Originally posted by Gideon
Anakin, in the right frame of mind, can beat anyone in the PT? Just because he curbstomped Dooku doesn't mean he can do the same thing to everyone else, Rampant. I hardly see him beating Yoda or Sidious in a full out fight - given Yoda's speed, agility, and ferocity as well as Sidious's much superior fighting tactics and Force powers as well as the obvious psychological domination.
Anakin obliterated Dooku - meaning (according to this bullsh*t novel which is canon) Dooku had no chance at all. Now Dooku is not leagues behind the eras best, Sidious and Yoda. If Anakin can beat Dooku with such obvious ease then I can see him easily being able to take on either Sidious or Yoda and winning. Psychological domination means jack - Dooku is a master of Dun Moch (as much if not more than Sidious) and it didnt help him at all. In fact it just pissed Anakin off.
Anakin obliterated Dooku - meaning (according to this bullsh*t novel which is canon) Dooku had no chance at all. Now Dooku is not leagues behind the eras best, Sidious and Yoda. If Anakin can beat Dooku with such obvious ease then I can see him easily being able to take on either Sidious or Yoda and winning.
And all I see is you posturing that Anakin will "easily" lay waste to Yoda and Sidious because Dooku got his ass kicked; it's not the same. Yoda and Sidious are more powerful - with two other advantages, one being that Yoda is much, much more experienced in combat than Dooku and Sidious is much more clever than Dooku is when fighting is an issue. Dooku is so wrapped up in himself that he automatically dismisses the power and abilities of his opponents. As I've said many times before, he could have feasibly defeated Anakin and Obi-Wan by bringing his superior Force powers and control to bear, but he didn't.
Facing someone such as Yoda in an all out fight would prove disasterous for Anakin, given that Yoda's experience makes Dooku's own (and in turn, Anakin's) appear pathetic at best. Sidious will be even more difficult to fight than Yoda - given that Sidious has no compassion, no restraint, and he is an extremely smart fighter. All out? Especially against Sidious? No. Anakin wouldn't win. Not even in the right frame of mind.
Psychological domination means jack - Dooku is a master of Dun Moch (as much if not more than Sidious) and it didnt help him at all. In fact it just pissed Anakin off.
Riiight. Pray tell, is this the same intimidating Dun Moch-master Dooku who was terrified of Sidious? 'Cuz I think it is. 🙄
If Dooku were "more talented" in Dun Moch than Sidious, then that wouldn't be an issue would it? In fact, we could go so far as to say that Sidious was so potent that he had a natural dominating presence that made Dooku and Grievous complete wussies even when Sidious is lightyears away from them in distance. See Dark Rendezvous for Dooku pissing his pants when chatting to Sidious.
As far as manipulating emotions, it's another "no contest". Both of them are manipulators, true, but Sidious is above and beyond Dooku in that aspect as well - and Dark Rendezvous shows that Dooku got most of his "manipulating" skill from Sidious himself, who "taught" him how to do it.
Then, factor in that Sidious - unlike Dooku - intimately knows Anakin, and Anakin harbors a deep respect and affection for Sidious. Exploiting affection would bring greater results than exploiting anger.
So, please, Rampant. Dooku lost because he was cocky and because - in the right frame of mind - Anakin is a mile ahead of him in saber combat. Yoda, on the other hand, is considerably more powerful than Dooku - and has eons and eons of superior experience. And then there's Sidious, who is as powerful as Yoda is, with the additional advantages of being a smarter fighter, a much better manipulator, and completely directed for self preservation.
Originally posted by Gideon
And all I see is you posturing that Anakin will "easily" lay waste to Yoda and Sidious because Dooku got his ass kicked; it's not the same.
Im not posturing anything. I know that if Anakin was to fight Sidious or Yoda it would be an extremely difficult battle for both parties, regardless of the winner.
Yoda and Sidious are more powerful - with two other advantages, one being that Yoda is much, much more experienced in combat than Dooku and Sidious is much more clever than Dooku is when fighting is an issue.
