well it certainly makes sense, kain has all the cards
invcinbility, long range teleportation, repetoire of soul destroying magics among endless other powers
DMC team cannot defeat kain let alone Raziel as well who is almost his equel, this is almsot as bad as the MC vs a Chocobo thread lana had as an example of unfair threads 😄 na they would prob have a good fight but it would be in vain
Originally posted by Estacadono he wouldnt. dont underrate sarafanlord here. just becuz in devil may cry people are flying around in the game doesnt mean that when kain fights sarafanlord lord that they are fighting at a slugs pace. wrong. we have seen how fast kain can be and one can only say that sarafanlord can defend against speed otherwise how could he defeat kain. sure he had the nexuz stone but he was matching swipe for swipe.
Dante or Vergil would kill the Sarafan Lord in less then 5 minutes.Also the fighting system/combos of LOK compared to DMC is pathetic.
but when has kain actually reformed instantly from being destroyed like hellsing alucard has. even if he can, dante can still just use jackpot and he's got no defence against that.
yes, lok is sluggish compared to dmc. get back to me when lok chars put up feats comparable to dmc, in terms of fighting speed/skill
Originally posted by lightnesslok is sluggish but its just gameplay. we know kain can fight at an incredible speed by seeing him blur back and forth and with all of his abiliteis that we know he possesses. dmc is supposed to be fast action oriented fun with guns and what not so they emphazise that more while lok has always focused on cutscnes anbd the interesting story that the game offers.
but when has kain actually reformed instantly from being destroyed like hellsing alucard has. even if he can, dante can still just use jackpot and he's got no defence against that.yes, lok is sluggish compared to dmc. get back to me when lok chars put up feats comparable to dmc, in terms of fighting speed/skill
dante although quick reflexed and pretty powerful in his pwn right doesnt have the experience or the wits to match them up against kain.
Wits? As I've already said, Kain is a warlord, not a warrior...he has never used his abilities in creative way, neither in gameplay nor in cutscenes. He has never used his environment to his advantage in combat, for example. He's too much of a warlord to be a great warrior. He can be great with some prep plans etc, which he has demonstrated- and nobody in DMC team can be compared to him in that aspect...but sadly, there's no prep there.
Don't expect good leading skills from Dante and don't expect warrior mastery from Kain. And your Sarafan lord was just a human warrior, though eqipped with powerful magic...but that magic is the tailor-made-against-vampires one. All Sarafans were.
Swinging the two-hander in a blur motion is good but that's not that impressive. Dante is much more well-versed in greater number of weaponry- while Kain is limited just to swords and axes. Dante knows the idea that anything can be weapon in hands of true warrior- and yes- sharp metal and marble, when thrown with great velocity and accuracy, can kill. Lesser demons are no more durable then Sarafans without their armour (they are human knights, just equipped with anti-vampire magic).
Originally posted by Burning thought
its debatable wether that was teleportation or wether it was simply him breaking away the fakeness of his angelic cathedral like lair into the oblivion that it actually was unless it says somewhere that he teleported but it seems more likely that he did not since why would he teleport to space if he can battle in hell, its probably an illusion of hell or its the oblivion of hell either way its not space because it has clouds, another note is that dante is still standing normally without his wings so it must have been an illusion or a warping of hell.
Space or hell, anyways, Kain won't get out of there easily under his own power. Hell is even better since it's another dimension.
But the whole thing with meteors, stars and all that jazz points out to space...Dante being shown in human form in the end has plausible explanaiton- the same disc of mystcal energy he uses for his double jump.
Invicibility and soul sucking aren't the ultimate trump cards there. And since we have Mundus and Sparda Sr. for DMC team..I simply don't believe in Kain's soloing this.
I've seen said cutscene again- Dante never was in human form while in the fight. Mundus knocked him down to the Earth in the end of their fight, and that was on the Earth where Dante changed into his human form again and Mundus entered the lava pool.
And as for seconds before transformation- Dante probably stood on mystical energy disc then.
And it looks like orbital teleportation, since clouds are under them before they fight and they actually come DOWN into them.
Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
Have you noticed that red aura around Dante before the fight? That's most probaly that magical supporting stuff...be it created by Dante on his own or by Mundus.
Correction- red aura appears after Dante starts using the inherited might of high demonic lord (deflecting Mundus' energy blast with his eyes etc). That protective aura is a "projection" of Sparda form on Dante's human form...so it's the stuff that supports Dante while in space. By the way, that aura closely resembles one you have when you unlock "Super Dante" costume.
