Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
In the X-O Manowar/Iron Man crossover, a CCU was destroying omniverseS, plural.IN the Strombreaker mini, Asteroth said-
'All the universe, multiverses and megaverses shall be mine!'
And I wouldn't think a marvel demon could take over all of DC, image etc.
(promo)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=474708&pagenumber=4
(This page addresses the notion that Marvel does not have an Omniverse) 🙂
Marvel DOES in fact, have their own Omniverse. (2008 bios prove that)
(multiple MegaverseS) "an Infinity beyond Infinity"
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Now, realize how only funny cats have been allowed to cross over,
like Mxy and Impossible Man.
They didn't do anything special,
they didn't demonstrate any influence over anything on a significant scale
except the cats they were encountering. (one "hero" confrontation on each side)
That's the only reason I bet it's mentioned in IM's bio,
because it's only relevant to him.
You won't find that in FF's bio, or Reed's, Susan's or the rest.
IM's bio actually makes him scaring and beating up the Marvel Staff canon,
but is that really to taken that seriously? Not imo.
...........................................................................................
So I think it's all right to be cool and have fun with it,
but not to taken into consideration in a vs forum as a concrete piece of evidence.
Because,
issues like that are influenced by an outside factor like fan based complaisance.
Wanting to please both sides, and this imo,
is what leads to the disaster of Marvel/DC crossovers in particular.
(too many fans)
This is why we should keep debate feats withIN the sphere of the character's company.
Furthermore,
the stories focus so much on the heroic/villainous aspect of the theme,
that Cosmological sense flies out the window.
Like this bit from JLA/Avengers cross-over:
Polemachus is a whole Alternate Universe withIN the Prime Multiverse,
Qward is a whole Parallel Universe withIN the DC Multiverse.
"Another Universe, occupying the same Space,
but a different vibratory plane of reality"
..................................................................................
There's absolutely no way for these Two Realities to "share the same Space"
unless they're both located withIN the same Omniverse.
..................................................................................
BUT ...
..................................................................................
Isn't kinda eerily coincidental,
that DC's 52 Universes
are also separated by a vibratory plane withIN the same Space?
52 identical Earths in 52 identical Cosmos,
the Earths will occupy the same Space,
each on a different vibrational plane"
..................................................................................
But I thought Polemachus (Marvel) & Qward (DC) shared the same Space on a different vibratory plane?
hm
This would suggest,
that Marvel & DC not ony share the same Omniverse,
but the same Multiverse too.
🤨
Or,
do these Two Universes not only "share the Space" in their respective Multiverses,
but outside that too?
Cool, but I'd just like to know what other Space does Polemachus occupy,
if it isn't a piece of Marvel's Omniverse or Multiverse (whatever one prefers)
Same goes for Qward on the DC side.
Evidence that supports Polemachus occupying another Space
besides the Space it occupies withIN the Prime Marvel Multiverse.
Which means one would have to prove there are Two Polemachuses,
One withIN the Prime Marvel Multiverse,
and One withIN a mysterious area of Space where coincidentally Qward is a part of too.
..................................................................................
If the argument is that they didn't place the arc withIN the same Omniverse,
then I disagree because of said reason above, and that's it.
If the argument is
that it's canon because the companies dubbed it so,
that's fine,
I just don't understand why no DC name has been mentioned
in any of the Two bios with the subtle references.
Copywrite laws? Perhaps, but if it's canon how can that be an issue?
In other words, if both companies are in agreement,
both made the book together,
both know & understand this,
what the F is this "copywrite infringment" line about then?
It's not like someone's lying,
that's what happened in the garbage cross-over, characters crossed,
so if they wanna make Marvel & DC part of the SAME Omniverse,
what's the worry? Who's gonna sue for stating the Truth?
Or is it,
that the companies really do not acknowledge those encounters as significant,
and/or as relevant in terms of influencing either respective company?
Perhaps this is why the story isn't Never mention in Eternity's bio,
or any other Cosmic's bio,
or anywhere at all really
except for a subtle vague reference in the bio of a single Hero or two.
Or, as I think Galan was pointing out, (I'm paraphrasing)
perhaps these stories are only of consequence
when concerning said cross-overs are published.
Other than that, they're separate entites.
(this is a more logical outlook imo,
otherwise Dr Strange/Fate is the most powerful being in Marvel/DC combined)
😆
Ohhhh so this is what you've been cooking up in your days of absence.
Allow me to respond:
I'm sorry but how exactly have you proved wrong the canon fact that states that Marvel and DC exist within the same omniverse? 😕
You've posted scans of Marvel characters calling themselves protectors of the omniverse, does that prove that DC and Marvel aren't in the same omniverse? ❌
Just means that Marvel has characters who share the same roles as some DC chatacters do.
