Are humans special?

Originally posted by Evil Dead
how does that make them special? what good does the existence of language, computers or the interweb do you if you're in the forest of Kodiak island? You seem to think that technological tools define the human species when it is merely the intelligence that allowed them to create that technology. I assure you, that intelligence is no match for hordes of grizzly bears. What are you going to do to survive.....eat your dsl cable? Are you going to fend off grizzly after grizzly with your mouse pad?

My friend...
Stop.
Clear your mind and listen for just a second, ok?
HUMAN"S GOT OUT OF THE JUNGLE USING THE VERY INTELLIGENCE YOU DISMISS! That's why man went on to form societies and build cities and why bears are still roaming the forest. Our 'mere INTELLIGENCE' and 'mere technolngy' allowed man to make weapons which kill bears. And also to build ships that take us into space, and to comprehend the secrets of the universe itself. Man has learned to touch the mind of God... bears are still eating fish in the forest.
Look, humans can be awful, no question about it, and there is much we can learn from our fellow animals about harmony and all that.
But humans are special (including you), so accept it.

Originally posted by Cap'n Happy
My friend...
Stop.
Clear your mind and listen for just a second, ok?
HUMAN"S GOT OUT OF THE JUNGLE USING THE VERY INTELLIGENCE YOU DISMISS! That's why man went on to form societies and build cities and why bears are still roaming the forest. Our 'mere INTELLIGENCE' and 'mere technolngy' allowed man to make weapons which kill bears. And also to build ships that take us into space, and to comprehend the secrets of the universe itself. Man has learned to touch the mind of God... bears are still eating fish in the forest.
Look, humans can be awful, no question about it, and there is much we can learn from our fellow animals about harmony and all that.
But humans are special (including you), so accept it.

Ant's developed civilization, warfare, farming, slavery, eugenics and specialized labor before humans did.

Being special is not actually that special.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
The top of the food chain is detritus eating bacteria. I don't see us unseating them . . . ever.

Really? You don't see humans unseating bacteria, ever? I had a little bacteria on my scraped knee the other day. A little squirt of Bactine wiped it right out.
Friend, do you really not think you are superior to a bacteria, which can not reason, feel or express emotions, cannot grow in any meaningful way? I don't think you actually think this.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Ant's developed civilization, warfare, farming, slavery, eugenics and specialized labor before humans did.

Being special is not actually that special.

Once again, it is a matter of degrees. Ants, after hundreds of thousands (millions?) of years are still living in their ant hills. We have come a thousand time farther in just a few thousand years. Ants do not have humor, art, music. They have sex to reproduce, we do as well, but we also love. I'm quite sure you wouldn't trade places w/ an ant.

Originally posted by Cap'n Happy
Once again, it is a matter of degrees. Ants, after hundreds of thousands (millions?) of years are still living in their ant hills. We have come a thousand time farther in just a few thousand years. Ants do not have humor, art, music. They have sex to reproduce, we do as well, but we also love. I'm quite sure you wouldn't trade places w/ an ant.

They still live in anthills because anthills are awesome. Not to mention we still live in towns and cities, far less efficiently than ants do.

I've never felt love srug

Depends on the ant.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
They still live in anthills because anthills are awesome. Not to mention we still live in towns and cities, far less efficiently than ants do.

I've never felt love srug

Depends on the ant.

Ah, you're being funny, I get you now. It's hard to tell sometimes. Yes, ants ARE awesome. And you hang in there- that special... someone... will come along and make you feel loved. Twice, if you're lucky.

Originally posted by Cap'n Happy
Really? You don't see humans unseating bacteria, ever? I had a little bacteria on my scraped knee the other day. A little squirt of Bactine wiped it right out.
Friend, do you really not think you are superior to a bacteria, which can not reason, feel or express emotions, cannot grow in any meaningful way? I don't think you actually think this.

lol

superior isn't defined by the human condition. For instance, from a bacteria-eye-view, the fact you cannot reproduce through division, steal DNA from other organisms, or motor around with a flagellum far outweigh the petty buildings and whatever that humans needed to build to survive, or their abstract, yet truly meaningless, art and philosophy which they only produce to compensate for their depressing existance (intelligence as a curse).

bacteria, as far as well adapted and survival is concerned, outshine us. Unless you define superiority in terms of being human, you can't really say you are superior to them. The fact that your life is dependent upon harmonious symbiotic living between you and numerious species of bacteria. Soil is dependant on bacteria. Human civilization and everything we take to be monuments of human invention, are dependent on bacteria.

We share this planet with a number of other species all of whom are as valuable as we are.

