THe LT vs. Micheal the Arc Angel

Originally posted by illadelph12
I still find it puzzling that people consider LT being defeated by the HOTU, though it's said, or 'inferred', on panel, that it's sole purpose was for it to be used to destroy and recreate the 'universe' (or multiverse, depending on who you ask), as commissioned by TOAA itself, is supposed to somehow degrade LT's standing in the hierarchy. TOAA designated the HOTU with a specific purpose which was carried out, Thanos was simply the pawn TOAA used to carry out the purpose designated for the HOTU.

That's parallel to if The Presence empowered, say, Professor Chimp, with the power to recreate the DCU, and he did so, and in the process of doing so, he destroyed Michael, so somehow it degrades Michael's standing because the Presence provided the means to defeat Michael by granting Professor Chimp the power to fulfill a purpose of The Presence's will, whether by tricking Professor Chimp into doing so or my directly commissioning him to do so.

That line of reasoning is flawed.

Originally posted by Juntai
What about his other lower showings though, like the one mentioned of him needing the eye of agomotto to defeat a celestial,

I don't wanna use PIS as a cop out but,

that was PIS if I ever saw it.

Btw, the Celestial defeated a being that had supposedly absorbed LT's power.

Celestial > LT 😆

Originally posted by Juntai
or korvac,

LT disconnected an entire Universe from the Multiverse.

Low showing?

Death was involved in Korvac's survival.

Beyond that, LT's "ultimate Judgement" is not a Super Nova anymore, as it was in 1982 when that "What If" was published.

Originally posted by Juntai
or Reed blasting him with a canon in Last Planet Standing?

Not Canon, (in every sense of the word)

that was a goof issue.

Where a Writer is allowed to go rogue, and make up whatever nonsense he wishes.

Originally posted by Juntai
He has some low showings, despite HOTI.

Not really.

Eh, Korvac wasn't a low showing. LT blew up the sun and Korvac survived the resultant explosion, either by his own power or by Death's power (it's not clearly depicted how). I can name numerous characters that can survive a supernova. It's a non feat. LT didn't directly apply his power to Korvac, and when he did directly apply his power, he sealed off an entire universe.

The Reed Richards feat is also a non-feat also. Reed had invented a machine that uses the targets own energies against itself. LT was beaten by LT's own power, not Reed's. Why he'd stand there and allow it to happen though is beyond me. It's like a Green Lantern resorting to throwing punches or Flash being hit.

Originally posted by illadelph12
I still find it puzzling that people consider LT being defeated by the HOTU, though it's said, or 'inferred', on panel, that it's sole purpose was for it to be used to destroy and recreate the 'universe' (or multiverse, depending on who you ask), as commissioned by TOAA itself, is supposed to somehow degrade LT's standing in the hierarchy. TOAA designated the HOTU with a specific purpose which was carried out, Thanos was simply the pawn TOAA used to carry out the purpose designated for the HOTU.

That's parallel to if The Presence empowered, say, Professor Chimp, with the power to recreate the DCU, and he did so, and in the process of doing so, he destroyed Michael, so somehow it degrades Michael's standing because the Presence provided the means to defeat Michael by granting Professor Chimp the power to fulfill a purpose of The Presence's will, whether by tricking Professor Chimp into doing so or my directly commissioning him to do so.

That line of reasoning is flawed.

I have also said this in my posts.
It was basically GOD's power, not even close to a bad feat.

Also, Mr Master, I would continue, but the argument was/would still be just a circular argument going nowhere (as you can see, if you look back). Quite pointless, now actually.
I believe what I want, and you can believe what you want.
"Universe"
😛

Anyway... Micheal wins.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
I'm with bigbran, it was stated a couple of times that it was just one universe, and none that they refered to the multiverse.

And you got it wrong, bw.

It's not necesserly:
Omniversal > Multiversal > Universal

Abraxas defeating Roma (the omniversal guardian for example)

And im with both of you.

