Terry Bogard vs. Kyo Kusanagi (with a twist)

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Classic NES Balloooooooooooooon

Originally posted by Sado22

-related to protagonist

-He's related to the protagonist in the someway that Ken is related to Ryu. They are from the same school and know the same style. I mean, if Gouken was playable would you consider him a rip-off of takuma just because they are related? There relationship is completely different, Sado. Gouki wants Ryu to fight him in a death match, not become the heir of his style. Never mind that they are not related by blood like Ryo and Takuma.

Originally posted by Sado22

-same style more honed

Same Style?!

Try completely different branch of the same founding Style. Ryu isn't honing his fist the same way Gouki is.

Originally posted by Sado22

-same exact commands of the keys

Because AOF ripped off Ryu/Ken's motions and moves in the first place. So, if Gouki has the same moves as Ryu/Ken. Then Takuma should have the same ripped-off moves and motions from Rip-off.

Originally posted by Sado22

-wants him to unleash his potential

So, he can fight him to the death. Not because he wants his son to surpass him and take his place.

Originally posted by Sado22

-unnamed

His name is Shen Long Remember?

Originally posted by Sado22

-takuma=akuma

Gimmie a break you know that's not his real name. 😬

Originally posted by Sado22

-comes after main boss is beaten

This is just plain wrong, Sado. It even makes me question where you verify your facts. Gouki does not come after you fight Bison. You can only reach him by fulfilling certain objectives, after he which you fight him instead of Bison. 😬

Originally posted by Sado22
-demon mask

That's not a mask, though.

Classic NES Balloooooooooooooon

Originally posted by Sado22
@emperor:
regarding the Yuri being a ripoff of gouken's daughter. first of all, i said the first ever drawing and mention of Gouken was in the street fighter 2 manga back in 1993-1994. till then everyone believed that ryu's master was called Shen Long and there no pictures of him. that is why even when gouki was first introduced and his name was mentioned, people started calling him Akuma Long.
gouken official design too came in that manga series which was later adapted as canon by Capcom. again it was in 1993-1994.
ONE YEAR TOO LATE.
at any rate, "ojou-san" came way later. definitely NOT in 1992 when Aof was made since even gouken wasn't a character then. so if the character was not there then i doubt his daughter would be there.

~Sado

Still existed in the plot which is the point, his exsistence wasn't made because of Takuma. Also, Goukens daughter has been around since SF II.

Sado22 Restricted

Sado, was he the planner of Both SF and AOF?

yes actually. i already said that designer and planner both fall under the category of game designer. so yes, he was. or rather THEY were.

Still existed in the plot which is the point, his exsistence wasn't made because of Takuma. Also, Goukens daughter has been around since SF II.

my point, emp, is that there is no way yuri could be ripped off from a character who wasn't even developed back then. how can she be ripped off if they hadn't even drawn her back then...heck they hadn't even drawn gouken back then. also, ojou-san has been removed from canon in ways as tiamat mentioned since she's never been heard of since.

also i want some proof for her existence in SF2 times.

Same Style?! Try completely different branch of the same founding Style. Ryu isn't honing his fist the same way Gouki is.

i was talking about their in-game moves actually.

-He's related to the protagonist in the someway that Ken is related to Ryu. They are from the same school and know the same style. I mean, if Gouken was playable would you consider him a rip-off of takuma just because they are related? There relationship is completely different, Sado. Gouki wants Ryu to fight him in a death match, not become the heir of his style. Never mind that they are not related by blood like Ryo and Takuma.

gouki is a sort-of uncle to him, isn't he?

Because AOF ripped off Ryu/Ken's motions and moves in the first place. So, if Gouki has the same moves as Ryu/Ken. Then Takuma should have the same ripped-off moves and motions from Rip-off.

my bad for being vague. i wsa talking about the buttons. gouki and ryu do the same moves as each other wtih their button commands. just like takuma adn ryo.

So, he can fight him to the death. Not because he wants his son to surpass him and take his place.

they both wanted to die. akuma wants ryu to realize his full potential so he can be killed. takuma wants ryo to do the haohshikoken so he can be killed. notice that takuma wore the mask out of shame.

