Kain vs Team Supreme

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
Remember that nice Tarot spell of Kain? Omen power of Pandora box does just the same, except it's not limited to 5 enemies at the time. Flash- and they're dead. Sounds nice. Though you would counter that by Kain being the scion of balance or whatever, but OUTSIDE of Nosgoth it doesn't matter.

And once again, it's not Pyron vs his teammates with Kain taking a nap inside Mercury-sized Pyron's arsehole while he does the job for him, I suppose. You have NO PROOF Inspire Hate would affect Pyron. Making lesser enemies fight each other- wowz, what a great unbeatable power.

you mean inspire hate? Tarot spell? Pandora Box makes them fight eachother? Whats Nosgoth to do with it at all? first in a Versus characters have all their attirbutes acustomed to them in their own world anyway but how will Kain be diffrent outside of Nosgoth, his body and spirit does not change.

it is pyron VS Team, Kain can shield in this, Kain can do tonnes of things, only his soul attacks were taken away so he cant take souls, but inspiring hate and possession is excellent
why would it not effect Pyron, it would effect Pyron greater than anyone on here considering first his beaten by magic canonically that Demitri uses a lot of, and second hes never shown any resistence at all to magic, especially not this type, not to menstion magic of this type has not been used on pyron

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
In manga he attends the party with some vampires present, one of them tries to subdue Dante to make him awaken his demonic side. Dante shrugs it off.
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t463635.html
See the end of the page.

And do you want Nevan specially say to Dante "Now I'm using my high level vampire\succubus powers to make you my sex slave, my whitehaired sweet boy"? She TRIES to use that on Dante and after sees that it has no effect on him (BTW, anything with Dante vs succubi is funny- their hypnosis fails on him, but he has fun from watching them trying and basically watching free porn) she fights him. Once again, a vampire, a high level one, trying to manipulate basic aspects of human nature (in that case it's love, not hate, through, but that's manipulation of basic emotions).

where does it say their high level suc/vamp powers anywhere, she doesnt have to say it if you can provide me with evidence shes using some kinds of power other than simply trying to provoke a love interest. buit please describe to me how Dante can have any effect on this battle anyway?

also where are you getting lesser enemies from?

http://www.dark-chronicle.co.uk/bo1/spells.php

it says enemies in general nothing lesser about it

An emotional manip by vampiric goddess (the being of the same rank as Kain) fails. I've alreasy described WHY it was emotional manipulation. A victim of succubus forgets anything besides love for that, Dante reacts at her as if she was normal attractive woman, not succubus or anything. And she IS the vampire goddess with succubus powers coming as a bonus. Those powers are used to amplify normal emotions of human beings.

And BTW, if Pyron is that weak against magic then why do you think he would be any threat vs God Kratos, for example? In fact, Demetry fight states that magic is his kryptonite, isn't it (I've always thought that Darkstalkers is a crappy game which gets their audience due to Morrigan's boobs and fun of using Jedah's powers on those so I don't care about it much)? And he's being teamed up with some high level magical beings.

And as for Omen ability of Pandora Box

PF666 - Omen
Open Pandora's Box and damage all surrounding enemies with the flash of a violated taboo.
Does massive damage in a huge area.

Flash- and you're dead, darling.

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
An emotional manip by vampiric goddess (the being of the same rank as Kain) fails. I've alreasy described WHY it was emotional manipulation. A victim of succubus forgets anything besides love for that, Dante reacts at her as if she was normal attractive woman, not succubus or anything. And she IS the vampire goddess with succubus powers coming as a bonus. Those powers are used to amplify normal emotions of human beings.

And BTW, if Pyron is that weak against magic then why do you think he would be any threat vs God Kratos, for example? In fact, Demetry fight states that magic is his kryptonite, isn't it (I've always thought that Darkstalkers is a crappy game which gets their audience due to Morrigan's boobs and fun of using Jedah's powers on those so I don't care about it much)? And he's being teamed up with some high level magical beings.

