Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
And yet Odin, has only busted up Dead galaxies. hmmmm. 😕
And sent shock waves through every plain of existence, being tearing at the fabric of the multi-verse, destroyed multiple galaxies, knocked over planets like ant hills, easily restored a portion of the universe, reignited suns as side effects of his battles, etc. 🙂
Originally posted by Larceny
He didn't job, he himself already admitted his inferiority to Thor.Once
Twice
Just a couple of problems with that...
1. Those are both from the same encounter, and it took place a LONG time ago. Surfer's showings have increased significantly since his early days, while Thor's have remained pretty consistent. Now I know that Thor's had an upgrade, but so far all I've seen him do is own Iron Man and levitate Asgard so it's a little early to assume that he's leaps and bounds over his previous self.
2. That was the period of time when Surfer was stranded on Earth(the same time period in which he was nearly taken out by a poisoned cup of coffie and was ko'd by a brick from Karnak). If you're using Surfer's verbal statements as accurate reflections of his power, then you can look at this scan to see just how much he was depowered for the period...
So before his imprisonment he could have taken the beast out no problem, but during his imprisonment the thing actually gave him a tough fight. That's a pretty significant difference in my mind. And since we're going over past statements, let's skip forward a few years after Surfer was freed and have a look at what Thor's assessment of Surfer's power...
3. Yes Surfer was powered up by Loki in those scans, but it was to an unknown degree AND it happened after Surfer had already overpowered Loki(who's given Thor a tough fight on his own on more than one occasion now) so I'm betting it wasn't nearly as much of an amp as it's often made out to be.
4. In the second scan Surfer speaks of Thor's STRENGTH, not his power. I don't think that anyone's ever said that Surfer's physically STRONGER than Thor.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Just a couple of problems with that...1. Those are both from the same encounter, and it took place a LONG time ago. Surfer's showings have increased significantly since his early days, while Thor's have remained pretty consistent. Now I know that Thor's had an upgrade, but so far all I've seen him do is own Iron Man and levitate Asgard so it's a little early to assume that he's leaps and bounds over his previous self.
2. That was the period of time when Surfer was stranded on Earth(the same time period in which he was nearly taken out by a poisoned cup of coffie and was ko'd by a brick from Karnak). If you're using Surfer's verbal statements as accurate reflections of his power, then you can look at this scan to see just how much he was depowered for the period...
So before his imprisonment he could have taken the beast out no problem, but during his imprisonment the thing actually gave him a tough fight. That's a pretty significant difference in my mind. And since we're going over past statements, let's skip forward a few years after Surfer was freed and have a look at what Thor's assessment of Surfer's power...
3. Yes Surfer was powered up by Loki in those scans, but it was to an unknown degree AND it happened after Surfer had already overpowered Loki(who's given Thor a tough fight on his own on more than one occasion now) so I'm betting it wasn't nearly as much of an amp as it's often made out to be.
4. In the second scan Surfer speaks of Thor's STRENGTH, not his power. I don't think that anyone's ever said that Surfer's physically STRONGER than Thor.
1) No argument here, but this is pretty nice.
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/Thor%20Feats/Untitled-Scanned-14-1.jpg
2) One thing I've wondered about that though. Asgard is in a completely separate realm from Midgard, and Surfer's powers were only suppressed while within earth's atmosphere. Wouldn't that mean that while on Asgard he had full use of the PC? Also, in his fight with Loki he appeared as if he was back to previous levels.
3) See above.
4) I know.
Originally posted by Larceny
1) No argument here, but this is pretty nice.http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/Thor%20Feats/Untitled-Scanned-14-1.jpg
Originally posted by Larceny
2) One thing I've wondered about that though. Asgard is in a completely separate realm from Midgard, and Surfer's powers were only suppressed while within earth's atmosphere. Wouldn't that mean that while on Asgard he had full use of the PC? Also, in his fight with Loki he appeared as if he was back to previous levels.3) See above.
Originally posted by Larceny
4) I know.