Originally posted by Storm
We share this planet with a number of other species all of whom are as valuable as we are.

actually, more valuable. Many other species, I'd dare say most, contribute more to the harmony of their ecosystems than we do......allowing other species to not only flourish but to survive at all by creating a niche for them to fill.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
actually, more valuable. Many other species, I'd dare say most, contribute more to the harmony of their ecosystems than we do......allowing other species to not only flourish but to survive at all by creating a niche for them to fill.

Originally posted by inimalist
lol

superior isn't defined by the human condition. For instance, from a bacteria-eye-view, the fact you cannot reproduce through division, steal DNA from other organisms, or motor around with a flagellum far outweigh the petty buildings and whatever that humans needed to build to survive, or their abstract, yet truly meaningless, art and philosophy which they only produce to compensate for their depressing existance (intelligence as a curse).

bacteria, as far as well adapted and survival is concerned, outshine us. Unless you define superiority in terms of being human, you can't really say you are superior to them. The fact that your life is dependent upon harmonious symbiotic living between you and numerious species of bacteria. Soil is dependant on bacteria. Human civilization and everything we take to be monuments of human invention, are dependent on bacteria.

Arent scientists on the verge of creating artificial life? 😐 Well ok then if were going to use bacteria as our benchmark for superioity we can say we humans can create artficial life, bacteria cant. We have tha ability in the not so far future to become independent from bactaria and have the power to control bacteria while bacteria does not.

Come to think of it though alot of creatures when it come down to it have similar values to that of humans. An ant has a sense of community etc, so to an extent we can compare human values to that of other creatures.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Arent scientists on the verge of creating artificial life? 😐 Well ok then if were going to use bacteria as our benchmark for superioity we can say we humans can create artficial life, bacteria cant. We have tha ability in the not so far future to become independent from bactaria and have the power to control bacteria while bacteria does not.

Come to think of it though alot of creatures when it come down to it have similar values to that of humans. An ant has a sense of community etc, so to an extent we can compare human values to that of other creatures.

the ability to create artificial life is only relevant if the ability to create artificial life is a quality by which you are defining "superior". This would again be the taking of what is the pinnacle of human achievement and saying "being human the best is the most superior".

and yes, many of the morals that we consider "human" are really just behavioural patterns that turned out best for genetics in many species.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Arent scientists on the verge of creating artificial life? 😐 Well ok then if were going to use bacteria as our benchmark for superioity we can say we humans can create artficial life, bacteria cant. We have tha ability in the not so far future to become independent from bactaria and have the power to control bacteria while bacteria does not.

Come to think of it though alot of creatures when it come down to it have similar values to that of humans. An ant has a sense of community etc, so to an extent we can compare human values to that of other creatures.

Way to completely miss the point. Sure we might make artificial life or travel to the moon but we'll never be capable of traveling in a bloodstream or metabolizing nylon or surviving at ridiculously cold temperatures without help from something. There are many many ways to define "special" or "superior" and at least one of them will apply to anything you care to imagine.

We were plasced upon the food line for a reason. We are smart. shud of known that you people.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
We were plasced upon the food line for a reason. We are smart. shud of known that you people.

Irony is ironic.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Way to completely miss the point. Sure we might make artificial life or travel to the moon but we'll never be capable of traveling in a bloodstream or metabolizing nylon or surviving at ridiculously cold temperatures without help from something. There are many many ways to define "special" or "superior" and at least one of them will apply to anything you care to imagine.

edit.

Originally posted by inimalist

and yes, many of the morals that we consider "human" are really just behavioural patterns that turned out best for genetics in many species.

If I use "human" standards and these standards are applicable to ants and animals then im not looking from a human perspective im looking from their perspective as well. I can these use these standards as a criteria for what is superior or better.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Way to completely miss the point. Sure we might make artificial life or travel to the moon but we'll never be capable of traveling in a bloodstream or metabolizing nylon or surviving at ridiculously cold temperatures without help from something. There are many many ways to define "special" or "superior" and at least one of them will apply to anything you care to imagine.

Is the point you that youare trying to make is that eventhough humans can create artifical life and travel to the moon its irrelevant because there are still things that other creatures can do that we obvoulsy cant do, such as survive in extreme cold without assistance.

Your other point is simply saying that I am using a human criteria for what is special or superior.

Instinctual nature is special, but the ability to disobey instinctual nature is even more special...,thank you conscious thought.

Yes, humans are special. More so than the fuzzy bunny, laughing hyena, slithering snake, soaring bird and marching elephant circus.

At any rate genetic engineering and going to the moon can be applied to the vaules of other animals and insects. Humans as well as other creatures on this planet want to survive, if I can survive better than anybody else then im superior.

An asteroid threatens to wipe out life on earth we escape and everything else dies im superior. If I can take the DNA of other animals and take their attributes and others im superior. If I can even use my science to make them better at what they do im superior.