KMC Comic Book Tiers

Perefalcon or whatever, there's a couple of things you're missing here.

It's not just ALL about power and who beats who. It's a lot about versatility, experience and so on. Take Reed for example, he can simulate super strength, has an incredible stamina/durability and so on. I think it's safe to say that he earned his spot in the high meta. His intelligence plays a big role, but it's not just that.

When Cable was at full power, he didn't have the virus holding him back, he was pretty much equal to Nate Grey. Which is why I think he's listed above Apocalypse. Though I think he wasn't that much stronger than Apoc anyways.

The List

Sub-Skyfather (Transcendent)

Amazo, Appolyon, The Asgardian Destroyer,Black Racer, Blackheart, Blaze, Circe, Count Abyss, Death Urge, Despero, The Doctor, Dr. Fate, Dr. Strange (classic), Eclipso, Elders of the Universe (minus Ego), Fernus, The General (Shaggy Man), Gog, Gray Man, High Evolutionary, Ion (current), Jenny Quantum, The Keeper, King Thor, Magus (original), Mangog, Mongul I (Pre Crisis), Nightmare, Onimar Synn, Onslaught, Queen of Fables, Resurrection Man 1 Million, Sentinel (Alan Scott), Silver Age Kryptonians/Daxamites, Solomon Grundy (Peak), Solusandra, Stayne, Strange Visitor, Sun Eater, Superboy Prime, Superman 1 Million, Takion, Tanaraq, Thanos, Tyrant (powered down), Validus

Herald

High
Adam Warlock, Baron Zemo (w/ Moonstones), Cyborg Superman, The Eradicator (Fortress Mode), Genis-Vell, Green Lantern (Hal, Kyle, Alan), Infinity-Man, Majestic, Moonstone (w/ both stones), Qztr, The Sentry, The Silver Surfer, Sinestro, Spartan 3.0, Stardust, Superman (including B/R and AS), Thor, The Void

Middle
Alexander Nero, Beta Ray Bill, Binary, Black Adam, Black Bolt, Cable (Full Power), Captain Atom, Cpt. Comet,Captain Marvel (DC), Damien Hellstrom, Doomsday, Evinlea, The Fallen One, Firelord, The Flash III (Wally West), The Flash IV (Bart Allen), General Zod, Gladiator, Green Lantern (Guy, John, Katma, Kilowog), Hyperion, Ikaris, Imperiex Probes, Kid Omega, Lobo, Loki, Magus (Post-IG), Martian Manhunter, Maxima, Mon-El, Morg, Nate Grey, Orion, Quasar, Rachel Summers (Phoenix II), Red Shift, Skreet, Supergirl, Supreme, Swamp Thing, Terrax the Tamer, Void, Waverider, Wildfire, Wonder Woman

Low
Absorbing Man, Air Walker, Animal Man, Apocalypse, Apollo, Argent, The Atom, Aztek, Bizarro Superman, Breach, Cassandra Nova, Cir-El, Count Nefaria, Damage, Darkness, Darwin, Death's Head 3.0, Death Metal, Dr. Doom, Dr. Invincible, Dr. Light, Dr. Polaris, Drax The Destroyer, Engineer, Etrigan, Exodus, Fin Fang Foom, Firestorm, The Flash II (Barry Allen), Gammid, Gamora (w/Godslayer), Gilgamesh, Gorilla Grodd, Graviton, Green Lantern (Soranik Natu), He-Man, Hector Hammond, Hulk, Iceman, Isis, Jade, Jack Hawksmoor (in city), Jack of Hearts, Jericho, Juggernaut (Classic), Kalibak, Lightray, Living Monolith, Lunatik, Magneto, Major Force, Makkari, Man-Beast, Manchester Black, Mar-Vell, Matrix Supergirl, Meggan, Mongul, Monica Rambeau (Pulsar), Mr. M, Nova (Frankie Raye), Nova Richard Rider (current), Plastic Man, Prime, Professor X, Raven, The Ray, Red Tornado, Ronan the Accuser, Saturn Girl, Selene (External), Sersi, Shadow King, Shaman, Starhawk, Super Skrull, Superboy, Tempest, Ultra Boy, Ultra-Humanite, Ultron, Union, Vulcan, Winter, Zauriel,

Metahuman (Mid-tier "Iron Man" level)

