart, and it results in a change of action: "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; and He shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you" [Acts 3:19-20].

You must trust in the "completed work" that Jesus Christ accomplished for you on the cross...you must believe that Jesus Christ "took your place" on the cross, died for your sins (although He never sinned) and was resurrected bodily from the dead [Romans 10:8-11]: "By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ ONCE FOR ALL [i.e., He does not have to die again...over and over again on any altar]. And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can NEVER take away sins: But this man, after He had offered ONE SACRIFICE for sins forever, sat down on the right hand of God: From henceforth expecting till His enemies be made His footstool" [Hebrews 10:10-13].

Salvation is a GIFT of God...and we cannot earn it by our good works [Ephesians 2:8-9]. God gives it to us "free" when we place our FAITH [i.e., trust] in the "completed work" of the Lord Jesus Christ [on our behalf] as the satisfaction [or payment] for our sins [Romans 6:23]. He died as our "substitute" and took the punishment for our sins upon Himself (even though He never sinned) and became our "sacrifice" to satisfy the righteousness required by God [1 John 2:2]. Now because salvation is a GIFT that God offers us "freely"...we must "receive" it [Revelations 3:20;John 1:12-13] to be "saved"...that is, we must "reach out" in faith and receive the GIFT of God [Jesus Christ...John 1:12-13]: "For the wages of sin is death; but the GIFT of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord" [Romans 6:23]. (Continued)

There is nothing to repent for. Do not begrudge your life, for the road you have traveled has brought you here, and this is heaven.

Page 3:

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the GIFT of God: not of works, lest any man should boast" [Ephesians 2:8-9]..."In whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace (unmerited favor)" [Ephesians 1:7].

To be redeemed from the consequences of your sins you must receive Jesus Christ [God's GIFT to you] personally as your Saviour by faith and trust in the "completed work" that He accomplished for you on Calvary's cross.

Rejection of God provision of salvation through Jesus Christ is eternal death in Hell [1 John 5:10-13]. The choice is yours alone to make [Joshua 24:15;Deuteronomy 30:15].

My prayer for you is that you will accept God's precious GIFT of salvation...and that receiving it you will experience that PEACE which surpasses all understanding [Phillipians 4:7].

Marchello

Originally posted by Marchello
Page 3:

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the GIFT of God: not of works, lest any man should boast" [Ephesians 2:8-9]..."In whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace (unmerited favor)" [Ephesians 1:7].

To be redeemed from the consequences of your sins you must receive Jesus Christ [God's GIFT to you] personally as your Saviour by faith and trust in the "completed work" that He accomplished for you on Calvary's cross.

Rejection of God provision of salvation through Jesus Christ is eternal death in Hell [1 John 5:10-13]. The choice is yours alone to make [Joshua 24:15;Deuteronomy 30:15].

My prayer for you is that you will accept God's precious GIFT of salvation...and that receiving it you will experience that PEACE which surpasses all understanding [Phillipians 4:7].

Marchello

There is nothing to be saved from. 🙄

*["...And doesn't matter one iota how they interpret the Bible, it doesn't stop them being Christian. It doesn't matter one iota if they have other things in addition to the Bible, it doesn't stop them being Christian. It only affects them in terms of denomination. It is that interpretation, that doctrine, that makes them Catholic or Protestant or whatever..."]

***Your words are the words of an unregenerate sinner in need of salvation...only the Lord Jesus Christ can redeem you. Too it would do no good to try and reason with you...for you are beyond reason...too proud to see your unregenerate condition.

Marchello

Originally posted by Marchello
*["...And doesn't matter one iota how they interpret the Bible, it doesn't stop them being Christian. It doesn't matter one iota if they have other things in addition to the Bible, it doesn't stop them being Christian. It only affects them in terms of denomination. It is that interpretation, that doctrine, that makes them Catholic or Protestant or whatever..."]

***Your words are the words of an unregenerate sinner in need of salvation...only the Lord Jesus Christ can redeem you. Too it would do no good to try and reason with you...for you are beyond reason...too proud to see your unregenerate condition.

Marchello

I suspect if I cared I might find that insulting, but I don't.

You are an unregenerate ignorant person in need of a bit of learning.. You asked "what makes a person Christian?"

