Originally posted by Mr Master
What else are they supposed to be?The Universal and Multiversal embodiments are already there,
had to be something else. (it stands to reason that they are something much greater.
If there was any Help at all, On Panel it was depicted as TALK!!!
with his Hooded, Spectral Ally" (I'm not sure who this is)
"Not yet ... First there must be the Transdimensional [B]ConsultationThe Living Tribunal did ALL the Work!!!
"he sits at the CENTER of ALL things, feeling the flow of countless Realities, their FATE irrevocably determined through the judgment rendered by HIS Three Faces"
"Two SIBLINGS whom the Tribunal has a place for in His great scheme of things"ALL the WORK On Panel!!! (the "other Helper perhaps gave him the 'OK' and that was that"😉
"the Pulse of Creation reverberates through him, for he is its Heart, ALPHA & OMEGA revolve on the Wheel of Destiny, a Destiny SPUN by HIS mighty Hand"
"A Hand soon opening to allow TWO Brothers to assume their pre-destined Roles as Architects of New Realities ... and ONLY this Judge knows why"So show me where is it stated that LT is the Judge of just one Multiverse.
or let me know the issue, I'm sure I'll have it, I'll post the scans for you.
I know that Universes vary in power, atleast in comparison to 616.
But on the other hand, Beyonder is an anomoly you seldom see.
Not many characters have been able to take over everything since Beyonder.
Biggest threats have been,
Jaspers
Chaos Wave
Abraxas
(imo) the IG could have been in this league as a threatanyways you get me. [/B]
False, you assume that marvel is utterly flawless in their creations (or there are no contradictions on panel). These writers are not scientists?
You also assume this stuff is real.
There is more than one universal embodiment and thus why not more than one multiversal embodiment?
You can't use bio as proof and then call a part of the same bio a mistake (without proof).
That is to say, you can just pick and choose what you deem as a mistake without proof. Even when I just proved that the panel doesn't contradict the bio. Thus rendering your only means of proof useless.
"His great scheme of things" doesn't imply that TOAA don't have the same great scheme of things. It is possible that the writers had both TOAA and LT involved with the brothers. And it is a contradiction to assume that TOAA don't know why (or only LT knows why). For TOAA knows all (he is omniscient).
How do you know that LT did all the work?
Because it was never said on panel (or even implied).
How do you know that the brothers will become megaverses (they're not yet in the scan) and not multiverses or universes? And you can't say because all the universal and multiversal embodiments are already covered (How do you know this?-or is this just speculation).
How do you know that the brothers in the scan is not just a vision (or image of them-like a hologram)? These are abstract beings now. For example, just because you see LT's Mbody doesn't mean that is all of him. He exists in all universes of the multiverse and is thus abstract.
And what is with the constant posting of "Wheel of Destiny" stuff?
This doesn't show that LT has megaversal power or even multiversal power (but at least universal power). You can spin destiny on your hand of one single universe (if you were the supreme omnipotent of that universe) or galaxy or planet or your own life. You can even control destiny of the omniverse (if you're GOD). Thus destiny could have many different homes.
A reality is actually an universe. The architects of New Realities (the brothers) should only be assumed that they are at least (but not excluding) universal.
And about LT being the Judge of only one multiverse. I said Guardian (or is the same thing?).
It is in several scans my friend. I seen them with my own eyes here. Either you are lying, don't have the issues (and haven't seen the scans here), or are grossly misinterpreting the scans. I will bet you a hundred dollars to a donut that there exist at least two sources (at least one on panel) that it mentions that LT is the Judge (or Guardian) of only one multiverse. Most know this and have seen it.
And if you still don't know what I'm talking about then say so. For I will show you what I'm talking about with the scan(s) and then you must explain yourself because your reputation will then be on the line.
But at least you said that I got you with the "differences in universes" idea.
Originally posted by h1a8
False, you assume that marvel is utterly flawless in their creations (or there are no contradictions on panel). These writers are not scientists?
You also assume this stuff is real.
There is more than one universal embodiment and thus why not more than one multiversal embodiment?You can't use bio as proof and then call a part of the same bio a mistake (without proof).
doesn't imply that TOAA don't have the same great scheme of things. It is possible that the writers had both TOAA and LT involved with the brothers. And it is a contradiction to assume that TOAA don't know why (or only LT knows why). For TOAA knows all (he is omniscient).
