The problem with the ego gem is that it was part of Malibu comics. It was alternate universe. Malibu comics was bought and then dissolved by Marvel Comics. Since the battle took place in the Malibu's "Ultraverse", it didn't take place in mainstream Marvel 616 continuity. To further support this, The ego gem hasn't even been seen, heard of, or even mentioned in the 616 universe at all.
Originally posted by Evangel94
Ladies and Gentlemen,1. Jean was inside the "M'Kraan Crystal" when she 'held' the universe. It wasn't even the 616 universe. She didn't do it under her own power. The crystal is what allowed her to do it..
What do you mean it wasnt the 616 universe? This is really becoming a joke Evangel. If youre not gonna bother to read the info in the thread then why bother to join the argument at all?
This kind of laziness that you epitomize is what makes the arguments in this thread go round and round in circles. Have some consideration for your fellow posters.
It was the 616 universe and that is fact. Even if it wasnt the 616 it doesnt change the feat performed, the manipulation of the matter and energy of the entire universe.
Either way this previous post of mine shuts you down.
Ummm the HCT future she amputated was the future of 616. Please read the relevant comics. It really would help.
After Jeans death heres the original response to Emma:
Heres Logan recounting the events which lead to this apocalyptic future in 616
We’re told about how the universe is broken and we’re told of a point where this break occurred. (Obviously referring to Cyclops’ response)
Heres Jean eventually amputating that future from 616 resulting in the “badly wounded” universe:
To heal the wound Jean is directed to the WHR. She is told to heal this wound she must grow a better future to replace the one she just cut away. Jean travels to the crystal empty handed.
Whilst in the WHR Jean is told her task (the telekinetic control of all of those atoms at once) isn’t as easy as it sounds in training.
Formerly empty handed energy globules appear in her hand and by the next panel she has what we’re told is the badly wounded orphan universe. Despite the Consciousness’ words of caution Jean performed her task with no discernible strain and within the space of a few sentences. She materialized the patient within the hospital and that involved the telekinetic control of all of the universes matter as clearly depicted via the art and the speech.
Please bear in mind that Jean amputated HCT future from 616, thereby wounding it, at which point she was directed to the WHR to treat the patient, she went there at which point she materialized a wounded universe in her hand. It doesn’t get much clearer than that.
Jean is told that to grow a better future to replace the one she cut away, she must water the patient with her hearts blood. I.e To symbolically cut all her ties with reality by urging Cyclops to carry on without her. “Live Scott. Live”
Heres the resultant altered response to Emma
What is it she applies her power to which results in an alteration of the events of 616? The patient, the glowing disc in her hand she previously materialized within “the hospital” to treat by growing it a new future. A future she grew by altering Cyclops response. The universe she materialized for treatment was 616. Noone can doubt that.
What do you mean the crystal allowed her to do it? Where is that ever stated? What on panel depiction lead you to come to that conclusion? You have been chased into a deadend and with nowhere to go and nothing else left to say youre stubbornly throwing around mindless speculation and assertions instead of being a grown up and admitting you aint got sh*t left to reply with. As stated the manipulation of the universes component matter was done via telekinesis.
Throughout New X-men Jeans telekinesis consistently grew as the Phoenix within began to manifest once again.
It expands until it becomes more than just an expression of her thoughts physically but until Jeans mind becomes in touch with all her surroundings.
Sublime gathers some of Jeans blood to give himself her mutation, access to the Phoenix Force and with it “telekinetic godhood”
The Beast gains telekinetic godhood and similarly describes his expanded senses and how all matter responds to his slightest whim.
He telekinetically rewrites E.V.A’s software:
Manipulates Logan at a genetic level, turning off his mutation:
Before Jean subtracts him from reality and then telekinetically amputates the chronal axis cutting off this future timeline:
Leading into my WHR scene summary above, wherein we saw Jeans telekinetic godhood demonstrated best with her telekinetic manipulation of all the matter and energy contained within the 616 reality.
Jeans growing telekinetic power with her re-emergence as the Phoenix was one of the main storylines of New X-men and her growth was documented throughout the series leading up to her realising her potential at its end. You have obviously not read the series, your opinion is based on hearsay, a few scans and a love for the IG saga. Jeans power as stated came from her mutation and her feat was performed via telekinesis.
Originally posted by Evangel94
2. The comic GalacticStorm is quoting is an alternate universe comic. It's Earth-15104 NOT Earth 616. "What-If" comics shouldn't be taken with a grain of salt when compared to the canon Earth 616 universe. Remember Punisher killing the Marvel Universe anyone? Or how about Magneto killing Thor by throwing a regular building on him.
Your weak attempt to demean Phoenixes feat by likening it to a What If falls flat on its face because
a) It was the future timeline of 616, it was not a divergent timeline created by a change of events. It happened in 616, it became an alternate reality when Jean amputated it from 616, before altering events to bring about a new future from the “stump”. The future youre currently reading about in comics today.
b) It was the same Jean Grey of 616 who performed the feat. It wasn’t an alternate reality Jean Grey, it was Jean from 616 reborn into reality to put everything back on track.
Originally posted by Evangel94
3. The Marvel Handbook is a joke. It's been known to be full of errors and contradictions against what actually happened in the comics. It should not be considered in a detailed comic debate. COMIC scans are what matters, not anything else.
Unless the Handbook is stating something CONCLUSIVELY stated or depicted otherwise on panel then you as a reader have no authority here to dictate that such an official source is meaningless for debate.
A good example of a CONCLUSIVELY wrong entry is Namor being able to lift just 85 tons as stated in older entrys. Its conclusively incorrect because Namor has been shown lifting buildings and supporting the weight of ships.
A poor example is if an inconclusive (and therefore open to interpretation) statement or artistic depiction is made about a character and the handbook takes an alternative take on things to yourself. Sorry mate. Tough
Either way, some entries can be discredited with conclusive on panel evidence, however some entries are spot on, fact filled enjoyable reads. In light of that while you can discredit an entry you cant dictate that we all disregard handbooks in general as evidence because they contradict your opinion on things.
That will be all. 😄
Originally posted by Evangel94
The problem with the ego gem is that it was part of Malibu comics. It was alternate universe. Malibu comics was bought and then dissolved by Marvel Comics. Since the battle took place in the Malibu's "Ultraverse", it didn't take place in mainstream Marvel 616 continuity. To further support this, The ego gem hasn't even been seen, heard of, or even mentioned in the 616 universe at all.
But it is Marvel continuity as not only during the arc did the characters crossover into 616, but the incident is referenced in the bios of characters such as Sersi and Black Knight. 😬
The ego gem doesnt have to have been heard of or seen of since. That doesnt mean its not a part of marvel continuity anymore. What WOULD make your assertion the case would be if a comic were to come out reiterating the IGs origins and stating there to be only six gems.
See the difference? 🙂
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
But it is Marvel continuity as not only during the arc did the characters crossover into 616, but the incident is referenced in the bios of characters such as Sersi and Black Knight. 😬The ego gem doesnt have to have been heard of or seen of since. That doesnt mean its not a part of marvel continuity anymore. What WOULD make your assertion the case would be if a comic were to come out reiterating the IGs origins and stating there to be only six gems.
See the difference? 🙂
I was just reading about First Fallen, male version of the Phoenix
Interesting
🙂