But don't worry, Zephiel. Even if you are cherry picking and have no knowledge about medicinal facts, you are still better than Darth Sexy. I will give credit were credit is due.
Zephiel is really good Master Tortoise.
And Also,Just being "optional" does not mean "noncanotical" as the good General pointed out.
Why thank you. Of course, General Kenobl may not be existant anymore, Korto Vos may replace him....
DS, You insulted me for no good reason, you claimed I did not know the difference between what was necessary to finish the game and what was not, and you generally acted like a rat. You also made numbskull arguments (Like "Bendak invalidates you entire argument'😉 to avoid a fair debate. So I have somebody who does not know the difference between a rational argument and spewing drivel yaking at me, claiming his invalidated Primary quests=canon everything else=Noncanon point. Talk about irony.
I am not spotlessly innocent in the argument previously, but you were the one who started the mudslinging.
If you are willing to admit that you went way out of bounds, than we can get back to the topic at hand.
His body works the same way. I doubt it is "constantly" pumping its stuff into him,
Frankly, I don’t care whether you doubt if it’s constantly pumping into him. The fact is, BOTS states that the creatures were constantly pumping it into him. Sorry, a canon source is greater than your opinion, no matter how much you whine. If he were unable to use his hate to keep himself alive as Sion does, he would have died long ago on the surface of Dxun.
However, it seems that facts just can’t fit through the sparse crevices in your diminutive skull.
And yes, I have played KOTOR II (finally somebody realizes that) and I have met our dear friend Mr. Sion. However, many people credit the DS as the ONLY thing holding his body together, and it is undoubtably a major role in it, but another large role is Sion's on bullish will to live and his raw hate.
And the ability that Sion demonstrated is similar to Bane’s. He uses the darkside to continue his existence, despite the fact that the adrenaline should have destroyed a normal human being long ago. I am well versed with biochemistry, son, I am majoring in it.
Do you know anything about biochemical processes that occur within our body? An excess of adrenaline causes a plaque growth, rupture, subsequent formation of a clot, and an eventual heart attack. For a normal human being, an overgrowth of plaque would kill us. It would eventually rupture and create a clot. For Bane, it is possible that through the darkside he can will the destruction of the fatty acids that accumulates within his arterial walls, as with the buildup of plaque, subsequently causing them to be re-emitted into the orbalisks (in the symbiotic relationship that Kaan describes.) This only causes the beneficial effects of the adrenaline and strength to be recognized.
On a macroscopic scale, what you are sadly unable to grasp, is that Bane is able to use his sheer hate to keep himself alive, much like Sion does. It really isn’t to difficult to comprehend. Sion was able to keep himself alive. Vader was able to keep himself alive despite much of his organs being horribly burned from wounds he suffered in Korriban. Bane would have died if he could not find some way of countering the mal effects of the adrenaline. In fact, within a week all the adrenaline the orbalisks were pumping into him should have eventually led to a massive clot that would kill him.
But you being a rather inept biochemist, and piss poor debater, cannot really seem to grasp any of these concepts.
As for "sustenence" we have never actually seen somebody in either game actually eating/drinking, but that does not mean they actually do not eat or drink. Few games, in fact, show somebody eating or drinking on their own, but it is implied.
Completely irrelevant. It doesn’t take the brightest lightbulb to understand that by sustenance I was referring to Bane’s ability to keep living through sheer hate and will.
What I am trying to do is to build up the body of evidence. Which is used in law to call the evidnece by one side. In other words, I am showing the accomplishments of Revan, such as defeating Bendak without the force, defeating the One, etc.
Which is completely irrelevant to the situation at hand. How many powerful people did Luke Skywalker defeat in close quarters before he discovered the force? Whoops nearly no one. Yet he proceeded to become the strongest Jedi ever.
But it does show what Revan is capable of, as he had less time, was cut off from his knowledge, was drastically outnumbered even with his allies, but at the same time managed to truimph over seemingly insurmountable odds.
Your assertion that only Revan is capable of performing this feat is ridiculous. Quantify how powerful each individual DJ on that battle station was. Numbers?
Bane would easily be able to perform the same considering his bio armour was blatantly resistant against lightsaber slices, he was continuously pumped with adrenaline and strength, and he possessed extraordinary regenerative capabilities. He was also viewed by the people in the academy, people with Leia’s training, maybe moreso, as being faster than the eye could see.
