Racism

Originally posted by chithappens
I don't think his point is to say you should feel guilty. Should you care? Yes, because it affects the things you do today no matter who race you are.

People tend to identify "the system" with "white people." A fallacy since all white people did not contribute to it, but also has some validity since the world and it's paradigm is clearly dominated by people of European origin.

I do not judge all white people. I see the origin of how the present got how it is. It does not mean white people should feel guilty. Does not mean minorities should feel entitled. Everyone is getting screwed, but there is no honesty among us to just talk about WTF actually happened.

The majority of people (as an entire population) have a minority of power cause they continue to bicker over dumb chit. Kinda ironic. It's nothing but the Art of War and Machiavelli on a massive scale.

Nice to see one "black person" is clear headed and doesn't have a racist agenda in here. Kudos.

Originally posted by chithappens
Nice analogy. I won't steal it though 😆 . It is an accurate way to depict what is going on now. I hold no grudge against white people at all; they did not do it as individuals so why be mad at them?

I get angry when people act like I'm 🤪

ESPECIALLY after I've done my research, and have viewed a subject from MANY different angles.

Originally posted by chithappens
The lies seem to just teach us that think just "are" rather than have us consider how they got that way.

AGREED.

Originally posted by chithappens
Same with the images: Truth of the matter is that there are more poor white people than any other people in the U.S. Would I ever believe that without federal stats? Hell no, but it is the truth. Sadly, poor white people seem to be mistakenly extinct; societal images say that hardly none exist.

True. Very True. Like the majority of welfare recipients are White.
But we (African Americans) get the stereo type.

Funny it is.

Originally posted by chithappens
But we are way off topic and will probably not address this issue. 🤪 🤪

True Wisdom is often off topic 😄

Originally posted by chithappens
I don't think his point is to say you should feel guilty. Should you care? Yes, because it affects the things you do today no matter who race you are.

Not to the extent people are claiming.

I care about the past (as a whole not just the actions of whites and blacks) only because of it's role in shaping the general form of the present. The crap the whites have done in the past says nothing about whites in the present.

Originally posted by chithappens
People tend to identify "the system" with "white people." A fallacy since all white people did not contribute to it, but also has some validity since the world and it's paradigm is clearly dominated by people of European origin.

I'll give you that much. Europe had a technlogical head start so it's just natural that they'd spread faster and take what influence they could.

Originally posted by chithappens
I do not judge all white people. I see the origin of how the present got how it is. It does not mean white people should feel guilty. Does not mean minorities should feel entitled. Everyone is getting screwed, but there is no honesty among us to just talk about WTF actually happened.

Well this I agree with for the most part. But the facts of the past only tell you how we got into this mess. Looking only at the past gives a very skewed picture of the present.

Originally posted by chithappens
The majority of people (as an entire population) have a minority of power cause they continue to bicker over dumb chit. Kinda ironic.

People are morons. Always have been always will be. The smart ones either leave or take over.

Thats just a fact of human nature.

Originally posted by chithappens
It's nothing but the Art of War and Machiavelli on a massive scale.

Ermm . . . wut?

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
OK found it.

How can you smile offensively? Jocks are hardly a good example for anything but jocks.

The way these things are run most of the cooperative people get edited out (more often in comdey interviews though).

10 college students is also not a representative sample.

You smile offensively when you have that offensive and cringed look about you while blushing and sporting a even linned smile with tight lips. Like the girl was doing just before she nodded.

Why would cooperative people be edited out. I'd be a good project if he was able to obtian answers of all kinds. And I don't the film wasn't being made in order to record statistics. I was just a simple classwork project or a short doc.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
Why would cooperative people be edited out.

Ever seen parts in a show when the go out and ask simple questions to random people and "every" person gets them wrong. They just take out the people who get it right to give a bigger impact.

But like I said thats more common with people who are just trying to be funny.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
I'd be a good project if he was able to obtian answers of all kinds. And I don't the film wasn't being made in order to record statistics. I was just a simple classwork project or a short doc.

So he wasn't trying to demonstrate anything and he really didn't end up demonstrating much except that the relatively small number of people he spoke to didn't want to answer a rather akward question on tape.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
But claiming that I feel guilty is extremely innacurate. I feel absolutely no guilt for being white or even for being middle class.

My problem isn't with guilt. Guilt is an emotion that never "Helped" anybody.

I'm more concerned about the assumed innocence. Assumed innocence being:

Slavery was along time ago. Everybody's dead. Get over it.

My issue is with accountability.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Obviously the system underwhich I live is messed up but I honestly don't feel guilt for benefiting. I also don't smile when I see homeless people.

I feel you. You shouldn't feel guilty. But you are benefiting. I don't want you to stop benefiting. I would just like a chance to enjoy the same benefits. I already enjoy the same problems.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
The system has problems and I don't think anyone denies that. What does irk me is the tendency of people to identify the system and white people. To paraphrase the Grapes of Wrath "men created the monster and now they have no choice but the obey it".

