Pre-retcon Molecule Man vs Spectre and Michael or Lucifer

Michael and Lucifer are equal in power and are the second strongest beings in existence next to the Presence . Feats ? Lucifer survived a Omniversal explosion at point blank without being affected aswell as the fact that he created his own Multiverse . He even ocasionally walks outside creation and such , even talking to or sometimes defying God . Molecule Man couldn't even bring Death back .
You want me to show you how powerfull Spectre is ? Let's take a look at Spectre before he was depowered by the Presence , and exactly how strong is he :
s151.photobucket.com/albums/s132/Erik_Magnus_Lensherr/?action=view&current=TheSpectre1-03.jpg

"His power once limitless now dormant , untapped" (Reffering to events prior to his failure to stop Anti-Monitor)

The Presence/God : Yours was the Power Omnipotent .
The Presence/God : Yours was the power to concievably Halt the Crisis on Infinite Worlds , and also to Preclude the epic struggle between Heaven and Hell.

Now this is the Presence talking , the supreme being in the DC Universe so I don't think there's anything to talk about . It is literally stated that Spectre , prior to Crisis on Infinite Earths had Infinite power and he was Omnipotent . Which is something that neither Pre-Retcon Beyonder or Molecule Man were , who were also superior to the Living Tribunal.

I mostly posted this because of the fact that this board is full of threads involving Spectre and Michael/Lucifer , without anybody really knowing what they are capable of . (Copy and Paste the link)

1. Pr MM was never shown going up against Gods oppositte right?? Ok he loses

2. He can't fight any of those beings powerless like Lucifer going in Deaths realm powerless and still able to kill her.

3. The power inside Michael can destroy everything.

Read up on DC

Originally posted by kevdude
1. Pr MM was never shown going up against Gods oppositte right?? Ok he loses

2. He can't fight any of those beings powerless like Lucifer going in Deaths realm powerless and still able to kill her.

3. The power inside Michael can destroy everything.

Read up on DC

1. If you mean GEB then yes Spectre did go up against it and did absolutely nothing to it. He even thought he was attacking the full figure of GEB and it ended up being his thumb. Ok Spectre loses.

2. Death in marvel and death in DC are different so the statement is inconsequential.

3. That statement is wrong in the DC universe alone.

Originally posted by Air Legend
1. If you mean GEB then yes Spectre did go up against it and did absolutely nothing to it. He even thought he was attacking the full figure of GEB and it ended up being his thumb. Ok Spectre loses.

2. Death in marvel and death in DC are different so the statement is inconsequential.

3. That statement is wrong in the DC universe alone.

Could MM go up against TOAA s oppositte if it had 1???

Could Pre MM go up against Marvel Death in her realm and still kill her?

Yes its been shown his blast would destroy everything 😱

See what im doing now?

Originally posted by kevdude
Could MM go up against TOAA s oppositte if it had 1???

Could Pre MM go up against Marvel Death in her realm and still kill her?

Yes its been shown his blast would destroy everything 😱

See what im doing now?

TOAA doesn't have an opposite and is truly supreme because TOAA writes everything we read. Presence isn't even Almighty in DC. Spectre went up against GEB and failed miserably. You act as if he actually challenged the GEB.

I said Marvel's Death and DC's Death are different therefore the statement is inconsequential. Did you not understand?

Yes that blast will kill everything including the Presence (his creator) and Lucifer. 🙄

Originally posted by Air Legend
TOAA doesn't have an opposite and is trully supreme because TOAA writes everything we read. Presence isn't even Almighty in DC. Spectre went up against GEB and failed miserably. You act as if he actually challenged the GEB.

I said Marvel's Death and DC's Death are different therefore the statement is inconsequential. Did you not understand?

Yes that blast will kill everything including the Presence (his creator) and Lucifer. 🙄

You don't understand oh well, and about Michaels blast of course it wouldn't kill them.