His name is Shen Long Remember?

again i'm talking in-game. akuma appeared as an unnamed fighter after the main boss fight....just like the then unnamed takuma.

This is just plain wrong, Sado. It even makes me question where you verify your facts. Gouki does not come after you fight Bison. You can only reach him by fulfilling certain objectives, after he which you fight him instead of Bison.

he DOES come after him in ways then 😆

That's not a mask, though.

demon faced....and demon mask. hmmm....

~Sado

brainchild81 Privateer

Originally posted by Sado22
gouki is a sort-of uncle to him, isn't he?
No.
Originally posted by Sado22
my bad for being vague. i wsa talking about the buttons. gouki and ryu do the same moves as each other wtih their button commands. just like takuma adn ryo.
Nah. He's got some Ken in there to w/the shoryureppa & in the MVC games he shoots his air fireball down like Ken instead of forward like Ryu
Originally posted by Sado22
they both wanted to die. akuma wants ryu to realize his full potential so he can be killed. takuma wants ryo to do the haohshikoken so he can be killed.
Bullshit mane. Takuma never told him to do the HK & he ain't ever killed anybody or asked anybody including ripoff for a deathmatch before or since. Already shot this one down b4 when you posted that win quote that never happened. Give it up.
Originally posted by Sado22
demon faced....and demon mask. hmmm....
It's a tengu mask dammit. Nobody calls it a demon mask. Tengu's all have big noses like the one in DOA. The mask has a big nose. Gouki's nose is normal. You're reaching. & I didn't dodge anything, that 8-6=2 part meant that only 2 of your points carried any weight & that was until Emp shot a hole in one of 'em. You are now down to one. It's over Sadp. Even the "proof" you posted mentioned Gouken & Sheng Long as what he's based on. Takuma isn't even part of the equation. You've wasted your time w/this. Cap said Roy's a homage to Terry? Awesome. They ever say shit about Takuma? No? I wonder why 😐 Find something........hell....anything from Capcom(or anywhere else) saying Gouki is based on Takuma & you'll have something. Otherwise you're just bullshitting yourself. This is getting tiresome mane

Sado22 Restricted

No.

yes.

Nah. He's got some Ken in there to w/the shoryureppa & in the MVC games he shoots his air fireball down like Ken instead of forward like Ryu[/quote[
almost 2 or 3 years LATER, brain 😬
I'm talking specifically in SSF2T since that is where he came and that is where he's being the bigold takuma spoof that he is.

[quote]Bullshit mane. Takuma never told him to do the HK & he ain't ever killed anybody or asked anybody including ripoff for a deathmatch before or since. Already shot this one down b4 when you posted that win quote that never happened. Give it up.


you're not seeing the point is all i ever said. takuma was only to be beaten with the hsk. heck even in SvC he says that he can only be beaten by the haohshikoken. we dont know the details of the fight but we DO know that ryo was damn near about to do it to kill his ass.
also you fail to respond to my previous reply. reply to that first, mane.

It's a tengu mask dammit.

roughly translated as monster or demon. don't tell me "tengu" and regurgitate what emperor said dude 🙂

Nobody calls it a demon mask.

actually it's a bird "demon".

Tengu's all have big noses like the one in DOA. The mask has a big nose. Gouki's nose is normal.

.... 😐

I didn't dodge anything, that 8-6=2 part meant that only 2 of your points carried any weight & that was until Emp shot a hole in one of 'em.

brain, stop talking for emperor. i can say the same and say wandering flame and blue tornado agree with me on all of them and so i win automatically on account of people agreeing with me. 'twas never about number....as a you said yourself. emperor is an amazing debator and if he proves me wrong i'll whole heartedly admit it so we can all go on with our lives. but he hasnt (no offense to him of course).
same applies to you. you think i actually enjoy sitting on my ass and posting and searching google to post up links here for you when I have a 550 page novel to read AND a shortstory to complete AND another shortstory to write?! 😠

Find something........hell....anything from Capcom(or anywhere else) saying Gouki is based on Takuma & you'll have something. Otherwise you're just bullshitting yourself. This is getting tiresome mane

find me anyone...helll...anything from capcom stating that they ripped off SNK's powers system, dash system, zoom, facial change and the multi-hit specials 😬

and don't take to personal levels again. both of us know that we both are capable of uloading a truck of disses on the other. but its too stupid to do so and i evne apologzied for what i said before. people our age are too old for dissing and fighting over two characters who don't even f00king exist.
heck f00k ryu and f00k ryo and let's get this shit over with.