True. But please understand, that THIS system was built FOR white people.
Hence the generalization.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Ever seen parts in a show when the go out and ask simple questions to random people and "every" person gets them wrong. They just take out the people who get it right to give a bigger impact.

But like I said thats more common with people who are just trying to be funny.

So he wasn't trying to demonstrate anything and he really didn't end up demonstrating much except that the relatively small number of people he spoke to didn't want to answer a rather akward question on tape.

I've never seen such a show. Jay Leno every so often has a skit where he goes out and asks people the simplest questions and some get them wrong but some do get them right and he's trying to be funny doing it.

The kid seemingly tried to demonstrate or show that what peoples feeling or ideas were on the matter plainly. But i don't think it a akward question..

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Not to the extent people are claiming.

I care about the past (as a whole not just the actions of whites and blacks) only because of it's role in shaping the general form of the present. The crap the whites have done in the past says nothing about whites in the present.

I'm not just talking slavery or something in terms of race. As a whole, this world is European dominated. To say what they did in the past has nothing to do with the present is beyond naive.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos

I'll give you that much. Europe had a technlogical head start so it's just natural that they'd spread faster and take what influence they could.

If we want to be historical accurate, Europeans were far behind Asians and Africans from a technological standpoint before the 15th century (and one could argue the same for Native Americans). We are talking about people who did not even know how to properly grow food without the natives help. We are talking about a place where Greeks are given credit for Egyptian philosophy. Greece is praised as this great place of thought and philosophy, although they killed philosophers constantly. Go figure. 🤣

Everything regarding "modern" technology is associated with Europe from a educational standpoint.

Remember Prince Henry of Portugal? He was the first to go around the southern tip of Africa! Remember that story? Cause no one even had seagoing ships at the time (this is paraphrasing from a high school history textbook) so he had to build his own ships with no former blueprint! What an explorer!

Funny thing about that story though: the ancient Phoenicians and ancient Egyptians did that before 600 BC (not to mention the Phoenicians traded with the inhabitants of the Canary Islands and sailed up to Europe around the same time period; it is also highly suspected that made it to Central America by sailing). In fact, Henry was inspired to replicate those feats after hearing about them. So he was 2 milleniums too late to have intiated such travel but here he is getting credit for it.

The closest we get to the truth is the Vikings of Greenland but even that is way after the other voyages.

*There is also a lot of speculation about Asian and South American interaction. So much is lost in the bullshit.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos

Well this I agree with for the most part. But the facts of the past only tell you how we got into this mess. Looking only at the past gives a very skewed picture of the present.

That does not even make sense. You can not understand the present without the past. Just look at the present? That's like start a book in the middle - you don't know what the **** happened.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos

People are morons. Always have been always will be. The smart ones either leave or take over.

Thats just a fact of human nature.

That's stupid. You said people are morons, but the smart ones take over. I tend to think I am more knowledgeable that the next person but that does not mean I **** them over every time I get a chance.

Human nature my ass.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos

Ermm . . . wut?

Just use a search engine. I'm not explaining that also.

"Art of War", "Machiavelli"

Originally posted by chithappens
That does not even make sense. You can not understand the present without the past. Just look at the present? That's like start a book in the middle - you don't know what the **** happened.

The argument I'm responding to claims to form an accurate picture of the world by reading the first ten pages.

If you look only at the past you get a seriously messed up picture of the present.

Originally posted by chithappens
That's stupid. You said people are morons, but the smart ones take over. I tend to think I am more knowledgeable that the next person but that does not mean I **** them over every time I get a chance.

Human nature my ass.

Humans, plural, are stupid. As in the group.

There are smart ones. They lie, cheat, steal, kill and manipluate to get what they want. The ones that don't do that leave society all together.

Since it's been going on for a long time and happens to be the entire basis of all forms of goverment, be the despotic or representative or tribal or whatever, I'd say it reall is human nature.

Originally posted by chithappens
Just use a search engine. I'm not explaining that also.

"Art of War", "Machiavelli"

🙄

Hey chithappens,

Have you noticed that ancient peoples of color (Africans/Native Americans/Myans/Aztechs/Aboriginees/Islanders/ect.) and thier societies have ALLOT of similariteis between them?

Too many almost.

One could almost say that we are all related.

Originally posted by BlueDMighty
Hey chithappens,

Have you noticed that ancient peoples of color (Africans/Native Americans/Myans/Aztechs/Aboriginees/Islanders/ect.) and thier societies have ALLOT of similariteis between them?

Too many almost.

One could almost say that we are all related.

OMG ITS LIKE THERE LESS THAN 1% DIFFERENCE IN EVERYONES DNAZ!

Originally posted by chithappens
Because every idiot has an opinion but not everyone can explain themselves.

What are saying is pretty petty because they means once you read the sentence stating if you agree or not, you will not even read the reasons. Pretty lame.

Oh and it is not laymans. Just stick to what you know - that 2 seems like a waste you are too lazy to even read a few damn paragraphs. 🤣

Well when I'm postin @ 5am and haven't had any sleep yet then he11 yeah I'm gonna be lazy and not read the uber long winded posts. especially when I skim over them and realize they're mostly bla bla bla whites are racist, bla bla blacks are racists etc. Its stupid that you are all arguing over this BS.