Yoda's experience will certainly help, but its certainly not going to be giving him any huge advantage - at least not to the point you are making it out to be. Dooku had decades of experience on Anakin but it meant nothing. Yoda had centuries of experience on Sidious yet he was left on his ass.
When you say 'clever' I presume you mean intelligent, tactical fighting. Yes Sidious is a very clever fighter, but so was Dooku to a certain extent (despite his arrogance), yet he was left with no hands, no head and a carcass burnt to oblivion. Again, I dont think that Sidious' clever fighting is going to give him the huge bonus that you make it out to be.
Dooku is so wrapped up in himself that he automatically dismisses the power and abilities of his opponents. As I've said many times before, he could have feasibly defeated Anakin and Obi-Wan by bringing his superior Force powers and control to bear, but he didn't.
I agree.
Facing someone such as Yoda in an all out fight would prove disasterous for Anakin, given that Yoda's experience makes Dooku's own (and in turn, Anakin's) appear pathetic at best.
See above. Yoda's experience couldnt beat Sidious and, from a certain point of view, couldnt beat Dooku (seeing Yoda wasnt able to capture/kill him). It will help but its not going to be enough to win him the fight.
Sidious will be even more difficult to fight than Yoda - given that Sidious has no compassion, no restraint, and he is an extremely smart fighter. All out? Especially against Sidious? No. Anakin wouldn't win. Not even in the right frame of mind.
Compassion? Perhaps, but I think that is clutching at straws. Anakins compassion is not going to effect him, assuming he is in the right frame of mind. Restraint? Anakin wtf pwned Dooku and was still said to be restraining himself - if I remember the novel correctly. So I think that Anakin has a very good chance at beating him. Sidious' force powers are better, but so were Dooku's. Superior force prowess is irrelevant if you dont get the chance to use them.
Riiight. Pray tell, is this the same intimidating Dun Moch-master Dooku who was terrified of Sidious? 'Cuz I think it is. 🙄If Dooku were "more talented" in Dun Moch than Sidious, then that wouldn't be an issue would it? In fact, we could go so far as to say that Sidious was so potent that he had a natural dominating presence that made Dooku and Grievous complete wussies even when Sidious is lightyears away from them in distance. See Dark Rendezvous for Dooku pissing his pants when chatting to Sidious.
As far as manipulating emotions, it's another "no contest". Both of them are manipulators, true, but Sidious is above and beyond Dooku in that aspect as well - and Dark Rendezvous shows that Dooku got most of his "manipulating" skill from Sidious himself, who "taught" him how to do it.
Irrelevant but I concede the point. I was going by the movies seeing I despise EU. From the movies Dooku clearly uses Dun Moch more in a battle, and by the looks of it more effectively. But if EU disagrees then so be it.
So, please, Rampant. Dooku lost because he was cocky and because - in the right frame of mind - Anakin is a mile ahead of him in saber combat. Yoda, on the other hand, is considerably more powerful than Dooku - and has eons and eons of superior experience. And then there's Sidious, who is as powerful as Yoda is, with the additional advantages of being a smarter fighter, a much better manipulator, and completely directed for self preservation.
See above reasoning. Anakin obliterated Dooku and was said to still be holding back, going by memory(please correct me if I got that wrong). Dooku is not leagues behind Yoda or Sidious. Yes they are a good notch or two better but the gap in power levels is not large enough to save them from Anakin. Unless they can do what Dooku couldnt and use the force then I dont see them having a very good chance. But Anakin is so fast and so strong that I doubt that a force technique will be very practicle. Experience means jack as I explained. Sidious' smarter fighting might help him, but not a heck of alot. He would be more worried about blocking Anakins barrage of strikes.
Im not posturing anything. I know that if Anakin was to fight Sidious or Yoda it would be an extremely difficult battle for both parties, regardless of the winner.
It's interesting; earlier, you said Anakin would "easily" win. Now, it's difficult for both parties? Let's clarify: it would be difficult for both parties in a lightsaber duel. In a Force fight? Hell. No. And in an all out fight? Perhaps.
