Who can beat the Spectre?

Originally posted by fangirl101
It's also important to note what is the spectre's mission? is he going to tap the logoz? etc.

fangirl101 is nvrbeenwthagirl

Part 1 Lucifer talks shit

Originally posted by fangirl101
lucifer talks trash to the spectre. he can.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Lucifer created a multiversal out of raw power. He withstood the blast all at once and wasn't even singed. He bitches the spectre and the endless, who are beyond multiversal, and talks shit to God.

There's also a post where he literally says Lucifer talks shit to the Spectre, but I'm not going to take the time to find that one. Props to the person who does.

Part 2 Darkseid and use of "lvl"

Originally posted by fangirl101
are you saying he's never at normal lvls? what is his normal lvl? when he's a giant? in countdown, he was fighting jimmy as a giant against ALL of the other new gods powers. that lvl? he had no apparant power up there.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
You did it again. the same DUMB DUMB DUMB bullshit. Eternity doesn't have to kill anyone for me to know that his blast would kill Odin. I dont' need Highfather's staff to kill someone when it's been shown ripping a ****ing hole in the time space reality continuum. What idiot in thier ****ing right mind would need to see the staff kill someone when it can acually rip reality? You'd have to be seriously brain dead to see a combat showing. That would be like someone having to see death kick some ass to believe she can't one shot Thor. Duh, of course she can. As for DS and the ALE aspect, He didn't have any help surviving the blast. No one amped his durability. You are thinking of the fight against the ale itself. And guess what, DS still supplied a 5th of the power required. BUt I think math might not be a good subject for you. And you saying DS powers don't work on superman is really silly considering DS has plentry of times simply teleported superman away. And the fact that superman grows more powerful means that He isn't really the herald lvl character people try to make him out to be. He was herald lvl when byrne retconned him. He's far beyond that now. I can take DS taking one beating from a being who can turn the wheels of mageddon and hold a black hole in his hand and fly out of a double black hole and save the omniverse. you down play DS against superman as if superman is Thor lvl. LMAO. get real. As for DS in his latest showing against superman, is that what you call it? superman comes from out of no where and DS has just been blasted by highfather's staff and just reabsorbed by force his omegas and you count that as a fight? You fail on so many lvls. [/B]

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Not even in that book. you fail. Your attempt fails on every lvl.

Part 3 "NO" and then the same choppy, incoherent rambling

Originally posted by fangirl101
NO. The Molecule man has no feats to suggest he's more powerful than the LT. Now isn't this forum about statements only when back up by FEATS? kthanks. you have a good day. Seems we have selective statement/featitis. Statements hold weight when we want them to and other times with no feats to back them up, then they are taken as just hyperbole.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
NO. The LT was never retconned. There simply is another LT depicted in a story that was a Dream. Two LT's. I have come to the conclusion that Since the story is just a dream to the Actual LT, THe LT depicted in the story isn't the same at all. Thus the current LT, cannot be used as a measuring stick to the one in the dream, since it is NOT him.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
NO. I just admitted that if Classic MM where to fight the LT, he'd lose becuz the LT has the power of the Editors and TOAA behind him. Classic MM has nothing but the power he displayed in the series. No backing of anyone.

Part 4 Wonder Woman's skills!!!!

Originally posted by fangirl101
IN A HAND TO HAND FIGHT BETWEEN OLD THOR AND WONDER WOMAN, SHE WOULD WIN. SIMPLY BECAUSE SHE HAS ACTUAL SKILL FEATS AND SHE'S GOT BETTER REFLEXES AND BETTER SPEED.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
In comics, skill mean alot. Captain America Playing with Namor. Gamora Making Thanos Bleed. Batman is well, Batman. Karate Kid ****ing pwning a Superman villian. So I dont' see Why WOnder Woman, a class like 60 million, can't pwn someone who may be Slightly stronger than her. Makes no sense at all. Especially given her magical weapons and superior speed FEATS.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Where are his strength feats and speed feats and durability feats that are just so out of her abilities? I haven't seen them.

Originally posted by Air Legend
fangirl101 is nvrbeenwthagirl

Part 1 Lucifer talks shit

There's also a post where he literally says Lucifer talks shit to the Spectre, but I'm not going to take the time to find that one. Props to the person who does.

