Official WWE Thread

Originally posted by Sado22
please. Austin can't carry a dead cat. he just has overwhelming persona and his character is adored by the whole world. the same as hogan. all these two (and Rock) have to do is make an appearance and everyone starts getting orgasms just watching them. Austin was never a great wrester, neither were Rock and Hogan. but these guys can get the crowd behind them even when they are just throwing a punch. guys like HHH, HBK, Angle, Benoit etc don't have that luxury so they wind up doing all the work without them being mentioned in the match. that's the sad truth. performance wise, Trips is better than Rock, Austin and Hogan combined. those three don't have the kind of endurance, ability and the way HHH carries other people. they jsut come for their money, pose, and leave. that's not wrestling passion, that's making money. oh, and how many times did Trips drop the ball to these three? he took the worse bumps for them, dropped the title to them, carried them to good matches and made them look good. heck, he dropped the title to Rocky Mavia back in 1997 😘

Endurance is a bullshit criteria.

Matches last as long as they have to. The Rock was in an Iron Man match with Triple H.

Triple H doesn't carry anybody. Well, maybe now. Cos everyone's shit. He's never carried any of the big stars, ever. They were all big stars and then Triple H came after.

Who are you to say those people do not have passion for the business? They worked most of the year, for many years. Night in, night out. Stop being an idiot.

Originally posted by Sado22
long list. way too long. name me someone who carried trips. Rock? austin? Hogan? Foley? 😂

Foley was the one who made Triple H's current character believable. It was Foley's ability to make the OTHER guy look brutal that made Triple H's brutality believable.

Same applies to The Rock at Royal Rumble 1999. Undertaker at King of the Ring 1998.

Originally posted by Sado22
Trips carried THEM because he pulled out a great match out of them when they had critics blaming them for not being able to wrestle. Austin and Rock have both been criticized for lack of wrestling and more gimmick even in their prime. pick up a WWE magazine from their era and you'd see that wrestling critics always panned their in-ring performance. esp, the Rock. and despite being a WWE wrestling fan since 1994, I've never heard a critic say that Trips in-ring performance is "limited". so please, kill the noise.

Hahahaha. The Rock was already a proven I.C. Champ when Triple H was coming up. They BOTH made great television during the DX/Nation gang wars days.

They BOTH worked a great match at Summerslam 1998, which made Triple H noticeable, but The Rock had already had great matches. Triple H was never established enough to carry any of these people since they were all OVER before him.

Summerslam 1998, The Rock and Triple H were cementing their status as FUTURE upper-carders while Austin was having one of the best WWE title matches ever, with the Undertaker.

Triple H didn't CARRY anybody, he is, if anything, the last of that crop of stars to get over.

Originally posted by Sado22
Goldberg sucked. i'll never forgive the prick for ending Bret Hart's career. Bret was a good wrestler...it's just when little kids call him the best there is that i get annoyed. cuz he aint. and he wears pink tights.

Funny, because Bret is over it. It was an accident. What right do YOU have to not "forgive" him? He didn't intend it.

He was the reason WCW kept beating the WWE in ratings for 86 straight weeks. Him and the nWo.

Originally posted by Sado22
like i said, list is way too long. some of the best angles, matches etc had trips in them. since all the way back in 1997. Flair match with HBK was good because of HBK. HBK carried his ass like only he can. same reason why he carried Hogan to a decent match. only thing this shows is that HBK is a better performer than HHH......and no one's ever denied that anyway. Trips=brawler/technical. HBK=speed/highflier/technical/speed

The funny thing is, you're calling them technical...but what "technical" ability do they have?

They're not in there pulling off intricate moves. They're spot machines. Just not obvious spot machines as say, Rey Mysterio. Triple H has the facebuster, the high knee, the spinebuster. He does all of these, then Pedigree. What else? Punches and fighting in between. He's no more a better technical wrestler than any of the others you named against him.

You keep accusing these people of being carried, but they outdate Triple H. They were carrying people and having great matches before HBK and Triple H.