Yoda's experience will certainly help, but its certainly not going to be giving him any huge advantage - at least not to the point you are making it out to be. Dooku had decades of experience on Anakin but it meant nothing. Yoda had centuries of experience on Sidious yet he was left on his ass.
Two completely different situations. Yoda was "left on his ass" due to a tactical stalemate in which Sidious got the better end of the deal. It was not something that could have been controlled, and then you have to factor in that Yoda was combating someone who was just as powerful as he was, plus was the smarter and more ruthless fighter. That negated the "experience" and equated everything.
Count Dooku was facing someone more powerful than him in lightsaber prowess, physical skills, and stamina - and sealed his own fate with the constant taunting as well as his own arrogance.
When you say 'clever' I presume you mean intelligent, tactical fighting. Yes Sidious is a very clever fighter, but so was Dooku to a certain extent (despite his arrogance), yet he was left with no hands, no head and a carcass burnt to oblivion. Again, I dont think that Sidious' clever fighting is going to give him the huge bonus that you make it out to be.
Rampant, your bias is stretching the limits of my patience, but I want you to know that I am trying to be as kind as possible - but pull your head out of Dooku's ass! Dooku's arrogance is what limited his tactical fighting. You're trying to imply that Dooku and Sidious are on par with tactics, and interject a point that "Dooku is teh smart!!1", and I will agree - but Sidious is a much smarter fighter than Dooku. No, it's not close. No, Dooku's not on par. He has such a superiority complex that he literally does not take into consideration the skills of his opponents. 70 years of being virtually unchallenged can do that to a guy, and Dooku realizes he's either beaten or going to lose a handful of times (twice with Yoda, once with Mace, and once with Anakin).
And you don't think "clever fighting" is going to give him a huge bonus? That's a ridiculous assertion.
I agree.
Why does that not surprise me?
See above. Yoda's experience couldnt beat Sidious and, from a certain point of view, couldnt beat Dooku (seeing Yoda wasnt able to capture/kill him). It will help but its not going to be enough to win him the fight.
You're comparing apples and oranges; Yoda and Sidious were virtual equals in power - with Yoda having more experience and Sidious being smarter. That's why the fight ended the way it did. Dooku knew he was beaten and that's why he fled. And, how did Yoda's experience fail him with Count Dooku? Both times Dooku fled against Yoda - it wasn't a lack of capability - it was compassion. Dooku endangered Anakin and Obi-Wan as a distraction and fled, forcing Yoda to save them than kill Dooku; the second time, Dooku activated a missile that was going to wipe out the Republic forces stationed on Vjun.
Compassion? Perhaps, but I think that is clutching at straws. Anakins compassion is not going to effect him, assuming he is in the right frame of mind. Restraint? Anakin wtf pwned Dooku and was still said to be restraining himself - if I remember the novel correctly. So I think that Anakin has a very good chance at beating him. Sidious' force powers are better, but so were Dooku's. Superior force prowess is irrelevant if you dont get the chance to use them.
No. Sidious has no compassion, restraint, or a desire to make himself feel superior to Anakin. Considering that we know Sidious had no use for Anakin outside his sphere of influence, it is obvious that if Sidious absolutely knew that Anakin would not be returning - and Anakin attacked him - Sidious would cut Anakin down without a moment's hesitation, and bring everything he had against him to bear.
Also, Sidious is better versed in the Force than Dooku - and as we know - it is his preferred method of fighting (though obviously when confronted at point-blank with sabers, he'll go for his saber), whereas Dooku obviously goes for the saber first until he absolutely has to use the Force or unless he's showing off (a la AotC).
What's to stop Sidious from just blasting the frick out of Anakin when the fight begins?
Irrelevant but I concede the point. I was going by the movies seeing I despise EU. From the movies Dooku clearly uses Dun Moch more in a battle, and by the looks of it more effectively. But if EU disagrees then so be it.
