Originally posted by Borbarad
Wow. Kun received the entire knowledge of a guy who was able to create solar flares and destroy entire star-systems usingthe force orforce aided weaponary.
And had a whole 6 months to learn from it... Wow, what a god.
Wow. That was a force drain.
No proof for that whatsoever.
Kun simply resisted a rather similar attack without actively defending himself against it (Wall of Light attack through Odan).
Right, because force blocking is totally similar to something described as the greatest of all sith techniques and something to which there is no defence {🙄}, not to mention that Nihilus' raw power is miles beyond Odan's.
And where's the proof that Kun didn't actively defend against it?
Yeah. And Kun quite clearly and easily choked Odan, a 1,000 year old Jedi Master who apparently defeated Ancient Sith Lords (who sucked) to death.
And by Odan's own admission, he was 'old an weak,' so the feat really isn't too special.
Even as a ghost he was capable of force choking Luke's student (about 10 people) at once and would have most likely killed them if Streen wouldn't have been there. Guess what's more impressive.
Funny how you forget to mention that Kun as a spirit was more powerful than he had ever been in true form, given he had access to a number of power sources that he had preserved since his physical death.
Funny. So he kept his battered ship together ? Can you please explain to me why his ship didn't simply crumble into pieces at the moment he was killed by the Exile ? Obviously the ship was functional enough to remain intact without his presence or force powers keeping it together. Meaning that was quite untrue.
Erm, except, that's what actually happened... The ship starts falling to pieces as soon as you start leaving the Ravager.
Wow. Kun used the force to bind his spirit to the temples on Yavin 4 and as a ghost was still powerful enough to cause some nice amount of damage - 4,000 years after his actual death.
Look dude, if you're going to just jump into someone else's argument, at least understand what they're saying. Allankles is simply pointing out that Nihilus knows more than one technique. And again, Kun as a ghost > Kun in his true original form, so quit with this 'even as a ghost' bs.
Urm. Knowledge ? Kun had more knowledge than he could ever use, according to the omniscient narrator of the TOTJ comics. Hard to trump that.
Do you actually like not know how to distinguish between having access to knowledge, and studying under said knowledge? Yes, Kun's knowledge base was incredibly large, however his 6 months of learning from said knowledge in comparison to Traya's decades in studying the lightside, as well as a further year in learning the darkside pretty much sucks.
Intelligence ? Kun might, in some cases, appear like being quite the hot-head. But I really don't see where he lacks intelligence. He was obviously rather good at making people join his cause as he basically talked people in joining the Dark Side.
No, that's not what he 'basically' did, what he 'basically' did was convince a group of Jedi into coming with him to his source of what they thought was some ancient forgotten Jedi knowledge. However, he in no way actually turned them to the darkside, the credit for that goes to the sith spirits that were released from the sith holocron.
Woah. I didn't see Kun using his amulet to freeze the entire population of the Senate on Coruscant. I didn't see him using his amulet while killing Odan (also only one force attack to kill a Jedi Master) and I didn't see him using his amulet while slaugthering Vodo or performing that nice Sith ritual to enable his spirit to "run rampant throughout the galaxy". So I wonder what you are talking about...
What don't you get about the amulets considerably augmenting his force connection? He doesn't actively have to be using the amulets for them to be in effect, as they naturally increase his force connection.
Let's not forget that Revan did actually plunder the place and finally destroyed it pretty much using the mass shadow generator. Did you any Sith holocrons in the Academy during KotoR 2 ? I can't remember "a large library" of them that was actually found there. And even then I don't see a point while Kun, who had knowledge coming from people that Kreia descriped as "frightening" (in terms of power), should be less powerful than Kreia.Not to mention that I don't see any revelance for this thread. Ulic could hold his own against Exar Kun. Something that people who must have had pretty nice combat skills (like Vodo) weren't capable of. Hell...even when he completely lost his force powers he was able to hold his own against an enraged Jedi in a lightsaber duel. So I guess in terms of lightsaber combat Ulic
would defeat The Exile.is pretty formidable
Leaves force powers. And again Ulic received information from Freedom Nadd and most likely Aleema (both rather skilled when it comes to Dark Side abilities) and of course Exar Kun himself (who also had a nice knowledge base). Aside of that he also owns a Sith amulet (similar to that of Kun) that seems to have boosted his powers as Aleema perceives him and Kun as "rippling with Dark side energies" after their duel. And the Exile ? The Exile technically is just another Jedi when it comes to force powers, without any special training or knowledge. The only thing "special" is that "hole in the force" stuff which does actually affect combat...how ?