WHY do you think they kept making Triple H fight these people that YOU claim he was carrying? Because they wanted Triple H to be put over by the legends, so HE would seem better.

Do you not see how the business works?

Originally posted by Sado22
i just told you. the crowd's always easier to get behind ANYTHING rock does because of his gimmick. its just how it is. same as Austin who comes and does awkward looking stunners, that are sold bad and executed worse, does some sloppy ground stomps and sloppyass clotheslines........and the crowd just easts it up. it doesn't mean his in-ring performance is good or that he's carrying the other dude. the crowd just gets into the match easier. same with Rock. same as Hogan. they just need to be there for the ratings to go high. and NO ONE ever claimed that Trips is a bigger star than these three. you're missing the point completely. its easier for these three to draw in a good match rating because the crowds behind it automaticaly. but all it takes is good wrestling knowledge to know that these guys can't infact wrestle. something critics are unanimous about.

more to come soon...

That's what it's about, though. This is not the UFC.

The person who gets the crowd the absolute most excited, draws the most ratings and earns the most fans, that is who is best for the company.

I don't watch wrestling for the technicality alone, because technicality doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if you're a better wrestler than your opponent, because what matters is if you're entertaining the crowd. That's who wins.

Shelton Benjamin is one of the best technical wrestlers they have, he's going nowhere.

Austin returning from the bar to help Team WWF was one of the single most exciting moments in the company's history. You sit there and say "He didn't do anything.", but that's the point.

His music hit and that's it, the crowd went nuts. He got the biggest reaction at Wrestlemania 25. He's the biggest merch seller ever, or one of.

He never needed to be carried. The only carrying HE did was the company itself. Not Triple H, not anyone else. When the WWE needed to beat WCW, they created Austin and he carried them to the finish.

-AC

thats the glory with austin though... he'd get out wrestled and would hapily admit it, but his matches were entertaining and his character was carried over well, but i feel the same about triple h. you either like people or you dont, simple as.

can someone injure batista again please?

Originally posted by Sado22
foley takes bumps to make EVERYONE look good. like the Rock can carry someone. please mate, the dude can't wrestle if his life depended on it. he's just fun to watch with all the 'power ranger" crap Rock does just to land a slap.

Originally posted by Sado22
long list. way too long.

Originally posted by Sado22
name me someone who carried trips. Rock? austin? Hogan? Foley? 😂
Trips carried THEM because he pulled out a great match out of them when they had critics blaming them for not being able to wrestle. Austin and Rock have both been criticized for lack of wrestling and more gimmick even in their prime. pick up a WWE magazine from their era and you'd see that wrestling critics always panned their in-ring performance. esp, the Rock. and despite being a WWE wrestling fan since 1994, I've never heard a critic say that Trips in-ring performance is "limited". so please, kill the noise.

@AC-Goldberg showed up after WWE had started kicking WCW's ass IIRC. He was a lame attempt @ putting them back over. That accident was caused by Bill never really knowing how to work a good match. He was green as hell

Is there a wrestling vs thread on kmc?

Matches last as long as they have to. The Rock was in an Iron Man match with Triple H.

Triple H doesn't carry anybody. Well, maybe now. Cos everyone's shit. He's never carried any of the big stars, ever. They were all big stars and then Triple H came after.

Who are you to say those people do not have passion for the business? They worked most of the year, for many years. Night in, night out. Stop being an idiot

hogan was'nt desperate for money when he came back to wwe, he really does love wrestling. he could make money doing all sorts. he WAS apparantly being lined up to fight john cena for teh heavyweight title at wrestlemania to try and recreate the rock hogan atmosphere(wouldnt be anywhere near as good but still) but he had to have back surgery so the story was scrapped.

Hogan vs Cena.

Worst match ever. 😐

hogan was'nt desperate for money when he came back to wwe, he really does love wrestling. he could make money doing all sorts. he WAS apparantly being lined up to fight john cena for teh heavyweight title at wrestlemania to try and recreate the rock hogan atmosphere(wouldnt be anywhere near as good but still) but he had to have back surgery so the story was scrapped.