It was stated point blank that it was just universe Thanos became supreme over with HOTI and it was just the universe he destroyed and recreated. I showed multiple scans, from different issues of both Thanos and A. Warlock stating the point. The handbook states it as well, its canon. However some people value their opinion more than whats actually presented as canon by Marvel. If following someones argument means you have to ignore whats clearly and directly stated and illustrated on panel in favour of opinion and speculation then that is an argument i personally would avoid like the plague. 🙂

Youre right about a multiversal being not necessarily being greater in power than a universal being. People often mistake role with power. They dont necessarily come together. Roma is the omniversal guardian in role, however power wise she is no greater than the abstracts of any given universe.

Its good to see some people out there actually analyse and critique the arguments presented here instead of just swallowing them because theyre saturated with scans and a brash delivery. 🙂

Keep up the good work. 😉

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
It was stated point blank that it was just universe Thanos became supreme over with HOTI and it was just the universe he destroyed and recreated. I showed multiple scans, from different issues of both Thanos and A. Warlock stating the point. The handbook states it as well, its canon.

😆

This Bio site is Officially APPROVED by Marvel,

www.marvunapp.com

Marvel even directs Official Handbook readers to it,

for extra information and even corrections can be found to Handbook Errors

(from the Official Marvel Universe Handbook 2006)

Look at what I found!

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix3/celestialorderthanos.htm#Heart

"Thanos foiled efforts to stop his plan by Eternity, the Living Tribunal etc ... but he also Obliterated the Multiverse in the process"

"Thanos did so, using the Heart's power to Re-Create the Multiverse bereft of the flaw that would have destroyed it"

So I was right from the beginning, it was the Multiverse Thanos Absorbed.

yawn

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
However some people value their opinion more than whats actually presented as canon by Marvel. If following someones argument means you have to ignore whats clearly and directly stated and illustrated on panel in favour of opinion and speculation then that is an argument i personally would avoid like the plague.

In which case you should avoid yourself at all cost. 🙄

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Youre right about a multiversal being not necessarily being greater in power than a universal being. People often mistake role with power. They dont necessarily come together. Roma is the omniversal guardian in role, however power wise she is no greater than the abstracts of any given universe.

😂

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Its good to see some people out there actually analyse and critique the arguments presented here instead of just swallowing them because theyre saturated with scans and a brash delivery.

You belittle those that disagree with you, and swallow the children of those that agree with you. 😕

You should run for office someday,

a bigger sell out I have never encountered.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Keep up the good work.

I wonder if they know they're being patronized.

Originally posted by Mr Master
😆

This Bio site is Officially APPROVED by Marvel,

www.marvunapp.com

[B] Marvel even directs Official Handbook readers to it,

for extra information and even corrections can be found to Handbook Errors

(from the Official Marvel Universe Handbook 2006)

Look at what I found!

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix3/celestialorderthanos.htm#Heart

"Thanos foiled efforts to stop his plan by Eternity, the Living Tribunal etc ... but he also Obliterated the Multiverse in the process"

"Thanos did so, using the Heart's power to Re-Create the Multiverse bereft of the flaw that would have destroyed it"

So I was right from the beginning, it was the Multiverse Thanos Absorbed.

yawn

In which case you should avoid yourself at all cost. 🙄

😂

You belittle those that disagree with you, and swallow the children of those that agree with you. 😕

You should run for office someday,

a bigger sell out I have never encountered.

I wonder if they know they're being patronized. [/B]

Worthless post. On each of the marvunapp bios they have e-mail links for the public to e-mail them corrections to their bios. Marvunapp does NOT dictate continuity, it summarizes it. What dictates continuity are the comics.

Not only is that line in marvunapp completely contradicted ON PANEL, but the same makers of that site wrote a completely different thing within the actual handbook that is based off of that site. The handbooks It would seem they revised their stance. 🙂

Your argument is in tatters 👇

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Not only is that line in marvunapp completely contradicted ON PANEL, but the same makers of that site wrote a completely different thing within the actual handbook that is based off of that site.

On Panel Thanos Absorbed the Multiverse, and this was certified in the Official Marvel Bio.

I always knew he did, from the first time I read the End.

Right here:

Thanos absorbs LT - Eternity/Infinity - Cosmics - All the Celestials .... on and on ...

