Originally posted by carver9
Ok, I can do better then. Despero soloed the entire jla and theres nothing to indicate that despero is>WWh.
You mean besides the fact that Despero was taking on the JSA and JLA? I'll give you that any Despero other than the one in Virtue and Vice, is probably not as strong as WWH, physically. In Crisis of Conscience, Despero was only doing so well against the League because he took over so many of them.
Originally posted by carver9
Mongul has soloed the jla
When?
Originally posted by carver9
hell even wonderwoman has soloed the jla (didnt have superman there).
That was a training session.
Originally posted by carver9
There are a lot of people that has soloed the jla so using that as a high feat is riduculous.
Name a few of them, and tell me in which issues they looked good against a competent JLA.
Originally posted by carver9
Its a good feat but when people as low as deathstroke (even though deathstroke never gave gl time to use his ring) solo this team then that takes away from that feat from konvikt.
Kyle had plenty of time to use his ring, but all he tried to do was punch Deathstroke. Eventually Deathstroke was on the losing end, and only managed to escape because of Dr. Light.
Originally posted by Rorschach
You mean besides the fact that Despero was taking on the JSA and JLA? I'll give you that any Despero other than the one in Virtue and Vice, is probably not as strong as WWH, physically. In Crisis of Conscience, Despero was only doing so well against the League because he took over so many of them.When?
That was a training session.
Name a few of them, and tell me in which issues they looked good against a competent JLA.
Kyle had plenty of time to use his ring, but all he tried to do was punch Deathstroke. Eventually Deathstroke was on the losing end, and only managed to escape because of Dr. Light.
But you do know that that same despero almost got his head taken off by hawkmans mace.
Well it wasnt the entire jla, it was superman, wonderwoman, and batman, the major jla.
But the point of the training session was to try and take wonder woman down without holding back.
Just to name a few, despero, promethius, titus, doomsday, the general, solomon grundy, shaggy man, etc...
Even though kyle didnt use his ring dont take away from the fact that deathstroke physically almost beat the jla. Kyle isnt the only member on the jla.
Originally posted by quanchi112
He never beat them when he was mindcontrolled prior to fighting WW?
Unless you consider running away a victory, then yeah he didn't exactly defeat them.
First, he BFR'd Martian Manhunter by taking him by surprise, he then destroys John's constructs, which creates an opening the JLA watchtower , which John goes through. He then runs away while Wally is giving Black Canary an Oxygen mask.
Konvikt is taking on the Leauge straight on, more akin the way Titus fought them, not Superman.
Originally posted by RorschachThanks for the info. I shouldnt go by what other posters tell me. Serves me right. It makes sense that Superman couldnt beat the jla straight up.
Unless you consider running away a victory, then yeah he didn't exactly defeat them.First, he BFR'd Martian Manhunter by taking him by surprise, he then destroys John's constructs, which creates an opening the JLA watchtower , which John goes through. He then runs away while Wally is giving Black Canary an Oxygen mask.
Konvikt is taking on the Leauge straight on, more akin the way Titus fought them, not Superman.
🙂
Originally posted by carver9
But you do know that that same despero almost got his head taken off by hawkmans mace.
That's an exaggeration. Hawkman knocked a few of his teeht out, then was taken out. Despero kept fighting.
Originally posted by carver9
Well it wasnt the entire jla, it was superman, wonderwoman, and batman, the major jla.
Oh, you mean the fight that ended with Superman stopping Wonder Woman from killing Mongul? How does that count as Mongul soling the JLA?
Originally posted by carver9
But the point of the training session was to try and take wonder woman down without holding back.
No, it was to see if she still capable of being in the League, even if she had lost her sight. If the League wanted to use all the power at their disposal, they would have also sent in Superman do more than just fire one bullet from a pistol.
Originally posted by carver9
Just to name a few, despero
Due to his strength and telepathy.
Originally posted by carver9
promethius
Had prep, and his plan to defeat Superman was to have him commit suicide.
Originally posted by carver9
titus
Valid, though some people are under the misconception that he's just a brute with nothing other than physical strength.