[quotes]it shows both his force poweress and other skills, multitasking and hand-eye coordination, which undoubtably can prove a boon in a fight to the death. [/quote]
Piss poor logic. So just because Anakin possessed good pod racing skills, he can take down Yoda? Your buildup is horribly fallacious.
Surely if it were that bad you would score further points and rout me from the field by making these other fallacies known?
I was not picking them out because they are blatant regurgitations (and whatmore, bastardizations) of what far more skilled debators were bringing up. Moreso, many of the facts don’t translate into a battle scenario.
Revan, on the other hand, took control of a army that had been driven from dozens (AT LEAST) of planets, and was heavily demoralized, low in experience etc. and, like Pilsudski at the Battle of Warsaw in the 1920's, he ROUTED the enemy and eventually destroyed him. This while managing to groom his army discreetly for his eventual return as a Sith.
Maybe it isn’t too difficult to recognize the fallacy inherent in your own evidence. How well he manages an army does not translate into how well he can use the force. You are using the wrong quotes to back up how powerful Revan was.
NJO Luke’s tactical abilities aren’t exactly at the top. Does that influence his combat strength? Yoda wasn’t a tactical genius; he was one of the greatest Jedi of his time. Mace was actually a poor general due to his inability to make the proper sacrifices for war. He was still tied for best duelist of his time.
Your “quote on quote” evidence is ridiculous in that it does not contribute to your argument. Your inability to grasp this, really reflects on your lack of debating skills.
He also would have been able to have a larger base of knowledge not only on the Force techniques, /quote]ROFLMAO. Where does it ever say that Revan had a larger knowledge? Bane was initially surprised at all the knowledge he garnered from Revan. Understandable. But by BOTS he learned far more from Nadd’s holocron (which it is a logical conclusion contains the bulk of Sadow’s teaching and his predecessors.) He had a large database of knowledge too, possibly exceeding Revan’s by the end of BOTS.
By the end of BOTS, he was able to nudge a moon out of orbit, a moon that was equivalent to earth’s mass, and combine it’s atmosphere with that of Onderon.
[quote]but also on combat
Oh yes, because Bane’s combat skill is really THAT bad. He was able to defeat initially a duelist who had spent decades mastering every form of lightsaber combat, and decades more honing his skills in each form.
on leadership etc.
ROFLMAO. How does having leadership abilities translate into being a powerful Jedi. I suppose Kaan is also stronger than Bane? It is unfortunate that you are unable to grasp logic.
Really, your proof for Revan is becoming ridiculous. Now I know why DS considers you an idiot beyond bounds.
He defeated Darth Bandon, the man judged to be the strongest out of a Sith order of likely HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS and trained by Malak himself.
Quantify how powerful Bandon was other than HE WASTEH STRONGESTA1000000. Kasi’m was regarded as possibly the most powerful duelist the galaxy had(will) ever see(n), yet he was desperately running away from Bane, and was nearly killed had Bane not been so arrogant. Not to mention that Revan had the aid of comrades during that point. (Canderous, Juhani, Bastila) Your point is moot.
He succeeded in doing what almost no other had done, being one of the VERY VERY few to gain the Tusken Raider's trust and admiration to the point that he learned their history. This in a species that was still regarded to be only animals THOUSANDS of years afterwards.
OMG. I think you might be actually the dumbest person I have ever talked to in these forums. How does gaining Tusken raider trust prove that he can match up to Bane. It’s not even providing an adequate build up on Revan’s capabilities.
This is idiotic feat wars.
Darth Bane, the other member of the deathmatch, judged Revan's holocron to be far superior to the ENTIRETY of the resources avalible for teaching the Brotherhood of Darkness COMBINED!!!!
OMG!!!! I BET HE DID! BUT YOU KNOW WHAT! BANE HAD ACCESS TO ALL OF IT!!!!!!!!
As of BOTS, he also had the knowledge of everything in Nadd’s holocron too, which pretty much encompasses the bulk of ancient Sith knowledge as we know it.
But don't worry, Zephiel. Even if you are cherry picking
I didn’t choose to answer them initially because they were a joke. Any moron could tell that you were attempting a game of feat wars, some of the feats being completely irrelevant.
Seriously, your “presumed” knowledge on biochemistry is about as non existent as your ability to debate.
If you are going to argue Revan, please argue it like Gen Kenobi, SW_Legend, DS, Styles or anyone who is good Revan debater.