~Sado

~Sado

Sado22 Restricted

oh and emperor, there are TWO arts for ojou-san:

one of them looks like yuri and the other one looks like vice. i remembering reading that on tiamat's guide.

Classic NES Balloooooooooooooon

Originally posted by Sado22
yes actually. i already said that designer and planner both fall under the category of game designer. so yes, he was. or rather THEY were.

No, I mean't was he the planner in both games?

Originally posted by Sado22

my point, emp, is that there is no way yuri could be ripped off from a character who wasn't even developed back then. how can she be ripped off if they hadn't even drawn her back then...heck they hadn't even drawn gouken back then. also, ojou-san has been removed from canon in ways as tiamat mentioned since she's never been heard of since.

also i want some proof for her existence in SF2 times.

They don't have to be drawn, mane. It's their respective plots that are of consequence. AOF did borrow idea's from Gouken, an example would be Goukens relationship with Kens father being rehashed with Roberts father and Takuma. I find it odd that your calling Sakura s rip-off or Yuri, because they use the same moves. . .when AOF ripped those moves off from SF.

I know she's been removed, but she still exsisted. Furthermore, her character design was their since before SF II. Here's the proof:

She appeared in Capcom's own manga story for SF1 called Hadouken: Prelude to the Struggle. This manga is found in Gamest Magazine #13 from October 1987.

http://db.gamefaqs.com/coinop/arcade/file/street_fighter_plot.txt

Originally posted by Sado22

i was talking about their in-game moves actually.

my bad for being vague. i wsa talking about the buttons. gouki and ryu do the same moves as each other wtih their button commands. just like takuma adn ryo.

So, do Ken and Ryu. They do the same moves because back then shoto's were pallete swaps.

Originally posted by Sado22

gouki is a sort-of uncle to him, isn't he?

Well, since Gouken adopted Ryu almost as a son [Don't know if he legally adopted him] that makes Gouki by default almost like an uncle. But, there is no blood connection nor is Gouki interested in Ryu for the same reasons as Takuma.

Originally posted by Sado22

they both wanted to die. akuma wants ryu to realize his full potential so he can be killed. takuma wants ryo to do the haohshikoken so he can be killed. notice that takuma wore the mask out of shame.

Sado, he only wanted to die because he could not save Yuri on his own. It's not like he woke up one day and had a death wish. Takuma's whole goal in life was not to have Ryo murder him in a death duel like Gouki. He wanted his son to surpass, it doesn't neccessarily have to involve killing him. He wants Ryo to succeed his family's fighting style. Gouki in general wants to find strong fighters with the potential to kill him, it doesn't only have to be Ryu. Gouki only wanted Ryu to use Satsu No Hadou because he was butt horny for a death duel. Completely different motives when it came to their deaths, since one is more of a philsophy of life [Gouki's]. While the other was a matter of circumstances. Ask your self, does Takuma still want to die?

Originally posted by Sado22

again i'm talking in-game. akuma appeared as an unnamed fighter after the main boss fight....just like the then unnamed takuma.

he DOES come after him in ways then 😆

demon faced....and demon mask. hmmm....
~Sado

He doesn't really come after him, but yeah. These points are pretty similair.