"Irrelevent but I concede the point"? Yeah, that makes a lot of sense... It doesn't matter. Sidious is better versed in manipulation and psychological domination than Dooku, which makes your assertion that "Dooku is teh uber!" at it and "might be better than Sidious" rather ridiculous.
See above reasoning. Anakin obliterated Dooku and was said to still be holding back, going by memory(please correct me if I got that wrong). Dooku is not leagues behind Yoda or Sidious. Yes they are a good notch or two better but the gap in power levels is not large enough to save them from Anakin. Unless they can do what Dooku couldnt and use the force then I dont see them having a very good chance. But Anakin is so fast and so strong that I doubt that a force technique will be very practicle. Experience means jack as I explained. Sidious' smarter fighting might help him, but not a heck of alot. He would be more worried about blocking Anakins barrage of strikes.
Again: you're comparing what Anakin did to Dooku to a hypothetical fight. We know Sidious is a smarter fighter than Dooku. We know he is more powerful than Dooku. We know Sidious doesn't have an overwhelming desire to prove his power over Anakin. We know Sidious doesn't have a point to make. We know Sidious is self-preservation oriented.
In a Force fight, Anakin has no chance in hell. In an all out fight, Sidious's superior command of the Force, decent lightsaber skills, and smarter techniques will let him win.
But, it doesn't matter, as this is a saber fight, and as I said before - Anakin will likely win, because I do take what he did to Dooku into consideration. But those were different circumstances.
Originally posted by Gideon Obliterates him, Faunus? In a Force-fight? Yes. In an all out fight? Probable. In a lightsaber fight? Doubtful. Very doubtful.Damn, missed the saber-only part. Well, then I guess he'd put up a fight, but I can't see him outdueling Sidious.
and, correct me if I'm wrong, didn't you agree that Dooku was greater than Sidious (at least in swordsmanship)?As a duelist? He's more efficient and effective, yes, and I can see him taking Palpatine in a similar situation, but I don't recall claiming that he was his outright superior, no.
Sidious could win by virtue of his dominating psychological presence and superior tactics - but I seriously doubt that his raw saber powers are above Anakin's. No one in the PT is.What are "raw saber powers"? If you mean raw Force power, then yeah, Anakin has that in droves. Problem is, he obviously can't utilize it to its maximum potential yet due his lack of control and mastery. If he had indeed recognized his powers, he would have crushed Obi-Wan in their contest.
If you're referring to his ability as a combatant - he's hardly the best of the PT in that aspect. He can be easily manipulated and tricked into putting himself in detrimental situations, as was evidenced by his defeat at Obi-Wan's hands. Sidious was able to outmaneuver Yoda, who in the Emperor's mind was far more than a match for Anakin. Mace Windu's Vaapad and shatterpoint could probably make short work of him, and had Dooku not been the cocky, gullible S.O.B. that he was, I believe he could have defeated Anakin again.
Lastly, if you're thinking of saber mastery alone, Anakin is again outclassed by a few others. Obi-Wan is a contender, although I'll concede Anakin's swordplay may have surpassed his own. Yoda has almost nine centuries of practice under his belt, and again was thought by Sidious to be capable of "destroying" Anakin. Mace Windu created his own deadly style - with which he's accomplished innumerable feats - and Dooku himself, well, he's mastered the ultimate refinement of saber-to-saber combat in existence. And then of course, there's Sidious himself, who slaughtered some of the more skilled Jedi Masters of his time with contemptuous ease (in the most idiotically choreographed fight in history).
Again, I don't see Anakin defeating Palpatine.
TPM sidious alone would whoop anakins ass, He could move faster than the eye can see at that time, and ROTS sidious didnt touch a lightsabre for 13 years, yet being alone to pwn 3 masters quickly is pretty much impressive.
Again i dont get it, juz cuz dooku got his ass wiped by anakin why does it mean anakin can beat any1? You also seem to forget that djem so > makashi and it also contributes to dookus defeat
Originally posted by Gideon
It's interesting; earlier, you said Anakin would "easily" win. Now, it's difficult for both parties? Let's clarify: it would be difficult for both parties in a lightsaber duel. In a Force fight? [B]Hell. No. And in an all out fight? Perhaps.