Laughable
I haven't read a single convincing argument on here for why Revan edges Bane. All I've read is that he taught Bane a great deal ( through POD's blatant retconning of course, as if teachers haven't been pummeled by their students) and that he survived Malachor's dark side energies by embracing and utilizing the dark side, ignoring the fact that Kreia was broken because she was mentally unstable at the time.
The orbalisk armor plus Bane's substantial TK give him the edge in this one IMO.
Ok than, that argument made no sense whatsoever. Firstoff, yakking about retconning is not an argument, it is out of universe, and if anything it IMPROVED my respect for Bane and what he went through. So THAT is not valid.
And second the part about Malachor V, you claim that Kreia was only broken because she was emotionally unstable after Revan's fall. Firstly, I would love for you to prove that. And secondly, you are being willfully ignorant. Malachor V was so inherently corrupt that in the final battle of the Mandalorian Wars over it, IT CORRUPTED JEDI WHO WERE IN ORBIT OVER THE PLANET DURING THE BATTLE!!!!!!!
So, on-contrare, Kreia must have been VERY powerful to have lasted that long before breaking.
Revan managed to survive being devoured by the same things that broke Kreia and CORRUPTED JEDI (many of whom must have had some measure of respectable power) FROM ORBIT and not only survived, he took the power that assaulted him and HE OVERWHELMED IT. THAT takes a lot of willpower, given how many have been proven to have fallen at Malachor's seductive grasp.
He also managed to infiltrate the Sith Academy on Korriban in secret, conduct sabotage against the academy while keeping up the charade as not only a loyal, unquestioning student, but also as the MOST SUITABLE SITH, than he pretty much (with the help of his allies) gutted the Academy, killing the master, redeeming his apprentace (and several other Sith), killing the master's now-insane-master, and pretty much all the loyal Sith at the academy. All the while resisting the corrupting influence of Korriban itself.
That, my friend, is impressive.
Yes, some of what I wrote, in the hindsight, is likely inaccurate, and I have been the first to admit it. However, most of what I wrote IS true.
Such as the Manaan Championship, the fact that he Killed Mandalore the Ultimate (certainly no slouch in combat to be mandalore) in fair 1-1 combat, Killed the One, A warrior who was so feared the man who was cheif of his tribe at the time surrendered his title without a fight at the One's invitation to duel for the title, etc.
As for the TK, the one place I have heard that is the whole "Nudging the Moon" part. I, quite frankly, am undecided on the issue, as neither side has done much save yell and point fingers at each other. Though, for what it is worth, what will it take for him to do TK? If he can do it standing up it might be a helpful aid to him, but if he has to do a ritual or has to meditate, than it will merely screw him off of his initiative.
The Obelisks can be a help, as they block lightsabers, but, as I mentioned with my previous posts, it puts him on the clock, as the adreniline being pumped into him will kill him if the fight goes on too long. They also leave a vulnerable spot near his face, which would be a killing zone for Revan, if Revan can breach Bane's defense, which given his exsperience and skill, I think has a good chance of happening.
And even if Revan cannot recognize the Obelisks (something I find slightly hard to believe for somebody who was said to practically devour knowledge) it will not take him long (if he survives the initial shock) to figure out the idea of them being able to survive Lightsabers, and will direct his efforts towards hitting the head.
Bane is experienced, and he is no slouch, but I am ultimatly hedging on Revan.
Hold on a second, zephiel I thought you were a Revan fan, when did you step aside for Bane? And there's NO single argument for Bane being superior to Revan or even being on par. Congratulations to Bane, who learned a fraction of what Revan knew, but suddenly he's more powerful? Hardly. There is nothing to indicate that Bane's power is even on the level of Revan.
There is a lot of evidence to suggest that Bane was on Revan's level, Sexy.
Kopekz thought he might just be the sith'ari aka the ultimate sith and perfect being after only just one conversation with Bane, so he clearly sensed that the force within Bane was on the next level.
Githany believed his power was beyond the level of pretty much any jedi or sith master when he had only received a few months worth of training.
Kaan, the leader of the BoD was scared shitless of him before he had even met him; this was based purely on descriptions of his power.
When he was 18, he was able to instinctively choke his father to death, which greatly speaks for how prodigious he was, and how strong in the force he as.
He once lost his temper, and was able to instinctively project his fury on an entire room full of people; that speaks for truly how strong he was in the darkside.