Originally posted by Sado22
whats your point?

then watch those matches again. Austin etc NEVER carried trips cuz they can barely wrestle themselves. last technical match Austin had was his first match against HBK.

So you dodged a WHOLE lot.

What's technical about HHH? He does three spots then the rest is punching. No more than Austin or The Rock.

Originally posted by Sado22
i'm trying to be polite here so why don't you cut the smart talk and kill the disses. who am i to say? i'm the WWE fan these guys are working for. Austin, Rock, Hogan go where the money is, esp Rock and Hogan. going to hollywood isn't my idea of loving the business. people like HBK, Taker etc never went to the movies even though there lots of money in it. look at there career. all they ever wanted was money that's why they never improved their in-ring performance. of course, Austin was limited more by his neck than anything but to say Rock and Hogan "love the business" more than money is really stretching things.

The Rock was 100x better when he came back to wrestling AFTER movies. It made him a much better showman.

Your argument fails.

You are NOBODY to say how much they love the business.

Fact is, they were wrestlers before they were rich. Hogan was wrestling in shit places and shit territories before he got famous. Austin dropped his career in construction, I believe, to RISK everything in becoming a wrestler.

You have no place to say that.

-AC

Originally posted by Sado22
think of it as this way:
hogan may love wrestling a lot but he is ultimately where the money is. he probably is passionate about it but ultimately his priority is making money not wrestling. that's what i'm trying to say. people like Trips, HBK etc never really jump ship to Hollywood but Hogan, Rock and Austin did. hence, i get a skeptical when they say they love the business. the may love it but it's not the love of their life 😄

I dont see how you can say Austin jumped ship. His last match was in 2003 vs the Rock. He physically couldn't wreslte without the risk of ending up in a wheel chair due to his neck. And he kept making on and off appearances in the WWE since then. Hell his first movie the Condemned was a WWE film. Austin's turn to hollywood isnt comparable to the Rock's or hogan.

I dont see how you can say Austin jumped ship. His last match was in 2003 vs the Rock. He physically couldn't wreslte without the risk of ending up in a wheel chair due to his neck. And he kept making on and off appearances in the WWE since then. Hell his first movie the Condemned was a WWE film. Austin's turn to hollywood isnt comparable to the Rock's or hogan.

What's technical about HHH? He does three spots then the rest is punching. No more than Austin or The Rock

Originally posted by Sado22
HHH can pull off more complex sets of moves than Rock or Austin ever have. ever seen those two pull off a move like the indian deathlock? he's not that technical but he's got more moves than those two.

Failure.

1) Any wrestler can be taught those moves. Kids pull those moves off when playing with friends. Triple H doing it, what, five times, doesn't make him a better wrestler. Even so, he doesn't regularly use it.

2) I asked you what was technical about him. If someone asked you what was technical about Angle, you could list billions of things.

What is more technical about Triple H? I don't want "can" or "has". I want lists of things he does night in, night out, that prove he is this wrestler that's massively more technical than Austin or The Rock.

The Rock does the Sharpshooter, for one. That requires more actions than the Indian deathlock.

Either way, let's list:

Austin: Lou Thez press, diving elbow, corner stomps with middle finger. These are his main spots.

The Rock: Punches and exaggerated punch, big flying clothesline, Sharpshooter, spinning DDT. HIS main spots.

Triple H: High knee, facebuster, spinebuster.

He has as many spots as the rest of them, less. What else does he do that puts him above them? He BARELY ever used the Indian deathlock, and that's not a technical move, it's simple. Anyone can do it. You could do it. Austin has used the sleeperhold more than Triple H has used the Indian deathlock.

So now, you've got yourself into an argument you can't win.

How he is more technical? I don't want guesses. I want actual, factual proof.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yes, and how does he punish his body? By putting people over and letting them batter him.