Originally posted by carver9
doomsday
A relatively weak League. The only noteworthy League he took out was in Doomsday War, and that was when Brainiac was controlling him, while he was in his Hunter/Prey form.
Originally posted by carver9
the general,shaggy man
Pre-Crisis is irrelevant, if that's all you got for Shaggy Man. The General was defeated by the League in World War III, and The Ultramarine Corps.
Originally posted by carver9
solomon grundy
When?
Originally posted by carver9
Even though kyle didnt use his ring dont take away from the fact that deathstroke physically almost beat the jla.
Because he had prep. That's how he took out Wally.
Originally posted by carver9
Kyle isnt the only member on the jla.
Yeah, but most of the others were taken out before they had a chance to use their powers, which didn't even make sense in regards to Zatanna.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Thanks for the info. I shouldnt go by what other posters tell me. Serves me right. It makes sense that Superman couldnt beat the jla straight up.🙂
Superman isn't a team-wrecker. Sure, he could cause them some trouble, but he's not in the same league as guys like Thanos, Amazo, Virtue & Vice Despero, etc.
Originally posted by Rorschach
That's an exaggeration. Hawkman knocked a few of his teeht out, then was taken out. Despero kept fighting.Oh, you mean the fight that ended with Superman stopping Wonder Woman from killing Mongul? How does that count as Mongul soling the JLA?
No, it was to see if she still capable of being in the League, even if she had lost her sight. If the League wanted to use all the power at their disposal, they would have also sent in Superman do more than just fire one bullet from a pistol.
Due to his strength and telepathy.
Had prep, and his plan to defeat Superman was to have him commit suicide.
Valid, though some people are under the misconception that he's just a brute with nothing other than physical strength.
A relatively weak League. The only noteworthy League he took out was in Doomsday War, and that was when Brainiac was controlling him, while he was in his Hunter/Prey form.
Pre-Crisis is irrelevant, if that's all you got for Shaggy Man. The General was defeated by the League in World War III, and The Ultramarine Corps.
When?
Because he had prep. That's how he took out Wally.
Yeah, but most of the others were taken out before they had a chance to use their powers, which didn't even make sense in regards to Zatanna.
Not an exaggeration to me, looks pretty hurt if you were to ask me with that blood dripping from his mouth.
http://img256.imageshack.us/my.php?image=824188767rf.jpg
I agree with the mongul fight.
I know the training was to see if she was still able to stay with the league due to the poisoning that she infected herself with from madusa but they were still told not to hold back.
I know its due to strength but you asked me who soloed the jla. Without the jsa being there he could have easily physically outfought the jla.
Superman didnt have a weakness, he was blue superman during that time, thats why he asked him to commit suicide but again he defeated the jla.
Titus did phyiscally beat the jla besides flash. Flash was the only person that he used a different power against. The rest got physically stomped.
You asked for times when the jla got defeated, I gave you doomsday and who was to say that they were weak.
The general almost killed the jla.
He didnt take out wally due to prep, he knew where wally was going which is a trick that all top tier fighters use against speedsters.
Again it happened. Even though you dont like HOW it happened, you still cant take away from the feat.
Originally posted by Marvelknight
If Superman wanted to, WWH would land a single blow. Not to mention that Supes has the power to put WWH down. There are too many advantages Supes has over WWH. And you're giving WWH 8/10 noway.
The sad thing is that the advantages that you speak of wont even work against hulk and to bad people far less then hulk has landed blows and actually knocked superman out.
Originally posted by Marvelknight
If Superman wanted to, WWH would land a single blow. Not to mention that Supes has the power to put WWH down. There are too many advantages Supes has over WWH. And you're giving WWH 8/10 noway.
*yawn* you saw this right? superman must have wanted to get his teeth
chipped right...?
Originally posted by carver9
The sad thing is that the advantages that you speak of wont even work against hulk and to bad people far less then hulk has landed blows and actually knocked superman out.