He pretty much mastered force lightning after just 1 hour of having learnt the technique, and was even able to create a miniature storm. By BotS, after having grown much more powerful, he would likely be able to replicate this to much greater effect.
He was able to release a wave of energy that was able to collapse the entire 20 story Rakatan Temple, and the temple wasn't even hit by the entire attack (it wasn't hit by the portion that hit Kas'im).
He was able to choke Quordis to death like he was a child, and Quordis was one of the top sith in the BoD, the head of the academy in fact.
He was able to control the power of over 20 sith lords combined with his own to destroy an entire world.
He was able to pull a moon out of orbit, and pretty casually too given he did it while riding on top of a flying beast.
He knew every move and sequence of the saber staff perfectly (and those are the moves and sequences for all 7 forms, and not just the regular forms, but Kas'im's perfected forms), and thus would be able to wield one to the same effect as Kas'im.
Sirak, the top apprentice at the BoD Academy was damn powerful; he was able to move in blurs, had mastered multiple forms..and Bane was able to completely outclass him in saber combat; his shatterpoint ability was so great that he was able to sense weaknesses in Sirak's style seconds after the duel began, and constantly throughout the battle, but held back because he wanted to humiliate Sirak, and tire him down first, and towards the end, was able to tool him with one masterful manoeuvre; his movements were faster than the eyes of everyone present could see, so fast that it seemed like time had stopped for them.
He as good as defeated Kas'im in a duel; Kas'im was basically The master of the lightsaber; he mastered every from, every primary art of the saber, and then furthered and perfected each form and constantly refined his skills, and Kas'im was only able to defeat him when he used a style that was alien to Bane.
While he was choking Quordis to death, Quordis begged him to stop and let them fight with sabers so that he could die with honour, and Bane said that he would be able to just as easily defeat him with a saber, and Quordis agreed. This implies that Bane would have been able to defeat him in seconds with a saber, and Quordis was one of the top sith of a pretty impressive order.
Bane possesses the orbalisk armour, which constantly pumps dark side energies and adrenaline into his body, and strengthens his muscles and keeps them constantly flexed. It's also completely immune to the cutting power of even a lightsaber, and covers his entire body, except for his head (the only area where he can be physically affected), and a few joints where the gaps are too small for a lightsaber to pass through anyway.
Revan managed to survive being devoured by the same things that broke Kreia
Prove that it “broke” Kreia. Show me a source. It obviously corrupted her, but it also corrupted Revan.
and not only survived, he took the power that assaulted him and HE OVERWHELMED IT. THAT takes a lot of willpower, given how many have been proven to have fallen at Malachor's seductive grasp.
Enough of this fanboy bullshit and actually supply passages, quotes, whatnot because otherwise no one has any reason to believe what you are stating. Sure Revan was not crushed by the darkside, but neither was Bane when he encountered the tomb of Freedon Nadd, or when he was being devoured by the Orbalisks that would have easily slain a regular Jedi. Same with Exar Kun, he embraced the power of the darkside instead of letting it break him.
and CORRUPTED JEDI (many of whom must have had some measure of respectable power) FROM ORBIT
He also managed to infiltrate the Sith Academy on Korriban in secret, conduct sabotage against the academy while keeping up the charade as not only a loyal, unquestioning student, but also as the MOST SUITABLE SITH, than he pretty much (with the help of his allies) gutted the Academy, killing the master, redeeming his apprentace (and several other Sith), killing the master's now-insane-master, and pretty much all the loyal Sith at the academy. All the while resisting the corrupting influence of Korriban itself.
This is feat wars. You are counting all of Revan’s feats and trying to establish him as being great without actually quantifying these feats. Many of the people in these academies were STILL acolytes. Hint: That’s why they were relegated to an academy, not on the battle field. Maybe because they needed training? The instructors were all weakling with the exception of Yuthura and that creepy old dude.
Such as the Manaan Championship, the fact that he Killed Mandalore the Ultimate (certainly no slouch in combat to be mandalore) in fair 1-1 combat, Killed the One, A warrior who was so feared the man who was cheif of his tribe at the time surrendered his title without a fight at the One's invitation to duel for the title, etc.
Defeating two non force sensitives, and being a swoop bike champion. Good thing Bane isn’t going to engage Revan in a swoop bike competition. Neither is Revan fighting against a non force sensitive.
Bane would best Mandalore in unarmed combat with his orbalisks and devastating force strength. He would slaughter the One like a bug. Your point?
