Originally posted by slade10So engines that generate enough velocity to make a Pluto sized planet accelerate to lightspeed don't add much resistance? 😆 Ok 🤪
Please read the thread. We've already been through this. Superman is shown straining to move warworld, THEN brainiac turns on the thrusters. It stands to reason that the thrusters did not add much, since superman was straining before they were turned on.Moreover, brainiac also states that warworld is in a position of "delicate balance" -- I don't know about you, but I do not turn on the jets when I am carrying fine china.
Finally, warworld is a moon. An average planet is hundreds or thousands of times larger than a moon. And destroying something takes far more power than moving it. Finally, note that thanos destroyed a planet before at least a 10x upgrade in strength by death. Probably closer to 100x.
Stand in front of my car and push it and I'll watch you strain for a bit then I'll put it into first gear and let the clutch fly and we'll see what happens.
Originally posted by slade10
For the knowledge, as is stated in the comic on the second to last page, for anyone who bothered reading it.Morg's power is nothing. Morg had already shown exactly zero capacity to harm tyrant. And by the time thanos got the orb, morg had already escaped from the draining battery and re-manifested his powers. It's not clear that orb had ANY power, much less the power to fight a galactus clone.
What was Thanos doing to it? If it had zero energy, why did Thanos grab it and instantly start doing better against Tyrant? Why did he even bother to pick it up? It's obvious that the orb, no matter the energy source, gave him a significant power boost. The fact is, Thanos DIDN'T stand by himself against Tyrant any more than Superman stood by himself against Imperiex Prime.
Neither did you. What's your point? You post enough to get your point across. You claimed that thanos did not smack thor around. That was clearly false.In any event, if people want to see the whole fight, I have no problem with it. I'm not the one trying to paint a distorted picture.
So how do you see Thanos smacking Thor around in that fight, exactly? Thanos gets his ship's shields broken, Thanos gets whacked into a wall, and Thanos gets a bloody freaking face. The fight was very even, both got in good shots. You posted 2 scans of Thanos hitting Thor, I posted two of the opposite, because you implied that Thanos basically manhandled Thor the whole time, which was CLEARLY not the case.
And stars are probably less stable than planets. It's one gigantic nuclear reaction, it doesn't take the same amount of force to forcea star to go nova as it does to shatter a rock of the same size. I can tear up a huge styrofoam ball, but I'd probably hurt myself punching a pebble. Size isn't all that counts. And Surfer fixing a star is matter manipulation, not raw blasting power. AND the scan of Surfer blasting Thanos is clearly not a full powered blast because A: no terrain damage. B: no power cosmic eyes, no real buildup, nothing. It was a much more standard shot.
Originally posted by Dizzle
What was Thanos doing to it? If it had zero energy, why did Thanos grab it and instantly start doing better against Tyrant? Why did he even bother to pick it up? It's obvious that the orb, no matter the energy source, gave him a significant power boost. The fact is, Thanos DIDN'T stand by himself against Tyrant any more than Superman stood by himself against Imperiex Prime.
Look, it's pretty obvious you haven't even looked at the comic. Why do you continue arguing?
Thanos had the orb from the start of the fight. He was tossing it around in his hand for 5 pages before the fight even started. This entire time, he is talking what he LEARNED about tyrant by examining the orb.
He does use the orb at one point and blast him. This is the best evidence that the orb granted any signficiant power. This is vastly outweighed by the other evidence, including clear text stating that the orb has granted thanos vast KNOWLEDGE.
Thanos has defeated cube beings, who are above skyfather level, and blew galactus through his ship and onto the ground. Going toe-to-toe with non-full-power tyrant is perfectly consistent with his known powers and appearances. On the other hand, claiming that a weak herald somehow boosted thanos makes exactly zero sense. Superman does not often yell to batman, "Bruce, please grant me your strength for this battle!"
Morg is even weaker relative to tyrant than bruce is relative to superman.
Originally posted by slade10
Look, it's pretty obvious you haven't even looked at the comic. Why do you continue arguing?Thanos had the orb from the start of the fight. He was tossing it around in his hand for 5 pages before the fight even started. This entire time, he is talking what he LEARNED about tyrant by examining the orb.
He does use the orb at one point and blast him. This is the best evidence that the orb granted any signficiant power. This is vastly outweighed by the other evidence, including clear text stating that the orb has granted thanos vast KNOWLEDGE.
Thanos has defeated cube beings, who are above skyfather level, and blew galactus through his ship and onto the ground. Going toe-to-toe with non-full-power tyrant is perfectly consistent with his known powers and appearances. On the other hand, claiming that a weak herald somehow boosted thanos makes exactly zero sense. Superman does not often yell to batman, "Bruce, please grant me your strength for this battle!"
