As for the rest of the proposals, my opinion:
Clayface to mid-meta- agree
Blanque [Superman-villain] to low-herald- agree
Cheetah to mid-herald- particular reason why MH? My initial thought is LH. /shrug
O.M.A.C. to mid-herald- agree
The Weird to high-herald- pretty sure I agree. I want to reread his later appearances to be sure.
Black Manta - high meta?--> i agree
Dracula - high meta--> i agree
Mera - high meta--> i agree, though lh isn't out of the question (would she take arthur for a majority? i could argue yes pretty easily)
Black Lightning - high meta--> defer though i am surprised, i'd have thought mm
Killer Frost - low herald--> hmm, seems high to me overall though i know she has some very good showings. ok either way.
Fantomex to - ???-->tough overall. his weapons keep him from being higher. basically he can beat and kill anyone his weapons can kill. he could certainly beat a lot of the low and mid meta tier--anyone who can be killed with a bullet will die. he's also all but immune to tp. mm is likely a better fit for him tbh, especially with EVA taken into account, and EVA should certainly be factored in as it is a part of him. his fights CAN always be 2 on 1. that, with misdirection, tp immunity and bullets that never miss are all good reasons to put him in the mm tier. i think ds would agree.
geo-force--> hm
Clayface to mid-meta--> i agree. high meta isn't out of the question.
Cheetah to mid-herald--> i agree
O.M.A.C. to mid-herald--> hmm. i'd have said lh. reasons for mid?
The Weird to high-herald--> was he ultimately proven that high? i know he had some good initial showings but thought he came back a little. mh seems ok to me but would be ok with hh. just wasn't sure he consistently stayed at that level.
guess i'm the only one reading some of the champions? kamala at hm feels good to me but whatever you all decide is fine. she's reed with a bigger powerset but less brains.
cosmic ghost rider?
domino? lm?
ironheart? hm?
devil dino? mm? moon girl? ms because of her brains, or higher?
shuri? lm?
squirrel girl???
gentle? mm?
namor?? lh??
mr terrific? mm?
jon? lh?
should be list the injustice characters?
I also thought about Black Lightning to mid meta when I first took a look, so I'll probably shift my vote to that unless there are any specific showings that bump him up?
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geo-force--> High meta is ok given how wide the tier is
Clayface to mid-meta--> agreed
Cheetah to mid-herald--> agreed
O.M.A.C. to mid-herald--> rather have him low herald
The Weird to high-herald--> agreed
Blanque - low herald sounds good
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Devil Dinosaur - low meta
Namor - high meta (I mean, Wonderman and Brion are in that tier, he's not heads and shoulders above them)
Originally posted by Galan007High-end superspeed [just below Flash/Supes], high-end super-strength [just below Wonder Woman], claws/bite imo make her a very dangerous combination. I'd see her closer to the Shazam/Black Adam tier, than Hercules/Aquaman, but I can see why one can view it differently.
Cheetah to mid-herald- particular reason why MH? My initial thought is LH. /shrug
Originally posted by Galan007👆
The Weird to high-herald- pretty sure I agree. I want to reread his later appearances to be sure.
He's gotten in essence TP immunity, and his physicals/energy manipulation is as good as ever. Captain Comet [high-end TP/TK] literally ran away from him, lol.
Sorry, been a bit busy past few weeks!!
Black Manta - high meta (along with Aquaman 👆)
Dracula - high meta
Mera - high meta
Black Lightning - high meta
Killer Frost - low herald
Fantomex to -High Meta (shows what you know, Leo!!). Bear with me here. He's got the stats of street tier guy, who can take out a LOT of the glass cannons above him. Professor X would be an extreme example. don't forget, he also has that shrink ray he stole from Doom (which I still maintain is standard equipment):
https://imgur.com/a/IQfEK
And just for Phildo:
https://imgur.com/a/b4Fcl
Geo-Force - low herald
Clayface to mid-meta
Cheetah to mid-herald
O.M.A.C. to mid-herald
The Weird to high-herald
cosmic ghost rider - trans
domino - Don't know. I was saying we should have a haxx tier - Black Alice, Fantomex, Longshot, Aquarian, those kind of characters.
shuri - when she was BP? I remember her giving Namor a good fight, and fighting Proxima Midnight, but that was it.
squirrel girl - haxx tier.
namor - mid/low H
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Fantomex to -High Meta (shows what you know, Leo!!). Bear with me here. He's got the stats of street tier guy, who can take out a LOT of the glass cannons above him. Professor X would be an extreme example. don't forget, he also has that shrink ray he stole from Doom (which I still maintain is standard equipment):
I was gonna say, Fantomex misdirection powers can potentially take out many people above low-meta how does it make sense to put him in -low-meta? Dunno about that shrink ray being standard equipment I think he barely uses it.