brainchild81 Privateer

Originally posted by Sado22
yes.
1st you tried that "father" shit & now this. Takuma is ripoff's pop. Gouki is neither Ryu's pop nor uncle. He doesn't even fall into the "father figure" category. Takuma also trained ripoff. Gouki didn't train Ryu, nor does he have any blood ties. Enough.
Originally posted by Sado22
you're not seeing the point is all i ever said. takuma was only to be beaten with the hsk.
Then how come ripoff beats him w/out even doing it? & does this have ANYTHING to do with wanting a death match? Enough pt2.
Originally posted by Sado22
heck even in SvC he says that he can only be beaten by the haohshikoken.
Lousy non-canon game. Means nothing & you know it. Considering how he was defeated w/out it by ripoff.Enough pt 3.
Originally posted by Sado22
we dont know the details of the fight but we DO know that ryo was damn near about to do it to kill his ass.
All we know is that he didn't & that his pop never asked him to. This is where the tiresome part comes in. Has Takuma EVER expressed that he wanted a deathmatch.......EVER? If not. Concede that this point has been killed & be done w/it. He's been in a million games w/his ripoff son & not once did he say "You really oughta try & kill me son" or "I'm gonna try to kill you son." He ain't no killer. We agreed on this. He don't want no deathmatch. Gouki loves deathmatches. Gouki IS a killer. Enough pt. 1000.
Originally posted by Sado22
also you fail to respond to my previous reply. reply to that first, mane.
You talking about the one where you tried to get those points I took back or something else? I'd rather not go over those again. It's like you know they don't hold water & you keep going w/them. How many different explanations of why they don't hold up do you need.
Originally posted by Sado22
roughly translated as monster or demon. don't tell me "tengu" and regurgitate what emperor said dude 🙂
You ain't paying attention again. Emp said Gouki's not wearing a mask. I said he don't look like a Tengu, cuz all Tengu I've seen got long noses. You alright? I put my own shit in. Otherwise I'd just say "ditto mane". You know this. Come on now.
Originally posted by Sado22
brain, stop talking for emperor. i can say the same and say wandering flame and blue tornado agree with me on all of them and so i win automatically on account of people agreeing with me. 'twas never about number....as a you said yourself.
Exactly. So what part of what I said has anything to do w/emp agreeing w/me & making me right? One thing I always like to point out is contradictions, why would I contradict myself? I said emp shot down 1 of your 2 remaining points. Nothing else. I slaughtered the others. You are the one who pointed out that Gears agreed w/you. I don't do that shit 'cuz I've been a one man army since I came here. Ask my blood bro. Never really cared if people agreed w/me or not. I was basically the only guy who didn't think Terry was cooler than the other side of the pillow. No debate when everyone agrees.
Originally posted by Sado22
emperor is an amazing debator and if he proves me wrong i'll whole heartedly admit it so we can all go on with our lives. but he hasnt (no offense to him of course).
If Gouki doesn't come after Bison.........he HAS proven you wrong. Prove that Gouki comes after Bison like you said or concede.
Originally posted by Sado22
find me anyone...helll...anything from capcom stating that they ripped off SNK's powers system, dash system, zoom, facial change and the multi-hit specials 😬
Nice dodge mane. I'm saying if Capcom admitted Terry inspired Roy & SNK admitted inspiration form SF(i think somebody said that) , why would there be NO MENTION ANYWHERE FROM ANYBODY OF TAKUMA's b-list @$$ INSPIRING ANYBODY, MUCH LESS GOUKI? I've never heard anyone but you say tha Gouki was a ripoff of Takuma. While that doesn't prove you're wrong(Everything else seems to 😄), you may wanna contemplate why.
Originally posted by Sado22
and don't take to personal levels again. both of us know that we both are capable of uloading a truck of disses on the other. but its too stupid to do so and i evne apologzied for what i said before.
WTF?!Haven't called you a single name since the apology. You alright mane? You getting touchy now?

brainchild81 Privateer

& even if one considers ripoff/Mr K to be a deathmatch. It's NOT what he wanted. He's forced into a fvcked up situation. Case closed.

Classic NES Balloooooooooooooon
Originally posted by brainchild81
& even if one considers ripoff/Mr K to be a deathmatch. It's NOT what he wanted. He's forced into a fvcked up situation.

I commented on that as well. Gouki wants to die a glorious death in battle, while Takuma was trying to save Yuri even if it meant he had to die. One person is being a good father while the other is following an outdated view of battle.

brainchild81 Privateer

He's a grumpy old man. Always talking that "In my day..." shit.

Gouki: "In my day if a guy swung & missed, we didn't just counterpunch him. Nah. We knocked his fvckin' head the fvck off!

Ken: Calm down, yo.

G:Nah, man! Fvck that shit! Ya'll ain't doin' it right! If a muthafvcka tried to kick & we caught his leg, we tore it the fvck off!

