Satan - The Prince of Darkness

Muslimscholar still won't get it....

Myself and Fini have already proven that the Islamic Texts state that for slaughtering an Infidel you will be rewarded with Virgins, Alliance and Feceman who have no recorded bias against Islam, have also backed both of us up.....

Sorry Muslimscholar, but you are either illiterate or in denial. The texts of Islam, Quran/Hadith support everything we have claimed. I am NOT arguing that Islam is a bad religion or anything like that, but the foundations on which you are "supposed" to base your Faith upon, clearly states this claim...

Originally posted by fini
is this it?

Why the smallest reward for every believer who is admitted to Paradise is 72 wives. ..................... 'The smallest reward for the people of Paradise is an abode where there are 80,000 servants and 72 wives, over which stands a dome decorated with pearls, aquamarine, and ruby, as wide as the distance from Al-Jabiyyah [a Damascus suburb] to Sana'a.'"

Definition of Infidel
1. An unbeliever with respect to a particular religion, especially Christianity or Islam.
2. One who has no religious beliefs.
3. One who doubts or rejects a particular doctrine, system, or principle.

the actual word is not used, but that should not matter.

further quotes
Slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush. (Koran 9:5)
I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers, Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger tips of them. (Koran 8:12)

Personally these are words used to brainwash muslims into terrorism. Most muslims wont do these things that we see on the news.

There are MANY MANY statements in islamic holy books that ARE METAPHORS and should not be taken literally. Why do people see the metaphors in the bible, eg. the entire mankind was born from 2 people and incest, ( lol ok ok some are too pigheaded to even see the literary devices) and cant see those in other scriptures???
Example: [b]Jihad-The term 'jihad' literally means 'struggle'. Muslims believe that there are two kinds of jihad.The other 'jihad' is the inner struggle of the soul which everyone wages against egotistic desires for the sake of attaining inner peace.
HEck even muslims are thought the literal meaning ( as in WAR), when it actually has a deeper meaning. People should sit and have a good talk with their Imam, not go to 'stirring discussions and meetings' [/B]

But i check the Quran and i couldnt find this surrah ....???

and yea next time bring all surrah not a half one , becuase its talk about spcific subject and people may misunderstand it ...

Originally posted by Fatima
But i check the Quran and i couldnt find this surrah ....???

and yea next time bring all surrah not a half one , becuase its talk about spcific subject and people may misunderstand it ...

Well, atleast you looked....so i can't call u ignorant....

Originally posted by fini
is this it?

There are MANY MANY statements in islamic holy books that ARE METAPHORS and should not be taken literally.

Oh really , like what for example ????

Let me be broad and say all of them.

Originally posted by Fatima
Oh really , like what for example ????

See, that is the problem. Taking things literally.

Qur'an, or any other book, cannot be the words of God to us. You know why? Because it concentrates on the things we have to do for God, not what we have to do for each other.

God does not need us to do things for him/her. If it says ''kill infidels'' then it surely means it is not said by God.

If God created all the that we see around us, the infinite complexities of nature and its beauty, why would he want to watch it get soaked in blood of people who ague how one should worship that God.

Bible was adopted by Roman emperors, who changed it to fit their rule better. Qur'an is the same.
I know you are thought that the Bible has been corrupted, but that Qur'an has not, but it is vey likely that it has, and most likely all other holy books too.

And who told you that god order to kill infidels , god will handle them in the judment day so we dont care about them...I belive in all three holy books ,but the Quran was saved from change and its the word of god ..becuas god is the only one who knows our need and what is good or bad for us and if it was from the human it will change with the years or the rules might change ..

for forbidn alcohol ,cheating,adultry ..all bad things ..also the punishment is very effective and reasonable ..maybe you or any western think its bad or not working at this time ,but if you look deeply you would find it very true ....I dont know whats your idea about holy books , but thats my reasons for belive in holy Quran and its enough to me ...

The Qu'ran said to kill all non-believers.

btw...

1. The Qu'ran was changed, if not the text the the interpretaion.

2. Punishments under islamic law ARE NOT at all reasonable.

3. And cut the "western" crap. Were all human and capable of understanding eachother.

Originally posted by Alliance
The Qu'ran said to kill all non-believers.

btw...

1. The Qu'ran was changed, if not the text the the interpretaion.

Yeah the text was changed. Orignally the Quran was just supposed to be verbal poetry, but then it was copied into objects like bones and ......stuff. After Mohammeds death his followers collected all the stuff togther to make the Quran. There are also different versions of the Quran written in different arabic script. Obvoulsy muslims will tell you the different versions are all the same.

As mentioned before the hadiths give the Quran its meaning, common sense indicates that they were created to give a biased view of the Quran.

