Biggest question not answered by Ted and Terry

Originally posted by Surreal_44
I am smart, thank you, Chiki. 😄

I may or may not be able to confirm W/E, but I would say, of course, that most of the evidence and the few spoilers I have tend to point in that direction.

From what I understand, W/E have a child together. If this Dominic kid is Jack's then my understanding is that it would not be Elizabeth's...hence my conclusion that Jack is vexed partially because he knows about the child, wants to be included in that child's life, but isn't entirely sure.

Of course no mention of a child would be mentioned in DMC, because that would have interrupted the story-line unnecessarily, and ruined the chemistry of J/E...which had to end with a kiss so that Jack could die.

It's not just a random idea I'm tossing out. 😄 I've put at least fifteen minutes of thought into it, and I've had this theory for a long time...just ask Lovely. I pm'd it to her a looong time ago. Back in Nov., I think.

Originally posted by Surreal_44
I am smart, thank you, Chiki. 😄

I may or may not be able to confirm W/E, but I would say, of course, that most of the evidence and the few spoilers I have tend to point in that direction.

From what I understand, W/E have a child together. If this Dominic kid is Jack's then my understanding is that it would not be Elizabeth's...hence my conclusion that Jack is vexed partially because he knows about the child, wants to be included in that child's life, but isn't entirely sure.

Of course no mention of a child would be mentioned in DMC, because that would have interrupted the story-line unnecessarily, and ruined the chemistry of J/E...which had to end with a kiss so that Jack could die.

It's not just a random idea I'm tossing out. 😄 I've put at least fifteen minutes of thought into it, and I've had this theory for a long time...just ask Lovely. I pm'd it to her a looong time ago. Back in Nov., I think.

You wasted 15 minutes of your life with this?

You are still loosing credibility

Surreal you clearly haven't read all the spoilers.

)Weeellll...I have a few sources. They tease me with information, and since they tease, I am suspicious. Until I get a completely verified script in front of me (what are the chances of that? 😆 ), I take everything with a grain of salt.

But from the various bits and pieces I've picked up from people, this seems to be a fairly logical course to follow.

Here's what I've heard, but don't know to be ABSOLUTE (bold words are the rumor, italics are my opinions):

--Will and Elizabeth marry. This could be after Will stabs the heart, but I suspect that it is before he does so. I also don't know how the marriage occurs, but I DON'T believe it is because Will is faced with stabbing the heart so he begs/forces Liz to marry him.

--Will and Elizabeth have a child. Not much to say on this, except that...well, at some point they must have hooked up in some manner. 😄

--Jack already has a child, probably a son, somewhere. This I think is the most far-fetched rumor, but it would make sense that somewhere along the way, Jack managed to get one woman pregnant. My guess is that the kid is in Singapore, just because Jack seems to have such fond memories of that place. 😄

--Elizabeth dies. Not much to add to that, really, except that I don't think for one moment that she'd stay dead.

--Norrington becomes the next Captain of the Flying Dutchman. I actually think this is plausible, if a certain chain of events that are rumored to happen occur.

Play Devil's Advocate with me for a moment...

Let's say that Will stabs the heart and becomes Captain of the Dutchman. He finds an injured, almost dead James on board, and convinces him to join his crew. So far so good, right?

Eventually, during the course of the movie, we, the audience, learns how the curse can be broken. Maybe Elizabeth hears, maybe she doesn't...but at some point, she ends up sacrificing herself to save everyone else. During this time, the EITC is defeated, just barely.

Still with me?

Will, heart-broken, kneels above Elizabeth and weeps, and realizes that if he hadn't been such a butt-head, Elizabeth might still be alive.

Calypso, who might be human, or possibly in goddess form, takes pity on the two lovers, and she works some magic to free both of them; Will from the curse, and Elizabeth from death.

But the problem is, the Dutchman NEEDS a captain. Someone has to find those sailors lost at sea. Who better than James Norrington? James volunteers, or is chosen by Tia, to be the next captain, so he does so.