Ryu: There's really no need for such language.

Gouki: Fvck you pvssy! Tired o' dat cookie cutter shit my dumbass brother tought ya'll! Back in my day, if I punched a muthafvcka in his jaw, he ain't have no fvckin' jaw no more! Fvck the bullshit! It's not a fvcking game!!!!!!

SmashBro Senior Member
Originally posted by brainchild81
1st you tried that "father" shit & now this. Takuma is ripoff's pop. Gouki is neither Ryu's pop nor uncle.

Actually, Akuma is kinda is Ryu's uncle. He and Gouken were brothers and I keep hearing that Gouken adopted Ryu when he was a baby.

brainchild81 Privateer

Uncle by adoption? I'll look into that. That's still not blood ties though. Takuma & ripoff are related by blood as father & son & as student & teacher

Sado22 Restricted

No, I mean't was he the planner in both games?

there were two guys who "directed" Street fighter. one guy's name i can't remember but the other guy was called Hiroshi matsumoto or something aka finish hiroshi.
Finish hiroshi was the planner of Street Fighter1 and the other guy was the director. both however were the game planners also.
in AoF BOTH of them were the directors (which really is gameplanners).

They don't have to be drawn, mane. It's their respective plots that are of consequence. AOF did borrow idea's from Gouken, an example would be Goukens relationship with Kens father being rehashed with Roberts father and Takuma. I find it odd that your calling Sakura s rip-off or Yuri, because they use the same moves. . .when AOF ripped those moves off from SF.

the part about robert's dad and takuma, conceded.
what i'm saying is that how can takuma-yuri be ripped off if they were drawn first. that is what i'm saying.

I know she's been removed, but she still exsisted. Furthermore, her character design was their since before SF II. Here's the proof:

the link doesn't work 🙁
but what version did she look like...the yuri one or the vice one? i'll check tiamat for now but if you find it do tell me so i can concede your point.

So, do Ken and Ryu. They do the same moves because back then shoto's were pallete swaps.

yes i know htat but that was one was only in SF1 till SuperSF2. beyond that there button commands have been different. what happened then was that akuma and ryu winded up having the same button commands. they gave ken a different button commands where he'd do roundhouses instead of backspins like ryu and akuma. ken would still retain his straight punches.

flash rewind a couple of years ago in AoF:
ryo and takuma had the same button commands and similar moves. robert on the other hand would do roundhouses instead of backspins but would still do his straight punches like Ryo and takuma.

Sado, he only wanted to die because he could not save Yuri on his own. It's not like he woke up one day and had a death wish. Takuma's whole goal in life was not to have Ryo murder him in a death duel like Gouki. He wanted his son to surpass, it doesn't neccessarily have to involve killing him. He wants Ryo to succeed his family's fighting style. Gouki in general wants to find strong fighters with the potential to kill him, it doesn't only have to be Ryu. Gouki only wanted Ryu to use Satsu No Hadou because he was butt horny for a death duel. Completely different motives when it came to their deaths, since one is more of a philsophy of life [Gouki's]. While the other was a matter of circumstances. Ask your self, does Takuma still want to die?

conceded. however, i WAS originally talking about unleashing protagonist's potential. i've been saying that since day one.

He doesn't really come after him, but yeah. These points are pretty similair.

i'm glad you agree.

~Sado

Sado22 Restricted

1st you tried that "father" shit & now this. Takuma is ripoff's pop. Gouki is neither Ryu's pop nor uncle. He doesn't even fall into the "father figure" category. Takuma also trained ripoff. Gouki didn't train Ryu, nor does he have any blood ties. Enough

don't put words in my mouth. i said he was RELATED to the protagonist. you're the guy who doesn't know that gouki is ryu's "uncle" of sorts. i just brought up the SF stuff to give you a prespective. don't act like i WAS saying that akuma is ryu's father.

Then how come ripoff beats him w/out even doing it? & does this have ANYTHING to do with wanting a death match? Enough pt2.

so he DID have a deathwish now didn't he?

heck brain just go back and reply to the post you were ACTUALLY supposed to reply to. you're wasting my time asking me to repeat myself all the time. it's all there. respond to that or just walk away.