What don't you get about being able to draw power from everyone she kills?
What don't you get about being harder to directly affect or sense due to a lack of force presence?
Didn't help her to overcome somebody like Sion and it didn't grant her immunity against force attacks. Going by this, the Exile is pretty much toast when she has to fight Ulic.
God forbid that she wasn't able to kill someone in combat who can't actually be killed in combat, what a weakling. That totally proves that Ulic > The Exile. 🙄
Originally posted by Allankles
Sadow possessed great knowledge in Sith alchemy (I haven't attempted to argue against that), but Kreia studied many Sith not just one ancient Sith alchemist. Her whole life (several years more than Kun lived) was dedicated to learning of the force and the Jedi and Sith specifically. So as impressive as Sadow was, it's a weak argument to try and place Kun's knowledge on par with Kreia's simply for the fact that Kun learnt from Sadow. Try again.
It's nice that you know what Kreia did considering we almost have no background information on her. People at that time weren't trained from infancy on - hence you can't tell me when Kreia did start her training exactly. And I don't have to put Kun's knowledge on par with Kreia's because it's above Kreia's amount of knowledge. As stated by the omniscient narrator, Kun had more knowledge than he would be capable of using.
What force drain? Nihilus used TK on Kreia, there was no indication that it was force drain.
Yeah. Of course. With the exception of the little fact that Kreia tries to lift her lightsaber using the force and is obviously not able to do that. Ups. Force drain. Unless you want to argue that Nihilus did telekinetically force push Kreia's force energy away... And then you should take it up with Kreia personally because, her own words from that scene: "There are techniques within the Force against which there is no defense. I was cast down, stripped of my power, exiled."
What's impressive about attacking Jedi acolytes? Besides I wasn't trying to claim that Nihilus' force choke on Visas was impressive, I was simply making the point that he used force techniques besides drain.
You did notice that a force choke is still "basic knowledge" when it comes to force techniques, right ?
Oh! You happened to miss the part in Kotor 2, where Visas mentions that Nihilus keeps the ship operational with the force, despite the fact that large parts of it's hull are destroyed? In fact, the bridge happens to be exposed to space, yet the ships internal pressure is unaffected. He was obviously using an unnamed technique. Besides, this is besides the point, I was merely highlighting that Nihilus was capable of using more than one technique.
In fact, the bridge does have windows in it. So you are wrong. And you seem to have missed the part in KotoR 2 where Nihilus ship doesn't fall apart after he is killed which should be the case if he kept it together. Got that now ? And even this would be telekinesis which is, again, a "basic" force technique. Scale isn't the same thing as "advanced force use".
What's impressive about this? You know that he actually died in performing this ritual, right? Nihilus was actually still in the physical realm while his life essence remained bonded to his armor. He supposedly used this technique to escape death on Malachor (during or after the Mando wars). Exar Kun's attempt to preserve his life failed, so what's impressive there? Again, I was merely making the point out that Nihilus knew more than one technique.
And I'm trying to explain to you that compared to Sith Lords who did know some really impressive stuff, Nihilus is nothing special with the exception for his force drain ability. And that's it. Kun in his time obviously had enough knowledge to construct Sith amulets (given he wears two of them when he had only one) and come up with Sith magic attacks (like the mass freezing in the senate) that Kreia, as it seems, didn't have any knowledge about.
It's an impressive feat, but it was never used on Jedi. Nihilus actually killed hundreds of Jedi and millions (perhaps billions) of organisms in one application of the force.
And Thon did defeat a Sith which did the same thing on Ambria. Now if Thon is, at least, compareable to the like of Odan and Vodo in terms of skill (given that they all were Jedi Masters at the same time), I wonder what your conclusion is, considering Kun did simply tool Odan and Vodo without having much problems.
First of all his spirit never run rampant throughout the galaxy, and killing Vodo, Odan in the manner that he did is more impressive than Kreia killing three Jedi masters by draining them of the force?
You mean three Jedi Masters that were actually concentrading of shutting the Exiles connection to the force down when Kreia did attack them ? You mean using a technique on them against which "there is no defence" ? Sure that is still impressive. Yet Kreia would still lose to Kun in a force fight.
The mass shadow generator obviously didn't destroy the trayus academy, how the hell can you even write that? Secondly it's obvious that there was plenty of Sith knowledge in Trayus core when you consider that it's implicitly stated that Kreia, Sion and Nihilus spent the better part of five years learning of the Sith at Malachor 5.
