Originally posted by slade10
Thank you for proving my point.Tyrant states that Morg has no power after being drained, THEN releases it back to him from the orb to fight thanos, terrax, and ganymede.
Thanos knocks Morg out with 1 blast, then walks away from his smoldering body to find more information about tyrant (which was the entire point of the enterprise). Morg is freed, and they let him run off back to galactus, with his power back.
What does this show?
1. Thanos when pulling punches was still able to leave morg smoldering on the ground with 1 blast. (I wouldn't go so far as to say he was trying to help him; thanos doesn't really help anyone, at least until his recent series.)
2. Morg's power had been released back to him.
3. Thanos later fought tyrant only on his own power, and took the orb for the knowledge within, AS IS CLEARLY STATED IN THE COMIC.
It makes little sense to say that that orb affected that fight when it was morg's orb, and morg's power had already been released back to him.
What about the morg fight on its own merits? (After all, it's possible that thanos AND tyrant are far weaker than we thought)
Granted, thanos did get tackled. But that tells us exactly nothing about power. King Thor was tackled by captain america when he was pulling punches. (because his child was being threatened) Thanos himself got knocked back by spiderman in the IG saga. What we DO know is that morg showed exactly zero ability to harm thanos (in a comic entitled "MORG", no less), even in a fight that thanos had no interest in fighting. And this was the fight's result (which avalon neglected to post):
And this is clearly a low showing for thanos. He DID get tackled, and his first blast WAS ineffective. But contrary to people's bizarre and crazed interpretation of my surfer vs. thanos scans, we have good and obvious reasons why thanos would pull punches against morg:
They were on the same side fighting tyrant, DUH.
In contrast, surfer has no reason to pull punches when thanos is about to kill him. But he was "holding back", right?
Thanks for the long drivelish post, and for saving me time of posting that scan.
It clearly says "reinvigorate" which means it's a normal morg giving Thanos a hard time. He needed Ganymede to hold him just so he could power up a blast..lol
Word it anyway you like. The scans are the proof. Funny how you neglected to post this during your "arguments."
And umm...I posted that Thanos won, read the caption....but it sure wasn't easily....
Originally posted by leonidas
so again, he can't 'flick' energy? you say he punched him? where exactly do you see him actually STRIKING ben?? absolutely astounding . . . he punches him cuz it says WHAM??! oh, well okay then . . . apparently blasts can't have WHAM after them. do you know how stupid that sounds?
We see thing hard charging from a few feet away. We see a flick of the fingers. Then Captain Marvel says "flick of the fingers."
Why would thanos wait until thing was almost upon him if he was going to use an energy blast? And why would he flick his fingers? He doesn't need to move his body or make hand gestures to release energy. This is not Dr. Strange. And finally why wouldn't captain marvel say, "You've KO'd him in one blast!" or "You've KO'd him with cosmic energy!" instead of what he DOES say: "You've KO'd him with a FLICK OF YOUR FINGERS."
Yes, he is glowing when he does it. Thanos, like other eteranals, is glowing in virtually all of his fights. His strength is a fucntion of cosmic energy. Or are you going to say these scans that I posted previously,
are not really punches? We don't see any physical contact. So Thanos is just moving his hand oh so close to surfer and then blasting him with cosmic energy? That makes no sense.
Originally posted by leonidas
and? glads has done the same. thor and herc. hulk has smashed a planet-sized asteroid.
Yes, and all of these feats are beyond sundipped superman, as aptly demonstrated by scans posted by superman's fans on this very thread.
As for the difference between champ's feat and these others. Champion did it on ACCIDENT -- in the afterswing of a physical attack. BIG difference.
Originally posted by leonidas
just stick to your precious 'words' that mean so much to you, cuz it's the only 'proof' you can claim for the 'infinite power' of the gem.
You use words constantly as well. They don't mean 'so much' to me. They mean what they mean. If you don't like words, move to greenland and start a hermitage.
Originally posted by leonidas
i'm likewise tired of this drivel.
Tired of this drivel? You never even attempted to respond to it before, so I'm not sure why you'd be tired of it. I, on the other hand, have point-by-point responded to every single argument you have made here. But you keep going back to the beginning and ignoring my arguments. I'm not sure if it's bad reading or debate by repetition.