Well this is a lightsaber only duel so point moot. But even based on the assumption they are going all out then Anakin would still give them a sh*t of a time. I also agree that Anakin wouldnt stand a chance in a force only match, so its a good thing it isnt a force only match. 🙂
Two completely different situations. Yoda was "left on his ass" due to a tactical stalemate in which Sidious got the better end of the deal. It was not something that could have been controlled, and then you have to factor in that Yoda was combating someone who was just as powerful as he was, plus was the smarter and more ruthless fighter. That negated the "experience" and equated everything.
Wtf are you talking about? So it gets negated now because it doesnt suit your argument? Yoda had more experience than Sidious yet still lost. The End. Everything else is besides the point. If Yoda's experience was as important as you are obviously making it out to be then he wouldnt be in the position of a 'tactical stalemate'. All I gathered from that load of bullsh*t was that Yoda's experience is no longer godlike because Sidious is ruthless and smarter. Smarter perhaps. Ruthless? Well Yoda knew that Sidious had just wiped out his Jedi Order, killed his friends, destroyed the Republic and essentially created a dictorship. Im thinking Yoda would be pretty ruthless at that stage as well.
Rampant, your bias is stretching the limits of my patience, but I want you to know that I am trying to be as kind as possible - but pull your head out of Dooku's ass!
Now what are you on about? I said that Dooku is a smart fighter. If thats being bias then heck, I dont know what else to say. I acknowledge that Sidious is smarter, I was making a comparison that tactical abilities meant sh*t due to the fact that Dooku was a smart fighter and got absolutely obliterated. I dont think that Sidious' tactics are so much better than Dooku's that they are going to save him.
You're trying to imply that Dooku and Sidious are on par with tactics,
No, I wasnt. Perhaps you better read a bit more carefully due to the fact I said no such thing. So how about you stop putting words in my mouth to suit your argument.
and interject a point that "Dooku is teh smart!!1", and I will agree - but Sidious is a much smarter fighter than Dooku.
No shit sherlock. 🙄
No, it's not close. No, Dooku's not on par. He has such a superiority complex that he literally does not take into consideration the skills of his opponents. 70 years of being virtually unchallenged can do that to a guy, and Dooku realizes he's either beaten or going to lose a handful of times (twice with Yoda, once with Mace, and once with Anakin).
Here we go again. I never said Dooku was on par so stop making shit up. I said that both Dooku and Sidious were smart fighters, I thought the fact that Sidious would be smarter would go without saying. Obviously not. 🙄 . So here we go. For the record Dooku is not as smart as Sidious. Happy now? Good, perhaps now you can stop blatantly making shit up.
And you don't think "clever fighting" is going to give him a huge bonus? That's a ridiculous assertion.
No, I dont think it is going to give him a huge bonus. A bonus perhaps, but certainly nor enough to outright win him the match. As said, Dooku was also a smart fighter but got destroyed.
Dooku knew he was beaten and that's why he fled. And, how did Yoda's experience fail him with Count Dooku? Both times Dooku fled against Yoda - it wasn't a lack of capability - it was compassion. Dooku endangered Anakin and Obi-Wan as a distraction and fled, forcing Yoda to save them than kill Dooku; the second time, Dooku activated a missile that was going to wipe out the Republic forces stationed on Vjun.
Yoda went after Dooku to capture him and stop the war. He was unable to do so. Yes he bet Dooku but he wasnt able to acheive what he wanted, despite your whole 'experience is teh uber' argument. So my point originally was that experience wasnt everything and it still stands.
No. Sidious has no compassion, restraint, or a desire to make himself feel superior to Anakin. Considering that we know Sidious had no use for Anakin outside his sphere of influence, it is obvious that if Sidious absolutely knew that Anakin would not be returning - and Anakin attacked him - Sidious would cut Anakin down without a moment's hesitation, and bring everything he had against him to bear.