The only thing that is obvious is, that there don't seem to be any greater sources of knowledge in the Trayus academy during KotoR 2. Which would be illogical anyways since Revan wouldn't have left the knowledge there just to destroy the planet (risking the destruction of said knowledge). And we don't know what Kreia, Sion and Nihilus exactly did on Malachor. What we know is that Kreia trained Sion and Nihilus but we don't know if the knowledge was still present at Malachor or if Kreia received it before. If that should be the case she possibly only had a few months to study that knowledge.
Lastly, Kreia never described the ancient Sith as frightening, she only mentioned that they were great lightsaber duelist and as you should know Sadow and his particular band of ancient sith hadn't started using lightsabers yet.
Oh, really ? She descriped Ragnos grasp of the Dark Side as "frightening" in case you didn't notice that. And Sadow and his friends had actually stopped using lightsaber and instead preferred their Sith swords. Does that naturally mean they are weaker duellists especially since Kreia says that "We would look like children playing with toys compared to them" when the "them" clearly refers to all ancient Sith Lords or at least those four burried in the valley which, unfortunatelly for you, would include Sadow. Hmm.
Originally posted by Apollo Cloud
And had a whole 6 months to learn from it... Wow, what a god.
That's far more time than the Exile ever had to learn something from Kreia. Aside of that: Have a look at Luke. Beginning ESB to end of ROTJ = 6 months.
No proof for that whatsoever.
See above.
Right, because force blocking is totally similar to something described as the greatest of all sith techniques and something to which there is no defence {🙄}, not to mention that Nihilus' raw power is miles beyond Odan's.
Kun didn't block the attack. He resisted it. And again: Odan did defeat ancient Sith Lords who were (at least the Sith on Ambria) able to reproduce Nihilus feat of draining a planet empty. Hmm.
And where's the proof that Kun didn't actively defend against it?
He walks in, and Odan tries to kick his ass. Kun, who doesn't even know that technique, is simply pushed back. Where's Kun's defence there ?
And by Odan's own admission, he was 'old an weak,' so the feat really isn't too special.
Yeah. Yoda is "old and weak" too. Hooray.
Funny how you forget to mention that Kun as a spirit was more powerful than he had ever been in true form, given he had access to a number of power sources that he had preserved since his physical death.
What bullshit. Where did you pull that from ? He obviously had no access to his amulets. He was barely able to talk over the centuries. Yet somehow he was "more powerful" than before ? Yeah, right.
Erm, except, that's what actually happened... The ship starts falling to pieces as soon as you start leaving the Ravager.
That might come from the huge bombs planted by Mandalore that actually blow the ship up, Mr. Smartass.
Look dude, if you're going to just jump into someone else's argument, at least understand what they're saying. Allankles is simply pointing out that Nihilus knows more than one technique. And again, Kun as a ghost > Kun in his true original form, so quit with this 'even as a ghost' bs.
Dude. If you're going to just jump into someone else's argument, at least make sure that you are capable to use reasoning or apply some logical argument. Ok. It's you. So simply forget that about "logic", "reasoning" and "arguments". Such words are strange to your mental realm of idiotism.
Do you actually like not know how to distinguish between having access to knowledge, and studying under said knowledge? Yes, Kun's knowledge base was incredibly large, however his 6 months of learning from said knowledge in comparison to Traya's decades in studying the lightside, as well as a further year in learning the darkside pretty much sucks.
Kun's six months of studying Dark Side lore + unknown time he spent as lightside practicioneer VS Traya's unknown time studying in both fields. Hmm...what result do you expect comparing two unknowns, huh ? Not to mention that things like learning speed or prodigious abilities on certain field might actually speed up the learning.
No, that's not what he 'basically' did, what he 'basically' did was convince a group of Jedi into coming with him to his source of what they thought was some ancient forgotten Jedi knowledge. However, he in no way actually turned them to the darkside, the credit for that goes to the sith spirits that were released from the sith holocron.
He's smart enough to device plans how to attack the republic. He's smart enough to make some suspicious people follow him. He's smart enough to plunder a world filled with Jedi knowledge without having to confront Jedi. Hmm....the guy doesn't seem to be stupid which was all that I wanted to say.
What don't you get about the amulets considerably augmenting his force connection? He doesn't actively have to be using the amulets for them to be in effect, as they naturally increase his force connection.