I commented on that as well. Gouki wants to die a glorious death in battle, while Takuma was trying to save Yuri even if it meant he had to die. One person is being a good father while the other is following an outdated view of battle.

death being the keyword there. circumstances and reasons don't matter. heck by this logic despite ryo and ryu wearing karate gis and apparently doing the same moves, since ryo has a life he's no ripoff of ryu.

If Gouki doesn't come after Bison.........he HAS proven you wrong. Prove that Gouki comes after Bison like you said or concede.

how? he just freaking agreed with me, that's how.

I'm saying if Capcom admitted Terry inspired Roy & SNK admitted inspiration form SF(i think somebody said that) , why would there be NO MENTION ANYWHERE FROM ANYBODY OF TAKUMA's b-list @$$ INSPIRING ANYBODY, MUCH LESS GOUKI? I've never heard anyone but you say tha Gouki was a ripoff of Takuma. While that doesn't prove you're wrong(Everything else seems to ), you may wanna contemplate why.

it wasn't a dodge and you know it. i ask you a question taht speaks for itself. capcom never admitted to any of the other things they ripped off from SNK. so why now?
as for Roy, for one i read it up on wikipedia. who knows how correct it was.

Uncle by adoption? I'll look into that. That's still not blood ties though. Takuma & ripoff are related by blood as father & son & as student & teacher

again....i said related. you didn't see my specify it now did you?

~Sado

Sado22 Restricted

before replying to the previous post, i suggest you reply to the original post brain. otherwise i'll just be repeating myself.

brainchild81 Privateer

What post? Asked you a while back.

Sado22 Restricted

the post you made before you stopped posting for a day or two? i replied to that one pretty in-depth. even i don't remember where it is though?

oh! you remember the part where we were discusssing the Zero canon? that one. 🙂

Akuma Killer Saikyo Pharaoh Sol Radguy

All I gotta say is this...compare Roy to Ken and you'll see more similarities there.

they borrowed, but Roy isn't comparable to Robert or Ryo, when it comes to rippin.

Classic NES Balloooooooooooooon
Originally posted by Sado22
there were two guys who "directed" Street fighter. one guy's name i can't remember but the other guy was called Hiroshi matsumoto or something aka finish hiroshi.
Finish hiroshi was the planner of Street Fighter1 and the other guy was the director. both however were the game planners also.
in AoF BOTH of them were the directors (which really is gameplanners).

Well, I commented on this one time before. Why was SNK stupid enough to accept a design for a character that is clearly taken? Furthermore, when this is found out, why has no one admitted it? Like brainy said, it was a quick attempt to cash in the popularity of SF. In that case it would make Ryo a Rehash, which is still as bad.

Originally posted by Sado22

the part about robert's dad and takuma, conceded.
what i'm saying is that how can takuma-yuri be ripped off if they were drawn first. that is what i'm saying.

Yuri wasn't drawn first, Little Miss was drawn in a comic that was published by Capcom in 1987. The link was to the plot guide, but I posted an excerpt from it. Guess you missed it, but my point is that she came first.

They don't have to be drawn first, Sado. It's obvious that Gouken and Takuma have some uncanny similarities: They both are friends of their main disciple's rich rival, They both have daughters, they most likely have similar moves [We'll wait for Street Fighter 4, since it's stated that Gouken maybe playable]. Either this and the similarities between Ryo and Ryu/Ken are a coiencedece or the idea is borrowed.

Originally posted by Sado22

the link doesn't work 🙁
but what version did she look like...the yuri one or the vice one? i'll check tiamat for now but if you find it do tell me so i can concede your point.

The link was to the plot guide, since I took a snippet from it too verify that Little Miss came first.

Originally posted by Sado22

conceded. however, i WAS originally talking about unleashing protagonist's potential. i've been saying that since day one.

~Sado

But, Gouki was never trying to unleash Ryu's potential. He wants Ryu to unleash his potential and come and seek him for a death match. Gouki has never taken a hand in unleashing Ryu's potential. The most he did was tell him that he has the ability to use the same power as himself and when he awakens to seek him out. Not the same as Takuma at all.