That is to say, you can just pick and choose what you deem as a mistake without proof. Even when I just proved that the panel doesn't contradict the bio. Thus rendering your only means of proof useless.
[B] "His great scheme of things"How do you know that LT did all the work?
Because it was never said on panel (or even implied).How do you know that the brothers will become megaverses (they're not yet in the scan) and not multiverses or universes? And you can't say because all the universal and multiversal embodiments are already covered (How do you know this?-or is this just speculation).
How do you know that the brothers in the scan is not just a vision (or image of them-like a hologram)? These are abstract beings now. For example, just because you see LT's Mbody doesn't mean that is all of him. He exists in all universes of the multiverse and is thus abstract.
And what is with the constant posting of "Wheel of Destiny" stuff?
This doesn't show that LT has megaversal power or even multiversal power (but at least universal power). You can spin destiny on your hand of one single universe (if you were the supreme omnipotent of that universe) or galaxy or planet or your own life. You can even control destiny of the omniverse (if you're GOD). Thus destiny could have many different homes.A reality is actually an universe. The architects of New Realities (the brothers) should only be assumed that they are at least (but not excluding) universal.
And about LT being the Judge of only one multiverse. I said Guardian (or is the same thing?).
It is in several scans my friend. I seen them with my own eyes here. Either you are lying, don't have the issues (and haven't seen the scans here), or are grossly misinterpreting the scans. I will bet you a hundred dollars to a donut that there exist at least two sources (at least one on panel) that it mentions that LT is the Judge (or Guardian) of only one multiverse. Most know this and have seen it.
And if you still don't know what I'm talking about then say so. For I will show you what I'm talking about with the scan(s) and then you must explain yourself because your reputation will then be on the line.But at least you said that I got you with the "differences in universes" idea. [/B]
Living Tribunal still wins. He's appointed the Judge for a reason. Ommipotence.
Originally posted by guy222
Living Tribunal still wins. He's appointed the Judge for a reason. Ommipotence.
He is judge of Marvel's Ominiverse. The Ultimator quite literally is Everything and not only is it everything, it shows that it has the power to own every thing, even beings such as mxy who can effortlessly whipe aways several multiverses and put them back together like nothing. You can't even destroy the Ultimator. The LT can and has been beaten.
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
He is judge of Marvel's Ominiverse. The Ultimator quite literally is Everything and not only is it everything, it shows that it has the power to own every thing, even beings such as mxy who can effortlessly whipe aways several multiverses and put them back together like nothing. You can't even destroy the Ultimator. The LT can and has been beaten.
all i am saying is living tribunal exists to judge and safeguard. he's the only one appointed for that. no one comes close. i will give credit to ultimator. just my opinion, i wield the avatar living tribunal still wins.
you agree to easily, even the LT doesnt have power over certain things, he cant just always say he can do this and that, sometimes his judgements have been overridden even by dr strange, or at least he's been defied, his powers have even been copied where he needed help from a freaking celestial, there is no such thing as MARVELS omniverse not logically since omni means EVERYTHING meaning all universes including our own, marvel needs to get there definitions straight.
Originally posted by h1a8
False, you assume that marvel is utterly flawless in their creations (or there are no contradictions on panel). These writers are not scientists?
You also assume this stuff is real.
There is more than one universal embodiment and thus why not more than one multiversal embodiment?
Your not saying anything here, your simply unwilling to except what has been extablished as Marvel Cosmology.
Originally posted by h1a8
You can't use bio as proof and then call a part of the same bio a mistake (without proof).
That is to say, you can just pick and choose what you deem as a mistake without proof. Even when I just proved that the panel doesn't contradict the bio. Thus rendering your only means of proof useless.
Actually friend this rebuttle is what is "useless" ...
I already PROVED ON Panel the manner of "HELP" LT received:
"Not yet ... First there must be the Transdimensional Consultation with his Hooded, Spectral Ally"
You want to ignore that, that's on you.
But don't tell me I'm picking and choosing duke,
the Bio said, "LT HELPED Fashion the Brothers" (through Consultation LT was Helped ... nothing more)
You do know what Consultation means?
Originally posted by h1a8
[B] "His great scheme of things" doesn't imply that TOAA don't have the same great scheme of things. It is possible that the writers had both TOAA and LT involved with the brothers. And it is a contradiction to assume that TOAA don't know why (or only LT knows why). For TOAA knows all (he is omniscient). [/B]
So then you rely on your speculative assumptions,
we'll stick to what the On Panel art/characters and Bio states.