Oh wait. I spot some nice contradiction to your point above that he was more powerful as a spirit (without amulets) than when he was alive. Now, all over a sudden, the amulets are augmenting his force connection ? Where has that ever been stated anyway ? For all we know, it just augments Kun's anger and forces them into the form of energy blasts.
What don't you get about being able to draw power from everyone she kills?
What don't you get about the nature of her abilities ? First: Considering a light side canon, she did never kill anybody "important". Pretty stupid point. And then she draws raw force power over away using that ability. But where does that make her stronger ?
What don't you get about being harder to directly affect or sense due to a lack of force presence?
What don't you get about the fact that this is an invention of your own brain, huh ? Mere Sith assassins can affect her via the force rather easily but everyone else should have problems ? Yeah, right.
God forbid that she wasn't able to kill someone in combat who can't actually be killed in combat, what a weakling. That totally proves that Ulic > The Exile. 🙄
God forbid that she wasn't able to use her uber-super-hyper-force-drain-hole-in-the-force-nonsens to kill somebody who needs the force to keep his body parts from falling apart. Woah. Impressive.
Her force skills aren't enough to overcome somebody who had his ass handed to him by Nihilus rather easily and was Kreia private pet. And she also doesn't have enough lightsaber abilities to actually disarm Sion. Yet that should work against somebody who was one of the most powerful force users of his time and had enough saberskill to stalemate Kun and fend of an enraged Jedi (the latter without having access to the force) ?
Yeah. Right.
The point is that the Exile has never shown anything impressive in terms of lightsaber combat or force use that would put her above Ulic Quel-Droma. It's really that easy.
Originally posted by Apollo Cloud
And had a whole 6 months to learn from it... Wow, what a god.
No proof for that whatsoever.
Right, because force blocking is totally similar to something described as the greatest of all sith techniques and something to which there is no defence {🙄}, not to mention that Nihilus' raw power is miles beyond Odan's.
And where's the proof that Kun didn't actively defend against it?
And by Odan's own admission, he was 'old an weak,' so the feat really isn't too special.
Funny how you forget to mention that Kun as a spirit was more powerful than he had ever been in true form, given he had access to a number of power sources that he had preserved since his physical death.
Erm, except, that's what actually happened... The ship starts falling to pieces as soon as you start leaving the Ravager.
Look dude, if you're going to just jump into someone else's argument, at least understand what they're saying. Allankles is simply pointing out that Nihilus knows more than one technique. And again, Kun as a ghost > Kun in his true original form, so quit with this 'even as a ghost' bs.
Do you actually like not know how to distinguish between having access to knowledge, and studying under said knowledge? Yes, Kun's knowledge base was incredibly large, however his 6 months of learning from said knowledge in comparison to Traya's decades in studying the lightside, as well as a further year in learning the darkside pretty much sucks.
No, that's not what he 'basically' did, what he 'basically' did was convince a group of Jedi into coming with him to his source of what they thought was some ancient forgotten Jedi knowledge. However, he in no way actually turned them to the darkside, the credit for that goes to the sith spirits that were released from the sith holocron.
What don't you get about the amulets considerably augmenting his force connection? He doesn't actively have to be using the amulets for them to be in effect, as they naturally increase his force connection.
God forbid that she wasn't able to kill someone in combat who can't actually be killed in combat, what a weakling. That totally proves that Ulic > The Exile. 🙄 [/B]
No dumbass, the proof is that Ulic was a saber prodigy who stalemated Kun, while you have nothing on the exile besides speculation and game mechanics. Great going jackass, another piss poor argument...
Originally posted by Apollo Cloud
Funny how you forget to mention that Kun as a spirit was more powerful than he had ever been in true form given he had access to a number of power sources that he had preserved since his physical death.
Excuse me, I just had to interject. I also find that the fact that you forgot to mention you were making shit up quite comedic, to say the least.
Let's assume, arguendo, that what you're saying is true. This then begs the question: why is Kun so weak? If Exar could draw on such supplies, why has his power vastly diminished to the point where he needs to draw on residual energy to sustain himself? Why does he need others' life forces when he supposedly has the Golden Globe to draw on? I'll repost what I said in the other topic, as it'd be stupid on my behalf to write something new:
Originally posted by Advent
"Kun discovered that one of his great temples was inhabited by a small band of armed humans. But before he could gather enough strength to reach out to tap this energy source, the Force-user and his fellows departed, and Kun again lapsed into sleep.Eagerly, but cautiously, Kun observes each arrival, proving for weaknessess and the power he needs to restore his lost reserves of energy. For a time, he is able to subside by feeding on their residual energy, but soon he will need worshippers if he is to grow more active.