But its not direct mind control, its not like Kain going into Dantes mind directly, inspire hate is emotional but its a direct spell, you would have to have resistence to conflict magic to be able to resist the spell, and mind power resistence to resist mind control, also rank means nothing, also ime curious does it say shes a Vampire Goddess? i cant remember her saying anything like it in the game but she may have done, completed DMC 3 only twice and its a big game

what do you mean, he is no match for pyron, sun sized Pyron would wipe the floor with God Kratos simply because he would punch the guy, most of if not all God Kratos most powerful magic attacks are not worthy of pyron anyway. Pyrons size would mean he could outclass the powers of anyone in his team, inspire hate would work against pyrons size but i dont think anything in this team has magic powers like kains that would work against pyrons strengths (size and strength overall) that could take him on, i mean for exampe Sephiroths measly magics, God kratos lighting bolts compared to a being the size of the sun or even a planet is nothing

also thats assuming they even know Pyrons possessed or inspired to hate, the thing is going to be about to attack when suddenly he swings his arm round and Dante, Kratos and Sephiroth and Ryu its game over for, Jedah is the only one due to his liquidlike form who may survive

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
And as for Omen ability of Pandora Box

PF666 - Omen
Open Pandora's Box and damage all surrounding enemies with the flash of a violated taboo.
Does massive damage in a huge area.

Flash- and you're dead, darling.

but it says damage, nothing about instant death? this move is confusing, also technically kain is already dead and he can resurrect once, second he has a shield that protects him from all attacks, Pandoras box would be considred an attack ime sure and would you please stop calling me darling 😛

The title is given to her in manual. Scans are to follow, she wasn't titled like that in the game, though. The descriptions of enemies and their status are usually given in the manual.
As for Dante's magic resistance, I've explained that point long ago- you "countered" that by showning him being knocked down by Mundus (when he previously sucessfully DEFLECTED the same attack from him- he was just unexperienced at the moment as he was using said power for the first time).

Repell SPELLS. None of those he faces (barring Sephiroth probably) is spellcaster. Stupid argument. Spells and arrows that are nowhere to be seen in that fight.

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
The title is given to her in manual. Scans are to follow, she wasn't titled like that in the game, though. The descriptions of enemies and their status are usually given in the manual.
As for Dante's magic resistance, I've explained that point long ago- you "countered" that by showning him being knocked down by Mundus (when he previously sucessfully DEFLECTED the same attack from him- he was just unexperienced at the moment as he was using said power for the first time).

Repell SPELLS. None of those he faces (barring Sephiroth probably) is spellcaster. Stupid argument. Spells and arrows that are nowhere to be seen in that fight.

fair enough, deflecting that dark beam is one thing, deflecting something you cannot see, hear or touch and even sense in most cases before its already startng to rip your mind apart is unlikely and perhaps impossible for Dante, also the things Mundus fires are all physical to an extent or energy, for example the large energy beams he fires when flying, or the little physical shard things he fires 3 of into dante. Also Mundus charged that up for a while and its unkown if Dante could do this many times, or if he could do it at the drop of a hate against any spell.

where, look on the spells list, it says Repel protects kain from all attacks, and kain says it reflects spells meaing if someone cast a spell on him, it would hit them, but if someone hit him or fired some other attack, it would be ineffective but not reflect back onto them, also Sephiroth is a spellcaster, technically Ninpo from Ryu is close to spells.

And in fact Kain is slow as damn slug compared to some of the members of opposing team. Kain can't neither move nor cast spells on max speeds, while Dante (for example, I'm using examples with the character I know the best) was moving at max speeds when he was young (running down the Temen-Ni-Gri with air burning around him due to friction), his reaction speed is also>>>Kain's (arguments about Kain's mind being advanced is moot, he's master strategist, but please show me him multitasking on superspeeds or a feat of reaction speed comparable to shooting bullets out of the air with bullets or calculating the trajectory of snooker ball in a fractiopn of second). He can speedblitz Kain before he tries to cast anything.

Anyway, I don't feel like wasting my time and money talking with a brick wall. Good luck, guys. I'm leaving that thing for a while.