Originally posted by h1a8
How do you know that LT did all the work?
Because it was never said on panel (or even implied).
How many times do I have to post the Scan for you to see LT doing all the PHYSICAL Work?
The ONLY "Help" LT received was in the form of TALK (Consultation)
No matter what you theorize, you can't defy what has been illustrated On Panel and in the Bio.
Originally posted by h1a8
How do you know that the brothers will become megaverses (they're not yet in the scan) and not multiverses or universes? And you can't say because all the universal and multiversal embodiments are already covered (How do you know this?-or is this just speculation).
You gotta be kidding me?
You're the only one speculating here, don't you see that?
Originally posted by h1a8
How do you know that the brothers in the scan is not just a vision (or image of them-like a hologram)? These are abstract beings now. For example, just because you see LT's Mbody doesn't mean that is all of him. He exists in all universes of the multiverse and is thus abstract.
"the Living Tribunal also helped fashion the twin Entities the BROTHERS, each of whom became the guardian of a different Megaverse, within the larger Omniverse but encompassing MORE than a single Multiverse"
That's why I know.
Originally posted by h1a8
And what is with the constant posting of "Wheel of Destiny" stuff?
This doesn't show that LT has megaversal power or even multiversal power (but at least universal power). You can spin destiny on your hand of one single universe (if you were the supreme omnipotent of that universe) or galaxy or planet or your own life. You can even control destiny of the omniverse (if you're GOD). Thus destiny could have many different homes.A reality is actually an universe. The architects of New Realities (the brothers) should only be assumed that they are at least (but not excluding) universal.
firefirefireph
Originally posted by h1a8
And about LT being the Judge of only [B]one multiverse. I said Guardian (or is the same thing?). [/B]
Then you were wrong.
LT is the Judge,
Roma is the Guardian.
Originally posted by h1a8
It is in several scans my friend. I seen them with my own eyes here. Either you are lying, don't have the issues (and haven't seen the scans here), or are grossly misinterpreting the scans.
"Either I'm lying or don't have the issues?"
How about,
considering for one moment, you don't know what the hell you're talking about.
Originally posted by h1a8
I will bet you a hundred dollars to a donut that there exist at least two sources (at least one on panel) that it mentions that LT is the Judge (or Guardian) of only one multiverse. Most know this and have seen it.
And if you still don't know what I'm talking about then say so. For I will show you what I'm talking about with the scan(s) and then you must explain yourself because your reputation will then be on the line.
Bring it duke,
I challenge you to produce a scan, that conclusively states,
LT is restricted to One Multiverse.
Originally posted by h1a8
But at least you said that I got you with the "differences in universes" idea.
You haven't "gotten" me with anything.
I been knowing the scale of power of Other Universes is below that of the 616 Universe. (you never taught me that)
Originally posted by Mider999
you agree to easily, even the LT doesnt have power over certain things, he cant just always say he can do this and that, sometimes his judgements have been overridden even by dr strange, or at least he's been defied, his powers have even been copied where he needed help from a freaking celestial, there is no such thing as MARVELS omniverse not logically since omni means EVERYTHING meaning all universes including our own, marvel needs to get there definitions straight.
its easy to accept a fact, than argue over nonsense. living tribunal/scathan killed protege. no one else did. u try and figure me out, my stance is eternal, no one is above living tribunal save the one above all in marvel. i told ya before, i honor ur opinion. i have mine. it is that simple
Originally posted by Mr Master
What has Ultimator done that grants him all that praise?Respect the Living Tribunal!
This is how the Omniverse is described according to the OHOTMU v5 (2006)
"the REALMS with a Multiverse"
"Within the Omniverse, collections of associated REALMS from different Multiverses are referred to as Megaverses"So a Megaverse is a collection of Multi-verses. (and LT has TWO of them in one Hand)
Ok,
Now we have the Living Tribunal On Panel holding the embodiments of TWO Megaverses in his hand like the toys of a child.
"he sits at the CENTER of ALL things, feeling the flow of countless Realities, thier FATE irrevocably determined through the judgment rendered by HIS Three Faces"
"Two SIBLINGS whom the Tribunal has a place for in his great scheme of things""the Pulse of Creation reverberates through him, for he is its Heart, ALPHA & OMEGA revolve on the Wheel of Destiny, a Destiny SPUN by HIS mighty Hand"
"A Hand soon opening to allow TWO Brothers to assume their pre-destined Roles as Architects of New Realities ... and ONLY this Judge knows why"And it's ALL CANON, according to the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe v5 (2006)
"the Living Tribunal also helped fashion the twin Entities the BROTHERS, each of whom became the guardian of a different Megaverse, within the larger Omniverse but encompassing MORE than a single Multiverse"
I do not usually disagree with you Mr. Master, but the entire HOTU story arc completely contradicts what you are representing.