Quasar according to Eon is the protector of the universe, Captain Marvel according to the Kree is protector, Captain Universe as appointed by the Enigma Force is protector of the universe. The same role is appointed by different parties.
As for your other Exiles point, i said that Marvel is a multiverse within an omniverse just like DC,(a megaverse if you include the likes of New Universe and other such loosely connected realities), Marvel can say whatever it likes about the omniverse because their comics feature their section of the omniverse from a Marvel perspective, however what Marvel cannot do is feature the properties of DC via name or artistic depiction being affected by what changes Marvel has decided to apply to the omniverse in a Marvel comic. That would be a breach of copyright.
The only time Marvel or DC can feature each others properties is with permission from the other and that results in crossovers, a number of which have been stated to be canon.
Roma can say she has numbered every reality in omniverse, does that mean that Marvel and DC arent in the same omniverse? ❌
Its her preogative to do that because of the role she has from a Marvel perspective, however what she may call Earth 16781, a DC resident might simply call Earth S.
The main Marvel multiverse is the name given to describe all of the marvel realities that share the traditional hierarchy of the abstracts. Some writers consider each of these realities to be a multiverse unto themselves, why? Because look at Eternity 616 for example, associated with him you have other dimensions such as Asgard, Mephistos realm, the Negative Zone, hyperspace where the Celestials come from snd others. All of those alternate dimensions associated with Eternity 616. However other Eternitys have their same versions of Asgard, Negative Zone etc associated with them however they are still generally deemed universes and all of them together are deemed the Marvel multiverse.
That is why you will get the occassional writer referring to "the multiverses" such as featured in about two of your scans, yet despite that all of those realms are deemed The Marvel multiverse.
An omniverse as stated by Marvel is the name given for ALL realities literally. The Marvel multiverse despite debatably being composed of many pseudo multiverses itself is not an omniverse. By canon the DC multiverse exists within the same creation as Marvel, yet the two companies properties are separate however as i posted earlier occassionally their is a "bleeding over" of the two companies that results in canon crossovers.
http://img149.imageshack.us/my.php?image=altuhb2005streetsamuraids2.jpg
Therefore despite the vastness of Marvels collection of realities it is not an omniverse unto itself because Dc exists within the same creation and DC and Marvels collections of realities are quite separate.
It is stated point blank by an official source that DC and Marvel are within the same omniverse, given that point regardless of what you want to call Marvels collection of realities, be it multiverse or megaverse Marvel can not be an omniverse unto itself because as stated an omniverse is literally ALL realities.
http://img149.imageshack.us/my.php?...tsamuraids2.jpg
In Marvels very own definition of what an omniverse is they refer to how DC is in it alongside Marvel. The issue is not debatable.
Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
In the X-O Manowar/Iron Man crossover, a CCU was destroying omniverseS, plural.IN the Strombreaker mini, Asteroth said-
'All the universe, multiverses and megaverses shall be mine!'
And I wouldn't think a marvel demon could take over all of DC, image etc.
The difference is that the X-O Manowar crossover is NOT canon. Its not referred to in any of the bios of the Marvel properties featured within which isnt surprising given that it was created SOLELY to promote an awful videogame of the same subject matter:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Man_and_X-O_Manowar_in_Heavy_Metal
Originally posted by 123KID
uh Marvel is more than a multiverse so you're already wrong right there
You haven't read my post have you? 😬
I believe this chunk of it deals with your doubts:
The main Marvel multiverse is the name given to describe all of the marvel realities that share the traditional hierarchy of the abstracts. [B]Some writers consider each of these realities to be a multiverse unto themselves, why? Because look at Eternity 616 for example, associated with him you have other dimensions such as Asgard, Mephistos realm, the Negative Zone, hyperspace where the Celestials come from snd others. All of those alternate dimensions associated with Eternity 616. However other Eternitys have their same versions of Asgard, Negative Zone etc associated with them however they are still generally deemed universes and all of them together are deemed the Marvel multiverse.That is why you will get the occassional writer referring to "the multiverses" such as featured in about two of your scans, yet despite that all of those realms are deemed The Marvel multiverse.