"OH MY GOD! TRIPLE H IS BRUTAL! HE'S EVIL!". He wouldn't have seemed HALF as calculating or brutal if Foley didn't let him seem that way. Fact.

As for the hear say; Triple H won his first title during his time with The Corporation, he was already in great favour with Steph.

Passion? The man doesn't HAVE to work hard. He is always going to either have the title or be fighting for the title.

Let me ask you this; if he split with Steph, do you believe he would still have this level of status?

He'd be on Heat fighting Funaki before you can say "Ironic burial".

He is a 13 or 14 time champion. That's two less than Ric Flair and it's all happened in the past 10 years. Flair is a 16 time champion based on a career much, much longer.

You're gonna tell me this is because Triple H is good enough? There have been plenty of people who could carry the strap. I'm not even saying Triple H shouldn't have won the title, at one point he was brilliant (Mostly cos he was having great matches with Foley, or in his earlier career, The Rock and then Austin). However, he has buried people.

Goldberg, fair enough. He wasn't staying anyway, but he was still better.

Steiner, fine. Wasn't helping himself and performed like shit, nothing like his WCW days.

Booker T, RVD, Kane etc. He's buried them all.

-AC

In case you havent noticed, Hunter too got injured at the garden though not as much as Foley. Nobody was calling Hunter brutal to my knowledge either but he was a great heel. Also how do you KNOW where he would be if he "wasn't" dating Steph? Are you the Nostradamus of wrestling? you make it seem fact that he would be nowhere having the strap around his waist in his career. Though I hate to admit his being 14 time champ does have something to do the Mcmahons(without question)

Oh I-drop I was the one who mentioned Hunter vs Rock at Judgement Day in an Iron Match with Shawn as the special referee. Plus his match against Austin at No Way Out. So I gave two matches.

Originally posted by P-Geyser
In case you havent noticed, Hunter too got injured at the garden though not as much as Foley. Nobody was calling Hunter brutal to my knowledge either but he was a great heel. Also how do you KNOW where he would be if he "wasn't" dating Steph? Are you the Nostradamus of wrestling? you make it seem fact that he would be nowhere having the strap around his waist in his career. Though I hate to admit his being 14 time champ does have something to do the Mcmahons(without question)

Oh I-drop I was the one who mentioned Hunter vs Rock at Judgement Day in an Iron Match with Shawn as the special referee. Plus his match against Austin at No Way Out. So I gave two matches.

You are biased toward Triple H, fact.

"I hate to admit...", why? Cos it's Triple H.

-AC

Originally posted by Sado22
that's why i didn't mention him in that paragraph 😄
i was talking about rock and hogan because Austin actually has a real reason not to be wrestling again.

Actually in the paragraph I quoted, you did.....

Originally posted by Sado22
think of it as this way:
hogan may love wrestling a lot but he is ultimately where the money is. he probably is passionate about it but ultimately his priority is making money not wrestling. that's what i'm trying to say. people like Trips, HBK etc never really jump ship to Hollywood but Hogan, Rock and Austin did. hence, i get a skeptical when they say they love the business. the may love it but it's not the love of their life 😄

Maybe I read it wrong but you cleared up your point.

You are biased toward Triple H, fact.

1) Any wrestler can be taught those moves. Kids pull those moves off when playing with friends. Triple H doing it, what, five times, doesn't make him a better wrestler. Even so, he doesn't regularly use it.

2) I asked you what was technical about him. If someone asked you what was technical about Angle, you could list billions of things.

What is more technical about Triple H? I don't want "can" or "has". I want lists of things he does night in, night out, that prove he is this wrestler that's massively more technical than Austin or The Rock.

that answers your question.
and again, never said he was technical. he's an overall better wrestler than Rock and Austin and Hogan for a wide number of reasons mentioned above.

The Rock does the Sharpshooter, for one. That requires more actions than the Indian deathlock.

Austin: Lou Thez press, diving elbow, corner stomps with middle finger. These are his main spots.