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
And in fact Kain is slow as damn slug compared to some of the members of opposing team. Kain can't neither move nor cast spells on max speeds, while Dante (for example, I'm using examples with the character I know the best) was moving at max speeds when he was young (running down the Temen-Ni-Gri with air burning around him due to friction), his reaction speed is also>>>Kain's (arguments about Kain's mind being advanced is moot, he's master strategist, but please show me him multitasking on superspeeds or a feat of reaction speed comparable to shooting bullets out of the air with bullets or calculating the trajectory of snooker ball in a fractiopn of second). He can speedblitz Kain before he tries to cast anything.

slow as a slug? how so? and compared to whom, When Pyron gets going he can move FTL okie, Sephiroth can move faster apprently, no feats but apprently he can, Ryu ime not sure, Kratos, nopes

kain has teleportation, thats not moving, thats appearing somewhere incredibly quickly then back again at diffrent places and you keep bringing up "when he was young" BS, yeh and kain when he was 9000 years+ younger when he is now led several armies as general, could throw fully armoured knights around with one arm as well as tonnes of spells, that doesnt mean he can do everything so many times greater, infact Dante ageing which he has may reduce his speed. His mind is advanced, hes a master strategist true but he also has the mind emblem of the concept of the mind itself at hand. Also this speed BS especially Blitz would be impossible, Dante is not that fast, the only one capable of a speed Blitz technically in this match is Pyron and he has to built momentum for his full speed it seems.

problem with all ridiculous speed arguments when talking with "at the speed of sound" are moot, because you dont know the distance kain is starting from them, second Kain has to move his hand or think for mind powers/soul possesion, Dante would have to do a lot more to get to kain, moving kains hand would be faster than dante could close the gap thats for sure, since Dante is not that fast, unless ofc the distance is only a few metres, which is BS unless Pyron is not sun sized or is starting a good distance from the main team, if kain was that close to dante, then they would both be gonners, only Dante more permanently because Kain has one resurrection

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
Anyway, I don't feel like wasting my time and money talking with a brick wall. Good luck, guys. I'm leaving that thing for a while.

yeh yeh, tickling the trolls again, and now your becoming a troll and a copout having to use a "brick wall" rubbish because your argument doesnt stand up, like the rest of them

so ive beaten 2 trolls and a copout in a couple of pages of debate, lawlz, i would of thought you could troll better than that considering Estacado is here.

Are you actually suggesting Kain wins? It says all powers Dante which gives Dante the ability to freeze/slow down time. Not to mention Sephiroth can teleport as well.

Kain can freeze/slow time to equel effect, Sephiroth is a non factor

here if youll civilally debate, and have some arguments bring them to the table, ime bored and could do with a proper debate, also this all crashes down in the effect kain would put a shield up before most of them could do anytihng, i think all he does is move his hand if even that, or his eyes glow green, there were not that many animation effects on kains BO1 spells to compare to nowday modern games, i dont remember him taking long at all to do any spells

also whats dante going to do? even if he slows time and somehow gets to Kain, and kills him once, that gives kain the ability to resurrect somewhere, it could be anywhere, behind the team, eslware in battle and surprise attack

Originally posted by Burning thought

so ive beaten 2 trolls and a copout in a couple of pages of debate, lawlz, i would of thought you could troll better than that considering Estacado is here.

Originally posted by Furion
Yeah but you still have me to deal with 🙂
1. That slow ass time projectile sucks da uberness. Like Seph would get hit by that.
2. His other Time thingy, the slow time one is it, how much is it's range again. Seph can just stay afar and pelt him with spells.