It would be very cool to have your holy text be a skeleton 😎

Originally posted by Alliance

The Qu'ran said to kill all non-believers.

No , they are alot of christins who lived in my country and they live in peace and save ,even more than their own countries ... god even said any muslim will kill them he will not see the heaven ...

[QUOTE]1. The Qu'ran was changed, if not the text the the interpretaion.

people maybe missunderstand it sometime ..but that does not make the Quran changed ...

2. Punishments under islamic law ARE NOT at all reasonable.

You can notice that in US there are more than million prisoners ..compare it with any islamic country ...and see who has reasonable law ..

.

And cut the "western" crap. Were all human and capable of understanding eachother.

I dont think western understand us ,how so if you called the rsistance organization a terrorsit ,but when your old people resisted the occupation it was OK ..even a simple thing you cannot accept it from us and that upsets me and upset all muslims too ..

Originally posted by Fatima
And who told you that god order to kill infidels , god will handle them in the judment day so we dont care about them...I belive in all three holy books ,but the Quran was saved from change and its the word of god ..becuas god is the only one who knows our need and what is good or bad for us and if it was from the human it will change with the years or the rules might change ..

for forbidn alcohol ,cheating,adultry ..all bad things ..also the punishment is very effective and reasonable ..maybe you or any western think its bad or not working at this time ,but if you look deeply you would find it very true ....I dont know whats your idea about holy books , but thats my reasons for belive in holy Quran and its enough to me ...

Islamic punishments are VERY reasonable. Like the Law that states if a person steals her or she should have thier hand sliced off !

Originally posted by Fatima
No , they are alot of christins who lived in my country and they live in peace and save ,even more than their own countries ... god even said any muslim will kill them he will not see the heaven ...

people maybe missunderstand it sometime ..but that does not make the Quran changed ...

You can notice that in US there are more than million prisoners ..compare it with any islamic country ...and see who has reasonable law ..

I dont think western understand us ,how so if you called the rsistance organization a terrorsit ,but when your old people resisted the occupation it was OK ..even a simple thing you cannot accept it from us and that upsets me and upset all muslims too ..

Christians living side-by-side with Muslims is irrelevant, as not everyone who is Muslim takes every written word of the Qur'an literally or to heart, that goes for any religion/religious person and their religious text of chocie. But, does the Qur'an say that all non-believers of Islam shall be put to death? That is the question.

The Qur'an, just like the Bible and Torah have the flaw that almost any passage in its text can be taken several different ways.

Comparing the amount of prisoners in a jail is not good example of who has better laws. One thing though, most Islamic countries carry out capital punishment for crimes that would be considered lesser in non-Islamic countries. Aren't women hanged for cheating on their husbands?

Are you comparing the American Revolution revolutionist to the likes of Al Qaida?

Originally posted by Alfheim
As mentioned before the hadiths give the Quran its meaning, common sense indicates that they were created to give a biased view of the Quran.

Yes.

Furthermore, Hadiths, just like NT was written by different followers - or there were testaments as such.

Originally posted by Fatima
No , they are alot of christins who lived in my country and they live in peace and save ,even more than their own countries ... god even said any muslim will kill them he will not see the heaven ...

2:190 Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors.

2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.

Now, maybe its just me in my "western" ignorance, but I don't have any idea how I could have interpreted that incorrectly.

Originally posted by Fatima
people maybe missunderstand it sometime ..but that does not make the Quran changed ...

You just proved my point. Even ignoring the textual change, people misinterpret it and change their interpretation. You just proved that. If people can misinterpret it, whats to say they aren't misinterpreting it now?

Originally posted by Fatima
You can notice that in US there are more than million prisoners ..compare it with any islamic country ...and see who has reasonable law ...

The us has 300,000,000 people. Compare that with the population of any Islmaic contry, correct for the population disparity, and then add in the fact that nations with Islamic law just simply execute "criminals."

Once you get past the fact, please reanalyze the rule of Law with rule of terror.

Originally posted by Fatima
I dont think western understand us ,how so if you called the rsistance organization a terrorsit ,but when your old people resisted the occupation it was OK ..even a simple thing you cannot accept it from us and that upsets me and upset all muslims too ..

Listen kid. Terrorism is a tactic. Organizaitons that use terrorist tactics are terrorist organizations. Plain and simple.

What is MOST amusing to me is that I side with Fatah. YET, even thought I believe in Palestinian independance and I have even stated that I feel Hamas is justified in its terrorist activities, you continue to slam me for things I don't believe in. Now THAT, is ignorance which you seem to be spewing an abundance of.

So I dont think you have any points. I don't think you can justify your opinons and simply blame it on the enigmatic "west."