Will and Elizabeth are returned to the land of the living, and we have ourselves a somewhat bittersweet end. Jack is alone, but not entirely. He's got friends, his father (maybe)...and a child. He's been afraid to claim the child as his own, but with the help of Elizabeth and his dad, realizes maybe, just maybe, he could be a good man, a good father, and a good pirate.

Will and Elizabeth are alone ( Gov. Swann and Bootstrap will both possibly be dead by this point), but not entirely. They have each other, and Jack, and the other pirates.

Norrington...well, Norrington is alone, as usual. No one to really back him up...except maybe his crew? Dunno. 😄

Tia goes back to being her goddess form, or whatever, but now she's sad that Davy is gone. Perhaps there is a reconciliation of some sort? That would be nifty.

At any rate, we have the bitter and the sweet. Dead friends and family, a few beloved characters alone, and yet, there is still hope for love and adventure. 😄

Ten years later, we see a very pregnant Elizabeth chilling out with Will in their house, where they settled after several years of sailing at sea. They are waiting for a visit from 'Uncle Jack', who brings his son along with him to meet his auntie and uncle. Jack is happy and no longer running. Hopefully, Norrington would show up in this bit as well. 😄

It's just a theory based on loose bits and pieces of information. I like to write, this is just my version of events, written at 1 am my time. 😄 I'm off to bed. 😄

Go ahead, shred me. 😄

Ok that is your opinion, I am not going to say anything about it. LMAO 😂 Don't get me wrong I really liked your story.

I wont shred you, I just pitty you lol.

Surreal you have a really good imagination, that was really.........creative. *hold back giggles*

I'm tired of the same topic. I keep saying the same thing. May 25th, 2007 will be At Worlds End. It will be a resolution of these characters and will bring closure. Not only that, it will be a resolution between the J/E shippers and W/E shippers. 4 more months...

Uncle Jack? If all that theory you added I changed it to Jack and Liz the first thing I would get rid of is Uncle Will.

Jack never had a child in the first place. THERE IS NO CHILD AT THIS POINT.

Seriously this discussion is boring me to tears. People who are great thinkers like Lovey, kate, and willo are even tired. Because there's really no point in arguing the same thing.

Its great that you put effort and waste 15 minutes of your life on this, not even I do it. And the little hints and spoilers and this and that, would you believe in that? Some of those hints and spoilers were proven not to be true.

I don't know where you get your sources, but I think its time to look for better ones. If there was ever a problem of Jack liking liz, wouldn't the ratings and the box office go to negative billion? Sure there are some critics that they didn't like some parts. But, now Jack was considered Liz's hero, because he proofed to be a good man. All those scenes they both had together twas leading to that kiss. No surprise there.

Again, here i go with the same BS. There is no kid at this point. You are twisting things in an almost sick and sad way. I don't know the point of this. It's amazing on how you put so much effort into this, but it still doesn't make sense. And by that I mean the lack of evidence, and how you manipulate some of the pieces in order for them to fit into the puzzle.

I really thought you were smarter. No, I don't mean 1+1=2 nor that your theories of a possible E/W ending is stupid. Because we also have theories of our own. But we go by what we see in the movie and how T&T work their magic as well as the characters and the actors themselves.

Why Jack chose to fell in love before his almost death is not entirely answered, but not entirely unsolved. Why not some other scene, why not at the beach, or the persuade me scene. My opinion on this to end this question and put us into a relief is that it could possibly be a point showed from T&T that Jack's feelings for Elizabeth were true. We needed to see that side of Jack, an unknown Jack, who accepted his fate in dying. Jack Sparrow? Sacrificing himself? That's the first thing I asked when I saw what he did. And I think they are making a point with this. Also with Liz, IMO, they are showing us that Lizzie didn't know what she had, until it was gone.

