Originally posted by pr1983
*coughwolverinecough*ds losing to superman isnt a low showing... superman always wins in the end, because he's superman... it isnt jobbing or a slight on superman, its just how his character has always been set up...
(Loisng to a character that ability-wise the said entity should dominate for the sake of a storyline = jobbing)
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
(Loisng to a character that ability-wise the said entity should dominate for the sake of a storyline = jobbing)
not when its superman... when he has to be, superman>everyone who isnt a god...
fair? maybe not, but i dont consider it jobbing...
Originally posted by Harry Fingerman
Wolverine is popular no doubt, but he's still not close to as popular as Superman. 😬
he's been more popular than superman for a while now... logan is on par with spiderman in terms of popularity...
Originally posted by Soljer
If I recall correctly, Spiderman and Wolverine are Marvel's number one and two, and are both above all of DC in terms of popularity.But I could be misremembering.
That could be true , but I'm referring to over all total popularity not just comic sales. I'm referring to household names. My grandmother has never bought a comic in her life , but she knows who Batman and Spider Man are. I really doubt she would know who Wolverine is.
Originally posted by batdude123
Wolverine isn't more popular than Superman.Where are you getting your sources?
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Sales. just read wizard. it tells you the top comic sales. The xmen and wolverine been kicking superman's asses for years. every now and then supers or bats cracks thier hold, but not for long.
I'm not talking about sales for comics. I'm talking in general.
Superman is generally thought of when you hear the word superhero...
And 'Death of Superman' will always be the best selling graphic novel of all time. 313
Originally posted by batdude123
I'm not talking about sales for comics. I'm talking in general.Superman is generally thought of when you hear the word superhero...
And 'Death of Superman' will always be the best selling graphic novel of all time. 313
It was so good. I think it was one of the turning points from me being a marvel zombie to a DC zombie.
Originally posted by Faceman
That could be true , but I'm referring to over all total popularity not just comic sales. I'm referring to household names. My grandmother has never bought a comic in her life , but she knows who Batman and Spider Man are. I really doubt she would know who Wolverine is.
To be honest, characters that are named something-man are easier to recognise and remember than others. Also, it could be argued that spiderman and batman got quite a bit of exposure through cartoons and all, more than the x-men at least. Batman even got that cheesy series in which Robin and him would go around with "pow!" and "biff!". THose were the days.
Originally posted by OualladaAnd those feats don't match up well against Superman's. Hence, Superman should win the fight. Correct?
Since they are runner's only feats, that is the level he is debated at.As for you believing that Superman is equal to or greater than Surfer and/or Thanos, that's fine. That is a story for another thread. Most logical posters on here would disagree though. Those threads already exist, and I will gladly debate either surfer or Thanos against Superman if a newer thread were ever to be created, and to be honest, I would fancy my chances.
Just to check on the last point. If I were to use SS losing to Thanos as evidence of Thanos > Superman, that would be ABC logic, right? However, Superman defeating other herald or Thanos level beings would not be ABC logic?
And I don't see what you're reitterating my comment of ABC logic. I was pointing out many of the debators place Thanos over Supes due to some very poor ABC logic, when the same can be done the other way.
There's nothing that puts Thanos heads and shoulders over Superman in pure power and combat prowess. Supes can on panel match up pretty much every feat Thanos has done under his own power. And then has hundreds on top that Thanos can't match. But you can't convice all the 'Thanos wins, SUPERMAN SUCKS!!!" people of that. And if someone did bother? Well, Superman and DC comics are just too powerful, and suck.
Originally posted by Juntai
And those feats don't match up well against Superman's. Hence, Superman should win the fight. Correct?And I don't see what you're reitterating my comment of ABC logic. I was pointing out many of the debators place Thanos over Supes due to some very poor ABC logic, when the same can be done the other way.
There's nothing that puts Thanos heads and shoulders over Superman in pure power and combat prowess. Supes can on panel match up pretty much every feat Thanos has done under his own power. And then has hundreds on top that Thanos can't match. But you can't convice all the 'Thanos wins, SUPERMAN SUCKS!!!" people of that. And if someone did bother? Well, Superman and DC comics are just too powerful, and suck.
Based on quality or quantity? I concede the quantity portion. Lemme know about the quality part.
I pointed out your comment on ABC logic simply because the flaw in using such logic applies both to the argument of runner > surfer and therefore runner > superman as well as the argument of superman > herald level and therefore > surfer. You can't have one without the other. Superman has A LOT of feats. How often does he turn the wheels of Mageddon? Let's use sports. A basketball player whose career spans twenty years is inevitably going to have games in which he racks up more points than he should. Should that player be judged on those games or on the average of said career over twenty years? If Thanos has half a century as a headliner to accumulate feats, you can then match the two together. Even as it stands, Thanos' highest feats include achieving ultimate power thrice.
As far as DC comics being too powerful, it's a wash in my opinion. I look at evidence, not companies.
Originally posted by OualladaQuantity and quality, Superman clearly has the advantage in the feat department entirely. What has he done that Superman hasn't accomplished similarly on an equal or greater level?
Based on quality or quantity? I concede the quantity portion. Lemme know about the quality part.I pointed out your comment on ABC logic simply because the flaw in using such logic applies both to the argument of runner > surfer and therefore runner > superman as well as the argument of superman > herald level and therefore > surfer. You can't have one without the other. Superman has A LOT of feats. How often does he turn the wheels of Mageddon? Let's use sports. A basketball player whose career spans twenty years is inevitably going to have games in which he racks up more points than he should. Should that player be judged on those games or on the average of said career over twenty years? If Thanos has half a century as a headliner to accumulate feats, you can then match the two together. Even as it stands, Thanos' highest feats include achieving ultimate power thrice.
As far as DC comics being too powerful, it's a wash in my opinion. I look at evidence, not companies.
I was pointing out the flaw in the logic as well, so to reitterate my point back at me was fairly moot.
I'm also not sure what you're getting at about Thanos' feats involving attaining ultimate type of power, beause that's beyond his personal powerset. In fact, they're not even 'feats' so much as plotlines in that regard.
Originally posted by JuntaiI'm also not sure what you're getting at about Thanos' feats involving attaining ultimate type of power, beause that's beyond his personal powerset. In fact, they're not even 'feats' so much as plotlines in that regard.
I think the point he was trying to make is that you need to average feats.
Originally posted by Ouallada
As I have said, Thanos is never going to blitz anyone, but his reflexes makes it difficult for him to get blitzed. Can I ask how we can tell from a panel that a character is going fast?
Difference is : you assume Fallen One was going Real Fast, while I don’t know his speed.
The way fallen one was emoting in that battle, plus the way illustrations were done, added to the fact that he is a higher end herald who has the ability to cover distance pretty quickly gives what I am arguing for some credence at least.
Obviously I cannot prove it, as there was no numerical evidence, but circumstantial evidence gives my claim credence.
Like I said a million times before : you just don’t know that. Not in the least.
How would you disprove it then? Show me why he was going at "2kmph"?
See ? Here is my previous post.
That's a speed feat from Thanos ? A proof of his superior reflexes ? Now, it could be considered as a one time "speed feat", but the problem is : we don't have the slightest idea how fast Fallen One was going.2 miles an hour ? 15 miles an hour ? Speed of sound ? Speed of light ? Your guess is as good as mine.
So don't twist my words, I said : we don't know his speed. All the rest is up for debate.
You seem to be confusing speed with reflex. The former is needed to blitz. The second is needed to avoid being blitzed. Similar, but a fine line.