Though, for what it is worth, what will it take for him to do TK? If he can do it standing up it might be a helpful aid to him, but if he has to do a ritual or has to meditate, than it will merely screw him off of his initiative.
Have you even read BOTS? The only possible option is that Bane nudged the moon while simultaneously controlling his mount. It was obviously not a ritual.
And it is clear that Bane moved the moon
We know for certain that Bane was on a flying mount and intended to connect the two atmosphere’s. Anderson was content to leave it at that, not to explore into how Bane pushed the two atmosphere’s together.The ghost ships that pervaded the landscape were probably reduced to nothing more than worthless slag, and it was stated that the moon was a graveyard. There were no ship’s traveling in or out.
How do you possibly imagine Bane traveled to Onderon?
We have on one hand, possibilities that were not even explored or hinted by Anderson, which you seem to tend towards to downplay Bane. Then we have the possibility which Anderson seems more favourable towards, and which seems the most plausible. Clearly it is the most logical conclusion. What you are effectively doing , is leading us into “wild goose chases” on what Bane “might” have done, when a simpler and clearer option is presented to us by Bane moving the moon.
The Obelisks can be a help, as they block lightsabers, but, as I mentioned with my previous posts, it puts him on the clock, as the adreniline being pumped into him will kill him if the fight goes on too long.
Ridiculous. If the orbalisks were capable of killing him through a clotting of the arteries, then Bane would have been gone a long time ago.
Bane could use the force to eliminate any atheromatous plaque, circulating it into the orbalisks as per the symbiotic relationship that Kaan describes. In this way, Bane wouldn’t have to worry about having too much adrenaline pumping through his arteries. BOTS never states that Bane was suffering from arterial clogs.
So to put it bluntly: no he would not be on the clock.
They also leave a vulnerable spot near his face
Prove that the orbalisks were only located neck down. According to BOTS: No doubt the other one was also spreading on his back. Eventually, they would probably cover his enitre body.
Even if he did not have orbalisks covering his face, he is going to place the majority of defense in that area. Revan however is going to face attacks from Bane on all parts of his body.
Add in Bane’s regenerative abilities, Dark blood welled up, and he cut deeper, digging with the knife's black tip to pry the creature off.
To his astonishment, though, as he made the incision, Bane watched the wound seal itself together, healing within moments. The pain remained, a stinging, throbbing sensation through his nerves, and I do not see Revan walking out of the encounter as a victor.
Bane was able to blast apart the foundations of the great Rakatan temple despite being knocked down a set of stairs and suffering from extreme fatigue. He crushed the bones of one of the strongest lords of that time as an afterthought. He learned almost all of Revan’s knowledge and whatmore, gained knowledge from Nadd’s holocron (which carries the bulk of ancient Sith knowledge).
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
Hold on a second, zephiel I thought you were a Revan fan, when did you step aside for Bane? And there's NO single argument for Bane being superior to Revan or even being on par. Congratulations to Bane, who learned a fraction of what Revan knew, but suddenly he's more powerful? Hardly. There is nothing to indicate that Bane's power is even on the level of Revan.
Mr. Sexy, I am open to the fact that Revan is on par with Bane. But I don't see how he is above Bane at all. What proof is their that supports Revan as being greater than Bane? Simply that he "taught" him? Bane also obtained a sizable knowledge base by the end of his career.
Revan's displays in the force were significant, no doubt, but they were always on a level that equal, (if not inferior to, IMHO) Bane's.
You can keep your opinion. I am open to the fact that they are equals, because the bulk of this stuff you can't be hundred percent sure of.
Excuse me, at the very most equal to Bane's? His knowledge base was SUPERIOR to Bane's and he was extremely strong in the force during a time when not everyone was a pussy, as in Bane's time when Bane's the only noteworthy sith. Bane appears to be, at the very BEST, on par with Revan, and again that's not counting the fact that Revan had more of a knowledge base. Not to mention he became more powerful as a Jedi, so I don't see an argument that dictates Bane=Revan at all. All of this Bane crap is easily refutable, not to mention 99% of BOTS is N-canon now.
Bane's knowledge base was actually pretty high.
1. He pretty much knew the entire BoD archives inside out.
2. Through Githany, he was able to learn most of the knowledge from the then current masters.
3. He was able to gain most of and the most important knowledge gained in Darth Revan's holocron. This gave him techniques such as the thought bomb, force drain, force fireball, and a standard force storm, as well as a few jedi techniques such as resisting poison.