The Rock: Punches and exaggerated punch, big flying clothesline, Sharpshooter, spinning DDT. HIS main spots.

Triple H: High knee, facebuster, spinebuster.

How he is more technical? I don't want guesses. I want actual, factual proof.

~Sado

Rock can wrestle up or down to his level of competition. & he can carry people when needed. Cripple H can't. Trips ISN'T fun to watch & he does the same old shit all the time.

Damn, Sado. You used to be waaay better @dodging questions. I just want you to name a few. Give me 3 "best" matches he's been in since 2002 or admit that he ain't really done good work since the Ironman match that AC was kind enough to point out. The match was pretty good. AC's doing a better job @ defending Crips than you are. PG gave us a HHH match that I'm looking @now. Don't be the one to pussy out Sado. Give us some of these "best" matches.

here:

Pro Wrestling Illustrated
PWI Feud of the Year (2000)[90] vs. Kurt Angle
PWI Feud of the Year (2004)[90] vs. Chris Benoit
PWI Match of the Year (2004)[91] vs. Shawn Michaels and Chris Benoit at WrestleMania
PWI Most Hated Wrestler of the Year (2003–2005)[92]
PWI ranked him # 1 of the top 500 singles wrestlers in the PWI 500 in 2000[93]
PWI Wrestler of the Year (2008)
World Wrestling Federation / World Wrestling Entertainment
WWF/E Championship (8 times, current)[94]
WWF European Championship (2 times)[95]
WWF/E Intercontinental Championship (5 times)[96]
WWF Tag Team Championship (1 time) – with Stone Cold Steve Austin[97]
World Heavyweight Championship (5 times)[98]
King of the Ring (1997)[3]
Royal Rumble (2002)[99]
Second Grand Slam Championship
Slammy Award for Best Hair (1997)
Seventh Triple Crown Champion
Wrestling Observer Newsletter awards
Feud of the Year (2000) vs. Mick Foley
Feud of the Year (2004) vs. Shawn Michaels and Chris Benoit
Feud of the Year (2005) vs. Batista
Wrestler of the Year (2000)
Wrestling Observer Newsletter Hall of Fame (Class of 2005)

PWI said that he was limited in the ring(& they LIKE him). Going to find more trips critics now

~Sado

My major problem with Triple H is that he keeps a lot of the young and deserving talent down... Guys like Shelton Benjamin...

Other than that, he's a good wrestler who puts on solid matches and has charisma on the mic...

My major problem with Triple H is that he keeps a lot of the young and deserving talent down... Guys like Shelton Benjamin.

Other than that, he's a good wrestler who puts on solid matches and has charisma on the mic...

~Sado

Originally posted by Sado22
you are biased against triple h, right? 😕

How? By not thinking he's more technical and less of a spot machine than they people you wrongly put him above? No.

Originally posted by Sado22
and they STILL don't. what does that tell ya? 😉

Nothing, because it means nothing, does it? Acknowledge the point. Him doing that move doesn't mean a thing. It's not a shooting star press, it's a simple move and anyone can be taught it. The fact that The Rock and Austin have not done it does not mean a thing as a result.

Originally posted by Sado22
i don't recall calling trips technical.

He's no more technical than The Rock or Austin. He has as many spots.

Originally posted by Sado22
-trips isn't sloppy like Austin

Austin isn't "sloppy".

Originally posted by Sado22
-doesn't do crap power ranger gimmicks to sel moves like Rock does

You mean...he doesn't do stuff that the crowd absolutely love, despite it not being the most elegant? True. People love The Rock way more than Triple H, that's why he's better. Triple H got ONE great reaction his whole career, and that's when he returned from injury.

Originally posted by Sado22
-isn't stiff like Hogan

Isn't as entertaining as Hogan either.

Originally posted by Sado22
-he does proper wrestling moves unlike Austin who does a drunken brawl

Hahaha, you do NOT understand the business. The moves he does can be done by ANYBODY. That is what you're forgetting. The moves Triple H does that Austin doesn't do, Austin and ANYBODY could do, if taught.

