Can Love and Sex be Separate?

Originally posted by Bardock42
That's a very broad question, there are many possible answers....depending on very many circumstances.

You'd like me to say "I dump her" or "I stay with her", but either are possibilities that all depend on the going of our relationship.

Also, you didn't ask me that question before, did you?

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura

If on the other hand there is no such understanding and/or the guy/girl did this either knowing it would hurt their partner then it is far more an act of betrayal as they didn't have the decency to not break the trust in the relationship.

What he said.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
dude, thats part of being in a committed rrelationship, being committed to your partner. most people with half a brain would agree with it. those who dont? swingers. Its not about jealousy, its about trust and respect.

and you never answered my question.

Actually that is about how you view a committed relationship (and how I do) - as in ones personal values on the matter, and the kind of things a person does or doesn't do in such a relationship. It has nothing to do with the % of brain a person has, just the bounderies one puts on a relationship.

Not all relationships are carbon copies.

Beyond considering things such as swingers, threesomes, open-relationships... what about a polygamous relationships (they existed once and still do in places)?

Or for that matter masterbation in which a visual aid is used?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
yes, in fact I did ask you that before. all I would like from you is an honest answer. the going of the relationship? lets just say that all is going well, and it is quite unexpected that she did this.

But then it is not going well. Well would be that we discussed it and she did it because she wanted to and I was fine with it. Lying to me is a whole different thing.

If she pretended that she would not cheat on me and then did then I wouldn't take it as easy. But if we discussed it and decided it is okay that would be ... well...okay.

Also, it is a FACT that you did not ask me that question before, don't pretend I disregard your points or questions, you just don't state (have) them (either)

Sex means love so no they can't be separate.If you don't love that person that you slepted with.Then that is not respecting that person at all and is wrong.jm

Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
Sex means love so no they can't be separate.If you don't love that person that you slepted with.Then that is not respecting that person at all and is wrong.jm

Utter bollocks.

Originally posted by Bardock42

Also, it is a FACT that you did not ask me that question before, don't pretend I disregard your points or questions, you just don't state (have) them (either)

Well I think this was original question...I think.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
but we are talking about if you would be OK if your GF went out and shagged some guy, and said "It was just sex, and I love you,"

Then you responded with this but it wasnt a straight answer..*shrug*

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, we do have very different views on relationships I suppose. I was just answering the question.

I could of course try to get a reasonable answer out of you why your girl can only sleep with you, but I guess it would just be circular arguments over and over.

Something like "She can't sleep with another person because I don't want that and I don't want that she sleeps with another person because it is wrong to sleep with another person when you are in a relationship and it is wrong because I don't want that she sleeps with another person when in a relationship..."

It probably comes down to "RJ doesn't want his girl to **** someone else for jealousy reasons" ... and that's fine, whatever gets you through your day. But just don't tell people that your way is better without any reasons.

Originally posted by Bardock42
That's like you saying I love apple pie so much I will never eat cheesecake again.

The problem with this anology is that its not unheard of to place this kind of emotional constraint on another person. To say that you love a person so much that you will never go out and have sex with, or cuddle with another person. It's not unreasonable to only show the affections of love to one person.

It is however ridiculous to do the things with food, to place such emotional attachments to one food that you forsake all others. The food doesn't have any emotions of there own, they won't be hurt if you go out and eat other foods. However your partner does have emotions and deep down might feel a little hurt.

One thing I find funny in this thread is people talk about accepting other people for having open relation ships, even though I get the distinct impression that none of the personally would be happy if the one they loved went out and slept with another person.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
cheating is the worst thing you can do to your partner, period. once they betray your trust, the damage is done.

I don't think cheating is the worst thing, dude, there are far worse things.

Your partner could be a scam artist and run away with all your money. Your partner could hurt one of your family members.
Your partner could go nuts and kill you.

or simply

Your partner may constantly put you down, trash you, and that my freind is far worse to me then being cheated on. When your partner is constantly putting you down, or judging your every move, that is abuse, and that to me shows that they don't love you for who you are, but for what they imagine they can shape you into.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
so if your BF was gone and you got horny, you would cheat on them? wow...what a weak willed individual you are.