Originally posted by leonidas
thor used power to ko a group of them. he beat the crap out of ss and ko'd him TWICE in that arc sans gem (deny it, please!)
Surfer was pulling punches, and they STILL fougth for virtually an entire comic. Surfer took probably a dozen blows through the comic, and was not put down until the last blow that sent him spiraling into a planet.
In contrast, against thor w/ power gem, surfer was put down with one mjolnir throw. Nothing elaborate. No long fight through an entire comic. One throw, bam, surfer's out.
You are ridiculously inconsistent. A few days ago, you were trying to argue that wm thor was forum-created nonsense, and that wm couldn't be THAT much of a boost, since wm thor was having a hard time with surfer and brb. Now when it's convenient for you, you exactly reverse your position. Suddenly, ALL of thor's vast power came from wm, and not the power gem?
The entire point of the arc's climax is the power gem and the vast threat posed by thor as long as he is bearing it. You have somehow exactly reversed this point and turned the power gem into something weaker than as asgardian trinket. That is either atrociously bad interpretation, or deliberately misleading.
Originally posted by leonidas
you nor anyone else can say how much. 10x you say? exactly which algorithm did you use to derive THAT number . . .?
I already have gone through my "algorithm" in detail probably a DOZEN TIMES.
What I said was that the power gem is clearly more powerful than the unipower (50x), than wm (10x), and the belt of strenght (2x). Nonetheless, I estimated conservatively and assumed that the power gem was granting thor 10x.
You, on the other hand, have no basis for arguing otherwise. Your "algorithm" consists of your near religious belief that the power gem is, in fact, weaker than an asgardian trinket, despite literally hundreds of comic pages suggesting otherwise.
Moreover, you cannot point to a single example where a power gem wielder was having trouble in a physical fight, having trouble lifting something, or otherwise indicating low strength. Yet you persist in that belief.
Until you can make that case, marvel's opinion beat yours. Sorry.
Originally posted by leonidas
you ARE pretentious, aren't you? WE'RE the ones who can't look at a scan and interpret it properly?? answer this: is it at all POSSIBLE YOU are misinterpreting? probably not. ALL of us are wrong and YOU are right.
Misinterpreting is being charitable. A better word would probably be "lying," in all honesty. See the aegis steel thread for examples.
Originally posted by leonidas
you do know (you must since you know these characters so much better than i do) ss HAS actually defeated thanos in a ss comic after strange banished them both (it was their psychic selves though, or astral selves, or some such, but it was never clear the difference between THESE selves and their 'regular selves'😉 to an abandoned planet? ss could actually have KILLED thanos, but decided to be merciful. when he got up, thanos sucker struck him to win.
Surfer "almost beat thanos" on the astral plane with their POWERS REMOVED. And after they AGREED to be sent there, not when they were "banished" by strange.
That proves, what exactly? That surfer with no powers still gets beat by thanos with no powers? This is the fight's conclusion:
Nice try, there.
I have to say, though, purposely leaving out crucial information (that the two agreed and were NOT banished, and had no powers) is very bad form. Almost as bad as photoshopping a scan.
Originally posted by leonidas
YOU asked ME who thought ss jobbed. i told you. and now you're all over ME for telling you?? you don't like or want answers, don't ask questions. you want to argue with all of the ss fanboys, be my guest. they'll laugh at you too.
You said there were plenty of people who thought ss jobbed. I asked who. You said ss fans on the ss thread. I said that this was hardly evidence that "plenty of people" think ss jobs. I've seen wolverine threads with many wolverine fans saying wolverine could beat superman, because of the admantium skeleton and regeneration.
Does this mean that "plenty of people" think wolverine could beat superman?
Originally posted by leonidas
as for who doesn't know anything about who . . . if you want to debate i'll be happy to oblige. it's clear you're getting pissed because a bunch of us remain unconvinced by your 'so carefully supported notions' like thanos is 1000x stronger than superman
Let's see. You called me pretentious, state that people are laughing at me, have said on somewhere from 5-6 threads that my opinions are "stupid" and "drivel." And I'm the one who's throwing a "tantrum"? Please.