And Thanos never stopped

Read

"For IF this BAND (the Living Tribunal, ETERNITY/INFINITY) Could Defy Me ... might not OTHERS be equally Foolish?"

"Could I ALLOW ANY to question my divine AUTHORITY?"

"NO .... So I CONTINUED to Absorb ALL that MIGHT THREATEN my REIGN ... Until ....

"Nothing Remained"

SO,

(AFTER absorbing the Living Tribunal - Eternity/Infinity - the ENTIRE Race of Celestials - all the Cosmics - Heroes and even some Villains of this "One Universe"😉

THE Unaswerable QUESTIONS?

WHAT Others Might be equally foolish?

WHO else COULD question his AUTHORITY?

WHO else can THREATEN his REIGN?

In this "Single Universe?" dontgetit

No one, was able to give a logical response.

That's because there is none if you try and keep it Universal.

OBVIOUSLY, Thanos is referring to existence OUTSIDE this One Universe.

Like Other Eternitys, rest of Abstracts and Alternates in OTHER Universes.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
The handbooks It would seem they revised their stance

Interesting,

and yet the Handbook is the one directing it's Readers to this website:

For Corrections made in Handbook ERRORS!!! 😂

(from the Official Marvel Universe Handbook 2006)

Do you hear your opinion being flushed down a toilet?

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Your argument is in tatters

I think not.

Now this is having one's arguments in "tatters"

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=4816634&highlight=TOAA+source+phoenix#post4816634

Anyone interested in the Agenda in this cat's eyes,

visit here ... you will Laugh no doubt.

You'll see claims of Phoenix being the power of creation

to Phoenix being "the Power of TOAA" hysterical2

😱 ... I'm not kidding.

Sorry to burst your bubble but marvunapp does not dictate canon. What dictates canon is the handbooks and most significantly whats occurs and is stated on panel. The handbooks writers (who you can speak to on comicxfan) and the marvunapp site will be the first to tell you that they aren’t always right which is why there is an option in both the handbooks and on every profile of marvunapp to contact the contributors and let them know of any discrepancies.

Handbook entries aren’t necessarily infallible and in cases where you can find instanceS on panel which contradict a handbook entry then what is established on panel takes precedence. The handbooks summarize what happens on panel, they do NOT dictate continuity.

In any case, the handbook entries pertaining to Thanos’ actions in The End say nothing of a multiverse, but instead of Thanos recreating a universe:

“The recreated UNIVERSE”

First off stop speculating. You dont know Thanos absorbed the entire race of Celestials. That point was neither stated or depicted on panel.

The handful of cosmics and heroes Thanos beat down believe it or not account for a minute percentage of all powers and civilizations within the universe. I think thats safe to assume Mr Master.

So Thanos saying "others might be equally foolish" and him continuing to absorb all that might threaten his reign could quite feasibly be referring to the rest of the universe and NOT the rest of the multiverse as you have unjustifiably asserted

Either way in the very same issue just a few pages later Adam Warlock appears and THANOS refers to how he destroyed just a universe:

“Only you could miss the end of the UNIVERSE”

“That is how the UNIVERSE came to an end”

At the end of that same issue:

“I can sense the UNIVERSE resuming its full glory and scope”

(I take it Thanos decided to ignore the rest of the multiverse he apparently destroyed at some point off panel)

In Thanos own title that came after “The End” it was stated many a time by Thanos on separate occasions that he destroyed and recreated just the UNIVERSE

Thanos #1:

“The first day of my reign ended with me destroying the entire UNIVERSE”

“The mantle of supremacy was tossed aside. The UNIVERSE was resurrected with no memory of its demise”

Thanos#2

“I even happened upon Thanos during his brief stint as THIS ACTUALITYS supreme being and witnessed him forsake that might to right a perilous imbalance in the UNIVERSE”

Going by LT’s bio and multiple issues where the debated point is stated by both Adam Warlock and THANOS ON PANEL, Thanos destroyed and recreated just a universe as can be interpreted from the art and as stated point blank in the issue it happened in.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
First off stop speculating. You dont know Thanos absorbed the entire race of Celestials. That point was neither stated or depicted on panel.