Part 2 Darkseid and use of "lvl"

Part 3 "NO" and then the same choppy, incoherent rambling

Part 4 Wonder Woman's skills!!!!

Dear. So much wasted energy. I'm not nvr. You'd be wise to not be a fool of. Because I have YIM and I'll talk to any moderator on there. And they will clearly see that I'm a woman. Not only that, I have a msypace page that is nearly two years old and guess what, my freinds on there leave comments to and about me. lastly, your comparison aren't really comparison. your examples of trying to prove i'm someone you think i'm not is not going to work because I'm not.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Dear. So much wasted energy. I'm not nvr. You'd be wise to not be a fool of. Because I have YIM and I'll talk to any moderator on there. And they will clearly see that I'm a woman. Not only that, I have a msypace page that is nearly two years old and guess what, my freinds on there leave comments to and about me. lastly, your comparison aren't really comparison. your examples of trying to prove i'm someone you think i'm not is not going to work because I'm not.

Originally posted by Bentley
Thanks Onedumbgo, it was worth to make this thread if only to learn what you posted.

I feel that the Spectre/LT thing is often taken too literally, when we talk about the Spectre the first question must always be "who is the host?", the host is important, Hal had Pharallax when he was the host and that made it relevant to the Spectre.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Fangirl101, please don't quote Air Legend's posts. I put him on ignore and I do not care to ever see another one of his posts again. I'll suggest you put him on ignore too.No problem, bro. Cheers.

Please make note that My profile is pretty old now. I have freinds who have visited me. Look at Thier comments. Clearly, I'm not a guy. You all be good now.

Originally posted by Air Legend
fangirl101 is nvrbeenwthagirl

Part 1 Lucifer talks shit

There's also a post where he literally says Lucifer talks shit to the Spectre, but I'm not going to take the time to find that one. Props to the person who does.

Part 2 Darkseid and use of "lvl"

Part 3 "NO" and then the same choppy, incoherent rambling

Part 4 Wonder Woman's skills!!!!

EDIT.

W/E

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Next point, you seriously need to stop selectively revealing which events occurred at the conclusion of 'Zero Hour.' It makes you look like you didn't read the damn thing or you're trying to mislead people. Just to show everybody else what we're talking about so they can make their own judgments, here is exactly what happened:

1) Hallax ties the end of time with the beginning and destroys the universe: http://img468.imageshack.us/my.php?image=2ej9.jpg

Nice try to give Hal credit for things he had nothing to do with!

A clear outright LIE.

2) Hallax then reforms the universe by spending his Power of the Guardians to create a plasma energy globule template from which he could reshape the universe. He would reshape the universe by utilizing the absorbed chronal energies of the original Crisis to mold it into any way he wanted. The vast knowledge needed to do so was taken from the Guardians.
http://img363.imageshack.us/my.php?image=5za7.jpg
http://img468.imageshack.us/my.php?image=8ga9.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/my.php?image=9km8.jpg

* Now before I go on, this is the most important point. Hallax essentially spent all his stolen Power of the Guardians in creating this plasma globule universe template. We know he spent at least most of it since it was enough to remold an ENTIRE damn universe. We also know that its from the stolen Central Power Battery because it's plasma energy (which is what manifested GL energy is), NOT chronal energy as confirmed on-panel by Waverider, "... begin absorbing the plasma energy universe Parallax has created -- before it begins to solidify!" Here:
http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=16hd6.jpg

Nothing says he spent all his powers of the Guardians.

The power they're absorbing is not being taken directly from Parallax, but energy Parallax already used. They are specifically targeting the plasma, as said on panel. Thus, them absorbing it had no effect on the battle, as I said in my previous posts.

We also know that all this plasma energy is from Hallax himself because the heroes confirm it on-panel when they start absorbing the plasma energies, they said, "It's working! We're absorbing most of Parallax's energy!" So already, by this time Hallax was severely depleted of personal energies:
http://img363.imageshack.us/my.php?image=17ka9.jpg

3) After that monumental expenditure of energy, Hallax is attacked by this team of heroes who blast him with everything they have: Waverider, Superman, Captain Atom, Darkstar, and Ray. Not only does he get blindsided by Waverider's initial chronal energy blast, but he defends against everyone else's attacks and then in a huge power release, knocks them for a loop:
http://img363.imageshack.us/my.php?image=11ox9.jpg
http://img468.imageshack.us/my.php?image=12hy2.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/my.php?image=13ra9.jpg