The worst I've said, I think, is that your arguments are tired. That is true. You've repeated the same arguments over and over, generally without even bothering to respond to the obvious (and already stated) counter-arguments.
This is a debate forum. When people made illogical, repetitious, or dishonest arguments, I point it out.
Originally posted by leonidas
you don't like that -- tough. accept others' opinions, even if you disagree, and move along.
I could say teh same about you. Accept my opinioin, move along.
This has nothing to do with accepting peoples' opinioins, though -- what seems to REALLY bother you is when people criticizie your (often unsubstantiated) claims. Especially, it seems, when it comes to superman.
Erm, Thanos did not beat thing with "just a flick of his fingers", it was a blast from his hands. I don't understand how this is up for debate. The pic is showing this very clearly.
Thanos is waaaay stronger than Thing, but if he actually tried to knock him down with a real flick of his finger, Thing would break it.
Originally posted by slade10They were on the same side fighting tyrant, DUH.
In contrast, surfer has no reason to pull punches when thanos is about to kill him. But he was "holding back", right?
I have to say, after looking a little closer, there is this scan, which suggests that thanos might not have been pulling punches.
(Thanos stating that morg is an obstacle, and it doesn't matter if he's being mind controlled)
Then again, after he knocks him down, he just walks away. I think it's pretty clear he didn't care to "help" Morg, but just as clear that he was far from bloodlusted.
Originally posted by who?-kid
Erm, Thanos did not beat thing with "just a flick of his fingers", it was a blast from his hands. I don't understand how this is up for debate. The pic is showing this very clearly.Thanos is waaaay stronger than Thing, but if he actually tried to knock him down with a real flick of his finger, Thing would break it.
I strongly disagree. The guy pimp smacked Hulk and Drax in one blow.
Dazed and sent them flying. Thing wouldn't be doing any kind of breaking at all. Thing can barely handle one of the Blood Brothers, let alone breaking anything off of Thanos
Originally posted by who?-kid
He surprised Hulk and Drax, knocked them back and they were back on their feet a second later, ready for more.No big deal.
Surprised?
They lunged at him head on while Thanos was standing there wide open and TURNED AROUND and slapped them. Like they were gnats.
ARE YOU KIDDING? That's a simple feat to you?
How many people can do that in MU world without being insanely powerful? C'mon man give credit where credit is due.
Furthermore Thing and Thanos should never be spoken in the same sentence because they have nothing in common.
oh, and demi, before handing out too many props, did you tell slade you think superman wins this fight via speedblitz? wasn't it YOUR revelation that thanos has no speed feats and cannot handle blitzes? i believe you used that ss scan where he missed the gauntlet as one of your proofs, among a couple others you brought up . . .
😉
😆
oh, and i can't get the scan -- not technically savvy enough to get the image from my computer to here, but i can quote and say it is from issue #3 of marvel THE END:
strange (in secret, to ss): " . . . Too much is at stake not to. BUt you must stay close and keep a sharp eye on him. For you are the only one with the power to do what must be done."
ss: "Which is?"
strange: "The first sign of betrayal on Thanos's part and he must be mercilessly dispatched!"
wish i was better with computers . . . 🙁
i'm sure someone must have the scan though . . .
and the issue where ss actually defeats thanos is ss #59. for those who doubt what i said, (because i've raised this particular issue in the past and some thanos fans told me i was full of crap) here's just one quick scan. again, this is their 'essences' battling and their powers are not the exact same as they would be. interesting to note that thanos WAS beating ss down in this fight before ss went nuts though, and the fight climaxed with the scene at the bottom where thanos is begging ss to kill him. as i said, ss chooses mercy (strange was TRYING to pull them out but their wills were too strong and he couldn't -- lethal force in the fight had been forbidden by strange, but he admitted to being powerless to prevent the death from happening), turns around and thanos sucker punches him for the win.
i'm not sure WHAT it tells to be honest about the respective characters, but ss DID have the chance to kill him -- least according to strange and thanos himself . . .
