Originally posted by Zack Fair
JustFrame I've been watching some SSF4 videos and you were right about Ryu's Metsu Hadoken still doing decent damage. I believe he will still be top tier even with no Ultra after a traded Shoryu and a 2 hit Shoryu. A decent Ryu does not rely on traded shoryus and raw ultra damage for his wins. His fundamentals are still top of the line.
Yep, I'm in contention to believe Ryu will be one of the best again (Top-3 imo from the theory evaluation of what is known about the SSF:IV cast thus far). The most visible aspect is that, he's only lost one "way" to abuse his Ultra and still has 23904823904283 other ways to land it. That's like 2nd Impact Ken with SAIII...he lost alot of links going into 3S but still had a million other ways to land it anyhow.
Only difference here is that Ryu was #2 in SF:IV, and in SSF:IV with what we do know, the only "potential" character to arguably be better then him now is possibly Dudley (Again due to all of the hype he's getting).
Regardless of the fact, I would like to make a note and agree with Zack on this that this is definitely not a glorified DLC. It is a completely new Street Fighter game in itself, the fact that everyone who's played this game has made a strong notion that it's characteristics, game engine in many aspects are very different from SF:IV which can change alot of things.
Not to mention the unveil of new characters (10 new characters in ridiculous...even Tekken 6:BR the upgrade to T6 didn't boast this many new characters), stages, etc, etc. This is already 10000000000000x better then the crap you get with all of them "Guitar Hero" garbage or Madden garbage, which changes little to almost nothing in their "every year" revamps.
Even in comparison to Tekken6:BR, which was a upgrade from Tekken 6, SSF:IV has far more change ups then even BR had, and by a large landslide magnitude. This game is definitely worth $40 dollars and in honesty, it's worth being a "new game" price entirely. If anyone (Not saying anyone does btw, but *just* in case) here buys crap like Guitar Hero, Madden Series, NBA Series, etc, etc all those that spawn a new game literally every year and for the ridiculous "new price", then you shouldn't say anything.
Capcom is doing ALOT for SSF:IV, so support this game because they are one of the few Companies left who actually Make Good Fighting Games.
I'm calling it now, Look to this Fighting Game garnering the Biggest Roster of Competitors for Evolution 2010, remember that last years Evolution, SF:IV broke or should I say annihilated all Evo FG tournament entry records with over 2000+ competition entree's or w/e it was for SF:IV alone! The second closest to that in Evo history was for 3rd Strike back in 2005 which garnered slightly over 100+ which is already amazing, however 2000+ is full of WOW.
SSF:IV will definitely be the headlined game for Evolution 2010, Bet it on it!
Ps: Here's to Wong taking it! (I know its super, super early, but USA FTW baby!)
4 every1 who just has 2 no Y I type this way. I dropped my phone a while ago and 4 sum reason the alphabet and just the alphabet has Bcome almost unresponsive. 2 type a letter means I have 2 push down on the screen very hard and I don't want 2 damage my screen so I try 2 use actual letters as little as possible. I've been meaning 2 get it fixed but I never got around 2 it. The dash I put NBtween letters and stuff was so that people can understand it better but now I C that I don't really need 2 use the dash anymore.
Originally posted by JustFrameI'm calling it now, Look to this Fighting Game garnering the Biggest Roster of Competitors for Evolution 2010, remember that last years Evolution, SF:IV broke or should I say annihilated all Evo FG tournament entry records with over 2000+ competition entree's or w/e it was for SF:IV alone! The second closest to that in Evo history was for 3rd Strike back in 2005 which garnered slightly over 100+ which is already amazing, however 2000+ is full of WOW.
SSF:IV will definitely be the headlined game for Evolution 2010, Bet it on it!
Ps: Here's to Wong taking it! (I know its super, super early, but USA FTW baby!)
Wh-wha-Whaaat????!!!!! Someone is actually cheering for J.Wong?! People hate on that dude so hard. I even seen cats complain that he shouldn't be able to participate in tourneys cuz he got a "head start". I'm like, it's one thing to hate the game but to hate the player, a human being? I can respect dude totally and I hope he wins as well. US is always laggin' behind JP on the tourney scene and we buy the damn games more than they do! Daigo has even said he enjoys US tourneys far more than the ones at home. It's cool to know that a top JP player would rather play in the US, but he's goin' down this time and for everyone who hates on Wong, beat'im 1st!
