"Mkaaay. Can someone, anyone explain why Sparrabeth would be a couple that could happen in the movies? Like what indicates Sparrabeth at all?
And yes, this is a sad excuse for a topic. Although it is going to be trashed by a certain someone anyways... most likely"'
... It's just life, though.
I think it's time (not going to say what inspired me) to reaffirm our belief in sparrabeth, that we weren't wrong, that we saw something between them that was real. After all, in the DMC comentary, T&T even say that the reason Elizabeth leans in for another kiss is her way of letting Jack know she did feel something and nearly all of DMC was Jack sorting out how he felt about things, including her. So here we are.
My reason: That look he has when he is in the longboat, preparing to see the kraken demolish his ship and the people in it, and he opens his compass. We don't get to see where it points, but I think it points to her. Terry I think said it points to land and shows Jack can give up what he wants for others, but if the compass points to what you really want most and he goes back to save them all, isn't what he wants the most is for them to be safe? And who on that ship do you think has had the most impact on him?
What's everyone else's big reason?
New video - shameless self plugging 😄
Bri I am working on your video, it should be up soon..ish 😉
Originally posted by willofthewisp
I think it's time (not going to say what inspired me) to reaffirm our belief in sparrabeth, that we weren't wrong, that we saw something between them that was real. After all, in the DMC comentary, T&T even say that the reason Elizabeth leans in for another kiss is her way of letting Jack know she did feel something and nearly all of DMC was Jack sorting out how he felt about things, including her. So here we are.My reason: That look he has when he is in the longboat, preparing to see the kraken demolish his ship and the people in it, and he opens his compass. We don't get to see where it points, but I think it points to her. Terry I think said it points to land and shows Jack can give up what he wants for others, but if the compass points to what you really want most and he goes back to save them all, isn't what he wants the most is for them to be safe? And who on that ship do you think has had the most impact on him?
What's everyone else's big reason?
We did see something in Sparrabeth...or else we would not still be here almost one year after the release of that horrible AWE. People can always interpret things to support their beliefs...maybe perhaps twists little truths even.....but we all think the same things about the same things...so in that case....eveyrthing we've ever believed to be true about Sparrabeth is true...despite that others try to discredit what we say. Anyways....we all know that Fate Intervened. The dress sank. The compass pointed to Jack. The compass didn't work for Jack because he was confused....he knew what he wanted, but was loathed to claim it as his own. The compass in the longboat pointed to the Pearl...becasue of Elizabeth. That her clinging to Jack as he fired the rifle was a climatic moment. That she cried in Tia's cabin ...not just from guilt but that she may in fact have killed a man she loved. I will forever believe in my heart of hearts that Jack and Elizabeth were the true love story of POTC Trilogy....they meet, they fight, they argue, but despite all this they are drawn to each other, they think alike, they act alike, they want each other, but don't want to want each other.....they hurt each other, use each other...yet, still care for each other...and in the end right a wrong....we see them develop....we see them meet, we see them connect.....they understand each other.....proof of that is no more evident than it is during the Pirate Brethren when jack votes her King....and the Parly scene on the strip of beach....awesome stuff...have to run
bravo, Willo and Tigers...
It's so true. I do agree that Jack and Elizabeth were the true story of the pirates series, whether or not the makers meant that to happen, that's what happened. The series begins with Elizabeth singing about "A Pirates Life For Me" and ends with Jack singing it. It's essentially a "coming of age" story for Elizabeth and a "moment of truth" story for Jack... sure Elizabeth marries Will and ends up entangled in this strange curse issue, but for me, that's the side story, the superfluous stuff. The thing is, Elizabeth becomes Pirate King. She beats the legendary Pirate of her childhood dreams at his own game, falls in love with him a little bit perhaps, experiences life with him and life as a pirate, and in some ways carries on the grand tradition of piracy all because of her encounters with Jack.
Jack is the crux the story hangs on. But his motives are always a little sketchy--- and my favorite moments of Jack are when he is with Elizabeth, always and without fail. It brings out depth in his character, which otherwise would have been a gorgeous cartoon. The fact that Jack has been taken in by Elizabeth forms the basis for the most heroic things he does. It makes his character something legendary and epic instead of just hilarious and pretty.
the tension, drama, humor, and plot surrounding Jack and Elizabeth is by far the most impressive of the series, and in my opinion, they never would have been able to pull off a trilogy without it. It's controversial, questionable, unexpected, and brilliant. Even though the ending between them was entirely unsatisfying for me, it still poignantly describes the bond between them-- fate has forced them apart, they've both made decisions about what they will be faithful to, but ultimately, that doesn't take away from everything between them, the sort of soul-mate spark.
it seems irrelevant to me that Elizabeth marries Will and becomes a mother, and that Jack sails off to find the fountain of youth. having adventures with one another was the high point of both of their lives--- Elizabeth grows up because of Jack, Jack accepts himself because of Elizabeth.
