Originally posted by Da Pittman
It really does annoy me that you keep using this argument, have you done your own research on evolution, the big bang theory, macroevolution, quantum mechanics, genetics and I can keep the list going and going and going like the Energizer Bunny. You post links to research all the time and more times than not as proof of your claims so why oh why is it valid for you to do it and not us?
Because when I do it the link gets ignored or discounted.
Originally posted by JesusIsAliveAnd the difference in when we post links is, you discount them and ignore them as well.
Because when I do it the link gets ignored or discounted.
OH wait that is the same.
So what is the difference again in your posting links to research that you haven't done personally and others posting links?
What about my other questions, or are you going to ingnore those as well? 😖
Originally posted by Da Pittman
And the difference in when we post links is, you discount them and ignore them as well.OH wait that is the same.
So what is the difference again in your posting links to research that you haven't done personally and others posting links?
What about my other questions, or are you going to ingnore those as well? 😖
I did that to show you the double-standard the exists. I take things by faith and you do as well.
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
I did that to show you the double-standard the exists. I take things by faith and you do as well.
There is a big difference; you have blind faith. The rest of us can be proved wrong, but not you, and that has nothing to do with being right.
As far as double-standard; no one reads my Buddhist sites, so stop feeling sorry for yourself.
Religion is based on control and domination of a group of people through the devotion to a belief system that can and/or cannot be proven. Control and domination through the threat of the torture of the soul after death if one does not believe as I say to believe (the term "I" being a reference to anyone who believe's their way is the only way).
Satanism is a religion that centers around the belief that the only thing that controls man is man himself and that giving in to 'carnal' desires is as natural as birth and death. That there is no afterlife and that once we die, if there is a soul it will remain here on Earth.
Christianity is purely based on the belief that there is life after death, that Hell is real and begins on Earth, and that the worlds were created by God who came to Earth as Jesus Christ to pay for our sins.
They each are based on beliefs. Beliefs people...not fact or fiction. No one really knows which one is right or wrong...it's a choice you make. Until we die we won't know what happens. I just hope I don't come back to this place.
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Question: did you personally conduct any of those peer-tested scientific inquiries that your entire, eternal future is based on? No? So then you are still (blindly) putting your faith in something/someone regardless.
Why do you assume that i have an "eternal future"? From what we know today, humans dont have immortality. Could you prove that the religious concept of "life after death" exists?
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
So I guess that the designer of a washing machine must first be proven to exist before any rational, sane person can conclude that it was designed? Is that what you are saying? This is ridiculous. Complicated design (of the magnitude of this complex system called earth) inherently points to an intelligent Designer. The human species is so complicated in terms of design, intellect, reasoning capacity, consciousness (which still cannot be explained scientifically), is reason enough to conclude that God exists. If I saw tire tracks, I would not need to prove that the tires that made the marks exist. Common sense (not peer-tested research based on the scientific method) dictates that at least the tires that made the tracks exists. I don't know how you can see this and understand this logic, yet not understand that the same logic can be applied to the existence of God (without seeing Him).
I already quoted something like this before. For man-made objects like washing machine, we OBJECTIVELY know that they are a product of design. With a little research, we could find empirically the designer's identity, purpose, and the mechanism of design, as we have experience that humans can make such things. For none-human made objects like the Universe, using religious myths to support a supernatural designer is stupid especially since We DONT HAVE OBJECTIVE and EMPIRICAL ways of finding the designer's identity, the designer's existence, the designer's mechanism for creation etc.. All we have are conflicting religious myths relying on SUBJECTIVE reasoning and BLIND FAITH as to validate its claim. According to the "sacred book" Vedas, Brahma created the Universe but the Bible-thumping Christians believe its God, so which religious interpretation is true and what makes it "truer" than the other? Why use a supernatural designer as an explanation for the Universe' existence when a natural and undesigned explanation like the Big bang would suffice. We still havent encountered any supernatural phenomena at all, so why make the huge illogical jump to a supernatural designer?