High
Abomination, Adam Strange, Aquaman, Ares (Marvel), Atlas, Aurora, Batman 1 Million, Battalion (Jackson King), Blastaar, Blob, Captain Britain, Captain Marvel Jr, Colossus, Death's Head II, Donna Troy, Emma Frost, Ghost Rider II, Grim Reaper, Guardian I, Havok, Hellstrike, Hercules (Mortal), Holocaust, The Human Torch, Invisible Woman, Iron-Man, Jean Grey (sans Phoenix), Jenny Sparks, Juggernaut (Depowered), Kang, Karate Kid, Living Laser, Mandarin, Mary Marvel, Maul, Mercer Drake, Metallo, Mimic (Exiles), Miss Martian, Mr. Fantastic, Mr. Sinister, Namor the Sub-Mariner, Nightshade, Nimrod, Northstar, Ocean Master, Osiris, Pitt, Polaris, Power Girl, Psylocke, Radioactive Man, Sand, Sasquatch, Shassa, She-Hulk, Starfire, Storm, Supernova, Temugin, The Thing, Thunderstrike, The Tick, Ulik, Ultimo, Vision, War Machine, Wonder Man, Zzaxx

Middle
Aegis, Atom Smasher, Attuma, Balder, Beast Boy, Bishop, Blink, Blue Beetle (Jamie Reyes), Blue Devil, Bombshell, Booster Gold, Box, Carnage, Cloak, Corrin, Crystal, Cyborg, Cyclops, Death's Head, Death Wreck, Dust, Electro, Elijah Snow, Farenheit, Flint, Fuji, Ghost Rider (Johnny Blaze), Ghost Rider(Dan Ketch), Grace Choi, Hawkgirl, Hawkman, Hellion, The Flash I (Jay Garrick), Kymaera/Namorita, Lightning Lad, Matua, M.O.D.O.K., Moonstone, Morlun, Ms. Marvel, Nico Minoru, Ogun, Quicksilver (classic), Ragman, Rogue, rom, Shadowcat, Shift, Steel, Terra, Thunder, Tiger Shark, Toxin, Vance Astro, Vengeance, Wonder Girl, Enchantress

Low
3-D Man, Ambrose Chase, Angel, Arachne, Arana, Azrael, Beast, Black Canary, Black Tarantula, Blade, Blue Beetle (Dan Garrett), Bruenor Battlehammer, Century, Charcoal, Charlie 27, Constrictor, Creeper, Cyber, Dagger, Deathlok, Deathstroke the Terminator, Doc Ock, Drizzt Do'Urden, Elixer, Falcon, Firehawk, Gambit, Green Goblin, Hobgoblin, Iron Fist, Jakita Wagner, Karnak, Kid Devil, Killer Croc, Klaw, Lady Deathstrike, Longshot, Luke Cage, Machine Man, Man-Bat, Mercury, Midnighter, Mister Hyde, Molly Hayes, Multiple Man, Mysterio, Mystique, Nightcrawler, Nova Richard Rider (classic), Nuke, Omega Red, Orka Humbug, Prometheus, Protocide, Puck, Puma, Rage, Sabretooth, Shang Chi, Silver Samurai, Speedball, Speedfreek, Spider-Man, Spider-Man 2099, Spider-Woman, Swift, Thunder Cats, Tombstone, Triathalon, Vance Astro, Vanguard, Venom, Vermin, Victor Mancha, Vulture, Warlock (Technarchy/Phalanx), Warpath, Wizard, Wolverine, Wulfgar

Street Level

High
Bane, Batgirl, Batman, Black Cat, Black Panther, Blacklash, Bronze Tiger, Bullseye, Captain America, The Cat, Constantine Drakon, Daredevil, Elektra, Green Arrow, Hawkeye, Hush, Kingpin, Lady Shiva, Ravager, Red Skull, Richard Dragon, Taskmaster, Union Jack, X-23, Nightwing, Red Hood

Middle
Arsenal/Red Arrow, Baron Zemo, Blue Beetle (Ted Kord), Crossbones, Deadshot, Echo, Grifter, Joker, Mach IV, Misty Knight, Moon Knight, Nick Fury, Nomad, Peacemaker, Punisher, Ra's Al Ghul, Rose Tattoo, Turok, Wildcat, Robin

Low
Alfred, Batroc, Black Widow, Catwoman, Christine Trelane, Colleen Wing, Night Thrasher, Obregon Kaine, Penguin, The Question, Riddler, Talia, White Tiger

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I took the liberty of moving Nightwing, Red Hood, and Robin all up a respective level. We had three votes on each for yes, and no opposing votes 😬

Also to whoever just copied it last (P. Falcon?) Dont change things again without votes. Kyle and Alan are where they were put for a reason.