No, I was just bringing up an example.

It depends how long I knew him, and how much I trusted him.

However, I need my partner to be there. I can't have a relationship where I only see my boyfreind once or twice a year. Sorry. I would so leave that guy, if that's how it was going to be. It doesn't matter how attracted I am, I can't do that.

Besides, you can't tell me that when you were with your girlfreind, you never watched porn, or looked at pictures of other naked women, or even fantasized about other women or celebrities.

Would you say that stuff is cheating ?

*wonders whats going to happen next* nuts

😆

Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
Sex means love so no they can't be separate.If you don't love that person that you slepted with.Then that is not respecting that person at all and is wrong.jm

It's called lust... You mix it with booze and sex happens.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Heh... Like warm apple pie... Anyway...

The problem with this anology is that its not unheard of to place this kind of emotional constraint on another person. To say that you love a person so much that you will never go out and have sex with, or cuddle with another person. It's not unreasonable to only show the affections of love to one person.

Yeah.

Originally posted by Creshosk

It is however ridiculous to do the things with food, to place such emotional attachments to one food that you forsake all others. The food doesn't have any emotions of there own, they won't be hurt if you go out and eat other foods. However your partner does have emotions and deep down might feel a little hurt.

Whatever.

Originally posted by Creshosk

One thing I find funny in this thread is people talk about accepting other people for having open relation ships, even though I get the distinct impression that none of the personally would be happy if the one they loved went out and slept with another person.

Er yeah that would be right and one person even mentioned it. However just because we dont like it doesnt mean it cant work for certain people.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Heh... Like warm apple pie... Anyway...

The problem with this anology is that its not unheard of to place this kind of emotional constraint on another person. To say that you love a person so much that you will never go out and have sex with, or cuddle with another person. It's not unreasonable to only show the affections of love to one person.

It is however ridiculous to do the things with food, to place such emotional attachments to one food that you forsake all others. The food doesn't have any emotions of there own, they won't be hurt if you go out and eat other foods. However your partner does have emotions and deep down might feel a little hurt.

One thing I find funny in this thread is people talk about accepting other people for having open relation ships, even though I get the distinct impression that none of the personally would be happy if the one they loved went out and slept with another person.

Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
Sex means love so no they can't be separate.If you don't love that person that you slepted with.Then that is not respecting that person at all and is wrong.jm

Originally posted by chillmeistergen
Utter bollocks.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well I think this was original question...I think.

Then you responded with this but it wasnt a straight answer..*shrug*

We should not lie here, sweetycheeks. The quote of Rogue Jedi there was a reply to you, not to me. It was certainly not a question aimed at me....in fact, it wasn't a question at all. Lets keep it fair and straight here, mkay?

Originally posted by Creshosk
Heh... Like warm apple pie... Anyway...

The problem with this anology is that its not unheard of to place this kind of emotional constraint on another person. To say that you love a person so much that you will never go out and have sex with, or cuddle with another person. It's not unreasonable to only show the affections of love to one person.

It is however ridiculous to do the things with food, to place such emotional attachments to one food that you forsake all others. The food doesn't have any emotions of there own, they won't be hurt if you go out and eat other foods. However your partner does have emotions and deep down might feel a little hurt.

One thing I find funny in this thread is people talk about accepting other people for having open relation ships, even though I get the distinct impression that none of the personally would be happy if the one they loved went out and slept with another person.

As for an open relationship, I would not mind that, so I guess I am the one here that's okay with it. Anyhow, it doesn't really matter cause it should be accepted even though no one here wants it.

Anyways, if anyone wants me to reply point by point to their arguments state them to me, I will in due time. Maybe some of you didn't understand what I (or themselves for that matter) said. So we could clarify that.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
However, I could easily argue, using your own presented logic, that if you truly love someone you would never yell at them, or take out your anger on them.