Honestly a lot people in the US are a bunch of xenophobes that would like to see the Middle East smash itself to bits and could care less what goes on there. Luckily, some of us feel differently. Maybe you should stop making uneducated assumptions about people.

I concur (apat from the Palestine argument, but that is different).

As far as the incanation goes -

The comparison between Islamic countries and USA is just counterproductive, simply because Islamic countries put to death far moe people than USA, and for crimes USA does not even consider criminal.

Not to mention Fatima gave a raw number, one not adjusted for population.

Originally posted by Alliance
Luckily, some of us feel differently. Maybe you should stop making uneducated assumptions about people.

Nuff said really.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
I concur (apat from the Palestine argument, but that is different).

This is where you and I disagree.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Islamic punishments are [b]VERY reasonable. Like the Law that states if a person steals her or she should have thier hand sliced off ! [/B]

If someone stole my car i will not sliced his hand only, I will break his head by hammer too .. 😄

[Robtard

Christians living side-by-side with Muslims is irrelevant, as not everyone who is Muslim takes every written word of the Qur'an literally or to heart, that goes for any religion/religious person and their religious text of chocie. But, does the Qur'an say that all non-believers of Islam shall be put to death? That is the question.

I will repeate it million time >>Nope

The Qur'an, just like the Bible and Torah have the flaw that almost any passage in its text can be taken several different ways.

The Quran is saved from changed ..I dont care if you didnt belive in that ..

Comparing the amount of prisoners in a jail is not good example of who has better laws. One thing though, most Islamic countries carry out capital punishment for crimes that would be considered lesser in non-Islamic countries. Aren't women hanged for cheating on their husbands?

And how do you evaluate which rule is better ???maybe comparing the amount of prisoners in a jail is not good example but atleast its show how society is safe ..

Are you comparing the American Revolution revolutionist to the likes of Al Qaida?

Who mention Al Qaeda ???I meant the resistanse organizations like in Palestine and Lebanon ...

Originally posted by Alliance

2:190 Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors.

2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.
Now, maybe its just me in my "western" ignorance, but I don't have any idea how I could have interpreted that incorrectly.

This surrah was talking about tribe in Mecca call "Quraish" ..when the prophet and his followers were preparing for traveling to Mecca for Ummrah ,they took their weapons with them becuase they were afraid that Quraish would attacking them as they always do ,so when they arrived to Mecca Quraish prevented them from going inside ,prophet send a man to negotiate with them ..but they condition that muslims should not do Ummrah this year but next year , and leave right away ...the muslims were very angry for that becuase they were prepared and spend a long time to arrive to Mecca ...but the prophet Mohammed agree on their condtions ..so God said if breach the agreement next year you have the right to fight them ....and you can read first surrah when it say "but begin not hostilities .Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors" just fight who fight you first ..Does that make sence to you ..

[QUOTE]You just proved my point. Even ignoring the textual change, people misinterpret it and change their interpretation. You just proved that. If people can misinterpret it, whats to say they aren't misinterpreting it now?

I will give you an example of how people misinterpreting the Quran ..There is surrah said that female should inherit half than a male ...some people take this rule as general rule ,so they dont equal between girl and boy ...and thats people s worng ..not the Quran..

The us has 300,000,000 people. Compare that with the population of any Islmaic contry, correct for the population disparity, and then add in the fact that nations with Islamic law just simply execute "criminals."

Arab nation also has 300,000,000 people , but we have less crime you do ,not for execute criminals.only..and yea most islamic countries dont apply all islamic rule ..except Suadi Arabia.....

Once you get past the fact, please reanalyze the rule of Law with rule of terror.

If these terror rule would make the criminals think thousand times before they do anything that could damage my society..then its a gift.. 😉

Listen kid. Terrorism is a tactic. Organizaitons that use terrorist tactics are terrorist organizations. Plain and simple.

I guess if these terrorist tactics coulde remove the occupation ,it shouldnt be called aterrosim.. its RIGHT ...Simple and plain..

What is MOST amusing to me is that I side with Fatah. YET, even thought I believe in Palestinian independance and I have even stated that I feel Hamas is justified in its terrorist activities, you continue to slam me for things I don't believe in. Now THAT, is ignorance which you seem to be spewing an abundance of.

Hamas or Fatah ...the important thing that these isreali pigs should disappear ..

So I dont think you have any points. I don't think you can justify your opinons and simply blame it on the enigmatic "west."

I actually have lots of points as you have for Islam ..but i m too busy now ..

Honestly a lot people in the US are a bunch of xenophobes that would like to see the Middle East smash itself to bits and could care less what goes on there. Luckily, some of us feel differently. Maybe you should stop making uneducated assumptions about people

And i dont care of how people in US are thinking about us ,since Bush has alot to be ashamed of ..

End Disscusion ,please ..