I definitely think that Cyber deserves a bump up to mid meta.

Where would Godzilla be? Marvel version.

Place him where u think he fits, but he can be moved by other users via voting system.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
Also to whoever just copied it last (P. Falcon?) Dont change things again without votes. Kyle and Alan are where they were put for a reason.

✅

Not trying to be biased or anything, cuz im really not, but i think that both Ronan and Nova (with Worldmind) deserve to be at least Middle herald level.

Ronan has beaten Genis before yet he is Top and Ronan is low herald level. Not cool.

He also took out Ravenous who is at least Middle tier herald level.

Genis fluctuated mightily in his power levels depending on the incarnation.

Also, Ravenous has very few appearences, and got tooled by Surfer then beaten by Ronan. I think Mid herald is generous for him.

As for Nova, he flat-out stated that the heralds in Annihilation (Stardust, Red Shift) were more powerful than him. So Mid-herald is a max for him, and I honestly can think of a ton of stuff that puts him higher than low Herald. He was probably < Iron Man before, so Low Herald is an improvement for him.

...just my 2 cents though.

Originally posted by llagrok
Perefalcon or whatever, there's a couple of things you're missing here.

It's not just ALL about power and who beats who. It's a lot about versatility, experience and so on. Take Reed for example, he can simulate super strength, has an incredible stamina/durability and so on. I think it's safe to say that he earned his spot in the high meta. His intelligence plays a big role, but it's not just that.

When Cable was at full power, he didn't have the virus holding him back, he was pretty much equal to Nate Grey. Which is why I think he's listed above Apocalypse. Though I think he wasn't that much stronger than Apoc anyways.

Peregrine is a type of falcon. Basically, it's the fastest animal on the planet and can dive at over 200 mph. I'm not just taking who beats who into account. I'm factoring in experience and versatility. Cable (in my opinion) was around the same level of Apoc at his height. Also, I see no reason to put Adam Strange and the Tick at the same level as Power Girl. As for Reed Richards, I was just thinking out loud there.

My changing the list was an accident. I basically copied and pasted the list onto a form, moved things around and then wrote down my rants. Then I meant to erase the list and just leave the rants but...I...guess...I....

sorta

forgot?

hehe.

Oops?

Back to Beta Ray Bill. The only thing I would say that puts him one notch below Thor is that he doesn't own a belt that allows him to double his strength. Yes, Thor is more experienced with magic, but Bill was bio-engineered to be a fighting freak. Plus, the fact that he's even worthy enough to hold that hammer should say something. The list of those who could lift it is pretty short. You would have to be Captain America and Wonder Woman worthy. Superman held it for the big emergency and then was unable to lift it afterwards, showing that he wasn't worthy. It's that short of a list.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Genis fluctuated mightily in his power levels depending on the incarnation.

Also, Ravenous has very few appearences, and got tooled by Surfer then beaten by Ronan. I think Mid herald is generous for him.

As for Nova, he flat-out stated that the heralds in Annihilation (Stardust, Red Shift) were more powerful than him. So Mid-herald is a max for him, and I honestly can think of a ton of stuff that puts him higher than low Herald. He was probably < Iron Man before, so Low Herald is an improvement for him.

...just my 2 cents though.

He's owned Genis on more than one occasion including a Genis merged with Rick Jones, and what about Ronan's impressive appearances against Surfer himself, as well as Thor.

I mean if the rest of the forum doesnt believe he is thats fine, but can we at least put it up for consideration.

Originally posted by peregrinefalcon
Back to Beta Ray Bill. The only thing I would say that puts him one notch below Thor is that he doesn't own a belt that allows him to double his strength. Yes, Thor is more experienced with magic, but Bill was bio-engineered to be a fighting freak. Plus, the fact that he's even worthy enough to hold that hammer should say something. The list of those who could lift it is pretty short. You would have to be Captain America and Wonder Woman worthy. Superman held it for the big emergency and then was unable to lift it afterwards, showing that he wasn't worthy. It's that short of a list.