4. He was able to access a jedi holocron shortly before JVS.
5. He was able to gain whatever he found in Nadd's tomb, including his holocron, which by Bane's own admission, was the greatest source of knowledge he had so far come across. His power grew to incredible levels at this point, to the point where he had the 'power to play with gravity and orbits like a child might play with toys (something like that).'
And BotS in perfectly canon Sexy.
And Bane's order was exceptional. So exceptional that a young Durge wasn't even noteworthy, he was a minion for the BoD (the same Durge that was on the level of the PT elites). And really, with Dark lords such as Kas'im (The Master of the Lightsaber), Seviss Vaa (who was so adept at sith alchemy that he was able to create a Giant Behemoth that could fire giant energy blasts out of its forehead), Kaox Krul (a legendary Dark Lord that was a beast in combat; he killed over 100 jedi in his lifetime), it can be assumed that the BoD was pretty damn incredible.
And again Sexy, knowledge isn't all there is to power; you're ignoring factors such as how prodigious Bane was in the force and with a lightsaber, and how strong he was in the darkside. Now Revan most likely did have a larger knowledge base, I'll accept that, but considering how large Bane's is, would more knowledge even make much more of a difference to his power?
Originally posted by allfg
Bane's knowledge base was actually pretty high.1. He pretty much knew the entire BoD archives inside out.
What, pray tell, was in the archives? Are you talking about Korriban, the same planet that was cleaned out of all its useful treasures concerning the ancient sith?[quote]2. Through Githany, he was able to learn most of the knowledge from the then current masters.
3. He was able to gain most of and the most important knowledge gained in Darth Revan's holocron. This gave him techniques such as the thought bomb, force drain, force fireball, and a standard force storm, as well as a few jedi techniques such as resisting poison.
4. He was able to access a jedi holocron shortly before JVS.
5. He was able to gain whatever he found in Nadd's tomb, including his holocron, which by Bane's own admission, was the greatest source of knowledge he had so far come across. His power grew to incredible levels at this point, to the point where he had the 'power to play with gravity and orbits like a child might play with toys (something like that).'And BotS in perfectly canon Sexy.
And Bane's order was exceptional. So exceptional that a young Durge wasn't even noteworthy, he was a minion for the BoD (the same Durge that was on the level of the PT elites). And really, with Dark lords such as Kas'im (The Master of the Lightsaber), Seviss Vaa (who was so adept at sith alchemy that he was able to create a Giant Behemoth that could fire giant energy blasts out of its forehead), Kaox Krul (a legendary Dark Lord that was a beast in combat; he killed over 100 jedi in his lifetime), it can be assumed that the BoD was pretty damn incredible.
And again Sexy, knowledge isn't all there is to power; you're ignoring factors such as how prodigious Bane was in the force and with a lightsaber, and how strong he was in the darkside. Now Revan most likely did have a larger knowledge base, I'll accept that, but considering how large Bane's is, would more knowledge even make much more of a difference to his power? [/B]
What, pray tell, was in the archives? Are you talking about Korriban, the same planet that was cleaned out of all its useful treasures concerning the ancient sith?
I'm talking about the archives themselves, not the tombs or storehouses of Korriban. And there was clearly quite a lot in the archives; information on Revan and the Star Forge, the philosophy, wisdom and ideology of the Ancients, details regarding the prophecy of the sith'ari... these were all contained in the archives just to name a few, and really, clearly much more, considering there was an entire room full of these scrolls detailing sith history, teachings and lore, and Bane seemed to hold them in pretty high regard too, saying that they supplemented and provided context to the lessons gained from the masters, and the knowledge contained within was stated to be in the same league of an entire holocron too, so that's saying something.
And what knowledge was this, and how would you quanitfy this knowledge when comparing eras, because Bane's era isn't exactly what you call impressive.
Standard powers such as force jump, force speed, TK, force choke, lightning etc. Hardly comparable to Bane's other sources of knowledge of course, and I never said it was, I was just listing as many relevant points as I could.
You don't KNOW how much knowledge Revan decided to put into the holocron, but chances are he wouldn't put EVERYTHING he knew in there. And not to mention Revan knew everything Bane knew, at the very LEAST.
