Originally posted by JBL
Supermans mind was not altered in any way. For all he knew he was fighting DD who he has fought before, only this time he thought he killed someone he loved. Fighting angry and trying to kill someone is not fighting out of his mind. Show anywhere in that fight where superman went crazy or didn't calculate his attacks.
Oh look what J'onn is saying.
😬
Originally posted by -Pr-
He was mentally compromised, which makes the fight unusable as an example for Superman.You can use it for Diana if you like, but only someone that doesn't read WW should have to. She has other feats that show her capabilities just fine.
If people want to "pretend" they don't understand this, then there's no need for them to post.
You be quiet and keep dinner warm.
Originally posted by h1a8
Whether he has the ability to one shot WW is irrelevant. He's not going to be operating at that level the start of the fight. He will be holding back.He's not going to be operating at many times the speed of light either. So she would be able to block or parry his punches. She can easily block HV so that's irrelevant (although he tanked a vicious dose of it without any visible damage).
Being more durable doesn't protect you from the lasso or make you immune to vital strikes. Being stronger is irrelevant if the fight doesn't go grapple and the weaker is much more skilled and has the strength to hurt you.
Bottom line: Superman will not one shot WW in this fight, either with fists or with hv. WW is fast enough to block or parry his attacks (as shown on panel). Superman would have to operate many times faster than light to be able to hit her consistently without her being able to respond.
You act like she's untouchable. She gets hit.
Starro virus infected Flash.
How about her fight with Power Girl? Sure, not the whole fight, there's certainly times she blocks or avoids hits. But she gets hit MORE times than she avoided, even including when she actually fights with skill. Which proves my point.
Oh that last part, Power Girl dodging the lasso? Yeah, Wonder Woman won the fight ultimately, but Power Girl isn't as strong, fast or skilled as Superman.
Let's see, what else? Hit by her mom.
Smacked by Mongul.
Donner tackles her.
Wonder Woman's shadow duplicate lassos her.
Supergirl hits her.
Starfire blasts her. Diana blocks, but fails the second time.
Deathstroke hit her numerous times in their fight, but I'll show just a couple.
Even with her not wanting to kill him and that.....evening gown slowing her down 😱 That doesn't help since he's only a few times faster than human.
Ya know how you always go "stun then lasso for the win?" Yeah, Mayfly was already lassoed and still this is how the fight went for Diana.
Not all of the fight, but Cheshire is a normal human, hits her more than once.
Not the whole fight, but Artemis manages to hit her more than once.
And far as I can tell, the Sandals Of Hermes would make her as fast as Wonder Woman, tops.
Circe pops in, and Diana has enough time to realize she's there, still gets blasted.
Gets hit several times by Pele. Unless you think whatever Pele did doesn't count.
Grabbed by Giganta.
Hit by a giant serpent god.
You dismiss these as "Diana will fight to the best of her ability" then you have to accept Superman does as well. That means he fights too fast for her to react and one-shots her. You either acknowledge that she's not untouchable, or don't argue that Superman will be holding back and not going faster than her.
And, looks like the lasso isn't the insta win you think it is. But I predict you'll ignore all this and just regurgitate your fanfic.
Originally posted by carver9
Superman was struggling to tag her in sacrifice She was dodging his punches easily. She also withstoo his hea vision and easily broke out of his ice breath casually. She DBZed him as well... winked out and was too fast for him to detect. Casually blocked his heat vision. The list goes on. This is a debatable fight.
Context never has, nor ever will be, your friend, Fearful One.
Originally posted by krisblaze
Obviously WW still wins.She's faster and more skilled.
😆 No, she's not faster. The only argument is to cling to some statements that are contradicted numerous times before and after. And more skilled? Yeah, but judging by the few fights that don't have extenuating circumstances, not by enough to compensate for his physical advantage(and own skill, I guess).
Originally posted by carver9
But he was able to dodge her thin lasso. You're making excuses.I haven't been corrected though.
Lol...him heat visioning someone that wasn't even paying attention to him let alone fighting him doesn't prove anything. She tanked heat vision in the face from a Superman that was trying to kill her and throw her in the sun.
Wonder Woman 6/10.
Good Lord you're terrible at this. And her not paying attention matters when she was one-shot as a SIDE-EFFECT? Just imagine if that would have hit her directly. This is why you fear me and my BZ challenge.