4) This is finally when Corrigan Spectre comes in and begins attacking Hallax. Naturally, Hallax is blindsided again before being able to strike back at Spectre. He breaks out of Spectre's shackles and seemingly kills merged Hawkman:
http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=14yr6.jpg
http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=15bh1.jpg
http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=16hd6.jpg

5) Finally, after trading blasts with Spectre, he defeats Spectre. How do we know Spectre's beaten? From the on-panel depiction of Spectre being blasted and his disappearance thereafter until Hallax dies. AND from Kyle's concurrent clear-as-day confirmation, "the Spectre's sacrifice has weakened you -- given us time..."
http://img363.imageshack.us/my.php?image=17ka9.jpg

6) Whereupon with Kyle's proclamation, this MMA free-for-all between Kyle, Batgirl and Ollie occurs. Of course, Hal still manages a blast aimed at Damage, but kills Batgirl instead. Finally, after Kyle wrestles him, Kyle lets us know that Hallax has indeed lost his remaining reserves of power. Finally, Spectre returns.
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/4561/zerohour018gu9.jpg
http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/2699/zerohour019qt0.jpg
http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/4164/zerohour020cj0.jpg

So how exactly did you try to characterize this entire fight? Let's see:Wow. You thought Hallax was STILL amped up by the Central Power Batteries AND the chronal energies? Even AFTER he looped the end and beginning of time AND recreated an ENTIRE plasma energy globule universe? Just. Wow. No wonder you think Hallax is pathetic for running out of energy. You COMPLETELY disregarded the fact that he spent most if not nearly all his energies recreating the damn universe! How did you miss that fact?!

Not only did you neglect to mention that obvious fact, but you didn't even mention the all-out assault led by Waverider's team! This isn't just reaching... it's purely and utterly misleading. And a failed attempt at that. Honestly, this thread should just end here. But I'll continue in my next post and address the rest of your comments.

I also never said Hallax was pathetic, I said Parallax fell short of Spectre's power, even with a very vast outside power source at his disposal. Without this power ampage, it's very very clear that Parallax or the ION entities are not even close to Spectre in terms of power or stature.

I have to cut this short and run to work now, I'll be back some other time to keep tearing down your outright lies.

When I wrote that "Hal ties the end of time with the beginning and destroys the universe," I meant to say that, "Hal tightens the loop that ties the end of time with the beginning and destroys the universe." That is the only correction I have to make with the above posts. Thanks for pointing that out. Even though I think your utter glee at doing so is very unflattering. Still, it is a correction.

Everything else I posted stands as true. Much of whatever else you have to say is gibberish. Hallax created the plasma energy globule universe. Where did he get that energy? The Power of the Guardians. If you think he is significantly amped by the time Waverider's team and Spectre attacks him, you overestimate how much energy he wields. You seriously think he can create a universe of plasma energy and then still have a significant power reserve left? Even I don't think so. The scans make that clear. And quite frankly, the only motivation you have for trying to convince anybody that Hallax was at the peak of his powers afterwards is to try to show how Spectre diminished that vast power on his own.

Which is utterly ridiculous considering that creating a plasma energy globule universe would surely require vast amounts of energy. And you're still continuing to ignore Waverider's team's attack. Nice dodge. And all of this means nothing anyway, since there is one simple immutable fact: that Spectre was still defeated by Hallax. I already posted the scans and Kyle's on-panel confirmation. Spectre only reformed after the battle had already been won. That's further evidence that Spectre was waylaid during the time when Ollie killed Hallax.

That is all on-panel. Stop grasping at straws, Juntai. The only thing you managed to do was correct my mistake that Hal tightened the loop rather than caused the loop. Which overall, means nothing to the crux of this current debate. Hallax used a significant amount of his energies to create the plasma energy globule universe. Common sense dictates that Hallax only has so much power. What? You think he can do all that and still have most of his power left? That argument is self-defeating. Hallax was also assaulted by Waverider's team. Now, Spectre did further drain him of his energies. But his involvement wasn't nearly what you think it is and considering his on-panel defeat with on-panel confirmations by characters... like I said originally... why you're bringing up Hallax's defeating Spectre at the end of time is beyond me. Stop belaboring this point.