Not necessarily, how can we be certain that Revan knew all the stuff in Freedon Nadd's holocron for instance? But really, he would have likely put the very best of his knowledge inside at the very least, and probably almost all of his knowledge, considering some of the stuff Bane learnt was as diverse as resisting poisons etc..
What's JVS? And where was this? And so?
The comic, Jedi versus Sith..
And this was in the comic All for you.
And so you need to stop addressing all of my points separately, and see them for what they are; a bunch of points that amount to something much more in the bigger picture.
Oh god, no it's NOT. It was retconned and certain events contradict POD therefore they are NOT canon. Nadd did NOT have a holcron, and Bane did NOT go to DXUN because he found REVANS holocron on LEHON and admitted that THAT was the best knowledge he's ever had and THATS where he got the rule of two, so you can cancel the entire DXUN trip because it didn't happen, sorry.
Really Sexy, you clearly have no clue how canon works. By your logic, the entire RotS novelisation shouldn't be canon because of a few contradictions. A few contradictions doesn't retcon the entire story, only said contradictions. So the idea that Bane thought up with the Rule of Two from Nadd's holocron has been retconned, sure, but not the existence of the holocron itself, or that Bane came across it. And you do realise that aspects of BotS have been referenced in other sources, right?
Bane's order was exceptional? Who are you trying to kid? Durge was on the level of the PT Elite? LOL. Bane was the only Dark Lord worthy of any recognition during his time. Well him and Kas'im. Nothing impressive about an order which contains tens of thousands of sith.
By Obsession, Durge was pretty much on Anakin and Obi-Wan's level, so yes, he was in the same league as the elites. And your second point is false, I just mentioned quite a few who were clearly pretty exceptional, it's not my fault you're ignoring them.
More knowledge=more power in most cases. You don't see someone with less knowledge defeat someone with more, at least not in the SW universe. And when I say more knowledge I do include the quality of knowledge as well. Again, there is nothing to imply that Bane was Revan's equal, much less his superior.
There is a lot of evidence to suggest that Bane was on Revan's level, Sexy.
Kopekz thought he might just be the sith'ari aka the ultimate sith and perfect being after only just one conversation with Bane, so he clearly sensed that the force within Bane was on the next level.
Githany believed his power was beyond the level of pretty much any jedi or sith master when he had only received a few months worth of training.
Kaan, the leader of the BoD was scared shitless of him before he had even met him; this was based purely on descriptions of his power.
When he was 18, he was able to instinctively choke his father to death, which greatly speaks for how prodigious he was, and how strong in the force he as.
He once lost his temper, and was able to instinctively project his fury on an entire room full of people; that speaks for truly how strong he was in the darkside.
He pretty much mastered force lightning after just 1 hour of having learnt the technique, and was even able to create a miniature storm. By BotS, after having grown much more powerful, he would likely be able to replicate this to much greater effect.
He was able to release a wave of energy that was able to collapse the entire 20 story Rakatan Temple, and the temple wasn't even hit by the entire attack (it wasn't hit by the portion that hit Kas'im).
He was able to choke Quordis to death like he was a child, and Quordis was one of the top sith in the BoD, the head of the academy in fact.
He was able to control the power of over 20 sith lords combined with his own to destroy an entire world.
He was able to pull a moon out of orbit, and pretty casually too given he did it while riding on top of a flying beast.
He knew every move and sequence of the saber staff perfectly (and those are the moves and sequences for all 7 forms, and not just the regular forms, but Kas'im's perfected forms), and thus would be able to wield one to the same effect as Kas'im.
Sirak, the top apprentice at the BoD Academy was damn powerful; he was able to move in blurs, had mastered multiple forms..and Bane was able to completely outclass him in saber combat; his shatterpoint ability was so great that he was able to sense weaknesses in Sirak's style seconds after the duel began, and constantly throughout the battle, but held back because he wanted to humiliate Sirak, and tire him down first, and towards the end, was able to tool him with one masterful manoeuvre; his movements were faster than the eyes of everyone present could see, so fast that it seemed like time had stopped for them.
He as good as defeated Kas'im in a duel; Kas'im was basically The master of the lightsaber; he mastered every from, every primary art of the saber, and then furthered and perfected each form and constantly refined his skills, and Kas'im was only able to defeat him when he used a style that was alien to Bane.
While he was choking Quordis to death, Quordis begged him to stop and let them fight with sabers so that he could die with honour, and Bane said that he would be able to just as easily defeat him with a saber, and Quordis agreed. This implies that Bane would have been able to defeat him in seconds with a saber, and Quordis was one of the top sith of a pretty impressive order.