Just to a few other things to my post :

1.Pre-Retcon Beyonder's power was not limitless . It is stated that it's milion of times more than all of the rest of the multiverse combined , which means it's not infinite , since it's a quantity multiplied with another.
2.Pre-Retcon Beyonder is also not omnipotent , otherwise he would have been able to bring death back in a blink of an eye .

Spectre has him in both .

Originally posted by kevdude
You don't understand oh well, and about Michaels blast of course it wouldn't kill them.

dur You mean you don't understand. Just because you like DC more doesn't make the characters of DC more powerful.

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Just to a few other things to my post :

1.Pre-Retcon Beyonder's power was not limitless . It is stated that it's milion of times more than all of the rest of the multiverse combined , which means it's not infinite , since it's a quantity multiplied with another.

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
2.Pre-Retcon Beyonder is also not omnipotent , otherwise he would have been able to bring death back in a blink of an eye .

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Spectre has him in both .

Originally posted by Air Legend
dur You mean you don't understand. Just because you like DC more doesn't make the characters of DC more powerful.

How would you know if i like DC characters more then Marvel?? Marvel has more characters overall that I like then DC but DC goes crazy on there characters powers. The Beyonder is as powerful as anyone can be without going next to God himself. Try to keep your bm in check 😉

Originally posted by kevdude
How would you know if i like DC characters more then Marvel?? Marvel has more characters overall that I like then DC but DC goes crazy on there characters powers. The Beyonder is as powerful as anyone can be without going next to God himself. Try to keep your bm in check 😉

Beyonder did all these crazy things while imposing limits on himself. Beyonder was pretty much the God of Marvel, not the Biblical God, before he was retconned. Beyonder was reality.

After watching F4: rise of the silver surfer I did some quick research to find out who was the most powerful character of all time. I got TOAA and Presence hence the reason that was my former name. But after reading some comic books and looking at the scans on KMC I found out that the Presence was merely a character just like Astner said (damn him he was right lol). Reading the Crisis on the Infinite Earths completely proved this to me.

GOD/TOAA>Thanos HOTI, Classic Beyonder, Infinity Being, Presence (I really don't think I should put him with these three because his apparent fallacies)> everything else

God/TOAA is greater than everthing that is for sure because God/TOAA equals artist and writer. The rest is my opinion due to comic books, scans, and such. I just don't like how people say Presence is equal to TOAA because that is simply wrong. DC doesn't have a character that can match God/TOAA since God/TOAA are real people.

As for assuming you like DC more, sorry.

Originally posted by Air Legend
Beyonder did all these crazy things while imposing limits on himself. Beyonder was pretty much the God of Marvel, not the Biblical God, before he was retconned.

After watching F4: rise of the silver surfer I did some quick research to find out who was the most powerful character of all time. I got TOAA and Presence hence the reason that was my former name. But after reading some comic books and looking at the scans on KMC I found out that the Presence was merely a character just like Astner said (damn him he was right lol). Reading the Crisis on the Infinite Earths completely proved this to me.

GOD/TOAA>Thanos HOTI, Classic Beyonder, Infinity Being, Presence (I really don't think I should put him with these three because his apparent fallacies)> everything else

God/TOAA is greater than everthing that is for sure because God/TOAA equals artist and writer. The rest is my opinion due to comic books, scans, and such. I just don't like how people say Presence is equal to TOAA because that is simply wrong. DC doesn't have a character that can match God/TOAA since God/TOAA are real people.

As for assuming you like DC more, sorry.

Its funny when you say real people. They was written and and drawn just like everyone else in the comic world. And The Source = The Presence, they are 1 and the same. Infinite Being has some problems being on that list. Beyonder shouldn't be on that list either since its not up to date. And it could be anyone with the HOTU not just Thanos.

Originally posted by kevdude
Its funny when you say real people. They was written and and drawn just like everyone else in the comic world.

No they weren't. God/TOAA equal the artist and writer and they are above the omniverse/comic world.