Originally posted by leonidas
oh, and demi, before handing out too many props, did you tell slade you think superman wins this fight via speedblitz? wasn't it YOUR revelation that thanos has no speed feats and cannot handle blitzes? i believe you used that ss scan where he missed the gauntlet as one of your proofs, among a couple others you brought up . . .😉
😆
Not on this thread! Check it out for yourself...I cleared MY thread. Seems like you're having some trouble on yours. 😄
But don't let ME distract you...you already have enough to worry about. 😉
Originally posted by leonidas
and the issue where ss actually defeats thanos is ss #59. for those who doubt what i said, (because i've raised this particular issue in the past and some thanos fans told me i was full of crap) here's just one quick scan. again, this is their 'essences' battling and their powers are not the exact same as they would be. interesting to note that thanos WAS beating ss down in this fight before ss went nuts though, and the fight climaxed with the scene at the bottom where thanos is begging ss to kill him. as i said, ss chooses mercy (strange was TRYING to pull them out but their wills were too strong and he couldn't -- lethal force in the fight had been forbidden by strange, but he admitted to being powerless to prevent the death from happening), turns around and thanos sucker punches him for the win.i'm not sure WHAT it tells to be honest about the respective characters, but ss DID have the chance to kill him -- least according to strange and thanos himself . . .
They had no powers. See the scan I posted above from the first page of the fight. Surfer states he's lost his power cosmic; thanos affirms.
And here's the scan after yours.
Thanos indicates that he wants to die to join his mistress death. Does that mean he threw the fight? Arguably. In any event, this was not anything close to a normal fight.
Originally posted by demigawd
Not on this thread! Check it out for yourself...I cleared MY thread. Seems like you're having some trouble on yours. 😄But don't let ME distract you...you already have enough to worry about. 😉
translation: i ran away on 'sabbatical' -- again! -- before the debate REALLY got too heated. 😆
and, in the event that you haven't been paying attention: this thread will NEVER be cleared. nor am i especially worried, much as you'd love it if i were . . . i'm happy knowing most still seem to be somewhere in the neighbourhood of my opinion. if slade convinced a few, good for him.
as far as i'm concerned, i'll simply cite irreconcilable differences on this thread. 😄
but . . . this IS thanos v superman, demi-who-never-loses-debates. so . . . does superman speedblitz thanos and win . . . fill in the uninformed! 😖hifty:
i luv ya like a brother, but yer a bastard thru and thru . . .
😆
and for the future: instigating is MY schtick . . .
I've been trying to find a good site with some more info and scans on Thanos' abilties. This one seems to be pretty good and raises some good points. 📖
http://www.corvusonline.net/thanos/powers.html
1. The most important is that it states that the looseleaf edition of the HBOTMU states that both his speed and agility are at the "enhanced human" level. I'd don't have a copy, so can anyone verify this.
2. It shows a scan (that has been posted here) showing Thanos manipulating matter so creating K-nite is a possibility.
3. Thanos has produced Gamma Radiation from his eyes (again K-nite radiation should be possible)
4. Thanos' attacks may be magical in nature: "It has been speculated that the nature of Thanos' cosmic energy reserve may be quasi-mystical in nature. Certainly comments made by Odin during his battle with the Mad Titan would lend support to this theory, as he stated that Thanos tapped into a reserve of 'Dark' power. Considering Thanos' knowledge of things arcane, it is quite possible that his energies are partially mystic in nature. "
5. He maybe able to increase his strenght and duriblility higher than his base line: "It has been suggested that Thanos can tap into his reserves of cosmic energy to increase his durability even further. While it has not been proven, several incidents have shown evidence for this claim. Chief among these examples is the battle he waged against a doppelganger of himself, created by the Magus ( 'Warlock and the Infinity Watch' #9 ). At the climax of this battle, Thanos appeared to supercharge his strength and durability with a nimbus of cosmic energy."
I'm not sure what all this proves or who it favors, but I thought I'd add it to the debate.
Originally posted by TheKahn1. The most important is that it states that the looseleaf edition of the HBOTMU states that both his speed and agility are at the "enhanced human" level. I'd don't have a copy, so can anyone verify this.
Pretty sure that's wrong. IIRC, Marvel's site (the official one) states that thanos has "near godlike reflexes and agility."