Whether or not he's worthy doesn't tell us too much about his power level, so I don't think that's something which would give us an indication of his power level. Thor was relatively weak the first time he lifted Stormbreaker.

As for being a bio engineered fighting "freak", I don't think that puts him on the same level as Thor. Not given Thor's immense fighting experience and training. Thor has trained ever since he was a teenager and been fighting just as long. In "son of asgard" we got to see what it was like being an Asgardian teenager, and it looked like non-stop fighting to me.

I need someone to explain to me why Adam Strange and Power Girl are on the same level. Also, why Falcon and Vulture are on the same level as Spider-man and Venom. That's just insane.

If experience brings Beta Ray Bill below Thor, then Kyle is below Hal.

Alan also should be below Hal. Yes, he's got experience, but he's also old. Old age = slower reflexes and weaker will power. Every time they teamed up Hal proved to be the better ring slinger. Jordan no longer has a weakness to yellow, but Alan has a weakness to wood!! If that's changed, someone tell me. Kilowog has proven on several occassions to be a superior Lantern, almost to Hal's level. He has natural strength that is superior to human strength. He's got incredible will power, experience, engineering skills that help him create objects and NOTHING scares him, but he puts the fear of the guardians into people that usually have no fear. I think he's simply down a level because he's not a major character.

Originally posted by llagrok
Whether or not he's worthy doesn't tell us too much about his power level, so I don't think that's something which would give us an indication of his power level. Thor was relatively weak the first time he lifted Stormbreaker.

As for being a bio engineered fighting "freak", I don't think that puts him on the same level as Thor. Not given Thor's immense fighting experience and training. Thor has trained ever since he was a teenager and been fighting just as long. In "son of asgard" we got to see what it was like being an Asgardian teenager, and it looked like non-stop fighting to me.

It's been explained to me that these are not ONLY power levels.

Originally posted by peregrinefalcon
I need someone to explain to me why Adam Strange and Power Girl are on the same level. Also, why Falcon and Vulture are on the same level as Spider-man and Venom. That's just insane.

They're above the people in High Street, and Spidey/Venom don't deserve mid meta. You have to understand that there's going to be variations in power level even at the same level, since it's literally impossible to seperate so many characters into only 10 levels. But making dozens of levels would be confusing and pointless...it's a rough gauge of power.

If you see a need to change, start the discussion and see if others agree. Don't demand an explanation for things you think are wrong.

Originally posted by peregrinefalcon
If experience brings Beta Ray Bill below Thor, then Kyle is below Hal.

Not really. Check out his respect thread...Kyle has done just as much feat-wise as Hal, and even a few things that Hal never has. BRB is stil <<< Thor in terms of # of feats both in power and versatility....Kyle has no such problems.

Originally posted by peregrinefalcon
Alan also should be below Hal. Yes, he's got experience, but he's also old. Old age = slower reflexes and weaker will power. Every time they teamed up Hal proved to be the better ring slinger. Jordan no longer has a weakness to yellow, but Alan has a weakness to wood!! If that's changed, someone tell me. Kilowog has proven on several occassions to be a superior Lantern, almost to Hal's level. He has natural strength that is superior to human strength. He's got incredible will power, experience, engineering skills that help him create objects and NOTHING scares him, but he puts the fear of the guardians into people that usually have no fear. I think he's simply down a level because he's not a major character.

Alan doesn't age anymore, it's part of the nature of his power. He also doesn't have the wood weakness anymore...that's been gone for a while. And on a cosmic scale where we're talking about people who can destroy planets, I don't really think Kilowog being stronger physically means much...it's about what they've done with their rings. He's good, but is still just a bit player, while Hal/Kyle/Alan/even John have been in the starring roles.

Digi where do you think Godzilla marvel version should be?

Not a clue.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Not a clue.

I don't see a problem in starting my discussion by showing how things are wrong. If there's a rule against that, then I'd like to see it.

Originally posted by peregrinefalcon
I don't see a problem in starting my discussion by showing how things are wrong. If there's a rule against that, then I'd like to see it.

Oops...I quoted the wrong quote. Hehe.