Originally posted by Lightsnake
Ben Kenobi is also described by George as the strongest of the good guys as of ANH in the commentary, does that tell you anything?
No, not really.
So, because he's stronger than a smuggler, a farmboy who got his ass zapped by a droid, a snobby princess, and let's not forget, a walking carpet, it's supposed to indicate anything?
Lol! Every single one of the aforementioned would get ripped to shreds by the Jedi of the prequels. What the hell is your point here?
and Vade'rs had time to compensate for his weakness.
No, he hasn't. You cannot build upon things which are impossible to build upon.
He will never be nearly as fast, nearly as agile, or nearly as graceful:
"Vader's legs and arms were artificial, and he would never be able to summon lightning or leap about like the Jedi had been fond of doing." (Rise of Darth Vader, Ch. 21.)
He just doesn't hold a candle in acrobatics. What we also know is that Luke himself was more agile and acrobatic than Vader, yet he's not even as "acrobatic as the young Jedi of the prequels".
We've seen him kill people who were masters as of the PT and pretty damn fine ones at that.
And? How does this even begin to prove he's better than his former self? Who annihilated the likes of Count Dooku, and Cin Drallig?
Yes, he killed several Jedi Knights. And only like, three are even noteworthy in the grand scale: An'ya Kuro, Tsui Choi, and Roan Shryne.
But, how does that mean he doesn't suck ass in comparison? Seeing as Anakin Skywalker would destroy those listed above?
The loss of agility or speed- and did you see Crimson Empire? tell me that's not agility
Wow, I guess he's as flexible as a monkey in the movies, too. Seeing as when he falls he does back flips.
Really, though, big deal. He's not nearly as agile as he was prior. Swinging around on a sword really isn't "all that" in comparison to what we see other Jedi do.
Furthermore, he doesn't display any of those skills in the movies because either: a) he can't or b) he has a helluva' lot of trouble doing them. That's why the duel against Ben Kenobi is so slow, it's because it's was hard to fight for the both of them, as they are "old Jedi".
Vader's had time to learn how to fight against more agile and faster opponents and temper his skill and adapt.
You're right, he's fought against some fast opponents and won. However, I don't see where he's beaten someone who is: more skilled, faster, more agile, and more graceful. And the three latter by, at the least, a league.
Be a dear now, and point that one out for me, will you? I think you'll have a hard time doing such, considering it's never happened.
We do have a definitive confirmation there?
Yeah, Lightsnake. Perhaps if you equipped your spectacles, you'd see this:
"In other words, the skill and power that Anakin shows as a young man is greater than what we see in the classic films. As Vader, Anakin is more machine than man, and being a half-droid construct has seriously hampered his lightsaber prowess." (Episode VI Lore.)
That is in direct regards to the movie era differences. Darth Vader in the OT is a peice of shit compared to his former self, and Anakin's skill is surpasses that of Vader's in the OT.
Luca ssays he's slower and his potential is lessened....so?
And that he's not as skilled, and his lightsaber "prowess" (skill) is "seriously hampered" (sucks ass, limited).
With a blade, while still getting used to the suit, he bested Roan Shryne and held his own against numerous Jedi knights and masters.
To quote you: "...so?"
Really now, none of that proves his handling with a lightsaber is better than Anakin's. Feat Wars, the bane of the fanboy. They do you no good. In fact, it would just say to the commoner that he must've been that damn good beforehand.
Although, it would also seem that indicate that he'd be better as time went on, we know that the skill he shows previously is better than what we see later, thus my position stands.