The HOTU ultimately made Thanos a multiverse, nothing more and nothing less, Thanos was then able to see the other countless multiverses just as like himself.
Now Thanos with the power of a multiverse was able to completely overpower and assimilate the LT.
This brings me to several thoughts;
1) Their is one LT for every multiverse
2) If their is only one LT for all the megaverse, then even though he can effortlessly traverse multiverses, he is not more powerful then one.
3) LT is akin to eternity, one LT per multiverse, but their is one overall LT for the Megaverse.
Originally posted by Board Walker
I do not usually disagree with you Mr. Master, but the entire HOTU story arc completely contradicts what you are representing.The HOTU ultimately made Thanos a multiverse, nothing more and nothing less, Thanos was then able to see the other countless multiverses just as like himself.
Now Thanos with the power of a multiverse was able to completely overpower and assimilate the LT.
This brings me to several thoughts;
1) Their is one LT for every multiverse
2) If their is only one LT for all the megaverse, then even though he can effortlessly traverse multiverses, he is not more powerful then one.
3) LT is akin to eternity, one LT per multiverse, but their is one overall LT for the Megaverse.
Originally posted by Mr Master
"the Living Tribunal also helped fashion the twin Entities the BROTHERS, each of whom became the guardian of a different Megaverse, within the larger Omniverse but encompassing MORE than a single Multiverse"That's why I know.
are you interpreting the 2 megaverses to be dc and marvel respectively?
Originally posted by Board Walker
I do not usually disagree with you Mr. Master, but the entire HOTU story arc completely contradicts what you are representing.
🙂
Originally posted by Board Walker
The HOTU ultimately made Thanos a multiverse, nothing more and nothing less, Thanos was then able to see the other countless multiverses just as like himself.Now Thanos with the power of a multiverse was able to completely overpower and assimilate the LT.
That's because that was the TOAA's plan all along,
to have Thanos recreate that Multiverse for whatever unfathomable reason.
Warlock tells Thanos, "You were chosen because of your WILL Titan"
Thanos is trying to find a way out of this, but Warlock lets him know better
"I am seeking that Proverbial Loophole"......
Thanos realizes, TOAA or "He" more specifically has him:
Originally posted by Board Walker
This brings me to several thoughts;
1) Their is one LT for every multiverse
There is One LT that exists simultaneously in ALL MultiverseS ...
Add this to my prior scans with the Two Megaverses in His Hand and it becomes Fact.
Originally posted by Board Walker
2) If their is only one LT for all the megaverse, then even though he can effortlessly traverse multiverses, he is not more powerful then one.
This isn't stated On Panel or in a Bio.
So we should stick to what has been established until further information is supplied by Marvel.
Originally posted by Board Walker
3) LT is akin to eternity, one LT per multiverse, but their is one overall LT for the Megaverse.
To avoid confusion, let's just deal with On Panel illustrations.
Originally posted by Mr Master
🙂That's because that was the TOAA's plan all along,
to have Thanos recreate that Multiverse for whatever unfathomable reason.
Warlock tells Thanos, "You were chosen because of your WILL Titan"
Thanos is trying to find a way out of this, but Warlock lets him know better
"I am seeking that Proverbial Loophole"......Thanos realizes, TOAA or "He" more specifically has him:
There is One LT that exists simultaneously in ALL MultiverseS ...
Add this to my prior scans with the Two Megaverses in His Hand and it becomes Fact.
This isn't stated On Panel or in a Bio.
So we should stick to what has been established until further information is supplied by Marvel.
To avoid confusion, let's just deal with On Panel illustrations.
I agree with most of what you say, except I do not agree that LT was only overcome because TOAA allowed it, it is the same as akin to saying the spectre is only defeated because the Source allows him to be.
From what was shown on panel, which is some thing I like very much about your debating style, it is not speculative for the most part.
What has been shown on panel is that the LT was overcome with the power of a multiverse, so though he may be claimed as the most powerful entity except for TOAA, going by on panel showings he is not.
Thats just my two cents.