Originally posted by darthgoober
I actually consider Thor's older speed feats to be more impressive than that particular one. Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to discredit Thor(or yourself) but to me it looked like all he really did was land in front of those people before soldiers pulled the trigger(or while they were in the process of pulling it).The thing is that it wasn't Earth that caused Surfer's depowerment, Galactus actually removed Surfer's time/space powers. Now I don't really understand how that would depower him in anything other than Time/Space manipulation(I guess maybe because the relationship between the Power Cosmic and the Universe itself), but that's the way it was always written to be. No time/space powers=weak Surfer(I blame the writing of the time period personally).
Cool.
I didn't mean to post that.....
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/Thor%20Feats/Untitled-Scanned-14-1.jpg
I thought the whole series was inconsistent, and as you pointed out, I thought only his time/space manipulation were suppressed.
Originally posted by Larceny
I didn't mean to post that.....http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/Thor%20Feats/Untitled-Scanned-14-1.jpg
I thought the whole series was inconsistent, and as you pointed out, I thought only his time/space manipulation were suppressed.
His time/space powers WERE suppressed, but somehow that actually made him weaker overall than he was previously. I don't understand it either, but there's no denying that he was a lot less powerful during that period.
Originally posted by darthgoober
You posted the same thing again 😂 .His time/space powers WERE suppressed, but somehow that actually made him weaker overall than he was previously. I don't understand it either, but there's no denying that he was a lot less powerful during that period.
And Blood and Thunder?
Originally posted by Larceny
Originally posted by Larceny
And Blood and Thunder?
And don't get me wrong, even though I see Surfer taking the majority against Thor in a forum match I still don't really consider Surfer to be necessarily more powerful(unless he continues to do things like create black holes with energy blast anyway). I just feel that Surfer has the proper abilities at his disposal to take the majority. There are also some people that I would see Thor doing better against than Surfer, it just depends on the individual abilities of the party's involved.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Ah... but is that REALLY something that's beyond the abilities of Classic Thor? I mean, creating a giant canyon is undeniably cool and all, but Beta Ray Bill destroyed a planet or something like that so I would give Classic Thor credit to do the same(and let's face it, that's a feat that surpasses the canyon feat by a fair margin).Impressive arc of showings for Thor, there's no doubt about it. But that's what it was, a single story arc. After Blood and Thunder Thor went right back to the way he's always been shown. Besides, it's not as if he's the first hero to take down a whole group of heroes who should individually give him a tough fight. Spidey's done it to the X-Men, several key JLA members have taken on the rest of the group, the Hulk's taken on the Avengers(including Thor) and the Fantastic Four at the same time, etc..
And don't get me wrong, even though I see Surfer taking the majority against Thor in a forum match I still don't really consider Surfer to be necessarily more powerful(unless he continues to do things like create black holes with energy blast anyway). I just feel that Surfer has the proper abilities at his disposal to take the majority. There are also some people that I would see Thor doing better against than Surfer, it just depends on the individual abilities of the party's involved.
By no means am I making an attempt to prove current Thor the superior of classic, only displaying something interesting.
Because he was in an enraged set of mind. A set of mind that released him of his conciseness and allowed him to fight with no restraint.
The thing is, when one character is constantly compared to another, a fight between the two is going to hold a lot of weight. The fact that the writer made an attempt to make it explicitly clear that both weren't holding back, the outcome of the bout is going to lead most, at least me, that one character is more powerful than the other. Hence the basis of my beliefs that Thor's power eclipses Surfer's.
Fair enough, I simply see i the other way around. Massive absorption abilities, energy levels capable of warping the universe, defensive capabilities on a semi-universal scale? I think Thor has what it takes to slide out with the majority.
Originally posted by Larceny
By no means am I making an attempt to prove current Thor the superior of classic, only displaying something interesting.
Originally posted by Larceny
Because he was in an enraged set of mind. A set of mind that released him of his conciseness and allowed him to fight with no restraint.
Originally posted by Larceny
By no means am I making an attempt to prove current Thor the superior of classic, only displaying something interesting.
Originally posted by Larceny
Because he was in an enraged set of mind. A set of mind that released him of his conciseness and allowed him to fight with no restraint.
Originally posted by Larceny
The thing is, when one character is constantly compared to another, a fight between the two is going to hold a lot of weight. The fact that the writer made an attempt to make it explicitly clear that both weren't holding back, the outcome of the bout is going to lead most, at least me, that one character is more powerful than the other. Hence the basis of my beliefs that Thor's power eclipses Surfer's.