Yes, but the same is likewise. If Anakin was 'in the zone' and truly wanted to kill Sidious then he wouldnt be worried with compassion, superiority etc. Although I am assuming that Anakin does not want Sidious alive for Padme, otherwise this theory admittedly goes out the window. Also Anakin kept much of his power under restraints, yet was still easily able to beat Dooku. If he went all out on Sidious, all restraints gone, then I honestly dont see how Sidious has a chance. Sids can have all the ruthlessness and lack of compassion in the world, its not going to negate the fact that Anakin is simply better than him.
Also, Sidious is better versed in the Force than Dooku - and as we know - it is his preferred method of fighting (though obviously when confronted at point-blank with sabers, he'll go for his saber), whereas Dooku obviously goes for the saber first until he absolutely has to use the Force or unless he's showing off (a la AotC).
Yes. I do agree that Sidous is better than Anakin with the force, and it would be possible for him to beat Anakin at the beginning of the battle with the force. But I dont feel this makes him a better fighter overall, when I am adament that if they got into a proper duel Anakin would win.
What's to stop Sidious from just blasting the frick out of Anakin when the fight begins?
Nothing. You are competely right. But this doesnt mean Sidious is better. Dooku could have done that to Anakin in ROTS, but 90% of this forum is convinced that Anakin is still better.
"Irrelevent but I concede the point"? Yeah, that makes a lot of sense... It doesn't matter. Sidious is better versed in manipulation and psychological domination than Dooku, which makes your assertion that "Dooku is teh uber!" at it and "might be better than Sidious" rather ridiculous.
Wtf. I conceded the point because A) you were right and B) it was irrelavent. So what the f*ck are you talking about now?
Again: you're comparing what Anakin did to Dooku to a hypothetical fight. We know Sidious is a smarter fighter than Dooku. We know he is more powerful than Dooku. We know Sidious doesn't have an overwhelming desire to prove his power over Anakin. We know Sidious doesn't have a point to make. We know Sidious is self-preservation oriented.
You are correct. But if Sidious was unable to beat Anakin with the force before the battle begun, then I think that Dooku's death will play out again. Anakin was holding back against Dooku yet still utterly destroyed him. If Anakin was going full out on Sidious all of the traits mentioned will be useless.
In a Force fight, Anakin has no chance in hell.
Agreed.
In an all out fight, Sidious's superior command of the Force, decent lightsaber skills, and smarter techniques will let him win.
Well it seems we shall have to agree to disagree. I think that unless Sidious can eliminate Anakin immediately via the force then he will lose. Much the same as Dooku.
But, it doesn't matter, as this is a saber fight, and as I said before - Anakin will likely win, because I do take what he did to Dooku into consideration. But those were different circumstances.[/QUOTE]
Different circumstances yes. But still circumstances that can easily be played out again.
Yea what the hell? No one is saying Anakin beats Yoda or Sidious in a full out fight, only possibly in a lightsaber duel. Its obvious he gets his ass handed to him in an all out fight with Yoda or Sidious, but a lightsaber ONLY duel is a different story. Anakin possesses the talent and skill to best both Yoda and Sidious in lightsaber combat, given that his head is in the right place.
Damn, missed the saber-only part. Well, then I guess he'd put up a fight, but I can't see him outdueling Sidious.
I can. Well, it depends. I definately think that when Anakin reaches the same mental clarification that he had in his fight with Dooku - he'd beat Sidious without extreme difficulty in a lightsaber match. However, this completely depends on Anakin's state of mind, given Sidious's own talent with a lightsaber and psychological domination that he would likely use to his advantage.
As a duelist? He's more efficient and effective, yes, and I can see him taking Palpatine in a similar situation, but I don't recall claiming that he was his outright superior, no.
