Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Now, I understand that you're in Japan and how that's different from being stationed in Iraq. But you don't think backdoor drafts and dropping the requirements to join or sending troops into battle with inadequate supplies, support or equipment is an even greater insult to our troops? I'm not denying that it was a stupid thing to say. I'm saying that you shouldn't get so worked up over a comment when the actions of the current administration do more to insult those men and women who want to serve for the noble reasons you guys seem to think every serviceman joined to express.
As far as supplies go, I'd like to see ANY war that took place in ideal conditions. Supplies are always short, we never have what we want, and there's always something newer and better. You can't tell us that you want us to have adequate body armor and weapons and then turn around and complain because the war budget keeps increasing. We catch that doubletalk, don't worry.
The point is, don't think we're stupid and don't rally behind us just because it's cool or to prove a point. Honestly, we'd be perfectly happy if people just left us alone to do our job and go home. People in the military are just like everyone else for the most part.
Just, you know, there are less fat people.
Originally posted by Kinneary
The military needs more people so the requirements were lowered. I really don't see the problem with that at all. When the requirements to join are lowered that doesn't mean we end up with idiots running our nuclear subs. Your score on the ASVAB and your military bearing are going to decide what you end up doing. Just because you can join doesn't mean you can do any job you want. There are still certain requirements to do any particular job.As far as supplies go, I'd like to see ANY war that took place in ideal conditions. Supplies are always short, we never have what we want, and there's always something newer and better. You can't tell us that you want us to have adequate body armor and weapons and then turn around and complain because the war budget keeps increasing. We catch that doubletalk, don't worry.
The point is, don't think we're stupid and don't rally behind us just because it's cool or to prove a point. Honestly, we'd be perfectly happy if people just left us alone to do our job and go home. People in the military are just like everyone else for the most part.
Just, you know, there are less fat people.
👆
You've got my support, sir.
100%
gunsmilie
Vote Republican.
Originally posted by PVS
kerry is a frikin idiot (and skull n bones...where's deano?)
of course every neocon is in the state of perpetual ejaculation over this since
they finally have something to harp on.
Thats why I would not be anymore thrilled with Kerry as president than I am about Bush being president.He's just as corrupted as well.Like you said,he is a member of Skull and Bones just like Bush and like Clinton,would be a horrible choice to represent the democrat party but I am afraid thats who we are going to be stuck with in the next election.
Originally posted by Kinneary
The military needs more people so the requirements were lowered. I really don't see the problem with that at all. When the requirements to join are lowered that doesn't mean we end up with idiots running our nuclear subs. Your score on the ASVAB and your military bearing are going to decide what you end up doing. Just because you can join doesn't mean you can do any job you want. There are still certain requirements to do any particular job.
Okay. I can follow your line of thought. But who are these lowered requirements targeting? If most people who join the military are coming from middle class families who have high school diplomas, then why is there a need to lower the requirements? My high school administered the ASVAB test. I got a call one weekend morning and the guy said I'd done very well on the test and offered to pay for my education and that he thought I would make an excellent Marine commander. I declined and asked him not to call again. That was my choice. As I pointed out earlier, many people in my class did not decline. I'm not saying they were stupid for having done so, I'm just saying that lowered requirements aren't aimed at the middle class kids who have already graduated from high school and can afford college. They're aimed at the poor kids who don't do as well in school and have no other options for higher education.
Originally posted by Kinneary
As far as supplies go, I'd like to see ANY war that took place in ideal conditions. Supplies are always short, we never have what we want, and there's always something newer and better. You can't tell us that you want us to have adequate body armor and weapons and then turn around and complain because the war budget keeps increasing. We catch that doubletalk, don't worry.
The reason you've never seen a war that took place under ideal circumstances is because war is never an idea situation. At least not for the people on the ground. As for my idea of military spending, you don't seem to know my position very well. I support a large military with adequate funding. In fact, I support a much larger budget. But I'm also not the type to think that military action is the first and best option. And since you point out the increase in military budget, I'd like to know why the military was dropped into a situation where they were grossly underequiped? If there was crystal clear intelligence about Iraq's weapons program, then surely the intel on the ground situation was at least good enough to know what they were going to be facing when they got there. And beyond that, an increase in military spending doesn't imply that money was spent on the supplies enjoyed by the men on the ground.
Originally posted by Kinneary
The point is, don't think we're stupid and don't rally behind us just because it's cool or to prove a point. Honestly, we'd be perfectly happy if people just left us alone to do our job and go home. People in the military are just like everyone else for the most part.Just, you know, there are less fat people.
"Don't rally behind us just because it's cool." Okay. I don't do that, but I get what you're saying. Sithsabre might not get it, but I do. And I've said many times in this thread already that I don't think all members of the military are idiots. I illustrated that from the first page on. Doing your job and going home is great. I'm sure you have an idea of when you'll be leaving Japan or moving on to your next assignment. The guys in Iraq thought that way too. The difference is that they're being kept there long past their expected commitment to the job. My cousin thought he'd be home in time to see his daughter born. As it is, he still hasn't seen her several months after she was born.