An omniverse as stated by Marvel is the name given for ALL realities literally. The Marvel multiverse despite debatably being composed of many pseudo multiverses itself is not an omniverse. By canon the DC multiverse exists within the same creation as Marvel, yet the two companies properties are separate however as i posted earlier occassionally their is a "bleeding over" of the two companies that results in canon crossovers.
http://img149.imageshack.us/my.php?image=altuhb2005streetsamuraids2.jpg
Therefore despite the vastness of Marvels collection of realities it is not an omniverse unto itself because Dc exists within the same creation and DC and Marvels collections of realities are quite separate. [/B]
Let me know if anything else is still troubling you ok?
so i'm supposed to believe your thoeries ?
sorry
i go by evidence
show me one comic stating a multiverse fits your distorted view
come on
or are you just making up things ?
i saw your defunct theory about what the Beyonder said
stating he meant universe = multiverse and how Mr. M proved you completely wrong by showing he meant multiverse when he traveled to things outside 616
Originally posted by 123KID
i don't care what you say ?
i care what it says in the comic
your theory writers consider individual universes = multiverses means nothing
If you cared what was in the comics then you would acknowledge the fact that within Marvel comics are issues which depict DC characters and subsequently there are bios that not only refer to those DC characters but as i've shown bios that specifically state the point that DC exists within the same omniverse as Marvel.
THAT is what this thread is about and that is the point i have tried and succeeded in proving. All of this nitpicking at what to call Marvels collection of realities is just us going off on a tangent.
What we certainly can't call Marvels own collection of realities is an omniverse because by Marvels own definition there is only ONE omniverse and that literally includes ALL realities. So given that they state DC is separate from their realities but within the same omniverse, Marvels realities can NOT be deemed an omniverse.
That cool?
Originally posted by Galan007
Lots of evidence here,
But if these companies are not linked in some way/shape/form -- how does one explain Mxy's ability to venture into Marvel, as well as IM's ability to hop over to DC?Marvel does afterall, acknowledge these facts on panel. ermmnone
Precisely. Thats all it comes down to.
The point is depicted on panel and stated in the bios, DC is within the same omniverse as Marvels.
Marvel characters being deemed protectors of the omniverse doesnt prove the point wrong.
Roma naming all the realities of the omniverse doesnt prove the point wrong.
LT being said to look after the Marvel multiverses doesnt either as explained. An omniverse isnt simply a collection of multiverses, its every reality there is.
DC is stated to be separate from Marvels collection of realities yet within the same creation therefore if Marvel says there is only one omniverse yet acknowledges DC as their neighbours within it, how can anyone claim that Marvels realities on their own are an omniverse?
I think the points being argued against for all the wrong reasons. 😬
Originally posted by 123KID
it's obvious
TOAA made the Presence, Mxy and Impossible Man
Nope. Marvel and DC acknowledge there is one omniverse and that both of their properties are within it. That is canon.
Marvel says TOAA created the omniverse, DC says the Presence. Does that mean that they're not within the same omniverse? ❌
It does however bring to mind (or at least should) regarding the relationship between the two companies supreme beings.
We may never know the answer to that question, however that does NOT change what is stated and depicted explicitly in a variety of official sources.
The explicit and specific answer to a debated question from various OFFICIAL sources is irrefutable and therefore renders irrelevant a collection of scans from various comics accompanied by a posters commentary on how HE THINKS these scans answer the question.
Nope. Marvel and DC acknowledge there is one omniverse and that both of their properties are within it. That is canon.
so is TOAA making the omnniverse
Marvel and DC in the same omniverse
thus TOAA made DC
Marvel says TOAA created the omniverse, DC says the Presence. Does that mean that they're not within the same omniverse?
pretty much
just according to you it doesn't
The explicit and specific answer to a debated question from various OFFICIAL sources is irrefutable and therefore renders irrelevant a collection of scans from various comics accompanied by a posters commentary on how HE THINKS these scans answer the question.
again your whole inferiority complex surfaces
Mr. M has as many official sources as you but disagrees with you
other people have other valid opinions
live with it
Originally posted by 123KID
so is TOAA making the omnniverse
Marvel and DC in the same omniverse
thus TOAA made DCpretty much
just according to you it doesn'tagain your whole inferiority complex surfaces
Mr. M has as many official sources as you but disagrees with you
other people have other valid opinions
live with it
Marvel and DC have said that their companies exist within the same omniverse. There are on panel depictions of this being the case, the featured characters bios reference the crossovers and their was an explicit statement regarding the matter:
http://img149.imageshack.us/my.php?...tsamuraids2.jpg
With that in mind, unless a poster has a statement from Marvel directly addressing the matter, saying that it has an omniverse separate to DC's for example, then they cannot credibly argue against the point without looking biased and illogical.
Quality over quantity. Mr Master can post as many scans as he wants but unless they say specifically that there are two separate omniverses like my sources say there is one and they are neighbours, then its nothing but a whole load of pretty pictures coupled with his OPINION on how it relates to the question at hand. 😬
Marvel and DC have said that their companies exist within the same omniverse. There are on panel depictions of this being the case, the featured characters bios reference the crossovers and their was an explicit statement regarding the matter:
what was tha tlink supposed to prove ?
doesn't work for me