Enraged and drained, Ken returns to Gantoris. Desperate for more energy, he goads Gantoris[...]
"Realizing that Gantoris is no longer his, Kun utterly drains him to provide himself a reserve of energy to last until he can subvert more students." (Jedi Academy Sourcebook, pg. 49)
The first statement is talking about a Force sensitive human who arrived on Yavin, not any of Luke's Jedi. And the fact that he couldn't even "gather enough strength" to feed on them implies that Kun's power is greatly lessened. I'm curious as to why he even would need to use some no name Force sensitive if he was more powerful in spirit form, as opposed to physical form (and had objects, places, etc. to draw upon).
And, the third statement is made in reference to when Kun appears to Luke as a shade of his father, and Luke rejects him. He's "drained", and is "desperate for energy", yet - according to you - he can call upon these supposed resources, and other things. To me, if what you're saying is true, then those things do not help him much, if they even do at all.
Throughout the entire story (Dark Apprentice, at least) Exar Kun draws upon anger, and is in dire need of such. Where are these alleged "resources"? Why aren't they so much as mentioned? The only reference to such a thing is indirect, and it's the Golden Globe. As Kun states that he had to "drain dry every last one of the Massassi". He doesn't say he accessed such afterwards, and there's no indication of anything you're suggesting. It's your turn now. Prove up.
Indeed, it'll be hard, considering Kun is more powerful in the flesh.
Advent, all those quotes that you just supplied are in reference to Kun before tapping into those power sources. Of course I'm not claiming that his spirit form alone is more powerful than his original form, but with all of the added power sources (Golden Globe, the Massasi Temples, Yavin itself etc.), it quite clearly is, given it was able to force own a post DE Luke, who was pretty damn powerful (DE Luke Respect Thread). Info on all of this is in I, Jedi, and I'll post quotes and such later when I have access to the book, so until then don't reply.
Originally posted by Apollo Cloud
Advent, all those quotes that you just supplied are in reference to Kun [b]before tapping into those power sources.[/b]
How about you actually provide viable evidence before typing, as you'll find it makes your response rather worthless.
1.) Prove that Kun 'tapped into' these supposed sources of energy he had after killing Gantoris. It's funny, since even the secondary, fallible account (I, Jedi) doesn't make any note that he did such, as far as I've checked.
The only thing that vaguely resembles your argument is dialogue between characters:
"I thought I heard someone - Bodo Baas, perhaps - say the temples here had all been raised as a focus for Exar Kun's power. Maybe this temple isn't the focus of it, but just linked to it. If the link was forged of Sith magic, Exar Kun might be able to block back-tracing. Another of the temples here, then, would be the centerpoint of his power."
And that doesn't support what you're saying either, because even after Kun trapped Luke at the actual centerpoint and put him in a comatose, he was "still was not ready to take on Luke directly", because he was not powerful enough. Which leads one to believe that the temples only preserved his strength enough to remain a spirit for thousands of years (much like the Ancient Sith on Korriban). Luke even wonders as to why Kun would still be lingering around, and not have vanished entirely, and that's the reason. Which leads me to #2.
2.) Prove that these sources even enhance his power anymore than they did to simply keep his spirit from diminishing.
3.) "With a nucleus of followers to provide him energy-providing anger and fear. Kun will have enough power to escape his exile and take on human form." (Jedi Academy Sourcebook, p. 49)
If the temples made him more powerful than he was in the flesh, then why are the students that he needs [to draw energy from] the only ingredient said to be used to revert him back to his physical form? The only "sources" that are said to increase his strength and power are that of actual Force sensitives, and their emotions. Golden Globe? No, not even mentioned in either account. Massassi Temple? Only used to sustain his spirit from becoming nonexistent. Yavin? Uh, prove up.
it quite clearly is, given it was able to force own a post DE Luke, who was pretty damn powerful
"...Luke called upon the powers that Yoda and Obi-Wan had taught him-but everything he did, every skillful technique, failed utterly."
And it also mentions previously that he was seeking any defensive tactic to work. This would imply that he had no defense for it.
Info on all of this is in I, Jedi, and I'll post quotes and such later when I have access to the book
Really? That's funny, I don't recall the Golden Globe ever being mentioned in I, Jedi (and I just searched the e-book). Care to provide a specific quote(s)? I'd love to know how the book contains said information.
so until then don't reply.
So until you provide sufficient evidence, don't waste my time, noob.