I suspect that misdirection with weapons could take down some in high-meta. Abominations has been taken out by a high powered laser through the ears. It's possible for example that Abomination could be put down by a shot at point blank range to his ear. Fantomex doesn't carry a regular gun, it's entirely possible that those bullets could reach Abominations brain since they can change direction.
I suspect if you use your imagination he could take out others in HM (genuinely no sarcasm intended in post). By the way I'm not too sure were to put Fantom but LM seems too low to me.
EDIT: Actually I'm not too sure about that because maybe i'm getting real world biology mixed up with comic biology...so maybe point blank to the eye?
By the way it should be pointed out that Fantomex could potentially beat Ares and Aquaman. Ares has been put down breifly with a point blank shot under his chin and Aquaman is not immune to bullets either. Aquaman has taken an AK47 to the head it didn't do serious damage but it did cut him, also when engaging with guns he has been shown to cover his face with his hands since bullets can cut his skin. If Fantomex could get in close he could do some serious damage to Aquaman.
Originally posted by Galan007👆
Made these additions to the list because it seems like a consensus had been reached:What characters/proposals are we onto now?
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For some of the ones leo proposed...
domino - low-meta
namor - against him being moved to low herald
mr teriffic - against mid meta, low meta, imo
jon - I'd wait. He's just been aged up to teenage years.
**I also added Geo-Force to HM.
Originally posted by leonidas*I added Kamala to HM. You're about the only person here who seems to know anything about her, and I trust your logic.
guess i'm the only one reading some of the champions? kamala at hm feels good to me but whatever you all decide is fine. she's reed with a bigger powerset but less brains.cosmic ghost rider?
domino? lm?
ironheart? hm?
devil dino? mm? moon girl? ms because of her brains, or higher?
shuri? lm?
squirrel girl???
gentle? mm?
namor?? lh??
mr terrific? mm?
jon? lh?
should be list the injustice characters?
Cosmic GR- trans based on what I've seen, but GotG could very well end up demoting him.
Domino- LM
Ironheart- defer
Devil Dinosaur- MM
Moon Girl- I'd be very tempted to put her in at LM, tbh. She does have wicked intelligence.
Shuri- defer
Squirrel Girl- Are we factoring in the 'toon force' stuff as part of her standard powerset?
Gentle- defer
Namor- I'd say keep him at HM for now. If his current amps end up sticking, then we can probably start talking about bumping him to the herald tier.
Mr. Terrific- I'd be fine with LM or MM.
Jon- as Phil said, it's probably best to wait for a bit before we place him. I'm positive he'll be at least LH, though.
Originally posted by Deadline
By the way it should be pointed out that Fantomex could potentially beat Ares and Aquaman. Ares has been put down breifly with a point blank shot under his chin and Aquaman is not immune to bullets either. Aquaman has taken an AK47 to the head it didn't do serious damage but it did cut him, also when engaging with guns he has been shown to cover his face with his hands since bullets can cut his skin. If Fantomex could get in close he could do some serious damage to Aquaman.
It can cut his skin, but it can't get through his muscles. Bullets still bounce off Aquaman even after they break the skin.
Originally posted by -Pr-
It can cut his skin, but it can't get through his muscles. Bullets still bounce off Aquaman even after they break the skin.
Yea that's why after they cut his skin they bounced off......however that implies it could be a problem if bullet attacks were sustained and if they were at point-blank range in vulnerable areas such as the eye this could be a problem.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Even a blind Aquaman would probably kill him, though. His senses are good enough otherwise, and he has more advantages than Fantomex does.I originally didn't vote for Fantomex at all because I just don't know where he'd rank.
I don't think it would blind him it would KO him. His sense won't do anything if he's being misdirected, which is what I supect it would take for him to get that close in the first place.
I'm not sure where he goes either but I think LM is too low.
Originally posted by -Pr-
I can't see it knocking him out, but that's me. Does Aquaman's telepathy not protect him from misdirection?And now I'm wondering if we need a tiers discussion thread.
Well the question is how tough do you think his brain is? Do you think his brain is tougher than his skin? Obviously his skull is bullet-proof but what were looking at is the blunt forced trauma shockwave going through his eye socket and reaching his brain. Some gunpowder is bound to get through and singe his brain and it's possible that fragments of the bullet may break off and go through his eyesocket (Or would it just flatten? His bullets are ceramic.) I doubt that Aquamans TP would help he's used it against Wolverine, a reality warper, one of Apocalypse's sentient ships and I'm pretty sure hes used it on Psycloke at some point (long time since I read X-force).
I dunno maybe, I thought we always had discussions in tier threads?