Originally posted by kevdude
And The Source = The Presence, they are 1 and the same.

You'll have to prove that with a scan. The Presence= The Presence.

Originally posted by kevdude
Infinite Being has some problems being on that list.

Why?

Originally posted by kevdude
Beyonder shouldn't be on that list either since its not up to date.

That's why I said CLASSIC Beyonder.

Originally posted by kevdude
And it could be anyone with the HOTU not just Thanos.

Thanos was the only one with the HOTI and no, not anybody could. Thanos' body was able to absorb the power and not everyone has Thanos' body.

kevdude why did god pick thanos to have the hotu if just anyone could do it?

makes no sense to me. if anyman could do it why go to the trouble of having thanos go through with that whole charade. maybe uhm i think that since he had the experience and the willpower after the ig affair that he and only he could do it.

Anyways, Classic Molecule Man takes this.

I have been under the impression that Michael and Lucifer are about even in terms of power. Perhaps Michael has an edge power wise because of the Demiurgic Power.

Michael was imprisoned by Sandalphon for a lengthy time and Lucifer had to come and set him free.
Lucifer was 'nearly' killed by a Tarot deck(Basanos) in is OWN REALM.
These seem like small events in relation to their power set.

I can't speak on the Spectre as I am not as familiar with him. However, it has been said in this thread that Michael and Lucifer are above The Spectre.

Yo.

Originally posted by Air Legend
Really? And it didn't even destroy the AM. hmm...

well, according to pr-Beyonder Molecule Man blasted *him * with a shot which could have "Slagged several Billion ENTIRE Dimensions (Universes)".....yet it didnt do anything to Bey, nor did it even scorch the floor where he stood, or even put Volcanna in danger from being that close to such unleashed energy sources.

so I dont see where U can point a finger at Spec and call that into question, when 1 of MMs biggest feats is nothing by hyperbole, and from a being who was fairly ignorant as to his own nature, let alone 'zactly how powerful a blast he was hit with.

Tazer

Yo.

Originally posted by quanchi112
kevdude why did god pick thanos to have the hotu if just anyone could do it?

makes no sense to me. if anyman could do it why go to the trouble of having thanos go through with that whole charade. maybe uhm i think that since he had the experience and the willpower after the ig affair that he and only he could do it.

Man is not meant to know the will of God, so His reasons for doing so wouldnt ever make sense.

Tazer

Originally posted by Tazer
Yo.

well, according to pr-Beyonder Molecule Man blasted *him * with a shot which could have "Slagged several Billion ENTIRE Dimensions (Universes)".....yet it didnt do anything to Bey, nor did it even scorch the floor where he stood, or even put Volcanna in danger from being that close to such unleashed energy sources.

so I dont see where U can point a finger at Spec and call that into question, when 1 of MMs biggest feats is nothing by hyperbole, and from a being who was fairly ignorant as to his own nature, let alone 'zactly how powerful a blast he was hit with.

That just shows that the Molecule Man was holding back. He slagged several billion entire dimensions while having enough control to not destroy the surroundings. Had he gone all out he would have caused multiversal destruction, which he indeed did when he went up against the Beyonder, and you would have known this had you read the comic. Also, you're trying to call the feat hyperbole when Classic MM casually repaired MULTIVERSEWIDE destruction caused by the Beyonder with but a wave of his finger? LOL. Try reading the comic book before you spout shit about PR MM's feats.

Originally posted by Air Legend
That just shows that the Molecule Man was holding back. He slagged several billion entire dimensions while having enough control to not destroy the surroundings. Had he gone all out he would have caused multiversal destruction, which he indeed did when he went up against the Beyonder, and you would have known this had you read the comic. Also, you're trying to call the feat hyperbole when Classic MM casually repaired MULTIVERSEWIDE destruction caused by the Beyonder with but a wave of his finger? LOL. Try reading the comic book before you spout shit about PR MM's feats.