As a swordsman (I consider a "duelist" to also include Force power - where Sidious is considerably above Dooku). I consider Dooku and Sidious to be on par, given that Dooku fled from Mace on Boz Pity, Sidious lost to Mace in lightsaber combat, and Sidious was able to stalemate Yoda in lightsaber combat (as far as we know) whereas Dooku was unable to beat Yoda in either AotC or on Vjun (a planet steeped in the dark side).
What are "raw saber powers"? If you mean raw Force power, then yeah, Anakin has that in droves. Problem is, he obviously can't utilize it to its maximum potential yet due his lack of control and mastery. If he had indeed recognized his powers, he would have crushed Obi-Wan in their contest.
What I mean by "raw saber powers" is that Anakin's talent for swordsmanship is peerless in the PT (including the likes of Yoda, Sidious, Mace, and Dooku) - given that Anakin [with "mental clarification"] was able to hand Dooku's ass (or in this case, hands and head) to him on a silver platter in the end of that fight. The novelization says that "Dooku is dead. The rest is mere detail."
But Anakin's psychological inferiority and (in my opinion) his stupid-ass tactics are what get him into trouble. Just plain ol' Anakin, I don't see him beating Sidious. Dooku-fight Anakin? I see him winning in about the same amount of time - if we exclude Sidious's penchant for manipulation.
If you're referring to his ability as a combatant - he's hardly the best of the PT in that aspect. He can be easily manipulated and tricked into putting himself in detrimental situations, as was evidenced by his defeat at Obi-Wan's hands. Sidious was able to outmaneuver Yoda, who in the Emperor's mind was far more than a match for Anakin. Mace Windu's Vaapad and shatterpoint could probably make short work of him, and had Dooku not been the cocky, gullible S.O.B. that he was, I believe he could have defeated Anakin again.
Yes, but his loss to Obi-Wan was due to not any lack of skill, but by Obi-Wan's superior state of mind, his superior tactics, his knowledge of Anakin's maneuvers and fighting styles, and - of course - Obi-Wan's own considerable proficiency at Soresu (that the "efficient" and "effective" Count Dooku was completely unable to overwhelm in a lightsaber match, I might add). In an all out fight, indeed, Yoda would make short work of Anakin, and Mace likely would as well. Dooku could have won if he used his Force powers, but, no, I think his swordsmanship is inferior to Anakin's own.
Lastly, if you're thinking of saber mastery alone, Anakin is again outclassed by a few others. Obi-Wan is a contender, although I'll concede Anakin's swordplay may have surpassed his own. Yoda has almost nine centuries of practice under his belt, and again was thought by Sidious to be capable of "destroying" Anakin. Mace Windu created his own deadly style - with which he's accomplished innumerable feats - and Dooku himself, well, he's mastered the ultimate refinement of saber-to-saber combat in existence. And then of course, there's Sidious himself, who slaughtered some of the more skilled Jedi Masters of his time with contemptuous ease (in the most idiotically choreographed fight in history).
Obi-Wan is not a contender; he won by virtue of superior psychology and tactics foremost, and lightsaber skills second. Yoda's speed and agility would overcome Anakin, but I doubt his "lightsaber skills" are beyond Anakin's. Mace? Probably, given Mace's own ferocity, superior experience, and how Vaapad is more dangerous and more powerful than any other lightsaber form. Dooku? In sheer swordsmanship? Again, it depends. Anakin won once he got "in the zone", so to speak. If that happened again, he'd curbstomp Dooku in my opinion in a sheer lightsaber match - and the same goes for Sidious unless Sidious can use his "smart" tactics to his advantage, but even then, I see him going down.
Again, I don't see Anakin defeating Palpatine.
He's certainly capable of it.
So no active use of the force, right? Damn close imho.
Sidious was able to own Kit in seconds, who was a damn incredible swordsman, and dominate his entire fight with Mace, as well as briefly contend with Yoda.
Anakin was able to battle with Cin Drallig one handed, while physically choking a padawan with the other hand.
I'd go with Sidious, his feats with a saber are better, and there aren't really any strikes against him, whereas we have Anakin failing to defeat Obi-Wan, granted he was quite unlucky to lose like he did.