Also, Dudley is gettin' hella hype but it's gonna fade soon. My cousin got a chance to play at Wondercon and he says that Dudley is top tier wit whole bunch of stupid ways to connect his ultra but he doesn't deal much damage at all. He tells me that their is no such thing as a Sagat tier in this version. EVERYONE got damage nerfed HARD and players are gonna have to FADC to Ultra multiple times if that's all they are gonna rely on. He actually gave me a bit of hope for Guile, too. He says that Guile didn't get nerfed at all, only his Ultra's like everyone else. And he said he even seen somebody Flash Kick, FADC to Sonic Hurricane.
I think J.wong is awesome.. I always root for him when he's battling.. most of the people that hate him say he talks alot of crap.. but whether thats true or not.. I think that kind of thing comes with the territory?.. I very honestly rarely come across someone who has any kind of sportsmanship when I play against / check out a tourney IRL.. it seems very cut-throaty in terms of balancing being friends with people.. and then meeting them on the battle field and having to destroy them in front of hundreds of people
I also think $40 for SSFIV is an amazing price.. people put out farrrrr worse garbage and charge 60 for it.. (WET, anybody?).. but then again I'm in love with fighting games..
Also.. how the F can you flash kick > FADC > Hurricane? lmao.. I thought you cannot leave the ground in order to FADC
I'm looking for someone to play as besides Ryu tbh.. I still cant do a SRK > FADC > METSU whenever I want during a real match.. so now wit the whole 2-hit thing, I'm sure my chances have gone straight down the shitter XD.. have my eye on Adon / Guile / Vega (claw) atm
Originally posted by SaTsuJiN
I think J.wong is awesome.. I always root for him when he's battling.. most of the people that hate him say he talks alot of crap.. but whether thats true or not.. I think that kind of thing comes with the territory?.. I very honestly rarely come across someone who has any kind of sportsmanship when I play against / check out a tourney IRL.. it seems very cut-throaty in terms of balancing being friends with people.. and then meeting them on the battle field and having to destroy them in front of hundreds of peopleI also think $40 for SSFIV is an amazing price.. people put out farrrrr worse garbage and charge 60 for it.. (WET, anybody?).. but then again I'm in love with fighting games..
Also.. how the F can you flash kick > FADC > Hurricane? lmao.. I thought you cannot leave the ground in order to FADC
I'm looking for someone to play as besides Ryu tbh.. I still cant do a SRK > FADC > METSU whenever I want during a real match.. so now wit the whole 2-hit thing, I'm sure my chances have gone straight down the shitter XD.. have my eye on Adon / Guile / Vega (claw) atm
Wong is an amazing player but he did come off as a douche when he started jumping around celebrating before even ending the championship with Daigo in Evo. I excuse him because he was probably excited as hell, and it just shows how personal their rivalry is IMO--which kind of lol-
The 2-hit Shoryu cancel won't be hard if its anything like Ken's FADC. Try doing Ken's FADC. Its more forgoving than RYU's IMO. Maybe not since it is just a matter of learning the timing.
I read in Shoryuken that Gouken's Flip has been nerfed. Does anyone know anything about this?
Originally posted by Mr.Biscuits
SRK > FADC > Metsu is easy mode. Just hit up training mode for 5 minutes, literally.Also you can leave the ground to FADC. Ryu's do it all the time when they land a Fierce SRK.
If anyone is down to play On Live let me know. SRG Skeetz is my Tag.
Agreed. By the way good matches earlier. Looking forward to playing your Sim a couple of dozen more matches. I need to get used to the matchup since you don't get to fight that many Sims. 1 thing that inmediately struck me was how I am too agressive. And only when getting poked 2-3 times in a row from across the stage did it register lol.
Reminds me of the frustration/annoyance factor when I was working on the Sagat matchup. Which is great because I like learning from my mistakes.