Originally posted by Larceny
Fair enough, I simply see i the other way around. Massive absorption abilities, energy levels capable of warping the universe, defensive capabilities on a semi-universal scale? I think Thor has what it takes to slide out with the majority.
Now before you start in about the versatility statement I'll explain what I mean. Don't get me wrong, both are capable of things like energy manipulation, transmutation, etc., but Surfer has shown a much finer degree of control in most categories. Thor might be able to transmute one type of substance into another, but Surfer can can actually use transmutation to create complex devices like machinery or alter the genetic makeup of sentient organics to a very specific purpose. Thor USED to be able to accomplish basic time travel, but Surfer can do that AND he can harness and control actual temporal and spacial energy for various uses. I freely acknowledge that Mjolier is also capable of some things that Surfer isn't, but overall there are more things that Surfer can do that Thor can't than vice versa.
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
I looked at the scan. Looks like he did the same shit he always does. A true warrior would have just blasted at thor and not given a speech telegraphing his intentions. Surfer got pwned for talking to much and fighting too little. I can get knocked out too if I didn't throw one punch and talked a bunch of shit.
Dude, it's a comic. Everyone talks a lot.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Oh ok. Well like I said it IS impressive(and I absolutely love the artwork).Have you ever seen what Surfer's capable of when HE'S in a similar state? I know that Surfer SAID he was going to stop holding back, but he actually says that quite a bit and it's almost never true. When Surfer was in an enraged/insane state, he maimed the Super Skrull(who's given Thor a tough fight on a couple of occasions now) with a single punch, and evolved an entire planet(and all the being on it) by BILLIONS of years in a matter of moments.
Oh ok. Well like I said it IS impressive(and I absolutely love the artwork).
Have you ever seen what Surfer's capable of when HE'S in a similar state? I know that Surfer SAID he was going to stop holding back, but he actually says that quite a bit and it's almost never true. When Surfer was in an enraged/insane state, he maimed the Super Skrull(who's given Thor a tough fight on a couple of occasions now) with a single punch, and evolved an entire planet(and all the being on it) by BILLIONS of years in a matter of moments.
Yes but at the same time, if everything BUT to characters actually confrontations suggest that one character should win while the direct confrontations suggest differently, then I think the overall showings should take precedent since the direct confrontations seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Think about it, Wonderman and Namor's direct confrontations suggest that they can give Thor quite a fight, but everything else that we've seen suggest that Thor should take either with a fair amount of ease... so which is more valid? Also, I don't doubt that the writer of Blood and Thunder considered Thor to be more powerful than Surfer, but at the same time the writer of that Avengers comic obviously considered Surfer to be more powerful or Thor wouldn't have said that Surfer's warning blast nearly killed him. Writers come and go, so the opinion of any single writer(or group of writers working jointly on a preplanned arc) don't hold a lot of weight in the grand scheme of things.
See with me it's the advantage in speed, versatility, and tendency to actually USE exotic things like BFR and transmutation that give Surfer the win, as well as better showings against foes that both have taken on at one point in time or another.
Now before you start in about the versatility statement I'll explain what I mean. Don't get me wrong, both are capable of things like energy manipulation, transmutation, etc., but Surfer has shown a much finer degree of control in most categories. Thor might be able to transmute one type of substance into another, but Surfer can can actually use transmutation to create complex devices like machinery or alter the genetic makeup of sentient organics to a very specific purpose. Thor USED to be able to accomplish basic time travel, but Surfer can do that AND he can harness and control actual temporal and spacial energy for various uses. I freely acknowledge that Mjolier is also capable of some things that Surfer isn't, but overall there are more things that Surfer can do that Thor can't than vice versa.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Oh ok. Well like I said it IS impressive(and I absolutely love the artwork).Have you ever seen what Surfer's capable of when HE'S in a similar state? I know that Surfer SAID he was going to stop holding back, but he actually says that quite a bit and it's almost never true. When Surfer was in an enraged/insane state, he maimed the Super Skrull(who's given Thor a tough fight on a couple of occasions now) with a single punch, and evolved an entire planet(and all the being on it) by BILLIONS of years in a matter of moments.
Oh ok. Well like I said it IS impressive(and I absolutely love the artwork).
