Darthgoober's Amalgam Tourney discussion thread

Originally posted by leonidas
well, he would need an oppenents 'soul' (though that in itself is enormously debateable . . .) so clearly it couldn't be done in a 'vacuum', but it could be done by BK alone -- that is, it is not the amalgam's combination of abilities that is ALLOWING him to 'amp'. so technically it IS just BK himself.

Yeah, it's really just a clarification of the ruling on goob's part, because we've defined the parameters but can't go any further from here.

Also, I'd totally just start debating that people don't have souls if I were facing NJ....it would be the quirkiest debate ever, but fun.

😛

My amalgam doesn't have a soul. ermmhappy

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Yeah, it's really just a clarification of the ruling on goob's part, because we've defined the parameters but can't go any further from here.

Also, I'd totally just start debating that people don't have souls if I were facing NJ....it would be the quirkiest debate ever, but fun.

😛

leo's absorption of knowledge seems to fall under a different heading in my mind, which is why I was first inclined to allow it. I DO however see how that could seem a lot like a loophole, so if the majority of the judges agree that it's nothing more than a loophole I overlooked(I'm ambivalent at this point) I'll ban the technique.

ban it? 😕

all i did was basically download information. this is something dhii does naturally. it doesn't change my character's abilities at all, just . . . let's me know more things. 😬

Originally posted by leonidas
ban it? 😕

all i did was basically download information. this is something dhii does naturally. it doesn't change my character's abilities at all, just . . . let's me know more things. 😬

It's not really any different from me getting Iron-Mans specs using a data-spy.

Originally posted by King Kandy
It's not really any different from me getting Iron-Mans specs using a data-spy.

Where does it say in the rules that power copying is not allowed?

Originally posted by King Kandy
Where does it say in the rules that power copying is not allowed?

Originally posted by darthgoober
If you gain the capabilities of the card, then it DOES toe the line in regards to power copying. You wouldn't TECHNICALLY be doing it, but you could be considered to be doing it in a roundabout loophole kind of way. That's why I left it for the judges to vote on, because it could easily fall under either category.

the card has 'capabilities'? 😕

not sure what that means, goob. i thought it was simply an access to information that i would have been hard-pressed to obtain any other way. like a direct route to some super-inter/intranet. using the card to gain info on my opponents (which would in turn allow me to formulate more precise strategies against certain ones of them) should be fine -- after all, BP used it for the same purposes.

dl'ing the info from the card into my cpu doesn't seem like power-copying. more like information gathering . . . i don't copy powers -- i just learn things, and it can only be from the mind character or a piece of tech.

Originally posted by leonidas
the card has 'capabilities'? 😕

not sure what that means, goob. i thought it was simply an access to information that i would have been hard-pressed to obtain any other way. like a direct route to some super-inter/intranet. using the card to gain info on my opponents (which would in turn allow me to formulate more precise strategies against certain ones of them) should be fine -- after all, BP used it for the same purposes.

dl'ing the info from the card into my cpu doesn't seem like power-copying. more like information gathering . . . i don't copy powers -- i just learn things, and it can only be from the mind character or a piece of tech.

Originally posted by darthgoober
I know the card can be used to access and hack into all kinds of computer systems, and that's the kind of thing I meant there. I don't mind you downloading all the data from the card, it's things like gaining access to all those systems. Of course, if Indigo or DHII already HAS the ability to remotely hack into a computer system and you're just using the passcodes obtained from the card then that's fine. Basically, you can take the info off the hard drive, but you can't take the functions of the computer.

they DO and that's exactly what i did. once i know the info is out there, dhii and indy can get in -- the card basically enables me to look in more places by letting me know those places are present. if that makes sense.

Ok then here are a few points on the soul absorbtion thing.

1) Has for the Extremis Limit Ironman pre-Extremis can amp himself by other opponents powers to the point where he has KOed Two Heralds of Galactus (Terrax and Silver Surfer) and Stalemated Thor. So even Ironman by himself can beak the Extremis Mark on his own. I am not doing any more than what Ironman isn't capable of with the caps.

2) Leo is amping his character. He may only be taking the knowledge of that person but it is still absorbing that persons abilities. Think about it he just gained every fighting feat from the Black Panther and all the tech knowledge he possess. Basically he just gained a whole bunch of feats from another character he can use. Also what if he absorbed someone with a Spiral Like Mind. He just gained a whole bunch of spells he can use. Either way it is amping or absorbing from another character.

This doesn't break any real limits since to use these powers the person I gained them from already has to be dead. So I can not use them my matches against that character therefore it doesn't actually break that rule.

Originally posted by leonidas
they DO and that's exactly what i did. once i know the info is out there, dhii and indy can get in -- the card basically enables me to look in more places by letting me know those places are present. if that makes sense.

Darth, I need some clarification. If Emma gives me telepathy, my Amalgam is expected to have the same proficiency with it as Emma herself does, right?

nj -- to gain them you need to KILL them. they're not 'already' dead. you KILL them. big difference.

and . . . how do you know whose 'soul' is IN the amalgam . . .? 😕

and goob: 👆

Ok NJ the rule is no power copying. Even if you didn't use the powers against the character they came from, it's still power copying. If leo went against someone who had Vision for a body(just an example), he wouldn't be able to copy Vision's circuitry to gain density control. The rule is no power copying, period.

Now in regards to leo, YES he gets the data from the card. Memories of previous battles carry over, so if he downloads the data he remembers what he read. Now in regards to his gaining BP's skills...probably not but I'm not going to outright ban it just yet. That's the kind of thing I was talking about leaving to a vote by the judges, because it's seems tough to call. leo has at least a week until his next match, so there's plenty of time to discuss it and put it to a vote.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Darth, I need some clarification. If Emma gives me telepathy, my Amalgam is expected to have the same proficiency with it as Emma herself does, right?

Originally posted by leonidas
nj -- to gain them you need to KILL them. they're not 'already' dead. you KILL them. big difference.

and . . . how do you know whose 'soul' is IN the amalgam . . .? 😕

and goob: 👆

The fact that the person has a human body and they possess powers means that I get their powers and their bodies abilities which have been shown.

You see it isn't like these things are completely separate characters they are amalgam meaning one character who possess all the abilities. So just like I've shown I get the powers of the person and I'll get their strength and durability added on to mine. I don't receive their knowledge or tech though.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Ok NJ the rule is no power copying. Even if you didn't use the powers against the character they came from, it's still power copying. If leo went against someone who had Vision for a body(just an example), he wouldn't be able to copy Vision's circuitry to gain density control. The rule is no power copying, period.

Now in regards to leo, YES he gets the data from the card. Memories of previous battles carry over, so if he downloads the data he remembers what he read. Now in regards to his gaining BP's skills...probably not but I'm not going to outright ban it just yet. That's the kind of thing I was talking about leaving to a vote by the judges, because it's seems tough to call. leo has at least a week until his next match, so there's plenty of time to discuss it and put it to a vote.

Once again no rule is being broken especially if Leo gets to keep BP's skills 😬

And if you put that to a judge vote then you have to put mine into a judge vote as well.