Morg is even weaker relative to tyrant than bruce is relative to superman.
What, knowledge and power can't be present in one item? Your logic makes no sense, as the one time it appeared in battle, Thanos used it to great effect. The fact that he DID use the orb to fight INSTEAD of his own blasts tells that it holds a significant amount of power, regardless of its other functions. As you said, it can't have merely been Morg's power, if Morg alone wouldn't have done anything to Tyrant.
The Superman/Batman comparison is kinda random... As you can't really prove that the orb didn't hold any significant power, when it very clearly does. I'm gonna call it a red herring and move on.
Originally posted by Dizzle
And stars are probably less stable than planets. It's one gigantic nuclear reaction, it doesn't take the same amount of force to forcea star to go nova as it does to shatter a rock of the same size. I can tear up a huge styrofoam ball, but I'd probably hurt myself punching a pebble. Size isn't all that counts. And Surfer fixing a star is matter manipulation, not raw blasting power. AND the scan of Surfer blasting Thanos is clearly not a full powered blast because A: no terrain damage. B: no power cosmic eyes, no real buildup, nothing. It was a much more standard shot.
That is insane. You think it takes less force to destroy a star than a planet millions of times smaller? This is your best argument on behalf of superman? (who, incidentally, has never even destroyed a planet)
A star is not a styrofoam ball relative to a planet's pebble. A star is a super-dense, super-heated house-sized mass of plasma relative to a pebble.
And yes, it would take significantly more force to destroy the super-dense, super-heated house-sized mass of plasma than it would take to destroy a pebble. All I would need for the pebble is a hammer. I could have a billion hammers, and I'd still have no luck with the house-sized plasma ball. Unless I joined the military and moved up to general rank, I don't think there's anything I could get my hands on to complete the task.
Originally posted by Dizzle
As you said, it can't have merely been Morg's power, if Morg alone wouldn't have done anything to Tyrant.
Actually, it was.
I've already been through this argument with leo. He and you apparently think taht this massively powerful artifact is used in this fight, with exactly zero textual indication by thanos or tyrant. Moreover, you both apparently also believe that despite its vast tyrant-level power, this orb disappears into the comic void and is never seen or heard of again.
That makes no sense. Thanos states he's acquiring knowledge from the orb, both before the fight and after when he's examining it. Tyrant does not mention the orb at all, and makes no indication that the orb is boosting thanos' strength.
Originally posted by slade10
That is insane. You think it takes less force to destroy a star than a planet millions of times smaller? This is your best argument on behalf of superman? (who, incidentally, has never even destroyed a planet)A star is not a styrofoam ball relative to a planet's pebble. A star is a super-dense, super-heated house-sized mass of plasma relative to a pebble.
And yes, it would take significantly more force to destroy the super-dense, super-heated house-sized mass of plasma than it would take to destroy a pebble. All I would need for the pebble is a hammer. I could have a billion hammers, and I'd still have no luck with the house-sized plasma ball. Unless I joined the military and moved up to general rank, I don't think there's anything I could get my hands on to complete the task.
Concussive force, no. But heralds come equipped with a lot more than that. Plasma isn't stable. I don't know exactly what it would take to start a massive nuclear reaction that would end in the star going supernova, but Nova didn't just fly up to the star and use a massive blast to blow it up. She started a reaction that caused it to make itself explode, there's a subtle difference.
Originally posted by Dizzle
Concussive force, no. But heralds come equipped with a lot more than that. Plasma isn't stable. I don't know exactly what it would take to start a massive nuclear reaction that would end in the star going supernova, but Nova didn't just fly up to the star and use a massive blast to blow it up. She started a reaction that caused it to make itself explode, there's a subtle difference.
Actually, she did. Look at the pic.
And not stable? You could set off a million hydrgen bombs in the sun, and it would be like a dime dropping in the ocean. Stars last billions and billions of years for a reason.
Originally posted by slade10
Morg is even weaker relative to tyrant than bruce is relative to superman.
Well, I'm happy you said that... This is a normal Morg mind controlled by Tyrant.
Thanos defeats heralds easily? 100x strength here? Morg effortlessly gets through Thanos blast and tackles him...
Indestructable? Unable to die? Why did he crawl to pick Terrax's axe? Why is he struggling to block the Morgs axe?
Ganymede, help!!! He finally defeats him, and even then it's not a K.O.