So I'm gonna be short and frank how I like it. Racism is stupid. End of story, this thread should have been closed along time ago. I cant believe it's reached 65 pages already. I mean sheesh.

Oh, and I will read a couple of paragraphs but when I actually have to scroll down to read someone's insanely long post....then screw that. I'm not gonna continue reading someone's drivel when all they're doing is ranting and raving about inequality and crap like that. .

But if you guys wanna rant about it fine whatever.

I disagree with what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. -Voltaire

QUOTE=9112962]Originally posted by BlueDMighty
Hey chithappens,

Have you noticed that ancient peoples of color (Africans/Native Americans/Myans/Aztechs/Aboriginees/Islanders/ect.) and thier societies have ALLOT of similariteis between them?

Too many almost.

One could almost say that we are all related. [/QUOTE]

I still think monotheistic religions are odd. No ancient civilization believed in only one deity. Lots of random tidbits are odd.

Similar to what Xeres said in 300: Took the land and erase your existence from history (or at least tell what you want).

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos

Humans, plural, are stupid. As in the group.

There are smart ones. They lie, cheat, steal, kill and manipluate to get what they want. The ones that don't do that leave society all together.

Since it's been going on for a long time and happens to be the entire basis of all forms of goverment, be the despotic or representative or tribal or whatever, I'd say it reall is human nature.

This is similar to Hobbes view of human nature. I'd say this is over symplifying things though. What you are suggesting is that one group (not neccesarly race) must always dominate another. Tribes in the Americas and in Africa may not get along all the time, but they did not go to war often (Asia I would make a case for but that takes a long explaination since before China became a whole nation there was a lot of bloodshed.)

It is possible to leave without domination and the such but money got involved and that complicated the factors for the individual.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
The argument I'm responding to claims to form an accurate picture of the world by reading the first ten pages.

If you look only at the past you get a seriously messed up picture of the present.

If you look at ONLY a certain something you will be skewed, but certainly when what you are told about the past is bullshit to begin with and no one will even be honest about what is going on in the present.

I'm not looking at only the past but it is important that you know I understand what I am talking about before I make refutations about dumb opinions concerning our present situation.

Originally posted by chithappens
This is similar to Hobbes view of human nature. I'd say this is over symplifying things though. What you are suggesting is that one group (not neccesarly race) must always dominate another. Tribes in the Americas and in Africa may not get along all the time, but they did not go to war often (Asia I would make a case for but that takes a long explaination since before China became a whole nation there was a lot of bloodshed.)

It's not groups that dominate, it's unconnected individuals.

Originally posted by chithappens
It is possible to leave without domination and the such but money got involved and that complicated the factors for the individual.

😂

Originally posted by Onitsu
Well when I'm postin @ 5am and haven't had any sleep yet then he11 yeah I'm gonna be lazy and not read the uber long winded posts. especially when I skim over them and realize they're mostly bla bla bla whites are racist, bla bla blacks are racists etc. Its stupid that you are all arguing over this BS.

So I'm gonna be short and frank how I like it. Racism is stupid. End of story, this thread should have been closed along time ago. I cant believe it's reached 65 pages already. I mean sheesh.

Oh, and I will read a couple of paragraphs but when I actually have to scroll down to read someone's insanely long post....then screw that. I'm not gonna continue reading someone's drivel when all they're doing is ranting and raving about inequality and crap like that. .

But if you guys wanna rant about it fine whatever.

I disagree with what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. -Voltaire

Sadly, you missed some pretty decent deduction on both sides along with a joke of plagirism.

You did not read it, that's fine but don't expect me to think your opinion has any ground to stand on if you do not even bother to see what others are saying.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
It's not groups that dominate, it's unconnected individuals.

Elaborate?

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos

😂

I meant "live". Tried to preview reply but it posted it. Too late to edit it. O well.

Originally posted by chithappens
*There is also a lot of speculation about Asian and South American interaction. So much is lost in the bullshit.

I'm not sure what happened to it but I found it around the time I discovered Jikuu Tenshou Nazca.

Originally posted by chithappens
If you look at ONLY a certain something you will be skewed, but certainly when what you are told about the past is bullshit to begin with and no one will even be honest about what is going on in the present.

So all we have to do if find out who's lying. That or this all became very 1984.

Originally posted by chithappens
I'm not looking at only the past but it is important that you know I understand what I am talking about before I make refutations about dumb opinions concerning our present situation.

The past is certainly important. But the only real uses for thepast are to learn and explain. If things are going to change they're going to change in the future or the present.

Originally posted by chithappens
Elaborate?

Groups are controled by people who take power within them (something that just about every form of government perpetuates by having an executive). In history it's very clear when one group goes after another group but I see it as more important when individuals take power.

Because the masses lack drive and focus they're forced into the machinations of people who take over. World leaders, or any leaders, take control because they can. And at that point it becomes the petty problems of that individual that effect everything.

For example Germany wasn't dangerous, Hitler was dangerous.