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
I have already stated that the Bible is historically, prophetically, and scientifically sound. I don't want to rehash that post.
I think everyone here is already aware of the dangers of using the Bible as a scientific tool. And historically speaking, the Bible has a lot more common with mythological stories like the Epic of Gilgamesh (just ask Noah) than real history.
Prophetically, these are the requirements for the real Messiah, the Jewish concept that Christianity borrowed, twisted, and misinterpreted to prove that they are right, that Jesus FAILED:
- The Sanhedrin will be re-established (Isaiah 1:26) - Unfulfilled by Jesus
- Once he is King, leaders of other nations will look to him for guidance. (Isaiah 2:4) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- The whole world will worship the One God of Israel (Isaiah 2:17) - Unfulfilled by Jesus. Christianity DROVE Judaism to the fringes.
- He will be descended from King David (Isaiah 11:1) via Solomon (1 Chronicles 22:8-10) - Fulfilled.
- The Moshiach will be a man of this world, an observant Jew with "fear of God" (Isaiah 11:12) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- Evil and tyranny will not be able to stand before his leadership (Isaiah 11:4) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- Knowledge of God will fill the world (Isaiah 11:9) - Unfulfilled by Jesus. Certainly not the Jewish one which this prophecy speaks.
- He will include and attract people from all cultures and nations (Isaiah 11:10) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- All Israelites will be returned to their homeland (Isaiah 11:12) - Unfulfilled by Jesus. Fulfilled by the Balfour declaration.
- Death will be swallowed up forever (Isaiah 25:8) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- There will be no more hunger or illness, and death will cease (Isaiah 25:8) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- All of the dead will rise again (Isaiah 26:19) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- The Jewish people will experience eternal joy and gladness (Isaiah 51:11) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- He will be a messenger of peace (Isaiah 52:7) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- Nations will end up recognizing the wrongs they did to Israel (Isaiah 52:13-53:5) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- The peoples of the world will turn to the Jews for spiritual guidance (Zechariah 8:23) - Unfulfilled by Jesus. not gonna happen anytime soon
- The ruined cities of Israel will be restored (Ezekiel 16:55) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- Weapons of war will be destroyed (Ezekiel 39:9) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- The Temple will be rebuilt resuming many of the suspended mitzvot (Ezekiel 40) - Unfulfilled by Jesus. Not gonna happen anytime soon with the Dome of the Rock sitting on top of it.
- He will then perfect the entire world to serve God together (Zephaniah 3:9) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- Jews will know the Torah without study (Jeremiah 31:33) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- He will give you all the worthy desires of your heart (Psalms 37:4) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
- He will take the barren land and make it abundant and fruitful (Isaiah 51:3, Amos 9:13-15, Ezekiel 36:29-30, Isaiah 11:6-9) - Unfulfilled by Jesus.
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
God does not have a beginning or end according to the Bible (which I accept by faith). For you to say that the Big Bang does not have a beginning is pure conjecture. How do you know that the Big Bang does not have a beginning? Has this been proven using the scientifc method? No? Then once again you have blind faith in something that has not even been empirically tested. You must admit that you are in the same boat as believers, whom you appear to have very little if no respect for. This is just my observation and I hope this does not offend you.
To assume that god designed/created the universe has MORE baseless assumptions attach to it than saying the Big Bang. First you have to assume that a religious concept like god exists, he is supernatural, he is eternal or at least exist before the Big Bang (uncaused), he has the power to create a universe, and that he is indeed the designer (and not some other god, basically you would also have to prove that there is only one god if youre into monotheism). That is at least 5 baseless assumptions with zero emprircal evidence backing it, relying only on blind faith. The Big Bang's existence is backed by solid emprical evidence and its one assumption, that it is uncaused could be explained by quantum mechanics which states that the so called law of causality breaks down at fundamental levels. Which of the two, supernatural god or natural Big bang has more explanatory power and which one is a dead weight?