Ok, before that one minor point blows up into a huge debate, I'll man up and admit right now that I was basing everything off of what Lightsnake's been saying, and honestly didn't know what I was talking about, but really Advent, you don't have to address every argument made against Kun you know, I mean geez, one might suspect you that you actually did kill commies. And the 'noob' comment hurt, by the way. 😂
That's not something I'd expect from you, but knowing you, it isn't too ridiculous.
Anyways, if you've ever read the discussion between Lightsnake, Kadesh, and I (those two were arguing the point you just were), I put their arguments on the matter to rest.
one might suspect you that you actually did kill commies.
😆
That really did make me laugh out loud.
Look at your rebuttals Darth Sexy or whoever it is that bothered to quote my posts; I state that Nihilus kept the internal atmosphere of his ship normal despite massive breaches in the hull, you say there were windows. Did you ever play through the Ravager level? As it's quite clear that many parts of the ship were exposed to open space, including the bridge.
Then you present a weak argument against Kotor 2 statement on Nihilus keeping the ship intact, Kotor 2 stated that he used the force to keep his ship intact, and it gets destroyed soon after Nihilus dies, so how the hell do you have an argument here? The specifics of what Nihilus did to actually keep his ship together are unknown, what matters is is that he did keep his ship intact - be logical.
As for Nihilis force techniques outside of his force drain, you only added "besides the basics" when I pointed out examples where Nihilus used techniques outside of force drain. Besides, your argument here is rather piss poor, as its completely based on your preference. Nihilus' drain makes him uber powerful and he's able to effect it because he's uber powerful, whichever way you look at it (logically).
Anyway, "basic", as you say, is really a matter of interpretation.
Lastly, Kreia was a Jedi Master for many years, and we know this because she was Revan's first trainer many decades before Kotor 2 and it's implied that she had many more padawans in her time as a Jedi. It should also be noted that she claimed to have followed Atris' path i.e. studying Jedi and Sith holocrons for years to uncover force secrets.
As far as Kun's knowledge goes, he may have had too much knowledge to use within 6 months, but the omniscient narrator never claims that Kun was the most knowledgeable Sith in history.
Logically Kreia, should have been many years more knowledgeable than Kun. She was a historian and chronicler for years, as well as master of a Sith academy for the better part of five years, she's clearly had alot more time than Kun to gain knowledge in the force. Nebaris made a valid point in this case.
As for what Nihilus did to Kreia in the cutscene, why should we argue incessantly over what is clearly specualtion on both our parts? The evidence says it was tk blast, anything beyond that is speculation based on what is read in Kreia's words, what we actually see, is a telekinetic force slamming Kreia onto a wall.
You want to believe you interpretation is the truth? You lose.
BTW The Exile beats Ulic.
Originally posted by Allankles
Look at your rebuttals Darth Sexy or whoever it is that bothered to quote my posts; I state that Nihilus kept the internal atmosphere of his ship normal despite massive breaches in the hull, you say there were windows. Did you ever play through the Ravager level? As it's quite clear that many parts of the ship were exposed to open space, including the bridge.
Then you present a weak argument against Kotor 2 statement on Nihilus keeping the ship intact, Kotor 2 stated that he used the force to keep his ship intact, and it gets destroyed soon after Nihilus dies, so how the hell do you have an argument here? The specifics of what Nihilus did to actually keep his ship together are unknown, what matters is is that he did keep his ship intact - be logical.
As for Nihilis force techniques outside of his force drain, you only added "besides the basics" when I pointed out examples where Nihilus used techniques outside of force drain. Besides, your argument here is rather piss poor, as its completely based on your preference. Nihilus' drain makes him uber powerful and he's able to effect it because he's uber powerful, whichever way you look at it (logically).
Lastly, Kreia was a Jedi Master for many years, and we know this because she was Revan's first trainer many decades before Kotor 2 and it's implied that she had many more padawans in her time as a Jedi. It should also be noted that she claimed to have followed Atris' path i.e. studying Jedi and Sith holocrons for years to uncover force secrets.
As far as Kun's knowledge goes, he may have had too much knowledge to use within 6 months, but the omniscient narrator never claims that Kun was the most knowledgeable Sith in history.
Logically Kreia, should have been many years more knowledgeable than Kun. She was a historian and chronicler for years, as well as master of a Sith academy for the better part of five years, she's clearly had alot more time than Kun to gain knowledge in the force. Nebaris made a valid point in this case.
You want to believe you interpretation is the truth? You lose.
BTW The Exile beats Ulic. [/B]