She assumed that by kissing Jack, her temptation will be satisfied and she will later run back to her beloved Will and be the best faithful bride ever. When instead she leaned into another almost kiss. By the end, she cried because she killed a man--oh, but not just any man, Jack Sparrow. A man whom she possibly indeed maybe in love with. These are words from T&T, I'm not saying it to please myself with it. She has that potential to do so. Its proving us that it's not lust no more what she has, but feelings leading towards a possible love.

This thread's question, well Lovely's question, will sure be answered and clarified in AWE. But for now it's not important at this matter.

As well as for the kid. Time to scratch that. There's only one kid. Nuff said, I'm tired of it.

Now this took me 5 minutes 🙂 a little bit shorter than you, Surreal 😉

-Edit-

A little bit shorter than yours, not you 😛. Im the shortest lol.

mmmm yummy... this thread had some great posts made lately. 🙂

My two cents:

I'm willing to bet my long hair that Jack doesn't already have a child, but that's gut instinct. there's no way to prove or disprove such an idea. Heck, I'm convinced Will and Elizabeth are going to pick up Jack's eyeliner habit (which may be wishful thinking on my part) so I'm not going to knock anyone's thoughts. it's an interesting theory, surreal, and would certainly be a surprise. I'm concerned, however, from a film-making standpoint, that adding such an integral piece of the puzzle out of the blue towards the end of film 3 would be a little bit forced. it doesn't seem to fit with the pattern T and T have created in their writing. I more usually see them causing plot points to converge in a way that harkens back to the beginning of a film.

i also, am entirely against the idea of two kids. I am actually against any kid. kids ruin films. but as long as they keep it at the end, i reckon it won't do any serious damage. i'm having a thought the final scene will be somewhat like the first scene in film 1.

I've said my peace about feasts, waffles, and fruitcakes. Like the compass, this discussion has outlived its usefullness and credibility and gone to the locker. IMHO, anyways. 😉

i am not convinced e/w are ending up together, though i dont doubt its likely. we've all had our shares of spoilers, the majority of which can be interpretted to either ship. despite what happens, I am of the opinion that J/E shippers will be given a bone to gnaw on and enjoy whilst the plot gets tied up. 😉

I'm not tired of the discussion, because generally that's why I get on this forum. some of the points are getting a bit redundant, however. still, we arent as bad as congress.

OH! And the part about the very preggers ELizbaeth chilling out in a house made me crack up. dont know why. just picturing it. hahahahahah. oh gee.

wow all these theories are intersting!... i wasnt entirely sure about the two kids either nt tht im against it just wandering where all these spoilers come from...

anyway but what chiki said was interesting about
ellizabeth kissing jack so its satisfied and her crying because she killed jack sparrow etc..........

its frm ted and terry it sed and it kinda explained it a bit more 2 me and wat its rly about...so thnx chiki😄

sry thought i wud like 2 share tht

Originally posted by willofthewisp
I think we answered it, sarahb. Jack's falling in love.

oh ok i guess that makes sense.. 😛

Oh, you all can laugh all you want. We'll see who's laughing at the end of AWE. 😉

Chiki:If you are so bored by what I wrote, you ought to just ignore it instead of responding.

Also, some parts of your post had me a bit confused with the wording, but what I got from your post is that you mocked my own theories, which I based on spoilers, with your opinions, which you based on a few scenes and statements made by the writers.

That's fine, but your point is moot, since your opinion has even less to back it up than mine does.

I didn't manipulate anything. I said it's a theory, not fact. Unfortunately, most of you can't tell the difference. You hear an idea, and you repeat it as fact until you believe it. I won't feel bad for you when you feel like you've been lied to...wait, we've had that rant already a few times, haven't we?