Originally posted by Juntai
WRONG!!!!!!!!!!
THE BEGINNING AND THE END OF TIME WERE ALREADY LOOPED BECAUSE OF CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS.

Nice try to give Hal credit for things he had nothing to do with!

A clear outright LIE.

WRONG!!!!! NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THOSE SCANS DESCRIBES ANYTHING YOU'RE SUGGESTING HERE.

Nothing says he spent all his powers of the Guardians.

The power they're absorbing is not being taken directly from Parallax, but energy Parallax already used. They are specifically targeting the plasma, as said on panel. Thus, them absorbing it had no effect on the battle, as I said in my previous posts.

Yes, Hal did create the Plasma energy, good job!

Spectre is standing when the conflict concludes. There is nothing to suggest he lost there besides you trying to force a false interpretation on us.. His 'sacrfice' was taking a big blast and forcing Hal to use up nearly all of his energy. And he ultimately fell short against Spectre. It's clear that he was still amped at this time battling merely judging from subsequent appearances of Parallax or ION, which were not nearly close to Spectre in power. A very clear indication of his being amped. As I said, bios and even Hal later down the road mused the coincidence of losing to Spectre and then becoming Spectre.
Sure it was somewhat of a team effort, most of all the great hero stories throughout history are, even outside of comics. But it was clear Spectre's role here was far beyond the capacities of the heros, and he was indeed the one that caused Hal to go powerless.

Hal didn't loop the beginning and the end of time, anyone who knows DC's cosmology knows that it happened during Crisis on Infinite Earths. Hal unraveled reality by going to the end of time [an end to where they would be none if it were not perpetually looped.] and played with the knot until it unraveled and reality erased.

I also never said Hallax was pathetic, I said Parallax fell short of Spectre's power, even with a very vast outside power source at his disposal. Without this power ampage, it's very very clear that Parallax or the ION entities are not even close to Spectre in terms of power or stature.

I have to cut this short and run to work now, I'll be back some other time to keep tearing down your outright lies.

It appears as though you are a spectre fan trying to play him up

Spectre is more powerfull than Parallax.

Spectre was more powerfull than Anti-Monitor.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Fangirl101, please don't quote Air Legend's posts. I put him on ignore and I do not care to ever see another one of his posts again. I'll suggest you put him on ignore too.

👆

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Spectre is more powerfull than Parallax.

Spectre was more powerfull than Anti-Monitor.

I think no one here is arguing against any of that.

Originally posted by Bentley
I think no one here is arguing against any of that.

Then you think wrong.

Originally posted by Bentley
I think no one here is arguing against any of that.

Not sure if i fit that descryption, but maybe its p.i.s or jobbing,but in zero hour parallax defeated the spectre(while fighting many heroes) I.M.O, and it seems that, a theory or just guessing is the explanation, when its win or loose, not....."i think he did his job and left for three pages""he came back at the end of the comic and helped with a new big bang" "he still had power when he came back and parallax was depleated"whatever floats the spectre fanbase boat i guess...and i am a fan 😕

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
When I wrote that "Hal ties the end of time with the beginning and destroys the universe," I meant to say that, "Hal tightens the loop that ties the end of time with the beginning and destroys the universe." That is the only correction I have to make with the above posts. Thanks for pointing that out. Even though I think your utter glee at doing so is very unflattering. Still, it is a correction.

Everything else I posted stands as true. Much of whatever else you have to say is gibberish. Hallax created the plasma energy globule universe. Where did he get that energy? The Power of the Guardians. If you think he is significantly amped by the time Waverider's team and Spectre attacks him, you overestimate how much energy he wields. You seriously think he can create a universe of plasma energy and then still have a significant power reserve left? Even I don't think so. The scans make that clear. And quite frankly, the only motivation you have for trying to convince anybody that Hallax was at the peak of his powers afterwards is to try to show how Spectre diminished that vast power on his own.

Which is utterly ridiculous considering that creating a plasma energy globule universe would surely require vast amounts of energy. And you're still continuing to ignore Waverider's team's attack. Nice dodge. And all of this means nothing anyway, since there is one simple immutable fact: that Spectre was still defeated by Hallax. I already posted the scans and Kyle's on-panel confirmation. Spectre only reformed after the battle had already been won. That's further evidence that Spectre was waylaid during the time when Ollie killed Hallax.