1. its not slow, and youve never seen it, show me it being slow to prove your theory....and yes he will be hit, when Kain is teleported next to him and hes slowed in a time field

2. 10-20 metres, but it stays active over a period of time where Kain could teleport right next to any of the characters except pyron and then their doomed if he uses one of his specalties like time bolt

furthermore, Seph as i said before may as well not be in the fight, hes nothing, pyron will swat him for kain, or Dante will, but Pyron is the only true threat to kain, without him this would be both in a way easier and harder for kain, easier because theres no a big guy who can go FTL and destroy kain easily, or harder because theres not a big guy to possess and swat the rest of his team

Not done yet, darling. Try again.
1. Dante has teleportation as well, in DMC4 he has developed all his brother's powers, including tactical teleportation (coughDimensionReavercough) and energy swords (not that that pseudoTK is relevant there).
2.Young version=19years old one, him running at Max speeds was actually shown as he a)outruns the bullet; b)air around him starts burning because of friction, that's the reentry speed. The speed feats of adult one from DMC4 and DMC2 are more teleportation-related, so that may be handy. But Dante doesn't seem like slow ass even when he's 30-40 years old in those games.
3.Mind emblem? One of the things developers wanted to include but didn't and there are no pillars present, I suppose.
If we're talking about things that were planned to be included in the games, then listen, and listen carefully, darling- what you're going to face (I'm talking about Dante there and things omitted during DMC4 development).
a)Nyx, primal spear. Basically Cassius Longin spear, ultimate thing against undeads and demons. Think Moebius staff.
Note:was thought to be an unlockable, then omitted.
b)Pandora Box being able to suck enemies into it, basically banishing them to Hell. Oh, I already can predict how you're countering that.
4. In fact, Dante may willingly take pounding from Kratos or Seph. In DMC4 it's shown that he can absorb kinetic (etc)energy from his opponents' attacks he blocks and use it to turn into totally invulnerable "dreadnaught" form, which can't be TK'ed as well (Nero's TK doesn't work on it). His speed and teleportation abilities doesn't suffer from that. There goes "mighty" Kain's TK.

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
Not done yet, darling. Try again.
1. Dante has teleportation as well, in DMC4 he has developed all his brother's powers, including tactical teleportation (coughDimensionReavercough) and energy swords (not that that pseudoTK is relevant there).
2.Young version=19years old one, him running at Max speeds was actually shown as he a)outruns the bullet; b)air around him starts burning because of friction, that's the reentry speed. The speed feats of adult one from DMC4 and DMC2 are more teleportation-related, so that may be handy. But Dante doesn't seem like slow ass even when he's 30-40 years old in those games.
3.Mind emblem? One of the things developers wanted to include but didn't and there are no pillars present, I suppose.
If we're talking about things that were planned to be included in the games, then listen, and listen carefully, darling- what you're going to face (I'm talking about Dante there and things omitted during DMC4 development).
a)Nyx, primal spear. Basically Cassius Longin spear, ultimate thing against undeads and demons. Think Moebius staff.
Note:was thought to be an unlockable, then omitted.
b)Pandora Box being able to suck enemies into it, basically banishing them to Hell. Oh, I already can predict how you're countering that.
4. In fact, Dante may willingly take pounding from Kratos or Seph. In DMC4 it's shown that he can absorb kinetic (etc)energy from his opponents' attacks he blocks and use it to turn into totally invulnerable "dreadnaught" form, which can't be TK'ed as well (Nero's TK doesn't work on it). His speed and teleportation abilities doesn't suffer from that. There goes "mighty" Kain's TK.

Kain uses TK shackles and wins!

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
Not done yet, darling. Try again.
1. Dante has teleportation as well, in DMC4 he has developed all his brother's powers, including tactical teleportation (coughDimensionReavercough) and energy swords (not that that pseudoTK is relevant there).
2.Young version=19years old one, him running at Max speeds was actually shown as he a)outruns the bullet; b)air around him starts burning because of friction, that's the reentry speed. The speed feats of adult one from DMC4 and DMC2 are more teleportation-related, so that may be handy. But Dante doesn't seem like slow ass even when he's 30-40 years old in those games.
3.Mind emblem? One of the things developers wanted to include but didn't and there are no pillars present, I suppose.
If we're talking about things that were planned to be included in the games, then listen, and listen carefully, darling- what you're going to face (I'm talking about Dante there and things omitted during DMC4 development).
a)Nyx, primal spear. Basically Cassius Longin spear, ultimate thing against undeads and demons. Think Moebius staff.
Note:was thought to be an unlockable, then omitted.
b)Pandora Box being able to suck enemies into it, basically banishing them to Hell. Oh, I already can predict how you're countering that.
4. In fact, Dante may willingly take pounding from Kratos or Seph. In DMC4 it's shown that he can absorb kinetic (etc)energy from his opponents' attacks he blocks and use it to turn into totally invulnerable "dreadnaught" form, which can't be TK'ed as well (Nero's TK doesn't work on it). His speed and teleportation abilities doesn't suffer from that. There goes "mighty" Kain's TK.