He did not go there to fight Morg but to help him escape from Tyrant. Tyrant was fighting Gladiator,Beta Ray Thor & Silver Surfer at the same time but Tyrant beat them. But yet Thanos went toe to toe with Tyrant and only left because he was satisfied that he could stand toe to toe with Tyrant and that he was able to get the sphere back to.Morg is very powerful probably the most powerful Herald when he had the WOL since Silver Surfer now like I said Thanos was not there to fight Morg but to help him. Morg beat Firelord,Nova,Terrax and Air-Walker all at the same time. Thanos vs Morg would be a hell of a fight but because of Thanos cosmic powers and experience Thanos wins 7/10 which is like 4 better then Superman could muster
Where do people get the stats that says Thanos is WAYYY stronger than Superman?
Thanos is one of the strongest heavyweights in Marvel, below a cosmic entity. But I always just see him sum up cosmic energy for blasting, and brawling effectively with several opponents at a time; I haven't seen a true strength feat from him.
If someone has posted one somewhere in these (sigh)28 pages, I've missed it.
No he not been shown lifting large ships or Mountains or anything like that but when somebody who wrote for the Incredible Hulk for 12 years says Thanos is in his own strength class I think you can believe him. Also Thanos has taken on 2 or more people at a time who lift well beyond Class 100 strength and beat them. Thanos is a cerebral assassin. He doesn't really worry about strength feats.
Originally posted by golem370
He did not go there to fight Morg but to help him escape from Tyrant. Tyrant was fighting Gladiator,Beta Ray Thor & Silver Surfer at the same time but Tyrant beat them. But yet Thanos went toe to toe with Tyrant and only left because he was satisfied that he could stand toe to toe with Tyrant and that he was able to get the sphere back to.Morg is very powerful probably the most powerful Herald when he had the WOL since Silver Surfer now like I said Thanos was not there to fight Morg but to help him. Morg beat Firelord,Nova,Terrax and Air-Walker all at the same time. Thanos vs Morg would be a hell of a fight but because of Thanos cosmic powers and experience Thanos wins 7/10 which is like 4 better then Superman could muster
You would argue that Aunt May could muster a win if it meant Marvel got a win.
<<And Marvel says that he KO'd him with a flick of his fingers... exactly why then? And I didn't know cosmic energy went "WHAM" in big white letters. >>
so again, he can't 'flick' energy? you say he punched him? where exactly do you see him actually STRIKING ben?? absolutely astounding . . . he punches him cuz it says WHAM??! oh, well okay then . . . apparently blasts can't have WHAM after them. do you know how stupid that sounds?
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but it's US who can't interpret scans!!
<<Champion had no idea the gem was that powerful. He was only accidentally tapping it. Read the comic, please. And even with just his accidental usage of the gem, he was smashing through worlds as if they were cornflakes. >>
and? glads has done the same. thor and herc. hulk has smashed a planet-sized asteroid. you STILL, after all this time, haven't shown anything a reg non-gem wearer hasn't done. good luck. keep repeating all the same things though. it's really helping you so far . . .
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just stick to your precious 'words' that mean so much to you, cuz it's the only 'proof' you can claim for the 'infinite power' of the gem.
<<THis argument is becoming tired. I've already shown feats. Thor with warrior madness fougth silver surfer for an entire comic, and could not bring him down. With the power gem, he 1-shooted him, along with strange, warlock, and the infinity watch.>>
i'm likewise tired of this drivel. thor used power to ko a group of them. he beat the crap out of ss and ko'd him TWICE in that arc sans gem (deny it, please!) -- ss was ko'd on the first page when aw fought thor 1on1 briefly, and he was ko'd at the end of that issue when aw had to use ss's own board to get them BOTH out of there before thor killed them both when he declared enough, and finished them easily. the gem appeared to have amped him some, yes, but that would be expected. you nor anyone else can say how much. 10x you say? exactly which algorithm did you use to derive THAT number . . .?
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<<That's true. Only cosmic energy wielders have the power to harm thanos, as he cannot be killed except by molecular dispersion. Please post the scan. I've been kind enough to support my arguments with actual evidence. And you and your JLA mates haven't had the best of records in interpreting scans, to be completely honest. >>
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you ARE pretentious, aren't you? WE'RE the ones who can't look at a scan and interpret it properly?? answer this: is it at all POSSIBLE YOU are misinterpreting? probably not. ALL of us are wrong and YOU are right.
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funny, i'm not the one who says a flash of energy and no sight of physical contact means someone has PUNCHED someone!!
