Originally posted by LORDSIDIOUS01
I choose Bane
It was clear in POD Novel that Revan's Sith knowledge was superior to that of Bane. If you have read or checked Bane's profile in Wiki then you will know this.
From Wiki: Arriving at the Temple, he found the holocron of Darth Revan. Learning much more about the Sith of the past, he concluded that Kaan and his Brotherhood would have to be destroyed, and set about formulating a way to ensure the survival of the Order. With the teachings of Darth Revan he would destroy the Brotherhood, and from its wreckage create a new and far stronger Order of the Sith Lords that would eventually destroy the Jedi.
Originally posted by Tortoise Herderman that sounds like revan pwns doesent it?
Ok, I only recently discovered this thread, and due to some Damn F*cking stupid arguments, I have been forced to act.Firstoff, Sithari, you say that power is more important than knowledge, when in reality, with most people we see, they are interdependant.
It Was Napoleon Bonaparte, a man who was heralded as the greatest General of his day, that said "General-in-chief must be guided by their own experience, or their genius. Tactics, evolutions, the duties and knowledge of an engineer or artillery officer, may be learned in treatises, but the science of strategy is only to be acquired by experience, and by studying the campaigns of all the great captains.
Gustavus Adolphus, Turenne, and Frederick, as well as Alexander, Hannibal, and Caesar have all acted upon the same principles. These have been -- to keep their forces united; to leave no weak part unguarded; to seize with rapidity on important points."He also said: "Peruse again and again the campaigns of Alexander, Hannibal, Caesar, Gustavus Adolphus, Turenne, Engene, and Frederick. Model yourself upon them. This is the only means of becoming a great captain, and of acquiring the secret of the art of war. Your own genius will be enlightened and improved by this study, and you will learn to reject all maxiums foreign to the principles of these great commanders."
He makes it a point to study those who came before him to learn their advantages, their skills, their weaknesses etc. And LEARN from them.And they also study things that could be helpful, like a man going into a duel to the death with swords might study human anatomy, as it helps him land a decisive blow to either kill/mortally wound his opponent.
He also emphasises the need for Experience. Bane was a member of the Gloom Walkers, a unit that DID make some quite impressive feats in combat. However, even when we consider his defacto command of said unit, he was in command of a single infantry unit.
Revan, on the other hand, took control of a army that had been driven from dozens (AT LEAST) of planets, and was heavily demoralized, low in experience etc. and, like Pilsudski at the Battle of Warsaw in the 1920's, he ROUTED the enemy and eventually destroyed him. This while managing to groom his army discreetly for his eventual return as a Sith.
He also would have been able to have a larger base of knowledge not only on the Force techniques, but also on combat, on leadership etc.
These could prove to be a far more powerful factor than we may know.
But in order to reach that generalship, he had to be powerful enough to reach it. And He Was.
FACT: He killed Mandalore the Ultimate in fair combat face to face.
FACT: He killed The One (The Black Rakata Cheiftan) after fighting his way through his warriors, a man whose reputation was so fierece that in a tribal civilization that was dedicated to war, whose Cheiftan had to have been a skilled warrior, that Said Cheiftan abdicated peacefully at the mere CHALLENGE of The One to duel him for the Cheiftan's position.
FACT: He defeated dozens of Sith soldiers and acolytes while they were being powered by BOTH the Star Forge and Bastilla's Battle Meditation, with minimum aid.
FACT: Singlehandedly defeated first Bastila and than Malak alone. The latter of whom was regenerated completely at least once by captive Jedi.
FACT: Kreia, who had no doubt worked with many powerful Jedi, described him as "Looking at the Heart of the Force." This is not completely quantifiable, but you have to keep in mind that this was in a Jedi Order that was far better trained that the PT ones, and who had the knowledge of Lore, techniques etc that had passed into the realm of myth by the time of the PT.
FACT: He walked on the surface of Malachor V, a planet that corrupted Jedi FROM THE ORBITING BATTLE. A planet that shattered Kreia's resistence withing seconds of her stepping on the planet.
FACT: Malak described him as being far more powerful in the Light than he ever was in Darkness.
FACT: He defeated Calo Nord, a bounty hunter who learned his trade with a bounty on his head by TOYING with his hunters before ruthlessly finishing them off. And apparently there were dozens of those who perished trying to collect said bounty. A man who is said never let a target survive.
FACT: He defeated Darth Bandon, the man judged to be the strongest out of a Sith order of likely HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS and trained by Malak himself.
FACT: He won his way up to the bloody Swoop Campionship of MANAAN, THE CAPITAL OF SWOOP RACING AFTER THE LIQUIDATION OF TARIS!!!!
FACT: He killed Bendak Starkiller, a Mandalorian duelist who killed so many people in death matches THERE WAS A BOUNTY PUT OUT ON HIS HEAD!!!! And that was BEFORE he rediscovered force sensitivity.
FACT: He succeeded in doing what almost no other had done, being one of the VERY VERY few to gain the Tusken Raider's trust and admiration to the point that he learned their history. This in a species that was still regarded to be only animals THOUSANDS of years afterwards.
FACT: He killed Selven, a woman who killed off the Ulgos of Taris, despite all their guards, droids, and security measures.
FACT: Darth Bane, the other member of the deathmatch, judged Revan's holocron to be far superior to the ENTIRETY of the resources avalible for teaching the Brotherhood of Darkness COMBINED!!!!
FACT: Bane said that he would not dare to TRY some of the rituals Revan had done, as they were simply too dangerous.
FACT: He killed Sherruk, a Mandalorian who had killed many Jedi, alongside his entire gang, WHEN HE WAS STILL IN THE EARLY STAGES OF ReDISCOVERING THE FORCE!!!!
Ok than, we also know that Zephiel is crap on medicine, as he does not realize there is a point to us shooting the crap out of his stupid arguments about the "Dark Side calming his situation."
I am sorry, but if somebody has their adrenaline going on for too long a period or for too intense a period, it can rupture! Period.
And that is in a normal human being. If Bane has all the orbalisks pumping in this fight, speed is key, as if he is delayed to long, he will die. Hell, if he wins but the fight has gone on too long he will STILL die.
Thus, Bane is on the clock. Not Revan. If Revan can hold out for long enough, even if he does not land a killing blow, he will still win.
So the real question is if Bane can breach Revan's defense and kill or mortally wound him before he kills himself or before Revan learns his weakpoint and kills him.
The Dark Side cannot calm one down. It FUELS RAGE. That is what it does. It has been mentioned as such repeatedly in the series.
So it gets the Heart going even FASTER. WHICH MEANS BANE HAS EVEN LESS TIME!!!!
So, barring a miracle, I would give this to Revan.
Sith'ari, Zephiel, get an actual argument. It makes you look bad if you do not.