And the clouds are below them immediately after teleportation, they flied DOWN into them before actual fight. So it's safe to assume that that was true suborbital teleportation.
i agree certainly with the point that LOK has very sluggish gameplay compared to DMC games due to the reason quanchi has stated that DMC is an action oriented game most of all wheras LOK is story, to be fair this is shown in their move lists since kain and raziel each only have the reaver as their weapon and about 5/6 moves each with their blades which was disapointing from defiance
fly down into them, from what i saw, mundus doesnt teleport, he warps reality changing hell from the fake cathedral to show the void for them to battle in, when he does it Dante is still standing in human form although with Sparda energy in him exactley where he stood before which points to them still being in the same place and that its all an illusion since Dante does not seem to be flying, then Dante jumps and mundus flies up into the sky and there are clouds above them as Dante transforms into his sparda
Sarafan lord was never a human, he was a Hylden lord, ancient and powerful race, not to menstion in the last battle the lord has the reaver itself, however Elder kain seems to be the only one who can use its full power not to menstion kain used the nexus stone which is why kain was defeated hundreds of years before.
maybe kain will not solo this, perhaps that would be too far although its "possible" is all i will say, kain can use his powers for creative use proved in defiance when he uses TK to launch people into fires and spikes and his creativeness is pointed to throughout the games storyline since he is matching move by move across time space on several levels which is extremely creative and would take incredible intelligence to be able to do it without messing up too much.
but i think since the fight gives Nosgoth side Raziel who has many powers similiar to kain and perhaps not absolute but near invincibiity the fight would eventually go to Nosgoth, since playing DMC 3 i dont see the brothers as fast as i imagined them to be since they show some speed and skill most of all vergil but nothing that would make them far faster than kain, perhaps barely a little faster not to menstion although they see be underrated are kains vampire sons who have many powers themselves especially all together.
another interesting note in kains favour is that he beat the hylden, Sarafan knights and demons in his not so strong BO 2 form, young kain not the elder kain, since hes had many thousands of years to evolve as well as regained his old BO 1 powers fully by the end of defiance he must be rather formidable wouldnt you think
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzydMLP4Fjw
Let's look at that again- and Mundus flies DOWN, not UP in the end- look at his wings, he clearly plummets DOWN to the clouds- and Dante follows him. The thing that seems to be "flying up" in the end of the video is just our adversaries stabilizing themselves in the clouds. That's no "astral form" talk either- since the combat follows up without any "waking up" scene- they supported by magic (Dante's demonic aura is fully activated, and that's the same aura, BTW, that you can see in Super Dante costume). Dante jumps up, transforms and then DESCENDS into the clouds, following Mundus.
Mundus actually flies DOWN (watch him closing his wings and pummeting down) and Dante has to follow him.
And as for speed...
http://www.devils-lair.org/cutscenes/dmc3/low/22%20-%20M8%20-%20Leviathan.avi
There's famous scene with Dante chasing and effortlessly catching the sword which flies on METEOR speed which is much more impressive that any blur. Won't you agree?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_1kETIVweo
And now add this. Alastor grants its wielder the ability of lightning speed, speeding already incredible fast Dante to the point that those shards appear to be in slo-mo for him when he performs that combo. Unlike Qicksilver of Chronoheart, that's not timestop- Dante just moves THAT fast.
And then we add Quickheart to that. Voila! Kain's facing one fast son of a gun.
ime sitll not convinced that they were flying down, i mean why would dante jump down, thats impossible since he seems to be clearly jumping up, i still doubt its space since a clear argument is that even if were both wrong or one of us is wrong about wehre their going theres still the oddity that why would mundus go into space when he can probably battle far more effectively in his own home which is what i think hes doing, he must be in hell, same when dante is hit down into the lava area that would not be in space or on the world, it looks more of a hellish area.
he did not seem incredibly fast, quick id give him, faster than kain but he wasnt exactley moving much faster than the shards in comparison if hes supposed to be that fast, he wasnt moving at lightning speed in the cutscene, i would still rate sanguine sensher move equel to what Dante did there, moving the soul reaver back and forwards in a double arc in a blur is still extremely quick.
still speedy as dante or vergil are they would not be able to destroy kain in which case kain has all the time he needs. Simply impale one of them which even with their increased speed, even fi they use quicksilver its only reducing kains speed to an extent he would probably be moving at the speed of an average man in which case he could still activate his own time reaver stalemating their speed once again. Then hes free to use TK and spells like inspire hate to mess them up.
using TK to impale people is just as creative as breaking a fan, only in kains case he could break the fan down with TK instead of hitting it down, problem is kain would not need to, i mean why would kain use objects of the environment when hes got the reaver, perhaps the most powerful weapon in gaming, he wouldnt use a fan would he, not to menstion he doesnt enjoy fighting like Dante does, he doesnt have a sense of fun it seems
The larger shards appear suspended in the air to him...we view the whole picture from Dante's point of view...he moves so fast that those shards appear as not moving to him.
I missed with Sarafan lord...my fault.
And Dante's jumping UP, transforms and follows Mundus DOWN (Mundus actually plummeted down before Dante chases him). The lava area can be pretty much any volcanic area like the ones at Hawaii (from the times of Greek mythology volcanoes are said to be gates of Hell)...and if they were fighting in hell, then why they fight in those clouds at all? They could have duked that out among the fires of Hell (if it's where Dante ends up from your point of view, to me it likes more like a volcanic plateu then actual Hell).
It's more like plummeting down into the atmosphere from suborbital teleportation, then fighting and all.