Originally posted by Sado22
-actually has a finisher that hurts unlike Rock or Hogan

Hahaha, your arguments are pathetic.

It doesn't matter if it hurts, it's wrestling. Also, I LOVE the hypocritical nature of your argument. You say Goldberg is an ass for doing moves that hurt for real, but you praise Triple H for it. You're a fool who has no arguments.

Originally posted by Sado22
-he executes his moves perfectly instead of a) doing powerranger gimmicks b) doing it horribly (name me the last time Austin landed a proper stunner on anyone) c) isn't a no-seller like hogan d) can actually do more than 3 moves if his life depends on it

The "Power Ranger" gimmicks, which I assume you mean over-selling, ISN'T RELEVANT here, you idiot. We're discussing who is a better wrestler. The Rock and Austin cared more about entertaining the crowd, and they did so more successfully than Triple H can ever hope to be.

Austin's Stunners relied on the OTHER guy, so it's not his fault.

You keep coming back to this "More than three moves" shit. ANYONE can do those moves. Austin did them in WCW and ECW. His CHARACTER was being a no nonsense brawler. It's not that he COULDN'T, it's that he DIDN'T. Big Show can do moonsaults, he doesn't cos that's not his character.

Originally posted by Sado22
that answers your question.
and again, never said he was technical. he's an overall better wrestler than Rock and Austin and Hogan for a wide number of reasons mentioned above.

Well, you're wrong. You're an uneducated boy who doesn't understand how characters work.

Originally posted by Sado22
not really. SS is a single fluid motion: leg takedown, put leg between legs, twist and sit on the opponents back. IDL is more complicated than that. fail.

Indian deathlock is putting your foot over, falling back and grabbing the head. Triple H didn't even bridge when he did it. You know nothing about wrestling. All you're coming up with is bs arguments.

Originally posted by Sado22
you're actually counting middlefinger stomps as a move?

It's a spot. Do you know what a spot is? Hmm?

Originally posted by Sado22
okay trips has double leg spinebuster, spear, ground and pound, knee faceplant, hard clothesline, indian deathlock, figure four, fury punches, running knee, backbreaker and DDT. these are all moves he tends to do in a match. all his spots.

I knew you'd slip into the trap.

I said spinebuster, I said faceplant (Facebuster), I said running knee/high knee.

So let's look, hard clothesline? Hahaha. The Rock did that. ANYONE can do that. That's what you are missing. ANYONE can do any of those moves you listed. Triple H doing them doesn't make him a better wrestler.

Also, how are you gonna pick on Austin's cornerstomp, but suggest Triple H's ground and pound/fury punches? You're a hypocrite and a fool.

He doesn't even do the Figure Four anymore.

They are NOT his spots. Spots are moves done EVERY match. YOU could do all of those moves, so are YOU a better wrestler than Triple H? People on amateur backyard wrestling videos do shit like that. Your argument that it makes Triple H a better wrestler is wrong as a result. Proven. All you proved is that he has a larger move set. So what? Doesn't prove a thing. If they wanted Austin to do all those, he could. The only reason he doesn't is based on character.

Originally posted by Sado22
you forgot the spit-in-hand-waste-time-oversold-slap and lets not forgot the highly innovative Rock Stomp=shake-a-leg-stomp

People cheer louder for those than for Triple H in general. Cos he sucks.

Originally posted by Sado22
you missed spear, ddt, knee faceplant, ground n pound,backbreaker and his hard clothesline

I didn't, I mentioned the ones HE uses alone. Not moves everyone else uses. I dealt with all this above, you desperate child.

Originally posted by Sado22
that satisfies you?

~Sado

Well no. You're 100% factually wrong, as I've proven.

Now, make like a good pet and start replying so I can tear apart your replies again, or save yourself the time and be an adult; realise where you're going wrong.

-AC