And in doing so, you would be drawing a False Analogy. There is quite a difference between raising your voice out of frustration, and fundamentally betraying your partner.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Really ? Maybe he has a rage problem. 😕

Maybe he has mental or emotional baggage that is too overwhelming for him to simply bottle up. Maybe he is hurt beyond simple repair, and needs special attention to tend his condition.

Maybe he is super sensitive, and cannot contain his hurt, and therefore would take anything I said or did the wrong way.

Maybe his fear of losing me is so great, that he tries to control me so I can never leave.

Maybe you are justifying bad behavior.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
It's likely that the same person who abuses me would be heartbroken and shattered when I left him. It's possible that he may feel guilt for years after I leave.

And his guilty would be the consequence of his abusive behavior.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
So if a driver hits my loved one, that means the driver hated my loved one ? That means the driver wanted to hurt my loved one ?

No, it means that whether the driver intended to harm your loved one or not, it does not change the fact that but for his actions, your loved one would not be hurt.

People do not live on good intentions. The pain that your loved one is experiencing is not suddenly acceptable, because the driver had good intentions, or if you prefer, did not have bad intentions. The situation is weighed against his actions. Ultimately, character is a measure of the man that you are, not the man that you intend to be.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
You can hurt someone, without meaning to or realizing it, and it doesn't mean you don't love them. All I can conclude is that you either:

1) Haven't seriously dated many men

or

2) All the men you dated have been the same

Or the parties involved in my relationships have behaved more maturely and taken the relationship more seriously than the parties involved in yours.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Well strictly speaking there are people with very liberal, "open" relationships. I would assume the people in them have an understanding and the nonexclusive nature of the physical side of the relationship works for them.

Now speaking personally that wouldn't work for me since my concepts of a personal relationship include a degree of exclusive commitment. I couldn't cheat on a partner and it would probably be it if a partner cheated on me because of my values in a relationship.

But at the same time I realise not everybody is the same. I don't think it is as easy as saying "thats not a committed relationship" since a relationship exists on more then a sexual level and some people might not put quite the same emphasis on sexual exclusivity.

Then there are things like threesomes and the so called "swingers" that apparently committed couples participate in, one assumes because in those cases they manage to separate trust, commitment and sex from one another. For them, so I've heard, the experience involving other people actually heightens their own happiness with their actual partner, adds to that side of the relationship. The minority perhaps, but they shouldn't be dismissed or their relationships somehow considered lesser.

By removing sexual exclusivity, they are no different than friends who occasionally have sex with one another, and it is arguable whether this qualifies as a true romantic relationship.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Can a person have sex with a person they are not in love with? Yes/No

Yes.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
If yes then is it possible for a couple to be happy, in love and committed even though they have agreed on open boundaries when it comes to sex since sex outside the relationship, since it would not have some sort of intent of love behind it or emotional significance, just being a physical thing? Yes/No

No. It is arguable whether a relationship with "open boundaries when it comes to . . . sex outside the relationship" qualifies as "committed." Without sexual exclusivity, they are committed to what exactly?

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
If yes then is that relationship somehow lesser/wrong/doesn't count because the couple have not subscribed to the traditional/conservative act of sexual exclusivity within their relationship? Yes/No.

It is not a matter of whether or not it qualifies as a relationship, but what kind of relationship it qualifies as.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Besides, you can't tell me that when you were with your girlfreind, you never watched porn, or looked at pictures of other naked women, or even fantasized about other women or celebrities.

Would you say that stuff is cheating ?

Why would you need fantasy and pornography if you are in a relationship?

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Why would you need fantasy and pornography if you are in a relationship?

T-to jerk off?

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
By removing sexual exclusivity, they are no different than friends who occasionally have sex with one another, and it is arguable whether this qualifies as a true romantic relationship.

That is odd. Then relationships to you are just good friends that decided to just **** each other?

Our definitions seem different.

Also, good going quadruple posting there ....