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i'll see if i can get a scan of strange later. frankly though i'm pretty tired of this argument (which is what you named it -- a noticeably different term from a 'debate', btw . . .)
you do know (you must since you know these characters so much better than i do) ss HAS actually defeated thanos in a ss comic after strange banished them both (it was their psychic selves though, or astral selves, or some such, but it was never clear the difference between THESE selves and their 'regular selves'😉 to an abandoned planet? ss could actually have KILLED thanos, but decided to be merciful. when he got up, thanos sucker struck him to win. morg also seemed to be doing just fine against thanos in avy's scan. hardly, '1-shotted', in any event.
oh, and i'm the only jla 'mate' debating, er, 'arguing' with you. the others are just laughing at this whole thing . . .. 😉
<<And? There are fanboys of every character who claim they're character is a worldbeater. That's nothing new. But no one who knows these characters thinks surfer loses to thanos because he's "jobbing." Did he lose to odin because he was "jobbing"? Tyrant? Thor w/ power gem?
Surfer and every herald has been shown to be miles below thanos. THis is as plain as the sun. If it's not plain to you, that's only because you keep talking about a character you know next to nothing about.>>
and?
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YOU asked ME who thought ss jobbed. i told you. and now you're all over ME for telling you?? you don't like or want answers, don't ask questions. you want to argue with all of the ss fanboys, be my guest. they'll laugh at you too.
as for who doesn't know anything about who . . . if you want to debate i'll be happy to oblige. it's clear you're getting pissed because a bunch of us remain unconvinced by your 'so carefully supported notions' like thanos is 1000x stronger than superman, but keep the insults to yourself. i apologized for my earlier childishness, and haven't yet resorted to telling you you are acting like a child throwing a tantrum because no one wants to believe you. it's always us misinterpreting, it's always us who are wrong, who are batty or misinformed or biased or fanboys. i told you you did a decent job supporting your case, but i, and others, remain unconvinced that thanos is 1000x stronger than superman.
you don't like that -- tough. accept others' opinions, even if you disagree, and move along. aside from you, i've not heard ANYONE say thanos is 1000x stronger than superman. NO ONE. in 28 PAGES! so we're ALL wrong and YOU'RE right? you're entitled to your opinion. i disagree with it but can accept it. why are you unable to do the same?
Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Well, I'm happy you said that... This is a normal Morg mind controlled by Tyrant.
Thank you for proving my point.
Tyrant states that Morg has no power after being drained, THEN releases it back to him from the orb to fight thanos, terrax, and ganymede.
Thanos knocks Morg out with 1 blast, then walks away from his smoldering body to find more information about tyrant (which was the entire point of the enterprise). Morg is freed, and they let him run off back to galactus, with his power back.
What does this show?
1. Thanos when pulling punches was still able to leave morg smoldering on the ground with 1 blast. (I wouldn't go so far as to say he was trying to help him; thanos doesn't really help anyone, at least until his recent series.)
2. Morg's power had been released back to him.
3. Thanos later fought tyrant only on his own power, and took the orb for the knowledge within, AS IS CLEARLY STATED IN THE COMIC.
It makes little sense to say that that orb affected that fight when it was morg's orb, and morg's power had already been released back to him.
What about the morg fight on its own merits? (After all, it's possible that thanos AND tyrant are far weaker than we thought)
Granted, thanos did get tackled. But that tells us exactly nothing about power. King Thor was tackled by captain america when he was pulling punches. (because his child was being threatened) Thanos himself got knocked back by spiderman in the IG saga. What we DO know is that morg showed exactly zero ability to harm thanos (in a comic entitled "MORG", no less), even in a fight that thanos had no interest in fighting. And this was the fight's result (which avalon neglected to post):
And this is clearly a low showing for thanos. He DID get tackled, and his first blast WAS ineffective. But contrary to people's bizarre and crazed interpretation of my surfer vs. thanos scans, we have good and obvious reasons why thanos would pull punches against morg:
They were on the same side fighting tyrant, DUH.
In contrast, surfer has no reason to pull punches when thanos is about to kill him. But he was "holding back", right?
From what it seems, Thanos hasn't really needed to show off his strength. Supes is a hero that does things that are flat out out of this world. He's gonna see the limits of his powers. Nobody has seen the limits of Thanos yet. I can guarantee that he's extremely powerful, and more than likely in his own strength class. He's definately much stronger than Hulk, or thing, or anything like that. Also, the whole flick of his fingers was a flick of his fingers. As in he just used the muscles in his hands. Any Marvel advocate will tell you that when Thanos uses his powers, he does it so that there is no question of his power. I guarantee that we may soon see his limits, but I guarantee that they're vast. He's gonna beat Supes, but it's gonna be a good fight.