Giefster vs Makoto
Adon vs Sagat
Dudley vs Cody
I'm so hyped for this game
Agreed. But IMO if a Sim's zoning is on point and he doesn't screw up it is hard to nail him. There is of course psychic DP but meh
Sagat is teh powerz. But seriously its fun fighting Sagat as Ken. Working for getting in, mind games shenanigans and trying to avoid getting thrown/Tiger Kneed your ass to the other side of the screen.
I just started using Ken last night. Well not started since I've used him before but never got his combos down etc. Trying to learn the key positions/tactics etc. Every once in a while I kind of forget am Ken and start playing ala Ryu which aint good and viceversa.
I like Wong because he's a Showman, he gets excited, he is brash and open. To me, that's nothing new in the fighting game scene, or should I say, the competitive world period.
Look to Ali...he was brash, confident and a champion, the samething goes with Wong, it's competition and when he wins, he shows it. To me, when people try to say that you should "calm" show no "emotion" and look "respectful" like how some of the top japanese players are to me is absolutely outrageous. Everyone has a different personality and thus, to me, showing excitement for a game and even being cocky in a sense is nothing "bad". Wong jumps up and down and ups the crowd and he's a "disrespectful" player makes me laugh really.
However, nearly 90%+ of the people who claim this most likely don't have alot of experience playing in the FG competition or have absolutely zero first hand experience in this. Ever since Street Fighter II hit back in 1991, you had your "calm" champions and your "showmen" champions.
Look to Mike Watson back in his younger prime days, he was an absolute trash talker, and not only would he talk smack, but he would do it while in play, that was his style, that was just how he did it to win, he used it as a strategy. Tomo Ohira was calm, didn't talk, didn't say anything, he was the "calm" Ryu type guy, and what a coincidence that he dominated with Ryu as well.
I've had guys who would beat me, and then get up and talk smack, jump up and down and will not shake my hand. I've had that happened many times before in my own personal experience, and I just except it, because that's how some people are. Wong is a super nice guy if you've ever met him face to face, and the guy is so open to helping you to improve your gameplay, so what his emotions show during his recorded matches is just his enthusiasm of winning, and nothing more.
To me, there's absolutely nothing, and I mean this, absolutely nothing wrong with how Wong portrays himself during these match ups, that's just Hype, people need to get over it and understand that. Because guess what...even Top Japanese players do that. Heck, go back to 3rd Strike where a few of the Top Japanese players when they beat the USA players they where taking off their shirts throwing them out the crowds and wouldn't even shake their hands.
That's just competition and the spur of the moment things, and we need to except that. Regardless of how you may "view" Justin Wong, the guy destroys basically everyone in the USA, all over the world besides a "few" of Japan's absolute Elite (Remember, when he went to SBO, he was destroying basically everyone there who's name wasn't Daigo, Mago, and a few others, even some as great as Tokido was getting total ocv by him).
We aren't far off from them at all, and with SSF:IV coming in both countries at the same time, there is no "advantage" to Japan who usually gets these games months before we do and thus have a clear advantage in practice and learning the game.
However, I will say this, now in the present day, we don't play nor are we as competitive in the FG World as we once were in the Golden Era Days, that's an absolute given. Even someone as good as Wong has stated that he doesn't play 8+ hrs a day due to other factors in his life, and yet he can compete with Japan's best says alot to you and me. "If" this was 1993, I'd vouch US would have easily equaled if not even beaten Japan in SFII back then, that's how ridiculously amazing those Top Players were back then, however today, it's just not the same scene anymore.
In fact, Japan wasn't even "dominating" us until a little after Alpha 3, everyone remembers the Valle vs Daigo in A3, however if would have went the full Best out of 7 AS they were supposed to do, I wouldn't be surprised if Valle would have came back to win it. Remember that Valle outfootsied Daigo the entire match up, however Gouki in A3 had the most stupid VC which helped Daigo alot. In fact, they were supposed to do a "Japan Style" Winner of One Set and then the Best of 7 for the USA Style...and if everyone remembers...Daigo Lost in that "Japan Style" however the "Capcom" Rep's didn't do anything, and only when Daigo was up 2-1 did they say "Okay Daigo, you win!". Yeah, that's why Valle had the look of "WTF are you guys doing?" and he went to talk with the reps about it.