Silly me.

whats goin on?

not all of what i say are theories *wink*

two of the things you said seem to be correct

although the father of the boy appears to be the big confusion

there is only one child

interesting when you consider what Terry once said about how he wanted to end the trilogy..the twist is the answer to a problem raised early on..

there is one problem raised at the start of AWE and its Jack who raises it, ..the solution is also hinted..then link the solution back to what was said by Gibbs on the pearl to Jack and Elizabeth in DMC..there's your answer..a child

"and bad..bad for every mother's son who calls himself pirate(what does gibbs look at?)...there's a bit more speed to be coaxed from THESE SAILS"

that is said directly to Jack and Elizabeth on the pearl..Liz gives Jack a "look"..no Will in the scene

but before this Gibbs also says to Jack

"for the love of mother and child Jack whats coming after us?" Jack gives a weird look..the Kraken is actually after Jack..and Liz actually sort of resembles that..

there's also many child refrences in AWE directed at JACK....none of these have been directed at Will..

People here and on KTTC have somehow got their hands on the salmon script..and they've found one hinting line said by Barbossa..but a more OBVIOUS one is still being overlooked by people..here and on KttC

think about it..if the kids a twist you aint expecting it..find the line that links directly in with that notion...

Originally posted by Surreal_44
Oh, you all can laugh all you want. We'll see who's laughing at the end of AWE. 😉

Chiki:If you are so bored by what I wrote, you ought to just ignore it instead of responding.

Also, some parts of your post had me a bit confused with the wording, but what I got from your post is that you mocked my own theories, which I based on spoilers, with your opinions, which you based on a few scenes and statements made by the writers.

That's fine, but your point is moot, since your opinion has even less to back it up than mine does.

I didn't manipulate anything. I said it's a theory, not fact. Unfortunately, most of you can't tell the difference. You hear an idea, and you repeat it as fact until you believe it. I won't feel bad for you when you feel like you've been lied to...wait, we've had that rant already a few times, haven't we?

Silly me.

You are STILL loosing credibilty. Since when we turned POTC into a competition? "We'll see whose laghung by the end of AWE." Our reason, well mine, is to enjoy the movie. Not to see if I won or beat your theories that I oh, so mock 🙄. Since I'm such a bad person.

I didn't manipulate anything. I said it's a theory, not fact. Unfortunately, most of you can't tell the difference. You hear an idea, and you repeat it as fact until you believe it. I won't feel bad for you when you feel like you've been lied to...wait, we've had that rant already a few times, haven't we?

Ok. I alredy feel bad for you. Your arguments are now useless. There is no point in debating anymore--ABOUT THIS TOPIC.

So move on, shall we?

Originally posted by LovelyOne
"and bad..bad for every mother's son who calls himself pirate...there's a bit more speed to be coaxed from THESE SAILS"

that is said directly to Jack and Elizabeth on the pearl..Liz gives Jack a "look"..no Will in the scene

but before this Gibbs also says to Jack

"for the love of mother and child Jack whats coming after us?" Jack gives a weird look

there's also many child refrences in AWE directed at JACK....none of these have been directed at Will...and Gibbs says them more than most.

People here and on KTTC have somehow got their hands on the salmon script..and they've found one hinting line..but a more OBVIOUS one is still being overlooked by people..

To Will, right now, the most important thing for him is his father, not a child. And Lovely, Jack is STILL wearing those fertility charms around his waist...

personally. I dont think the kid is the twist...the twist is the identity of the father...

who I suspect is Jack..because of Johnny going back to film "something" small when he wasnt even needed because they were shooting the start of the movie in November

twists are kept out of scripts...

chiki Surreal may indeed be right..Will may be the dad..

Originally posted by LovelyOne
personally. I dont think the kid is the twist...the twist is the identity of the father...

who I suspect is Jack..because of Johnny going back to film "something" small when he wasnt even needed because they were shooting the start of the movie in November

twists are kept out of scripts...

chiki Surreal may indeed be right..Will may be the dad..

Ok, and Jack may be the dad also...

So what's your point.

you're kinda implying that Surreal isnt credible. IMO she is.