That is all on-panel. Stop grasping at straws, Juntai. The only thing you managed to do was correct my mistake that Hal tightened the loop rather than caused the loop. Which overall, means nothing to the crux of this current debate. Hallax used a significant amount of his energies to create the plasma energy globule universe. Common sense dictates that Hallax only has so much power. What? You think he can do all that and still have most of his power left? That argument is self-defeating. Hallax was also assaulted by Waverider's team. Now, Spectre did further drain him of his energies. But his involvement wasn't nearly what you think it is and considering his on-panel defeat with on-panel confirmations by characters... like I said originally... why you're bringing up Hallax's defeating Spectre at the end of time is beyond me. Stop belaboring this point.

Now before I continue... because it pertains your post here as well... in a previous post: You said this;

Hallax essentially spent all his stolen Power of the Guardians in creating this plasma globule universe template. We know he spent at least most of it since it was enough to remold an ENTIRE damn universe.

Funny how Hal mentioned he was going to build more Universes after building the one, that didn't even get finished entirely. Clearly he had far more power than you're giving credit for. He even specifically mentions building a universe for the JSA. And then another for Centurion and one for the alternate Batgirl as well. . . .Or are you purposely leaving that out hoping to convince those who haven't read the story that Spectre fought a powerless Parallax? Hallax had a ton of energy left. One universe was apperently the least of his power, the bulk of it was lost fighting Spectre.

Out of energy before fighting Spectre? I think not.

Out of Guardian/OA energy before fighting Spectre? Not even close. Notice his giant green constructs and energy blasts. Especially given that he planned to build more universes, requiring the same plasma energy he used to build the first.

At the peak of his power he stole from the dawn of time and OA? I never suggested such a thing. Spectre still fought a multiverse destroyer/creator, until he was out of energy that he couldn't beat a handful of guys kicking and punching him. Surely Hal used some energy, but according to Hal, it was pretty much a drop in the water, while while he was going to go about rebuilding the Infinite Earths.

This was also CLEARLY a severely amped up Parallax, as subsequent ION and Parallax appearanced have them nowhere near the same level, so he is clearly above the entities, where you claimed he was not earlier in the thread. That was the reason for bringing up Zero Hour, because an amped up Parallax still was left powerless by Spectre, who still had vast amounts of energy left. So much in fact, that the others who absorbed Parallax's universe, dumping it into Damage, seemed to be far less energy than Spectre was pumping, given Damage's reaction. Spectre's powers clearly did the bulk of the work in restarting reality.

Spectre lost to Hallax?! Laughable. He was still standing at the resolution of the fight, after Parallax dumped the equivelent of a multiverse of energy into their battle, and STILL HAD MORE TO GIVE. There is no on panel confirmation of him defeated, only one you're extrapolating completely. In fact, his remaining vast energies suggest completely otherwise.

Now, you said, Parallax entity is immune to Spectre.
More lies, which seems to be a habit for you in this thread.
And since you've danced around it, and tried to run off on tangents every time I bring it up - I'll make it plain simple, and concise.

Fill in these blanks for me;
In Rebirth issue 4.
Hal calls out "____.... HELP ME!"
And it took ____ exactly ___ amount of panels to seperate them by clapping his hands together?"

If you said; SPECTRE, SPECTRE, and ONE. You are correct!

And after the Spectre leaves, Parallax believes that nothing can stop him, indeed, he clearly said without the Spectre there were no hands holding him in place.

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Spectre is more powerfull than Parallax.

Spectre was more powerfull than Anti-Monitor.

👆

edit.

And just in case you try to get really rediculous; Parallax said he was going to build more Earths for everyone specifically, but everyone who reads DC knows they always call the other Universes the other Earths. Hence DC's "Infinite Earths.", etc, etc, instead of universe. In fact, in context, it's all but directly stated that the plan is to bring back the infinite earths altogether, especially since this was written as the sequel to Crisis on Infinite Earths.

Originally posted by I love DC
Its quite clear you are twisting statements

It appears as though you are a spectre fan trying to play him up

You remind me of Quanchi a little bit.

Originally posted by Erik-Lensherr
Spectre is more powerfull than Parallax.

Spectre was more powerfull than Anti-Monitor.

👆