Have you ever seen what Surfer's capable of when HE'S in a similar state? I know that Surfer SAID he was going to stop holding back, but he actually says that quite a bit and it's almost never true. When Surfer was in an enraged/insane state, he maimed the Super Skrull(who's given Thor a tough fight on a couple of occasions now) with a single punch, and evolved an entire planet(and all the being on it) by BILLIONS of years in a matter of moments.
Yes but at the same time, if everything BUT to characters actually confrontations suggest that one character should win while the direct confrontations suggest differently, then I think the overall showings should take precedent since the direct confrontations seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Think about it, Wonderman and Namor's direct confrontations suggest that they can give Thor quite a fight, but everything else that we've seen suggest that Thor should take either with a fair amount of ease... so which is more valid? Also, I don't doubt that the writer of Blood and Thunder considered Thor to be more powerful than Surfer, but at the same time the writer of that Avengers comic obviously considered Surfer to be more powerful or Thor wouldn't have said that Surfer's warning blast nearly killed him. Writers come and go, so the opinion of any single writer(or group of writers working jointly on a preplanned arc) don't hold a lot of weight in the grand scheme of things.
See with me it's the advantage in speed, versatility, and tendency to actually USE exotic things like BFR and transmutation that give Surfer the win, as well as better showings against foes that both have taken on at one point in time or another.
Now before you start in about the versatility statement I'll explain what I mean. Don't get me wrong, both are capable of things like energy manipulation, transmutation, etc., but Surfer has shown a much finer degree of control in most categories. Thor might be able to transmute one type of substance into another, but Surfer can can actually use transmutation to create complex devices like machinery or alter the genetic makeup of sentient organics to a very specific purpose. Thor USED to be able to accomplish basic time travel, but Surfer can do that AND he can harness and control actual temporal and spacial energy for various uses. I freely acknowledge that Mjolier is also capable of some things that Surfer isn't, but overall there are more things that Surfer can do that Thor can't than vice versa.
Meh, the arts ok. I don't like the way he draws Thor though, looks like an NFL linebacker.
I've seen an enraged Surfer, and while impressive, imo he doesn't quite stack up to Thor. People don't quite grasp the impressiveness of the self imposed state of warrior madness, and while it was talk, we cannot ignore what was said. He was simultaneously tearing through a team of characters that according to the general populace reside in the upper echelon of herald level characters, including a supposedly enraged Surfer.
Super Skrull? He's been owned by Thor as well, in fact he was shown to be helpless before the power of Thor
Impressive, but more so that some of the more impressive moments of Thor?
However the situation is different in this case. Thor and Surfer's feats are so similar in impressiveness that interpretation of who's more powerful is left up to direct comparison. Where as with Wonder Man and Namor their feats are completely dwarfed to the point where direct comparison is unnecessary to determine who's more powerful.
True enough, but what we have to come down too after outside feats is direct comparison. Which fortunately for my case, leans towards Thor.
An advantage of speed travel speed that rarely if ever translates into combat speed.
Versatility that is matched by Mjolnir. In fact it's not a stretch to say that throughout each characters history, Thor has shown more capabilities threw Mjolnir than Surfer has with the Pc.
Again, on average Thor uses more exotic powers than Surfer, and I can almost guarantee he's used BFR as a tactic many more times than Surfer has.
Transmutation? Thor's done it. Actually altering the genetic makeup of sentient being.
Who do you have in mind? From my knowledge Thor has a better record against top tiers, and those above top tier than Surfer does. You know The Destroyer, Mangog, Surtur and Ymir, Galactus, etc.
Originally posted by LarcenyDidn't he die against the Destroyer? Almost get beat to death another time... got his hammer cut in half, etc.
The Destroyer, Mangog, Surtur and Ymir, Galactus, etc.
Mangog... he got one-shotted by Mangog once, made to look like a fool many times...
Oh wait, he managed to kill a weaker one with a series of cheapshots.
Surtur... he got beat by him before...
Oh wait, he managed to BFR both of them, when they weren't paying attention.
Galactus... Almost got killed by him... got taken out by fog from Galactus...
Oh wait, he managed to chase off a weak Galactus with a cheapshot Godblast.
Couldn't resist. ermm