That was beautiful, Kate! I fully agree that Jack and Elizabeth are the most complex relationship in the series. It almost makes it even more complex that they didn't end up together because we don't have to have it spelled out for us that they are connected and will run into each other later on. And I kind of like that: they have their own lives and go on their own paths, but yet can't seem to stay away from each other. What were the odds of the two of them seeing each other again after the events of COTBP? What were the actual odds of them actually being able to get into the Locker and getting Jack out? They influence each other's decisions and not only find the other one's company pleasurable, but enlightening. It's impossible for them to stay apart.
Kate, Willo, Tigers!! *standing O* Beautiful words!
"Elizabeth grows up because of Jack, Jack accepts himself because of Elizabeth." ----Kate
Those words hit home with me! It's so true! By the end of AWE Elizabeth was a completely different woman than the girl we were introduced to in COTBP! Jack and Liz do shine together, they bring out the best in one another!
There are many things in AWE that I would change, but one of the mains ones that bothered me so much and still does to this day....is that Jack never got to see Elizabeth SHINE to her full potential! Elizabeth's "What Shall We DIe For" speech was the culmination of everything Elizabeth had achieved...against all odds, against her upbringing, against her petite form, against her gender...Elizabeth climb to the top...earning resepect from men even from Barbossa himself! She stood tall and proud as a Captain, as a PIRATE KING and was, without fear, at the head of a war! It angered me that Jack wasn't there to see her at her very best, especially since it was he who showed her the way!
I agree with what you say Willo...their parting was very unsatisfying but in a way it sort of works. They both are still alive and as long as they are anything could happen. They are very much connect to one another! And going through adventures such as the ones they had, even though there was betrayal after betrayal, in the end their was a certain amount of trust gained! That even if at times they did turn their backs on one another, they equal it by also proving that they would go though great legnths just to bring them back to saftey! So in the future, since it is inevitable, when Jack gets into to trouble and needs help, he will always to turn to the one person whom he trusts...his dear Lizzie!
I wanted Jack to hear her too, but...this is hard to explain, I think it was more important for Will to be there. Consider COTBP. Through the first two-thirds of the movie, Elizabeth is trying to hold her own against Barbossa and hs crew and Will never gets to see she's not totally helpless. This always bothered me because I hoped, hoped, that he knew she was a tough girl and that was why he loved her in the first place. But who is with her when she has her first shining moment? Jack. Jack gets the brunt of her bravery because his rum gets burned and she outwitted him, but he got to see it and told her later he respected it. So COTBP was our chance to see that there was more to her than the typical sassy modern heroine. She was more than just talk and by the end, she was fighting right along Will and Jack both.
She really came into her own in DMC but it was like watching a teenager going through an identity search. Will isn't with her at all and doesn't even know until the movie's almost over that she isn't still in jail. Jack gets to see her brain here. She's quick with the remarks and she can verbally spar with him and, even though he and Will are both busy fighting themselves and James, I'm sure they catch a bit of her battling it out with Davy Jones' goons. But like you said, the guys aren't there for a lot of it.
But by AWE, wow. Here she is wrapping chains around guys' necks much like a certain someone did to her a long time ago. Will has had to see how much she's growing and obviously likes it because he was the one who taught her to fight in the first place, but Jack is gone for much of it and I don't think it's until he sees the death of her father that he realizes how much she's gone through. She's so young and so grown up that Jack must see what the effects of overbearing guilt, alienation, separation from her home and family, the sun, the wind, and possible exhaustion from sailing and fighting have done to her.
To me, he didn't have to hear her speech because he knew she had it in her all along. He made her the pirate king and when she made the decision to go to war, so confidently like she was daring anyone to challenge that choice, he nodded approvingly. And I'm sure seeing her there fighting Davy Jones did it for him too, lol. I mean, the woman he loves is trying to kill his worst enemy. If that doesn't seal the deal that Elizabeth is a powerhouse, I don't know what would convince someone.
Yes, poor Will. I just can't see a reason to choose him over Jack. I see a reason to choose him over a lot of guys I know, but not over Jack. Maybe T&T just wanted to go the unique route by having their princess not end up with the bad boy? Maybe they saw her going with Jack as a slap in the face to marriage and faithfulness....even though Liz already technically cheated on Will. I'm not sure why they considered Will and Liz staying together as so crucial to the story. They didn't make it clear enough that they were the soul mates. Instead, we got something much more interesting going on behind the scenes that occasionally comes to the forefront in the forms of poignant conversation that is actually character development rather than exposition and out-of-this-world kissing.
Miz Kateloves, I'm putting in my two cents as well, having been in on almost all the whatfor what's been said or theorized from last June. You go to the head of the class dear one--it's lovely and dignified and economical what you've stated. It WORKS! I am beginning to believe it's our coming of age too--man, what a point to make--brilliant piratistas!!