Originally posted by carver9
NOTHING was said on him dodging the lasso on Max command. The quote that was said during this scene "enough, time to get the lasso on him...use it, to clear his mind only for a moment. Free him from his delusions. What is Max making him see now. It's like he knows what I am about to do. Like he knows what the lasso can do". Where in that sentence does it say Max controlled made Superman move. She is ASKING what Max made him see for him to know to dodge the lasso.Lol...he was attacking her directly which is the reason he heat visioned her face. He grabbed her small wrist and broke it. Him punching her to Earth...him dodging kryptonite and punching it out of her hand. Lol...she was just too fast for him to hit and like usual, you are making excuses.
She withstood his heat vision.
So you don't think she can Ko him?
When did Bada rule out Sacrifice? Is that what Pr is talking about?
Him doing all that despite being hampered by thinking he was fighting a larger opponent who doesn't fight like her and being irrational from rage and grief somehow hinders him when he's in a normal state of mind and knows who he's facing? 😆
Originally posted by carver9
You even used a mind controlled Diana losing to Superman as evidence. Here is the mind controlled Superman you used...http://s1199.photobucket.com/user/Delta1938/SupermanVS/Heroes/WonderWoman/WW175/story
Here is the list you keep posting in this thread... Diana was controlled in some and Superman was as well but you keep posting it as evidence of Superman being above Diana.
Are you talking about the time in FINAL CRISIS? Well, considering he one-shot her as a SIDE-EFFECT of blasting through a force field, don't think that's going to make a significant difference.
Originally posted by h1a8
The only thing we can take from Sacrifice is
1. WW tanking HV as a durability feat, proving she can tank hv.
2. WW having strength necessary to hurt Superman.
3. WW being able to block Superman's hv.
4. WW being able to block and dodge Superman's punches.Outside of that it can't be used to determine if WW can beat Superman based solely off the outcome of the fight since Supes was compromised.
😆
She got burned to the bone by a pretty minor projection compared to what he's done before. For ****'s sake, he's one-shot her as a side-effect among other things.
The "strength necessary" to hurt Superman? She hurt him by bashing her bracelets into his ears. You'd be hurt too if someone snuck up on you and smashed a couple of cast iron skillets into your ears. The fact that she couldn't KO him despite that and a few free hits speaks volumes about the difference between them.
When he was mentally compromised. He was also heat visioning clouds and we've seen her hit before.
Similar to above.
Originally posted by JBL
I can see if he was drugged up or drunk, but thinking he's fighting DD is no cause for him to fight like a moron. He was in control at all times, he never snapped.
Yes, because the actual story didn't make it clear he was irrational from what he thought happened. /sarcasm
Originally posted by carver9
Don't get why you're posting scans of her being hit. Flash has even been hit before. That's like me posting scans of Superman being his by Kalibak, Mongul and GRandy. Look at her battle against Amazo though.
My second and last posts of those scans make it clear why I posted them, you ignoramus. sneer
And 😆 you thinking her self praise contradicts numerous feats before and after. Again, you ignoramus.
Originally posted by carver9
Don't get why you're posting scans of her being hit. Flash has even been hit before. That's like me posting scans of Superman being hit by Kalibak, Mongul and GRundy. Look at her battle against Amazo though.
Though it pains me to do this, 👆
I mean, seriously - the character has been around for 75 years. There's no need to prove that she's been punched a few times in that span.
Originally posted by Cogito
Though it pains me to do this, 👆I mean, seriously - the character has been around for 75 years. There's no need to prove that she's been punched a few times in that span.
😬 I made it clear it's because H1's living in a fantasy world where he thinks Wonder Woman is untouchable, and either he has to concede she gets hit, or if he continues to argue "to the best of their ability" he has to apply it to Superman too. Maybe you should actually check the point someone was making before agreeing with carter.
Originally posted by Delta1938
😬 I made it clear it's because H1's living in a fantasy world where he thinks Wonder Woman is untouchable, and either he has to concede she gets hit, or if he continues to argue "to the best of their ability" he has to apply it to Superman too. Maybe you should actually check the point someone was making before agreeing with carter.
The point was that a scan dump of WW getting hit was totally unnecessary.
Originally posted by carver9
He wasn't controlled. Every action Superman took, he took it under his own will. Max Lord made Superman see Doomsday ripping Lois apart. He then made Diana appear as Doomsday...after that, Superman actions were his own. Max didn't control his movements or hindered him from doing anything.
Okay whatever you want to call it..if you're going to cite feats then they all count. Which means Superman can easily crush her bones. You agree with that, correct? That he can crush her bones by merely squeezing?
Originally posted by Surtur
Okay whatever you want to call it..if you're going to cite feats then they all count. Which means Superman can easily crush her bones. You agree with that, correct? That he can crush her bones by merely squeezing?
I agree, Superman can break her bones. People in the same tier can harm each other to that extent. The same Superman got his jaw broken by one hit from Zod and Zod and Superman are peers.