Bane possesses the orbalisk armour, which constantly pumps dark side energies and adrenaline into his body, and strengthens his muscles and keeps them constantly flexed. It's also completely immune to the cutting power of even a lightsaber, and covers his entire body, except for his head (the only area where he can be physically affected), and a few joints where the gaps are too small for a lightsaber to pass through anyway.
Originally posted by allfgI'm talking about the archives themselves, not the tombs or storehouses of Korriban. And there was clearly quite a lot in the archives; information on Revan and the Star Forge, the philosophy, wisdom and ideology of the Ancients, details regarding the prophecy of the sith'ari... these were all contained in the archives just to name a few, and really, clearly much more, considering there was an entire room full of these scrolls detailing sith history, teachings and lore, and Bane seemed to hold them in pretty high regard too, saying that they supplemented and provided context to the lessons gained from the masters, and the knowledge contained within was stated to be in the same league of an entire holocron too, so that's saying something.
The archives were plundered as well as the tombs, thanks to Revan turning to the light side. Now during REVANS time, THATS when all the knowledge of the ancients was. If that was the case here, you would have an argument. But since everything has been plundered, you can render the entire knowledge on korriban aside from Revan's books, useless. I'm not denying there was SOME stuff, but the academy has been destroyed and rebuilt more than once, so it's unlikely the knowledge there is anywhere near the level of knowledge that was present during Revan's time.[quote]Not necessarily, how can we be certain that Revan knew all the stuff in Freedon Nadd's holocron for instance? But really, he would have likely put the very best of his knowledge inside at the very least, and probably almost all of his knowledge, considering some of the stuff Bane learnt was as diverse as resisting poisons etc..
The comic, Jedi versus Sith..
And this was in the comic All for you.
And so you need to stop addressing all of my points separately, and see them for what they are; a bunch of points that amount to something much more in the bigger picture.
Really Sexy, you clearly have no clue how canon works. By your logic, the entire RotS novelisation shouldn't be canon because of a few contradictions. A few contradictions doesn't retcon the entire story, only said contradictions. So the idea that Bane thought up with the Rule of Two from Nadd's holocron has been retconned, sure, but not the existence of the holocron itself, or that Bane came across it. And you do realise that aspects of BotS have been referenced in other sources, right?
There is a lot of evidence to suggest that Bane was on Revan's level, Sexy.
Kopekz thought he might just be the sith'ari aka the ultimate sith and perfect being after only just one conversation with Bane, so he clearly sensed that the force within Bane was on the next level.
Githany believed his power was beyond the level of pretty much any jedi or sith master when he had only received a few months worth of training.
Kaan, the leader of the BoD was scared shitless of him before he had even met him; this was based purely on descriptions of his power.
When he was 18, he was able to instinctively choke his father to death, which greatly speaks for how prodigious he was, and how strong in the force he as.
He once lost his temper, and was able to instinctively project his fury on an entire room full of people; that speaks for truly how strong he was in the darkside.
He pretty much mastered force lightning after just 1 hour of having learnt the technique, and was even able to create a miniature storm. By BotS, after having grown much more powerful, he would likely be able to replicate this to much greater effect.
He was able to release a wave of energy that was able to collapse the entire 20 story Rakatan Temple, and the temple wasn't even hit by the entire attack (it wasn't hit by the portion that hit Kas'im).
He was able to control the power of over 20 sith lords combined with his own to destroy an entire world.
He was able to pull a moon out of orbit, and pretty casually too given he did it while riding on top of a flying beast.
He knew every move and sequence of the saber staff perfectly (and those are the moves and sequences for all 7 forms, and not just the regular forms, but Kas'im's perfected forms), and thus would be able to wield one to the same effect as Kas'im.
He as good as defeated Kas'im in a duel; Kas'im was basically The master of the lightsaber; he mastered every from, every primary art of the saber, and then furthered and perfected each form and constantly refined his skills, and Kas'im was only able to defeat him when he used a style that was alien to Bane.
Bane possesses the orbalisk armour, which constantly pumps dark side energies and adrenaline into his body, and strengthens his muscles and keeps them constantly flexed. It's also completely immune to the cutting power of even a lightsaber, and covers his entire body, except for his head (the only area where he can be physically affected), and a few joints where the gaps are too small for a lightsaber to pass through anyway. [/B]