I responded with the way in which a Christian is classified, and that it is a term that is perfectly appropriate and accurate in the way in which it is used. I can't help it you have some sort of arrogant assumption you and you particular Christian group are the only true ones. You can sing that song till the cow come home, but it doesn't change the way Christians are defined.

And I would be unlikely to believe any claims of salvation coming from those who met with something they are incapable of debating respond with "sorry, But I guess you a sinner and lost." - You are far to proud to listen, which is far more damning I would say.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
You have a lamentable ignorance of Catholic doctrine if you believe the Catholics have made the Bible of "no effect."

But it isn't just Catholics is it... tell me of Mormons and Orthadox and JW's and...

Well any body exposing themselves is bad. Though I'm not sure the last time I saw a Catholic leader jump out of the shadows in a trench coat and flash.

????

How does Orthodoxy fit in with the Mormons and Jehowa's Witnesses?

Orthodox Christianity PRE-DATES Catholisism.

I don't actually know HOW it can be compared to Mormonism and Jehowa's Withness, who are farely new denominations.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
You have a lamentable ignorance of Catholic doctrine if you believe the Catholics have made the Bible of "no effect."

But it isn't just Catholics is it... tell me of Mormons and Orthadox and JW's and...

Mormons follow the Bible heavily, We do not deviate from it. We do have scripture and prophets that bridge the gaps left in the Bible, and gaps exist as anyone should know if they have studied the Bible, but we do not make the Bible of "no effect." We have made of "no effect" erroneous interpretations and beliefs based on misinterpretation of the Bible though.

Now, in a manner JIA is correct. In Catholic belief tradition is often stronger than scripture. It is believed that the general Catholic community will follow the correct path, and so, if the general community of the Catholic Church does something long enough it becomes a part of the Church.

Catechism of the Catholic Church
PART ONE: THE PROFESSION OF FAITH
*SECTION ONE "I BELIEVE" - "WE BELIEVE"
**CHAPTER TWO GOD COMES TO MEET MAN
***Article 2 THE TRANSMISSION OF DIVINE REVELATION
****II. The Relationship Between Tradition and Sacred Scripture

One common source. . .

80 "Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture, then, are bound closely together, and communicate one with the other. For both of them, flowing out from the same divine well-spring, come together in some fashion to form one thing, and move towards the same goal."40 Each of them makes present and fruitful in the Church the mystery of Christ, who promised to remain with his own "always, to the close of the age".41

. . . two distinct modes of transmission

81 "Sacred Scripture is the speech of God as it is put down in writing under the breath of the Holy Spirit."42

"and [Holy] Tradition transmits in its entirety the Word of God which has been entrusted to the apostles by Christ the Lord and the Holy Spirit. It transmits it to the successors of the apostles so that, enlightened by the Spirit of truth, they may faithfully preserve, expound and spread it abroad by their preaching."43

82 As a result the Church, to whom the transmission and interpretation of Revelation is entrusted, "does not derive her certainty about all revealed truths from the holy Scriptures alone. Both Scripture and Tradition must be accepted and honoured with equal sentiments of devotion and reverence."44

Apostolic Tradition and ecclesial traditions

83 The Tradition here in question comes from the apostles and hands on what they received from Jesus' teaching and example and what they learned from the Holy Spirit. the first generation of Christians did not yet have a written New Testament, and the New Testament itself demonstrates the process of living Tradition.

Tradition is to be distinguished from the various theological, disciplinary, liturgical or devotional traditions, born in the local churches over time. These are the particular forms, adapted to different places and times, in which the great Tradition is expressed. In the light of Tradition, these traditions can be retained, modified or even abandoned under the guidance of the Church's Magisterium.

Tradition is equal in weight to Scripture, but it is used to interpret scripture, so tradition must be held as the more accurate by the Catholic Church.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
It is still the highest honor to be called a Christian.

Says who ?

I used to be Christian....I never got any respect for it.

*["...I used to be Christian..."]

***Not so. The Scriptures define what and who you are: "They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us...Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denies the Father and the Son. Whosoever denies the Son, the same has not the Father: but he that acknowledges the Son has the Father also." [1 John 2:19,22,23].

Marchello