However, the man that he is, he just said forget it and let it go, a True Champ. If it was me, I would've been like "Umm...what's going on and I ain't done until I've played was supposed to have taken place!", but that's just me.
Anyhow, in Alpha 2...Valle went to Japan, and they couldn't even touch the guy in that game. All of Japan's Top's played him, and every single one of them got annihilated, this wasn't even a Valle vs Daigo in A3 lvl close, this was a Valle manslaughter to Japan's best. In 3S, Japan annihilated us cleanly because we started the game like 5+ years after they took it seriously already. In ST, Team USA lost to Team Japan, however I'll say this much...Valle, Choi's games were not ST, Mike Watson of 2000 was not 1991 and especially 1994 Watson anymore, "had" this of been like SFII with Tomo, Jeff, Wats in their prime, nobody on that Japan Team would have had a "winning" record against these guys.
So to me, although Japan "wins" they aren't so far ahead that they destroy us (Except in 3S, they are much, much, much better then we are in there, that game is pretty much like their MvC2 vs the US). To me, SSF:IV being released all over the world at the same time, anything can happen really. With the same equal amount of time, experience to play the game, anything can happen. However, first things first, we need to stop "copying" Japan's play style, it's ridiculous to how when I talk to some players today who are looking to get into the scene they'll be like "Youtube Japan and study them, they know their stuff".
Wow...if I was "able" to do this back in the early 90's and copied Japan...No way would my footsie game be as good as it was...because back in the those days...USA>>>>>>>>>>>>>Japan when it came to sheer zoning and footsies in the game of SFII.
To me, too much people bank on this, and need to find what truly works for them. I know I may get "branded" for this, however I'm going to say it, although I'm not a Top Player and would only "dream" of beating him, I feel that Daigo really isn't capitalizing on Ryu's footsie game enough. He plays him too aggressive in many cases, and that's his style of play, however if he changed it to a more footsie, zoning mentality, his Ryu would become absolutely Unstoppable.
Yeah, so I got alittle off, like I always do, however in my book, if we really dedicate and practice like we should, and had that drive, I guarantee it would be extremely, extremely close in this year's Evolution. Remember...Wong was One Single Set away from winning it all, and coming out of Loser's Bracket he had to win more, I'm sure I've mentioned this, but he was up 5-4 against Daigo, however due to the rules there Daigo took the win w/ less since he was from the Winner's Bracket.
So brush up, anticipate and wait, this year's Tournament can potentially be very, very equal for all countries who will come to represent in playing SSF:IV. I'll be looking forward to it, and so should everyone else, regardless of whom you root for.
Ps: The only guy I never really gave alot of respect for was a player who played for MvC2, forgot his name, but he threatened people's lives before "showing" up to the Evolution Tournament, and thus was not allowed to participate...now that is Poor Sportsmanship and just being downright stupid. However celebrating after a win and being a little cocky, that's Fine.
Regardless of how you may "view" Justin Wong, the guy destroys basically everyone in the USA, all over the world besides a "few" of Japan's absolute Elite (Remember, when he went to SBO, he was destroying basically everyone there who's name wasn't Daigo, Mago, and a few others, even some as great as Tokido was getting total ocv by him).
Justin went to Japan weeks prior to EVO and then again for SBO and wasn't doing much besides getting put on blast by Some Bison at that TRF tourney and then that Gief who ocv'd the U.S team in the 5 v 5 tourney.
Sabin who was in Japan for months told me in person how Justin was doing in Japan. Rufus isn't a big deal to Japanese players since they can Option select on Rufus all day.
Originally posted by Mr.Biscuits
SRK > FADC > Metsu is easy mode. Just hit up training mode for 5 minutes, literally.Also you can leave the ground to FADC. Ryu's do it all the time when they land a Fierce SRK.
If anyone is down to play On Live let me know. SRG Skeetz is my Tag.
well thats the thing.. I can do it in training mode fairly reliably. but I guess its like the whole 'in the moment' thing that has me screw it up during a match..
they can FADC a fierce SRK cuz its still on the ground when it hits