The handful of cosmics and heroes Thanos beat down believe it or not account for a minute percentage of all powers and civilizations within the universe. I think thats safe to assume Mr Master.

So Thanos saying "others might be equally foolish" and him continuing to absorb all that might threaten his reign could quite feasibly be referring to the rest of the universe and NOT the rest of the multiverse as you have unjustifiably asserted

Either way in the very same issue just a few pages later Adam Warlock appears and THANOS refers to how he destroyed just a universe:

“Only you could miss the end of the UNIVERSE”

“That is how the UNIVERSE came to an end”

At the end of that same issue:

“I can sense the UNIVERSE resuming its full glory and scope”

(I take it Thanos decided to ignore the rest of the multiverse he apparently destroyed at some point off panel)

In Thanos own title that came after “The End” it was stated many a time by Thanos on separate occasions that he destroyed and recreated just the UNIVERSE

Thanos #1:

“The first day of my reign ended with me destroying the entire UNIVERSE”

“The mantle of supremacy was tossed aside. The UNIVERSE was resurrected with no memory of its demise”

Thanos#2

“I even happened upon Thanos during his brief stint as THIS ACTUALITYS supreme being and witnessed him forsake that might to right a perilous imbalance in the UNIVERSE”

Going by LT’s bio and multiple issues where the debated point is stated by both Adam Warlock and THANOS ON PANEL, Thanos destroyed and recreated just a universe as can be interpreted from the art and as stated point blank in the issue it happened in.

Dam GS your on fire today keep up the good work 😮‍💨.

Originally posted by Mr Master

Do you hear your opinion being flushed down a toilet?

You dont have the capacity for that feat 😄

Originally posted by Mr Master
Now this is having one's arguments in "tatters"

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=4816634&highlight=TOAA+source+phoenix#post4816634

Anyone interested in the Agenda in this cat's eyes,

visit here ... you will Laugh no doubt.

You'll see claims of Phoenix being the power of creation

to Phoenix being "the Power of TOAA" hysterical2

😱 ... I'm not kidding.

A line of thinking i abandoned over a year and a half ago my friend. Posting it here is cowardly and really rather despicable because:

a) It was done out of spite because being unable to out debate through comparable skill or with conclusive evidence to hand you seek to attack my credibility

b) It was only a few weeks back you were arguing that the Beyonder was GREATER than TOAA, 😱 this is despite the fact that he had his powers stolen by Doom and he got overwhelmed by Rachels sensory capacity 🤨

Big hypocrite 😬

Despicable debator 🙄

Waste of damn time 😂

Originally posted by Supreme being
Dam GS your on fire today keep up the good work 😮‍💨.

Thank you 🙂

I just hate people twisting the facts and deceiving people all in an effort to have everyone subscribe to their comic fantasies. ❌

Its really quite sad 😬

Mr. M has proof that it was affecting the Multiverse ...

--

Originally posted by Board Walker
[B]
That the HOTU only made Thanos one full universe (a purple sphere, as Dr. Strange confirmed them to be universes in prior comics) and nothing more.

That role is not equated with power, the LT is the megaversal guardian but he does not have megaversal power.

I agree with Mr. Masters. Why would Thanos make the statement below?

"For IF this BAND (the Living Tribunal, ETERNITY/INFINITY) Could Defy Me ... might not OTHERS be equally Foolish?"

"Could I ALLOW ANY to question my divine AUTHORITY?"

"NO .... So I CONTINUED to Absorb ALL that MIGHT THREATEN my REIGN ... Until .... "Nothing Remained"

What else was left in the universe for Thanos to absorb? If he had absorbed the divine authority of the universe, who else is left to threaten his power? Answer, being the abstracts of outside universes.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thank you 🙂

I just hate people twisting the facts and deceiving people all in an effort to have everyone subscribe to their comic fantasies. ❌

Its really quite sad 😬

He's right though. 😬

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Multiverse, my child ...

Omniversal, my child

Universe, as it has been proven.

Originally posted by Soujaboy
He's right though. 😬

MR. M isn't right.

It is shown on panel, multiple times that is was exactly one universe and nothing more.

Just as I have said from the begining.