Try what again? i didnt try anything in the first place...
1. Teleportation, its very limited teleportation and moves in straight lines or vertically unlike the dimension reaver which ports anywhere and everywhere many times.
2. can you find the Youtube vid for your "faster" than a bullet argument please, id like to see it. And yes, the wiser adult version would use Teleportation over movement speeds, like kain does...
3. well sure but only if youve got a good case why you think it should be here, and the pillars excisting dont mean anything, the emblems are diffrent from the pillars, some of the emblems were not included as pickups due to no time to add them but canonically, you would have a full balance emblem only if you have all the others, so why were these things not added?
a) you can give him that spear if you want....

b) if you know how ime going to counter it, then why post it if you feel its going to be countered.

4. but what about Pyron, one whack and Dante would be ashes if that. Invulerability will not acitavte, why would Kratos or Seph attack Dante, unless you mean if they were inspired with hate, then Dante wont really be taking kinetic damage, he would be ripped apart, Sephiroth would unlikely use his sword VS dante in a real matchup and Kratos is incredible strong and may use Gorgon stare...then thats the end for Dante. Also he does not "need" TK also when did i say he was going to use it in this battle, hes unlikely to be using TK because he will be using Pyron

Originally posted by Classic NES
Kain uses TK shackles and wins!

dont you troll as well, heavens this forum has enough of them, no Kain uses Spirit wrack and wins!

I love the comparison of Pyron and Kain. Clearly they are equals in that much respects!

Originally posted by Classic NES
I love the comparison of Pyron and Kain. Clearly they are equals in that much respects!

is that real English?

"clearly they are equels in that much respects" i dont get it...

Originally posted by Burning thought
1. its not slow, and youve never seen it, show me it being slow to prove your theory....and yes he will be hit, when Kain is teleported next to him and hes slowed in a time field

2. 10-20 metres, but it stays active over a period of time where Kain could teleport right next to any of the characters except pyron and then their doomed if he uses one of his specalties like time bolt

furthermore, Seph as i said before may as well not be in the fight, hes nothing, pyron will swat him for kain, or Dante will, but Pyron is the only true threat to kain, without him this would be both in a way easier and harder for kain, easier because theres no a big guy who can go FTL and destroy kain easily, or harder because theres not a big guy to possess and swat the rest of his team

Originally posted by Furion
Compared to Seph, It's slow. Plus if Kain teleported next to Seph he could either:
Teleport away
Stick his sword through Kain's head.
But that would be if Kain went after Seph.

Pretty much the same can be said about Dante, plus Dante thinks faster than Kain (that doesn't equal being smarter than Kain, darling) and he can use his time manipulation\tactical teleportation.
Kain is a slug compared to both Dante and Seph, probably Ryu (but he's the weakest there).

There we go. Outruns and catches his sword accelerated by bullet to Max speed (thus the friction "burning" aura appears).
YouTube video
Some evasive stuff with teleportation as well as some nice cutting feats. See, the flying guy thinks he swings his sword as fast as Kain- he's mistaken as the time needed for him to turn around and cut Dante's head off is AGES for our whitehaired beauty.
YouTube video
I won't post Despair Embodied feat. What's funny is that both Despair Embodied and previously mentioned things are FASTER than Dante (even DTd\SDTd one) in gameplay.
Wait, I guess I should post.
YouTube video

Also Royakl Guard absorbs not only punches but blasts as well, Medusa gaze is slow as ass and easy to evade...