You can approach me like I'm the enemy. But I'm arguing for you guys in the military to get what you deserve and expect....what you were promised when you joined. And more importantly that the situation is explained to you realistically. And when I point out that the guys in Iraq are being mistreated and your outrage over that situation should be at the very least equal to your reaction to a stupid comment by Kerry, you tell me I'm calling you dumb.
Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Then attempt to put your thoughts into words yourself.
I did that plenty over the last few pages, you even responded to them.
You know my thoughts on the subject.
Originally posted by Mr Parker
Thats why I would not be anymore thrilled with Kerry as president than I am about Bush being president.He's just as corrupted as well.Like you said,he is a member of Skull and Bones just like Bush and like Clinton,would be a horrible choice to represent the democrat party but I am afraid thats who we are going to be stuck with in the next election.
No way Kerry'll run again.
It'll either be Hillary or Obama.
Originally posted by sithsaber408
I did that plenty over the last few pages, you even responded to them.
You know my thoughts on the subject.
You've explained why Kerry's stupid comment is worse than the practical abuse of military resources being commited by Bush? And you've explained why a stupid comment is as bad or worse than stupid actions? You've explained why back door drafts aren't worth getting worked up about? You've explained why inadequate equipment and supplies are no big deal? You've explained how enlistment requirements being lowered aren't targeting low income kids?
Originally posted by Mr Parker
Mccain would be horrible as well.That guy is so corrupted.He at one time had power as senator when people were begging him to take action to bring home POW'S of vietnam and he ignored the peoples wishes and did nothing to try and bring them home.He would be no good either.
In my wildest dreams it'd be Arnold Schwarzenegger! 😄
Hold on, now don't laugh.
Imagine Arnold VS Hillary! 😱
When Arnold was first elected there was talk of a bill to amend the constitution so that an immagrant who had been a citizen for 20 years or more could be elected president.
Imagine if it passed!
Arnold will almost certainly win as govennor again in my state next week (I'll personally be voting him in), and he's done well here, balancing out the budget without raising taxes.
Bill Clinton was a govennor who skipped the house and Senate and went straght to president, so was George W. Bush.
Hell, Ronald Reagan was an actor , then govennor of California, then President.
It could happen.
I was actually inspired by Arnold's speech from the 2004 Republican National Convention, and by his ability to give a rousing speech to a crowd.
Here's an excerpt:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6SRvRpfOZ8
Have a look at that, its not too long, and tell me that he wouldn't be just as good as Bush?
Or that him v.s Hillary wouldn't kick all kinds of ass?
Okay. I can follow your line of thought. But who are these lowered requirements targeting? If most people who join the military are coming from middle class families who have high school diplomas, then why is there a need to lower the requirements? My high school administered the ASVAB test. I got a call one weekend morning and the guy said I'd done very well on the test and offered to pay for my education and that he thought I would make an excellent Marine commander. I declined and asked him not to call again. That was my choice. As I pointed out earlier, many people in my class did not decline. I'm not saying they were stupid for having done so, I'm just saying that lowered requirements aren't aimed at the middle class kids who have already graduated from high school and can afford college. They're aimed at the poor kids who don't do as well in school and have no other options for higher education.
The reason you've never seen a war that took place under ideal circumstances is because war is never an idea situation. At least not for the people on the ground. As for my idea of military spending, you don't seem to know my position very well. I support a large military with adequate funding. In fact, I support a much larger budget. But I'm also not the type to think that military action is the first and best option. And since you point out the increase in military budget, I'd like to know why the military was dropped into a situation where they were grossly underequiped? If there was crystal clear intelligence about Iraq's weapons program, then surely the intel on the ground situation was at least good enough to know what they were going to be facing when they got there. And beyond that, an increase in military spending doesn't imply that money was spent on the supplies enjoyed by the men on the ground.
The point is still there.
"Don't rally behind us just because it's cool." Okay. I don't do that, but I get what you're saying. Sithsabre might not get it, but I do. And I've said many times in this thread already that I don't think all members of the military are idiots. I illustrated that from the first page on. Doing your job and going home is great. I'm sure you have an idea of when you'll be leaving Japan or moving on to your next assignment. The guys in Iraq thought that way too. The difference is that they're being kept there long past their expected commitment to the job. My cousin thought he'd be home in time to see his daughter born. As it is, he still hasn't seen her several months after she was born.
You can approach me like I'm the enemy. But I'm arguing for you guys in the military to get what you deserve and expect....what you were promised when you joined. And more importantly that the situation is explained to you realistically. And when I point out that the guys in Iraq are being mistreated and your outrage over that situation should be at the very least equal to your reaction to a stupid comment by Kerry, you tell me I'm calling you dumb. [/B]