Originally posted by psycho gundam*yawn* you saw this right? superman must have wanted to get his teeth
chipped right...?
Originally posted by Marvelknightexactly, thats why we use an average when it comes to showings because people like to discount low showings completely...as you just did right now.
That is a low showing that you are trying to use as proof. When there has been more times where Superman has taken far more punishment and not be KOed.
hulk has some low showings but king hulk or green scar as they say has a pretty good record, it is hard to even find a low showing, just super high ones so his average is higher than the average of "normal" superman's.
imo hulk 6/10.
Originally posted by carver9
Not an exaggeration to me, looks pretty hurt if you were to ask me with that blood dripping from his mouth.
http://img256.imageshack.us/my.php?image=824188767rf.jpg
Hurt? Of course he was hurt, that's why he was bleeding, but it wasn’t anything serious. He took Hawkman out and then kept fighting. Saying he Hawkman almost took his head off, is an exaggeration, considering all Hawkman did was knock some of this teeth out.
Originally posted by carver9
I agree with the mongul fight.
Then why bring it up? Why even claim that he soloed the JLA?
Originally posted by carver9
I know the training was to see if she was still able to stay with the league due to the poisoning that she infected herself with from madusa but they were still told not to hold back.
When was it mentioned that the League was told not to hold back, when did the League claim they weren't holding back? It was said that League were testing her, and not going easy on her, but they did not go all out on her. And in order to claim that she soloed the League, she would have had to actually defeat them, not stop fighting after Superman fired a gun at her. Wally even mentioned that
Originally posted by carver9
I know its due to strength but you asked me who soloed the jla. Without the jsa being there he could have easily physically outfought the jla.
I asked you for who soloed the JLA, not who could have soloed them. Furthermore, Virtue and Vice Despero was shown to be significantly stronger than the likes of Superman, Captain Marvel, etc. The argument you were trying to make is that people weaker than World War Hulk have consistently taken out the JLA, but I do not believe that Virtue and Vice Despero is weaker than the WWH, as he was doing well against a team consisting of Superman, Captain Marvel, Wonder Woman, Kyle Rayner, Alan Scott, Wally, Jay, Dr. Fate, and Power Girl. He was only defeated when the two Lanterns used Johnny Sorrow.
Originally posted by carver9
Superman didnt have a weakness, he was blue superman during that time, thats why he asked him to commit suicide but again he defeated the jla.
You seem to be ignoring the fact that he had prep, and that he took out the majority of the League one on one, and relied on exploiting their weaknesses. You seemed to have missed what I was getting at. You brought up Despero, saying he was weaker than World War Hulk, and that he defeated the JLA. Your whole argument has been about people weaker than WWH taking out the League, but brining up Prometheus, who took on the JLA with prep, and not sheer physical power, is a moot point.
Originally posted by carver9
Titus did phyiscally beat the jla besides flash. Flash was the only person that he used a different power against. The rest got physically stomped.
Originally posted by carver9
You asked for times when the jla got defeated, I gave you doomsday and who was to say that they were weak.
I do not consider Hunter/Prey Doomsday to be weaker than WWH. I do consider DOS Doomsday to be weaker than WWH, but the League he fought was quite weak. The only heavy hitters were Bloodwynd and Maxima. If I recall correctly, the two of them never fought him at the same time.
Originally posted by carver9
The general almost killed the jla.
He nearly killed Batman and Huntress. That’s about it. And in World War III he didn’t find them alone.
Originally posted by carver9
He didnt take out wally due to prep, he knew where wally was going which is a trick that all top tier fighters use against speedsters.
So Deathstroke just happened to have landmines planted right near him? Deathstroke had prep. He was prepared to the fact the JLA, as Dr. Light had hired him to protect him from the JLA.
Originally posted by carver9
Again it happened. Even though you dont like HOW it happened, you still cant take away from the feat.
What you referring to?
Grundy taking out the JLA? Which you haven’t backed up.
Or
Deathstroke taking out some of the other Leaguers before they had a chance to use their powers? Because if it’s the latter, then there’s some PIS involved.
